Kind of shocked

[Doug Moon]

This post was made in another thread by Scott Richlen,

Scott I hope you don't mind me lifting this and giving it's own airspace.  If so let me know and I will remove it ASAP.

Here's the latest from AMA District IV:

DC SFRA NO FLY ZONE - December 31, 2015

Hello District IV Members,

By now, everyone has probably heard about the fields in the Washington, D.C. Special Flight Rules Area (SFRA) being closed. The FAA requested all flying fields inside the SFRA out to the 30nm limit centered on Reagan National Airport to stop operations and all flying to cease. This involves everything that flies no matter whether it is at an organized field or your backyard. We have complied and informed all of the AMA clubs with fields inside the SFRA as well as any other groups we are aware of such as Multi GP and DC DUG and are working with the FAA on a resolution.

So, within a 30 mile radius of Reagan National: no flying.

Here's the problem for everyone else: what happens if FAA decides to apply this to every commercial field in the U.S.?  Are you currently flying within 30 miles of an airport?

Scott

I have to say I was kind of shocked this didn't get a bunch of feathers raised.  Maybe it was buried far enough down to where many didn't see it.
With a new BASH A DRONE thread starting every day I thought surely this would garner a pretty harsh response to the FAA's current push toward governing everything that has to do with, well, everything....included good old tethered flight.  The thought of a CL plane snapping off the lines and somehow crossing 30nm is actually funny as SH$T but the result in the agency's inability to use common sense is not funny.  And the AMA.......who......hahahaha.  I am not really laughing.  My field is less than 30nm from Love Field I wonder if we are next..

[Fredvon4]

Because of this DoT/FAA ruling to register all aircraft, UAS, sUAS, including small aircraft for hobby use only:

I found myself looking up the current FAA Notice to Airmen (NOTAM)s and saw the broad restriction when OBAMA was in Hawaii and thought to myself that very few RC or other Model airplane pilots would ever think to see if there was a No Fly Zone that would include their models at a local field or own yard/property

So Doug
 I assume that if the president or VP was to visit Dallas  (or in my case land at Robert Grey Army Airfield GRK) the usual NOTAMs would NOW include all of us hobby aircraft fliers.... Thankfully these restriction would not be permanent like the Regan National restriction sounds like it is. 

[Bob Matiska]

I certainly share your concern, as we all should. I joined the Swetland RC Flyers, an AMA chartered club in Wyoming, Pa some years ago, since it has a nice field a few miles from my home.  But we're just a mile or so from a small local airport, so almost any extension of this policy would shut us down. Note that we have a great relationship with this airport; they even invite us to their twice-yearly open houses to display and fly our aircraft. They won't try to stop our flying unless we do something really disastrous, but you never know what the bureaucrats in Washington will do if they go overboard over an abundance of caution.

The AMA website has a good statement about the current situation at its website:

http://amablog.modelaircraft.org/amagov/2015/12/30/ama-finding-a-solution-for-special-flight-rules-area-sfra-in-the-d-c-area/


I wonder how many AMA members are affected by this policy. Hopefully people at the FAA will come to their senses and back down on the restrictions. Or maybe it'll take a lawsuit by the AMA. Or maybe we all need to write our congresspersons...


Bob in NEPA

[Carl Cisneros]

Doug

We were talking about this last Saturday up at Scotts place.

no fun here at all believe me..................

Carl Cisneros Dist IV
Control Line Racing Board

17 miles south of Reagan Airport

[Jim Kraft]

The nationals would not be able to be held at Muncie as they are within 30 miles of an airport also. I am afraid this whole thing is going to blow up in all of our faces and there is nothing we can do about any of it. As Sparky said, hey buddy, what are you in for. " I was flying my Cox PT19 trainer in my back yard. " But I get out in three years upon good behavior and if I promise never to fly anything again.

[Randy Cuberly]

I thought the latest thing we heard from the AMA was that Control Line was not affected!

Randy Cuberly

[Randy Powell]

Well, we fly AT an airport so that would suck. Do you have to be lobotomized to work for the FAA?

[wwwarbird]

Do you have to be lobotomized to work for the FAA?

 Yes Randy, for years now that appears to be the primary qualification for about any Government position, and apparently the AMA as well.

[Mike Griffin]

I'm just waiting for the executive order banning all models.

Mike

[Ted Fancher]

There is some modest reason for sanity regarding airspace other than the Washington SFRA.  That acronym stands for the unique 30NM radius airspace Special Flight Restricted Area around Reagan National, the Capitol, the White House, etc.  All aircraft in that area may only fly when in contact with and under the control of Air Traffic Control because of the politically sensitive nature of the area.  It is possible that such complete shut down may, at least initially be restricted to that specific area.  It has been established for several years (sometime during my stint as an analyst at the NASA Aviation Safety Reporting System sometime subsequent to 9/11 and is charted and closely controlled with penalties up to and including military interception for, heretofore, allowable general aviation operations.

Like others, however, I'm not at all certain "our" government won't continue to usurp the rights of "its" citizens...for their own good.  I'm still flying my sorta loud kites that look a lot like TPs and Ruffys for the time being.  Thinking about putting crepe paper "tails" on 'em to attest to their benign nature.

[Steve Helmick]

If you talk to AMA nicely, they will email you about NOTAMS that apply to your locality. They notify me, but not being an R/C flier, frankly, I don't give a damn.   Steve

Edit: Just found an AMA Communique in my inbox. It says "for club officers, CD's, Leader Members", etc. You probably qualify, or could get a copy forwarded by somebody in your club or circle of friends.

[John Bocksnick]

As I understand it the grounding includes tethered model aircraft.

John Bocksnick

[david beazley]

As I understand it the grounding includes tethered model aircraft.

John Bocksnick

That is the info I got from the AMA AVP, Rick Moreland ALL model A/C grounded, even FF.
Our club is outside the SFRA in central VA, we have sent an invitation to the affected clubs in the area that can fly at our field.  if anyone is interested they can PM me for details

[Steve Helmick]

As I understand it the grounding includes tethered model aircraft.

John Bocksnick

We're special...since we're near (in) the other Washington (Pacific Timezone). Obama and his crew can screw up I-5 while we fly our CL models at Auburn Muni.  Steve

[Fredvon4]

I am waiting for a phone call so sitting here reading and thinking...of course most of us know the POTUS and others are (supposedly) well protected--- but I often wonder how many actually understand the extremes the Secret Service goes to, to limit problems, even within the USA

Most of us remember Pres Clinton screwing up flight operations in southern Calif, just for a haircut

For 8 years President George Bush made a few(many) trips to his ranch in Texas, fairly close to Fort Hood.

Initially Air-force 1 would land at Grey Army Airfield (GRK) basically shutting down any travel on this installation until he was transported off post to Crawford 51 miles away.

The actual impact was about 4 hours inbound and 2 hours outbound. This was frequent enough for the post commander at the time to ask for some relief so the soldiers and staff could follow a rational training and daily life program.  (I personally was proud of the commander of III Corps to have the huevos the even ask for some consideration, can't remember if it was LaPorte or Ordierno)

The powers that be understood the impact and found a solution: They moved the landing of POTUS/AF-1 to Waco's Technical College airfield with a much lesser impact.

My office was on west Fort Hood and our 2nd floor balcony has a great view of GRK.  Most of us knew in advance if the POTUS was coming, as there were many overflights of the area from the so called black helicopters.

The day before a few F15s would land, refuel, and do several different high performance max after burner take offs, then some touch n goes then park in HiCAP until AF-1 was safely landed. We even figured out when Bush was on his way here from the behavior of the F15s.... then they would all be gone and life and traffic got back to normal

I guess it is not too surprising that we ALL are included in the special use flight restrictions and various NOTAMs and we must take/accept some of it as national or POTUS/VIP security

But I strongly distrust my current government (no matter what party) and suspect we will see more and more restrictions for the use of NAS as time goes on

Hope I am wrong ----but I doubt we have seen all the stupid crap a bunch of politicians and bureaucrats can screw up

[david beazley]

I used to live inside the beltway in northern VA until 97.  I can remember when Bill Clinton would tie up the beltway and I-66 with all sorts of state and local police vehicles so a parade of black suburbans escorting the limo could get him to his golf outing on time.  We are all peasants and the politicians the new royalty.

[Brett Buck]

As I understand it the grounding includes tethered model aircraft.

  "Tethered" not equal "C/L" in the mind of the FAA. Tethered seems to mean aircraft flown via an umbilical cord with electronic signals, like a drone with the radio link defeated and a long wire to send the signals.

   Not that this is likely to make any important difference to use, since the subtlety above is likely to be overlooked.

    Brett

[WR Crane aka MrClean]

I have heard recently of some folks who would tether their RC airplane and fly it in a circle using the remote controls.  One of the reports was of a modeler whose vision went bad.  There was also talk of tethering Quadcopters (see, it's not a drone it's been leashed).

No idea if that's what the FAA speak was referring too but I can see where the ability of the plane to be released and flown as normal would make it as dangerous.  I've heard of handles, lines and planes going for a flight but not for long and we mostly use thongs now except in races so I don't see how it would apply to us.

As with gun control, the rules still don't fix a problem just makes somebody feel good.

[dave siegler]

So in the SFR area washington, all the general aviation airports were permanently closed.  I remember seeing GA aircraft with big chains locked to the propeller.

If owning that airport was a mom and pop business, well you were screwed.

There was some radius that where airports were temporally closed and some radius that was permanently closed.

Does any know where the radius of the RC clubs are in question? 

[david beazley]

30 miles radius of Reagan National Airport.

[Brett Buck]

I have heard recently of some folks who would tether their RC airplane and fly it in a circle using the remote controls.  One of the reports was of a modeler whose vision went bad.  There was also talk of tethering Quadcopters (see, it's not a drone it's been leashed).

   Type tethered drone into the internet and you will find what I was referring to. It's not just talk, that is already being done, extensively, long before this came along. That's what the FAA apparently wants to regulate, not CL - again, with the caveat above!

   Brett