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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: Norm Faith Jr. on December 28, 2011, 12:15:59 AM
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Thanks to plans and templates from Dalton Hammett, I was able to re-create a plane from my long; long ago past. The Enterprise Maverick. (mine was an Ambroid kit) 23" span, 20" long, for .09 - .19 size engines. I flew the Maverick in the King Orange, circa 1962 as a Junior in "Rat." I didn't have a tremendous knowledge of "Rat Racing," but I knew that a big engine on a small air-frame would "GO FAST!" My 1962 ship had the 1/4" fuselage increased to 3/8", along with the wing also. The stab was increased to 3/16". The only big engine I had at the time was the McCoy .35 Red Head. I ran it on "Glo39" and a Top Flite 9X6 Prop. I was around 15 years old and my dad was my "pit man." We didn't do very well, but it was one heck of an experience. We broke a set of lines during the pull test and a hero of mine, at the time; came out of no where and "gave" me a set of lines to compete with...her name was Betty Bell, a famous (to me) F/F Master. To this day, I always wondered what she was doing with control line stuff? But who knows? She saved the day for me.
This new Maverick has the 3/8" fuselage and wing, along with the 3/16" stab. The push-rod is carbon fiber with a modern bushing style 1 and 3/4" bell crank. The fuel tank is 2 ounces, custom built. I made some slight changes to the L/G installation. The engine a New (never ran) .35 Red Head with the factory 'Testors Plug," 8 1/2X 6 1/2 pylon racing prop. The finish is Rust-Oleum; Almond; spray can enamel. The red is Red Devil Latex with back trim tape. The whole finish was clear-coated.
BTW: I still have the original Red Head that I flew on the 1962 ship.
I know its not "Stunt," but now that it is done I can finish my second Angel, P/A ship and get started on my Profile Stiletto.
Norm
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It won't do a loop or a wing over.
If not....why not? D>K
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Talk about a blast from the past! Good Job Norm!!!
I'm with John, I'll bet it would loop and even go inverted IF you maintain a healthy dose of down elevator!
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Looks great Norm!
Bring it o Ed this next year and I'll race you! y1
Edit......
This is what auto correct looks like on a iPhone....
Should have read Bring it over to the MSC this next year and I'll race you! y1
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Nose heavy, I would guess. That motor is a monster with respect to the model..
Nice pics, reminding me of a couple of my early CL models (mine weren't so well finished).
Thanks for posting.
L.
"Shhhh! I hear footprints." -Vernon Appoy
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Snip
We didn't do very well, but it was one heck of an experience. We broke a set of lines during the pull test and a hero of mine, at the time; came out of no where and "gave" me a set of lines to compete with...her name was Betty Bell, a famous (to me) F/F Master. To this day, I always wondered what she was doing with control line stuff? But who knows? She saved the day for me.
snip
Norm
Norm,
I can second that "Betty Bell hero" commendation.
Back in 1959 my brother Gary and I attended the Los Alimitos NAS Nats after riding the train down from Seattle (Our dad had flown our airplanes down in his Apache and left them with family friends in Riverside, CA).
I was flying a Fox .35 powered Ruffy in Junior Stunt and was doing very well. I had placed first in my qualifying circle (Yes, they had enough JRs and SRs to required qualifying rounds!) and was excited about the finals the next day. I went out in the afternoon, insinuated myself into a practice circle shared with none other than Bob Palmer, and proceeded to put in the first of a few planned practice flights.
The flight was going well until halfway through the overhead eights when the Fox suddenly spit the crankshaft, prop and spinner out the front end and the airplane wafted around until striking the ground and tearing out both main gear. What followed was a classic "Nats all night rebuild" session in the wonderful much lamented Navy hangar with row after row of temporary plywood and saw horse work tables. We had our hands full needing to somehow rebuild and recover about one half of the bottom of the wing.
Duke Fox (who always haunted the stunt circles scoping out guys using his engines) showed up at the table almost immediately, took the remains of the engine and said he'd have it back in the morning with a "loose" fit so it wouldn't require a lot of break in. Gary and I then looked forlornly at the Ruffy with no real good idea about how to go about repairing it.
Like manna from heaven, who should appear but Bill and Betty Bell...she in her clipped short blond hair and even shorter Safari styled shorts; her slim build requiring a second glance to determine she was, in fact, a lady in what was then almost exclusively a man's (and boy's) world. In their hands they held some balsa wood, some silkspan, some dope and some stuff called fibreglass and the resin that went with it. Bill and Betty spent a goodly amount of their evening making suggestions for rebuilding and teaching us the joys of quickly setting catalyzed "goo" to secure the gear back into the wing. They then left us the silkspan and dope and ran off to get a bite to eat, saying they'd be back to make sure we were getting along OK; which they did, blessed our efforts, wished us good luck and retired to wherever it was they were staying. We finished the repair in the early hours of finals morning and ran off to the Navy dorms (another lamented staple of the old days) for a couple of hours sleep.
In a perfect world I would have come out blazing the next day and won the whole thing and had my picture taken on Sunday with Billy Werwage (who won Senior AND the Walker Cup flyoff) and Bob Palmer (who won the Open event). Alas, it was not to be. The Fox Duke brought back in the early AM had only a couple of tanks run through it before officials began and the engine overheated part way through each of the official patterns. In the last flight I did complete the pattern although the engine went lean and my landing consisted of a touchdown and several dozen low speed laps as the engine sputtered along before seizing.
I did, nonetheless, finish in sixth place not an awful showing and learned of the generosity and comradery that make modeling a "special" enterprise for a lifetime. I've never forgotten Bill and Betty although I never saw them again (they were from Texas and I was from Washington and didn't attend a Nats again until 1967). I bet, however, I could still pick Betty out of a lineup if she had her hair cut short and was wearing those same short safari shorts!
Ted
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Nose heavy, I would guess. That motor is a monster with respect to the model..
Nice pics, reminding me of a couple of my early CL models (mine weren't so well finished).
Thanks for posting.
L.
"Shhhh! I hear footprints." -Vernon Appoy
Believe it or not Larry, it balances at 1 1/2" behind the leading edge. I haven't tried to fly it yet. I'll wait for some warmer weather.
Thanks for the compliments.
Norm
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"I can second that "Betty Bell hero" commendation."
Hi Ted,
I've always wondered what happen to them...I sort of lost contact with what was happening in the "modeling world" due to a having to wear a "pickle suit" and fix bullet holes. When I came back, they seemed to have faded away. I found very little information on the internet; over the years. But, I'll never forget that experience.
Norm H^^
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I was under the impression that the Bells were from Florida, or maybe they moved. Many years ago, I asked somebody whatever happened to them, and got the reply that they were in a bad car accident (head-on), were severely injured, and unable to compete anymore. Sad! H^^
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Believe it or not Larry, it balances at 1 1/2" behind the leading edge. I haven't tried to fly it yet. I'll wait for some warmer weather.
Thanks for the compliments.
What prop ya using? Maybe if ya slow it down a smidge and give it more grunt[power], it'll turn the corners better. H^^?
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From what I can make out in the first picture I would suspect that the pushrod is bending when you apply up control. I would suggest adding a pushrod guide to decrease bowing. In the "old" days, we used Ambroid glue tube tops. :-)
George
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I was under the impression that the Bells were from Florida, or maybe they moved. Many years ago, I asked somebody whatever happened to them, and got the reply that they were in a bad car accident (head-on), were severely injured, and unable to compete anymore. Sad! H^^
Steve,
My memory tells my Texas, but....
Well, as you will learn, at my age the Blue Book value on memories is pretty low!
Sure hope the auto accident story isn't true. Sounds too much like Ed and Helen Southwick. Too many, too soon.
Ted
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Nose heavy, I would guess. That motor is a monster with respect to the model..
Nice pics, reminding me of a couple of my early CL models (mine weren't so well finished).
Thanks for posting.
L.
"Shhhh! I hear footprints." -Vernon Appoy
'spect you're right, Larry. Plus, if that wing span is 23" the average chord can't be more than four inches which makes for a very skinny wing with an area of less than 100 square inches. Add in the tiny tail and you can bet it won't be turning many sharp corners!
But it's cute as a bug.
Ted
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Definatly tooose heavy. either add weight to the tail or shorten the nose.
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Thanks for the comments guys...I still haven't run the engine. I want to do that on the stand. I've got to make a new set of lines and a do a couple of other things before I try to fly it. My original plane flew quite stable under power, but when the engine quit...it morphed into a 2X4. %^@
Norm
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Looking real good Norm. Enjoyed the story. We need to get together and do some flying!
Jason
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Steve,
My memory tells my Texas, but....
Well, as you will learn, at my age the Blue Book value on memories is pretty low!
Sure hope the auto accident story isn't true. Sounds too much like Ed and Helen Southwick. Too many, too soon.
Ted
Funny how some things stick with us, good and bad.
Definitely from Texas with the attitude to match IMO, don't ask for details. Maybe good memories are the only ones that should be passed on.
If she flew CL it was to get in events to count for the Overall Nats Champ. It was decided on results from three Free Flight, three CL, and three indoor events. She was primarily an FFer, and a very good one at that.
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I was under the impression that the Bells were from Florida, or maybe they moved. Many years ago, I asked somebody whatever happened to them, and got the reply that they were in a bad car accident (head-on), were severely injured, and unable to compete anymore. Sad! H^^
Your right Steve, the Bell's were from Delray Beach, right up the street from where I grew up at...Miami. Rode my bicycle to the King Orange one day, about four miles from my house to Master Field. (Amelia Earhart Field)
http://airplanesandrockets.com/magazines/navy-host-to-most-exciting-air-model-nationals-nov-1962-am.htm
See paragraph "Club Reflections." Some wise advice.
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My original plane flew quite stable under power, but when the engine quit...it morphed into a 2X4. %^@
Norm
That's funny Norm, reminds me of the movie "Space Cowboys". ;D I bet an Enya .15 will bolt right up. S?P
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:)))))) Looks greate and really much remind me for another model, which i had. :) It is also old, and i want really really much to refreshed it. So I change little bit the airfoil of wing, the tail. Because of years the balsa become with yellow colour and a lot of holes and small spots...so it need a lot of sanding and than polishing :) I was happy like little kid when i restore it at all and give back his shining with new colours :)))))
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:)))))) Looks greate and really much remind me for another model, which i had. :) It is also old, and i want really really much to refreshed it. So I change little bit the airfoil of wing, the tail. Because of years the balsa become with yellow colour and a lot of holes and small spots...so it need a lot of sanding and than polishing :) I was happy like little kid when i restore it at all and give back his shining with new colours :)))))
That's a dandy right there Tania, is that a NV Big Mig diesel? Suhweeeeet! CLP**
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I remember Bill and Betty Bell from when they lived in Fort Wortg Texas and we all flew at Forest Park. I'll never forget Betty with her Super Mouse rat racer. Also,Bill flying his Mackey ME-109 stuunt ship that was published in American Modeler in 1958. So this would be 58 or 59 and I was 13 or 14.
They also got me interested in free flight which they excelled at. Remember Faust Parker flying with that group.
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That's a dandy right there Tania, is that a NV Big Mig diesel? Suhweeeeet! CLP*
I second that! Tania...What are the dimensions on the airframe? What type of plane is it? It looks like one of the PDQ ships. My Maverick wound up weighing in a 18oz. What does your plane with that diesel weigh? Have you flown it yet? H^^
Norm
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:))) #^
The airplane named - Lion Cub
24"inc.wing span
it is planed to fly with 1.5 cm3
Weights 18 oz.(500 GR)
props - 8 x 4 OR 9 X 5
diesel engine MK 17 ::)))
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And the question about flying :))))
I still can not realized from nervs ( I know it sound stupid little bit ) it's a fact. Since from 4 years i start to read and interesting about acrobatic models. But the first thing which impressed me was the design of model indeed. I am talking about the shapes of models, not only the construction! I want to draw the lines, the colours of them and to give some shining which in my oppinion somehow lost in the most beautiful models like construction. But if you want to draw some shape colour of something you must know truelly how is build and how is made. The shapes of colours must follow and underline the construction of plane - maybe little bit sharp, maybe little bit soft but to found that colours and shapes of them which give shing and when you saw it on ground and also in sky easely to regoznied that this is the perfect deisgin for that model :) So before i start to draw on models it was nessery to learn about them and i did. For me i can say now it's enought. I am concetrating in that part of building planes and i want to keep going. Do i want to run model and fly with it - yes for sure i want :) heheh and even i can say that - my favorite figure is wing over :) But I need time to be enought strong inside to do that. Last year i had a chance for one day to run small Gee Bee ( indoor model ), because of my friend Igor Burger and Alex Schrek. It was greate pleasure for me and a lot of fun. But you know was phoam model, not such one which i had ( that one on photos ) and also another one which i finished soon. And finally because i am afraid not to be borring i will show pictures from my first fly :) I promissed! :))
Thank you for evrything !
Tania
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Tania, the resurection of that plane is awesome. I like it as it looks like a plane that needs to be flown everyday. I like the diesel power plant also. H^^
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And the question about flying :))))
I still can not realized from nervs ( I know it sound stupid little bit ) it's a fact. Since from 4 years i start to read and interesting about acrobatic models. But the first thing which impressed me was the design of model indeed. I am talking about the shapes of models, not only the construction! I want to draw the lines, the colours of them and to give some shining which in my oppinion somehow lost in the most beautiful models like construction. But if you want to draw some shape colour of something you must know truelly how is build and how is made. The shapes of colours must follow and underline the construction of plane - maybe little bit sharp, maybe little bit soft but to found that colours and shapes of them which give shing and when you saw it on ground and also in sky easely to regoznied that this is the perfect deisgin for that model :) So before i start to draw on models it was nessery to learn about them and i did. For me i can say now it's enought. I am concetrating in that part of building planes and i want to keep going. Do i want to run model and fly with it - yes for sure i want :) heheh and even i can say that - my favorite figure is wing over :) But I need time to be enought strong inside to do that. Last year i had a chance for one day to run small Gee Bee ( indoor model ), because of my friend Igor Burger and Alex Schrek. It was greate pleasure for me and a lot of fun. But you know was phoam model, not such one which i had ( that one on photos ) and also another one which i finished soon. And finally because i am afraid not to be borring i will show pictures from my first fly :) I promissed! :))
Thank you for evrything !
Tania
I get a big kick outta listening to you talk......my neighbor years ago was Alex Grachev, and his mom, we called "Mama Grachev", and I worked in a bottle washing factory with his dad Pete(r)[they came over from Russia]! They all talked just like you do. Makes me feel happy to hear it again. ;D
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Looking at Norms article, I guess Bob Violett always liked to go fast.
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Ted,
Haven't seen you since Hungary, hope all is well.
I was also at the 1959 Nats and flew in Jr. stunt.
Bill and Betty Bell were from Florida moved to Texas and back to Florida.
They were great competitors and did a lot for this sport in the early days.
Bill and Betty are both deceased, Bill only about a year and Betty several years.
There was a FF contest this past weekend in Palm Bay. Florida and both of their
sons were there.
I highlighted the article that Norm posted, which I have not seen before and
there was something about me and FF Scale, nice to see old stuff but a far cry
from present day F2C.
Dick Lambert
Daytona Beach, FL.
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Well done Tania ... we are waiting for youtube video from first flight :- )))))))))))
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John, yes, some of us are born on slavic side of world ... I will not be surprised if Tania knows some Александeр Грачeв in Sofia where she lives :- )))))))
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John, yes, some of us are born on slavic side of world ... I will not be surprised if Tania knows some Александeр Грачeв in Sofia where she lives :- )))))))
HAHAHA **)....... ;D....I can't wait to see the youtube!
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Hey, Igor :))))
Yes, John, that name is use often in Bulgaria - Alexandar :)))) even it's sound russion!
And about video - wait until summer or just come on WC :))) and you will saw me there :P It is winter here - snowing storm last night and more and more cm snow... ;( So no chance - the winter here is long until April :(
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I hope the snow stops soon, Tania....in dog years, I'm dead already! LL~ LL~ LL~ ;D
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Hi Norm
Sorry I missed this one when you posted it. The plane looks great - might have to build one myself.....
Dalton
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Back in the late 50's and early 60's before they found FF Betty and bill Bell were hot in the Florida rat and combat scene in rat Bill pitted and Betty flew, she was left handed and was really hard to fly against both could hold thier own in combat. Many good stories. Rad
and you are right they would give you anything they had if you needed it
they started modelling in FLA then Bill got a job in Texas then in the early 60's they moved back to Fla shortly after ,they separated and i lost track of Betty but Bill and His son Willy were still hot in FF .i believe the other son is still in Tex and still flys FF .Bill past away a little over a year ago
Betty designed here own planes and was on the FAI tow line team Miss them both
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Always remember Betty flying her 'Mighty Mouse' rat. Good people.
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I "Lern,t" how to mow the grass from your take off at my first Texakana meet... LL~
Norm
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Hi Norm,
I think it is really great that you have been able to recreate a significant model from your early days in the hobby! Great job, and enjoy it!
Thanks!
BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM