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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: Dave Nyce on November 17, 2007, 12:22:23 PM
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I have an engine that I bought new, probably about 10 to 15 years ago. It is for C/L, with no throttle control. The packaging reads "Northern Velocity", "made in Russia" and the engine has the marking "A3PO". It is obviously a 1/2A size, but I don't know if the displacement is .049, or .061, or other. Is anyone familiar with this engine?
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Look at the exhaust side of the crankcase for a "1.0" marking. If it's there, the engine is an .061; otherwise it's an .049. The "A" suggests that it's the AME version (look for AME on the Transfer side of the crankcase. Don't know much more . . .
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Thanks. There is no 1, and no other markings. I thought it was probably an .049. So, according to your post, that seems to be it.
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I was thinkin' that Northern Velocity would mean "NorVell", but that's a guess. Probably the same factory, in any case. D>K Steve
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David,
Those are wonderful engines, and perhaps the best general purpose half A engines ever produced. Their only fault, is that they can be very difficult to start when new. Spring starters help, but many of them came without the spring. The good news is that all of the Norvel engines have a steel thrust washer between the drive hub and crank case, so an electric starter like yours can be safely used.
Break them in exactly as recommended in the instructions, and they will last a very long time. Use smaller props to allow them to spin up rapidly, as the fuel draw is marginal with that big bore venturi.
I'm not familiar with the numbers you mention, but here is what I know about them (thanks to Geo Bain for his clarification).
They come in two different porting arrangements, and two different cylinder types. The only way to determine the porting arrangement without paperwork, is by removing the head for visual inspection. The sport tuned engines have five small ports (plus exhaust), and the high performance (AME) tuned engines have three larger ports (plus exhaust).
My early .049 is a Big Mig sport series, with natural aluminum fins, and a smaller glow plug. It also has a brass needle valve, without the right angle needle extension found on all later steel needles.
Revlite engines have larger cylinder fins that are black anodized. The cylinder mounting screws are hidden by the head and fins, and only accessible through holes drilled down through the fins.
The earlier (non-Revlite) cylinders have aluminum fins, and semicircle screw driver clearance cuts milled into the fins. The screws are plainly visible at the cylinder base, and can be removed with the head in place.
I'm not sure if the high performance AME tuning was ever available with the early aluminum cylinders, as I've never seen an example.
Later Norvels went to a hotter plug known as the Freedom plug. The earlier plugs were probably OK for C/L use, but too cold to give a reliable idle with throttled engines. The early plugs are smaller in diameter, so the Freedom plugs will not fit the old head clamps. The old head clamp part number is 100131, and the new Freedom plug head clamp is 110131. The new head clamp fits the old engines, as long as you use a Freedom plug.
Norvel also made a glow plug adapter for regular glow plugs, but they only fit the older p/n 100131 head clamps. I have one of these, but have not tried it, and don't recommend them. Use Galbreath glow head adapters, with the excellent and inexpensive Nelson plugs instead. Norvel plugs are getting very hard to find.
Probably more than you wanted to know.
Bill
PS. If you still need engines for the kids, I've got a couple of Cox Golden Bees that your welcome to. They look very clean, perhaps even unused, but I've never started them. One is missing the prop screw and washer, but both have tanks.
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Thanks for all the help. That's nice to hear it's a wonderful engine. Mine sounds like the AME, because it has 3 ports plus exhaust. I'm planning to build it onto a combat plane for the kids to try.
Yes, I'm still looking for some more Bee type engines. We'll start building the next set of planes probably in January. The management at the childrens home says that the kids are too busy now with school and the holidays. So, we could sure use the engines when we get started again.
Thanks again!
Here are some photos of the Northern Velocity (NorVel) engine:
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David,
Yes, that's AME porting, and you've also answered a question that I had about AME porting on the old non-Revlite cylinders. That's the first one that I've seen, but it confirms that they exist. H^^
I have a half dozen Norvels, but only one with AME porting. The sport engines are probably more useful for stunt and sport flying.
Let me go through my parts, to see if there is anything else you could use with the Cox engines. I also have some product engines, if your interested. No tanks on those of course, but perfect tanks can still be found.
Bill
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Thanks Bill!
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Let me go through my parts, to see if there is anything else you could use with the Cox engines. I also have some product engines, if your interested. No tanks on those of course, but perfect tanks can still be found.
Bill
AFAIK, Brodak carries teh Perfect tanks. I am pretty sure he bought out Perfect, and the rights to their goods.
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Bill,
Your right. H^^
Sams Hobbies also has Perfect tanks, and at their usual great prices.
http://www.sshobbies.com/
Bill
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Bill,
Your right. H^^
Sams Hobbies also has Perfect tanks, and at their usual great prices.
http://www.sshobbies.com/
Bill
It is always a great pleasure to deal with Joe! I wish many years of joy and success. He is one of many in our fantastic hobby who is a top drawer, class act.
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David,
A couple of things: Some CL flyers had trouble with early AME's . The problem was fuel draw. Keep the prop smallish so it can rev and mount the tank as close as possible. For the .061, many prefer an APC 5.7x3 or 6x2. It might be worth it to go with a pressured tank (like a bladder) or a smaller prop if you have problems. The next series of NORVEL engines had a courser needle valve and a pressure nipple on the muffler.
Unfortunately, the AMEs and Big Migs of that era had the size marked with ink or paint that came off very easily. Once it's off, the only way to tell size is to measure the bore and stroke, I believe.
I hope you understand that that AME has about twice the power of the Golden Bee, so size your plane accordingly.
Good luck with it. They ARE fine engines.
George
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OK. Thanks. Maybe I'll put the Norvel engine on something bigger that usually flies too slowly with a Golden Bee.