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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: Steven Kientz on March 28, 2012, 03:34:07 PM
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Browsing the jan 1969 issue of MAN and saw a 2 view of this plane. Has anyone built/ flown this? Is this a euro copy of a Nobler, or original design? does anyone have plans?
Steve
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Browsing the jan 1969 issue of MAN and saw a 2 view of this plane. Has anyone built/ flown this? Is this a euro copy of a Nobler, or original design? does anyone have plans?
Steve
Paul Winter of England, has built and flown one of the best versions seen. It is an original design.
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I'm far from needing a high level competition plane, but I really like the looks of that one.
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the super master is an excellent flying airplane - I have the plans I can e-mail you
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Thanks Wynn !!
stevekientz@comcast.net
Steve
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Browsing the jan 1969 issue of MAN and saw a 2 view of this plane. Has anyone built/ flown this? Is this a euro copy of a Nobler, or original design? does anyone have plans?
Steve
That small drawing of the Super Master in the Jan 69 issue of MAN (the Round & Round column by Pete Soule) was done by Jim Mayfield who was a very competitive stunt flier in southern California during the mid 60's and early 70's. (Mayfield did a 12 month series of these drawings in MAN at that time.) As noted on that drawing, the Super Master was by Josef Gabris of Czechoslovakia and that drawing showed its record at the World Championships flown by Gabris. 9th in 62, 5th in 64, 1st in 66, 1st in 68. After that drawing was published in MAN, Gabris flew to 3rd place at the 70 World Championships (behind Werwage and Giesiki which is the first year an American won the World Championship title.).
The Super Master was published in Aeromodeller, Apr 67. Full size plans are available from the AMA Plans Service.
From information published at that time, Mayfield determined the dimensions to be a 55.5 in span with 624 sq in area. The construction article stated the weight to be 43 oz. Flaps and tail surfaces were built up with open bays. Plans show over and under leadouts (like those used by Dick Williams' Electra and Bart Klapinski's Tempest and some of the Palmer designs). Power was the rear intake MVVS 5.6 engine (about .35 cu in displacement).
It is a nicely proportioned, even handsome looking airplane, obviously capable of top performance.
Keith
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Here in Arizona I believe Leroy Black flew a Super Master several years ago. As I recall, it performed quite well.
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At the Australian Nationals in 1970, Supermasters placed 2nd and 3rd, 1972 with 2nd and 3rd once again and 1973 I came 3rd with my Enya 45 powered Supermaster. So yes, they were quite competitive back then.
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the super master is an excellent flying airplane - I have the plans I can e-mail you
Wynn, would it be to much to ask you to email them to me as well? I've seen one pic of this plane and haven't been able to find it again since. This might be my next build.
Thanks,
Doug
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(Clip)
I've seen one pic of this plane and haven't been able to find it again since.
(Clip)
Doug
Best I can do with this scanner.
Keith
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Yes Steve, Jozef was my friend and I had several Supermasters. It will fly wery well these days. The only point is that it needs to be light, so do not try to "overpower" it by heavy equipment. The weight must be well under 50oz, best flyers were at 45oz, and it also means that it is not to strong wind.
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Tom Dixon seems to have an "Americanized" version on his plans list (whatever that means).
*SUPER MASTER - Josef Gabris (CSSR), 1st. at '66 World Champs. Classic looks. Excellent double-duty "Classic" and "Pro Stunt" model. 55" span, structure Americanized". Original used MVVS '56, a .40-.50 suggested.
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This is a good plan of the Supermaster sent to me by one of the Russian modellers a couple of years ago. Not sure which one Wynn has but this PDF is full size if anyone wants a copy of this version.
More memories Igor! Pic of Josef at Utrecht 1976. Still have some props I bought from Josef and his mate.
HH
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I have on film Ortes Hernandese flying one in Tuscon
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Nice looking ship. Looks kind of like a cross between a "Space Hound" and a Southwick "Skylark".
Something different...............I like it. y1 y1
Jerry
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Here is Paul Winter's SuperMaster photographed in 2005 at the CLAPA champs.
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The forerunner to the Super Master was the "Master". Mr. Gabris used it to win the "Critrium de' Aces in Brussels in 1958. It was a constant chord, turtle deck design.
Tug Wilson did am article in England a couple years ago with plans. It was close to the same size as the Super Master.
BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM
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Hello Dallas
Please send me the Supermaster PDF, I will apreciate it. I have two of the MVVS 5.6 engines not sure if they are the same as the one used by Gabris. This ones have a bolt on header and mufflers.
Juan
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Hey Herb - I have the same plans, plus one from Aeromodeller - both are full size PDFs - so I can send to anyone also
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Hello Dallas
Please send me the Supermaster PDF, I will apreciate it. I have two of the MVVS 5.6 engines not sure if they are the same as the one used by Gabris. This ones have a bolt on header and mufflers.
Juan
Hi Juan, Wynn. The pdf form has been a great way of sharing plans around the world. Many paper plans get buried or lost over the years which makes it hard for many to obtain a working copy. Plan should be there now Juan. Many of us here in OZ flew the Supermaster in the late 60s/early 70s, most powered by Merco 35 engines. Also most were under 45 oz. Dare I say that the Supermaster is a better flying model than any T-Bird! I can justify that statement due to being a T-bird flyer for most of the 60s and having constructed some 15 of them over the years to as late as 1997. One that I built around 1990 for classic has surfaced for sale in a model shop on the south coast of New South Wales. Tempting to buy it back but I resisted that last nip of Scotch. :##
Wynn, can you send me the Aeromodeller PDF so I have both as well. I still have the Aeromodeller plan which I used for my build in 1970 but it does look a bit rough now after 42 years!!
HH
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Thanks everyone for posting pics and offering the plans.
Steve
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I have on film Ortes Hernandese flying one in Tuscon
John,
I believe that it was Orestes Perdomo that you have film of flying at VSC not Orestes Hernandez. They are both Cubans and are flying buddies in Miami. Perdomo is Orestes Hernandez mentor and coach.
The Super Master is an excellent flying classic ship with a great performance record. A good basic layout that works well.
Jim Rhoades
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Herb - I'll send it in a mintue - its a 21meg file - scanned back when I didnt know what I was doing with my scanner and plans - I now have over 30,000 plans - like you, I keep them in digital format so they are not lost to future generations (until the digital age dies)
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Hi Wynn,
Can you please send me a PDF of the Super Master also.
Thanks,
Roger
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Hello Dallas
Received PDF I really appreciate you sending the plan. I will have it printed tomorrow.Thanks.
Juan
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Hello Dallas
Please send me the Supermaster PDF, I will apreciate it. I have two of the MVVS 5.6 engines not sure if they are the same as the one used by Gabris. This ones have a bolt on header and mufflers.
Juan
Hi Juan,
Those "look" like the old MVVS 5.6 but there were only something like 21 of them made back in the day. Very difficult to find if not impossible. The engine was based loosely on their racing engine with something near stunt timing. Only available to the USSR team members and associated countries.
I have been looking for a rear exhaust example (but knowing I cannot get an "original") for some time.
I did find an Akrobat .42 (used by the Soviets after the MVVS) and it runs similar to a ST .46. stunt. It is slated for a Gabris "Master", and later a Sirotkin "Ilyushin" from 1969.
Bill
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Hi Wynn,
Can you please send me a PDF of the Super Master also.
Thanks,
Roger
Perhaps you would like to have this scan that I made from an old Kodachrome slide that Les McDonald snapped at the 76 World Cup in Holland.
GREAT SHOT LES!
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Hey Jim, that could be Tuscon 1993 I think.
If you are correct thanks for the tip, if not I'm speechless
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Hello Bill
They are the real deal,MVVS 5.6 stunt engines. I got them from a Stunt flier from one of those associated countries. They have no markings but when I got them many years back I was told they were MVVS 5.6. I don`t know how old they are but I have seen another and it was listed as a circa 1957 MVVS.35 .Here is a Pic.
Juan
Found a place with info on the MVVS 5.6 here it is:http://modelenginenews.org/ad/mvvs.html#t4
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MVVS is not soviet engine it was produced in Czech town Brno on regular basis ... factory called MVVS ... it still exists and still makes engines, nowadays also electric.
MVVS 5.6A was made 1957 in first run really only 20 engines and given for testing to stunt guys, but later produced regularly almost everyone who flew stunt had it here. That engine on picture is from regular production, becuase that first run did not have screw for muffler. That motor was designed especially for C/L stund and those days mufflers were not necessary. Later they made exhaust screw either for muffler or for exhaust valve for R/C version.
MVVS 5.6A was dedicated for stunt. However the MVVS 5.6A was BACKWARD modified to speed 5ccm version and it was used by Bohumil Studeny for making speed record 244km/h and then the MVVS did a clone of that motor for speed. That modified engine from regular production was called MVVS 5R.
Before those 2 motors we had also speed engine 5ccm produced in Prague, called "Vltavan 5", it was designed and developed in MVVS, but for another factory.
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Is the "Super Master" plan suitable for posting publicly?
http://www.hippocketaeronautics.com/hpa_plans/index.php routinely takes 5 Mb files
and http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1288656&page=27 should handle 3 Mb
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FWIW
The "Super Master" by Gabris is listed in the John Pond plan service catalog as plan # 57G6 and should be available from the AMA plans service.
Use the 57G6 as a cross reference.
Jerry
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FWIW
The "Super Master" by Gabris is listed in the John Pond plan service catalog as plan # 57G6 and should be available from the AMA plans service.
Use the 57G6 as a cross reference.
Jerry
I am sure you are aware that the Pond plan service was taken over by the AMA.
Please read Reply #5 above.
Keith
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from history of MVVS
http://modelenginenews.org/ad/mvvs.html
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I have always wanted to build a Master, rather than the more popular Supermaster. I didn't know that Tug Wilson had done an article with plan, a few years back. Anyone know where it was published?
Regards,
Andrew.
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Wynn Robins -I have the same plans, plus one from Aeromodeller - both are full size PDFs - so I can send to anyone also i would allso like a copy of these plans bouth sets would be nice email bradshimflyer@aol.com thanks .
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I have always wanted to build a Master, rather than the more popular Supermaster. I didn't know that Tug Wilson had done an article with plan, a few years back. Anyone know where it was published?
Regards,
Andrew.
Hi Andrew,
I believe it was in the CLAPA (??) magazine. Full size plans available to boot.
Bill
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A Super Master plan (in original language), along with some other interesting plans, has just appeared in the Hippocket Aeronautics Plans Gallery.
(registration to Forum AND Gallery required to download)
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I have one finished; with a PA40 rear exhaust, hangingon my wall . fininhed ;but never flown (alas).
I made molded sheet top and bottom for the body and would reccommend doing same to save weight and money. :'(
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FWIW
The "Super Master" by Gabris is listed in the John Pond plan service catalog as plan # 57G6 and should be available from the AMA plans service.
Use the 57G6 as a cross reference.
Jerry
AMA # 26702 $18.00 Should be able to get a second set of plans for half price, for cutting up or making templates. H^^