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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: Mike Griffin on October 28, 2014, 09:13:58 AM
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I have been corresponding with John Brodak in regard to kitting the MO BEST profile. I had talked with John some time ago about this and at that time he told me that he hoped to kit the design in future so I thanked him and told him I thought it would be a good addition to his line.
Yesterday I received an e mail from John telling me that he did not know if or when he would ever kit the model and he gave me the permission to go ahead and kit the model and that he would forward me the plans and data he had on it.
Although I never had the chance to meet Larry personally, I always thought that he was a brilliant man and designer as well as just a really great person. i read and gathered as much of his writing and design work as I could and tried to incorporate his ideas into my own building.
With all this being said, I would be more than willing to invest in the time and materials it would take to produce a kit of the MO BEST if there was sufficient interest within our CL community to warrant producing the kit and the only way I know how to do that is to just ask you all if you would invest in owning one.
Should you want a kit I will place your name on a waiting list secured by a deposit and then notify everyone of when they were ready to ship and ask for the balance due.
This is not something that is going to happen quick as a lot of things have to be set into motion for production for this to happen and I would suspect it would be next Spring before any kits would go out.
Pricing would be in line with other profiles of its size and type and of course a final cost cannot be established until and prototype is cut and materials are figured.
I ask you to give me some feedback on this if you will and if there is enough positive feedback and commitment, I will proceed with the production.
I have pictures of the completed model on my computer somewhere but for right now I will post these and I wish I knew whose plane this was so I could give them credit for a beautiful job but this will show you the beauty of this model.
Thank you very much fellows..
Mike
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Hi Mike,
Great looking plane. It appears to have a swept leading edge?. Would the wing have to be built on a jig? Could you also post some sizes e.g. wingspan and length. It looks like it has an os 40 or 46 for power, I also like the thick airfoil.
Thanks,
Rich
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Looks good Mike, I bet this generates some good interest. I used to have plans for this and Larry showed an ST .51 version along with the smaller .40 & .46 size. Its got my interest for sure. Gerald
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I had a Tigre G.51 in mine (like the photo) - was an excellent flier.
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I seem to remember years ago when Larry was giving John the go ahead to produce the kit. I wanted the kit and was waiting for it. I then asked about a set of plans and was also told that I would have to wait. Met Larry at a VSC years ago and he was confined to a wheel chair. A very nice gentleman and I wish i had taken more time to visit with him. but, there lots of people wanting to visit with him. It was some time later when his health finally took a down hill turn and was no longer with us. I can't remember who, but they were going to try and get all of Larry's info out of his computor and get it in print. He was a very brilliant man and I miss the posts Larry used to do on the forums.
Anyway Mike if you do decide to do the kit, will it have the standard control system or Larry's control system? He designed the variable system what ever you call it that moved according to the handle movement.
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Larry's control system was called the Expo-crank. There was a lengthy
article in SN many years ago explaining it. I always thought it was a
nice system that made good sense, but maybe a bit complicated.
Anyway, I've always liked the Mo Best and would definitely be interested
in a kit.
Thanks, Steve
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Gentlemen, due to some unforseen circumstances, this project is looking doubtful. I will have more on this later.
Thanks
Mike
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I like the looks of this plane. I would be interested in a set of plans and make it a full fuselage instead of profile. I am not a big fan of profiles.
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Mike-
Larry was working on a lavish instruction book, well illustrated with his famous CAD drawings. He sent me two of these sets to review and edit some, and I'm sure they're around here some place (I'd never throw anything like that out). Should you decide to do the kit and not find these, I'll find mine for you. Larry doubtless had the whole thing on disc, and it would be well worthwhile for one of our computer guys to try to obtain Larry's files so that they could be completed, if necessary, and implemented. Larry did just about everything on computer, and his materials, if John doesn't have them, would help in the laser cutting. I can't believe that he or John had not already set up to accomodate that.
SK
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I am sorry to have to announce that I will not be kitting the MO BEST due to some unforseen circumstances that have come up.
Mike
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Didn't give us much time to even think about it. Sad turn of events. JB isn't doing it and you aren't either.
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The project team was Bill Jacklin, Rob Compton, Mike Nelson in the UK and moi in Oz. We found a lot of material on Larry's computer including all the plans, component drawings and, yes Serge, Larry's highly detailed assembly manual.
Larry's drawings all featured a standard control system. He suggested to me on one occasion that while the Expo-crank worked, it was complex and so very dependent on manufacturing tolerances that each unit required careful hand fitting. If I remember correctly, he said that the tolerance issue made it not commercially viable. Again from memory, I think Larry had some laser cut in plastic—possibly acrylic. If he didn't cut some, he certainly talked about it. Some of the drawings show a conventional bellcrank tilted so that in elevation in the neutral position the bellcrank is at the same angle as the flap pushrod. There are even detailed ribs with the bellcrank support at the angle, but no notes of any value to those of us following behind. The angled bellcrank probably improves the linearity of the controls but by how much over hockey stick flap horns of the correct size for a particular model? I have no idea.
Larry was working on a full fuselage version that he called Mo'Beast and like Jim, it's my preference. There is not a lot of work left to be done to finish the plans for that version but like Mo'Best, it's a complex model and the interest level needs to be high to make it viable.
Working with the drawings, I saw a way to use the same flying surfaces for both models. The trick was to use flaps that fit the full fuselage version and supply fillets long enough to fill the extra space between the flaps and the profile fuselage. A simple straight cut would produce the shorter fillet for the full fuselage version. This would require only a change to the horns and the fuselage to produce both versions.
The only comment I will add to Mike's post is, 'Never say never.'
Given sufficient interest, anything is possible in time.
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I have built and competed with 2 mobests. Both are shown in the pictures at the top of this thread. The top one is the first that I started from the pampa plans and completed using the first CAD plans that Larry had started. The second one was built entirely from Larry's version of the CAD plans. I had the ribs laser cut from larry's DXF file and have so far built 2 wings from them. I also started a Mo-Beast but this stalled when Larry's health started failing. I do plan to complete it and it is sad that the Brodak promise wasn't carried through.
I built my wings on a jig and they turned out well.
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I just wanted to add, that I have had several conversations with Geoff and he and Mike Nelson, Robert Compton and Bill Jacklin have put in an amazing amount of work and time on this project to get this plane to market. I have no doubts with this kind of talent this team possesses, this project will be completed and I will own one of these kits. The fact that I had to bow out will not affect the determination of this team to see the project through.
Mike
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I hope they carry thru. I vaguely remember when Larry published the Mo Best and kep waiting on Brodak. I would like one just for the memory of and to honor Larry. He was such a gentleman in what little time I had with him at VSC and the posts on the forum.
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As Geoff said, never say never. Larry was working, revising up until about a month before he passed away.
Our group has been working on finishing all drawing (really Geoff) and Laser cutting files. Having all of Larry's files
of which there are over 16,000 (!!!) it has been a bit of work figuring out his system for which revision was the one he wanted to go with. We have a few options that we still are considering.
Stay tuned.
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Well gentlemen, they say watch what you ask for. Went out to the shop to did little more tidying up and guess what I found. A two page set of plans for Larry's Mo Best. If I remember right it said version VII, copyright 1996. Shows the built up profile fuselage and the option for a .51 size engine in one corner. Need to get copies made as it is getting a little discolored. I need to verify the stuff I just typed, so don't hold me to the version.
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Doc, the old PAMPA plan had an error on one of the ribs. I can't remember exactly what the error was now—it was the first job I did on the plans, almost two years ago—but, if your drawing doesn't have Revision A across the bottom, it's the old rib set.
If Bill or Rob see this, they may be able to elaborate because they have both experienced the error.
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Larry's control system was called the Expo-crank. There was a lengthy
article in SN many years ago explaining it. I always thought it was a
nice system that made good sense, but maybe a bit complicated.
I think you should use it. I think Doug should, too.
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Geoff, The root rib was not correct on the plans as I had a set of ribs laser cut from those plans. I told Larry and he corrected it but out of convenience I used rib #2 as the root and made the wing like that since I couldn't fit the full size wing in my car at the time.
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Lee, that's it. I remembered that the error meant that you couldn't cut a set of correct ribs using the sandwich method but couldn't remember why.
The important thing is that the old PAMPA plan contained the error and the plan that PAMPA sells now has been corrected.