Engine -- $18 (that's a Cox, not a Brodak)
Tank -- $5 (??)
tubing -- $2
quart fuel -- $10
total -------- $37
Motor -- $50
Battery -- $20
Controller -- $15
Timer -- $30 (?)
Charger -- $100 (?)
total -------- $205
Hmm. I think the gas motor setup as a lower initial price... Even if you can get a charger for less (and assuming that I'm not way too low on the timer) just assuming the motor, battery and controller is way more than an engine, fuel and necessary tackle.
I've been watching this with a lot of interest and share everyone's obvious concerns about the decline in controline over the last 30 years or so. So I apologies in advance for largely restating what everyone has already said before. The biggest issue (At least in the UK) is the hobby being pushed out of the public's eye. Back in the 70's when I 1st started I walked down to the local common/park/school playing fields with my dad and fired up my Wenmac P63 and away I went. Almost 100% of the interest from passers by was favourable and I progressed to bigger/better models right up until I discovered girls.
Consider a similar situation today, I have seen little depron RTF RC models being flown everywhere and anywhere, including in "very public places" such as Beer gardens at pubs etc, in most cases people reactions are "cool gimme a go" Try rolling out your lines in a similar situation...... Even the public park has become a no fly area for us whereas the RTF RC brigade seem to fly them around with impunity. In these days of "Blame and Sue" things like common sense and situational awareness sadly seem to have dropped down the pecking order as far as general human traits are concerned. So... We all end up flying further and further away from the very people we would like to attract. My club has a great field, out in the countryside lovely location but no passing trade (Other than Valentino Rossi / Jenson Button wannabies on there GXSR1000 / Subaru Imprezzas who pass the gate at speeds approaching warp 6). Apart from that we do get the "Horsey club" stop to complain about the noise occasionally. Sometimes however you spy a complete family leaning against the gate with their cycles as you finish a flight. I always go over for a chat, but can't let them onto the site (Because of the "Blame and Sue culture"). Usually any talks of costs has parents running for the hills so I usually describe costs of a smaller set up rather than the one they have just been watching. Although I feel that Electric is the way to go the facts don't actually support my thoughts. I used to race 1/10 scale RC electric cars and IC was almost exclusively the domain of 1/8th scale expert orientated drivers. Looking at the RC car market today IC seems to have become the norm. I still find it suprising considering the electric option only really has a weight disadvantage (Not "so" important in a car).But as they say.... "There's nowt as queer as folk".
Anyway I'm rambling....
The reason for including the "quote from Tim" is just because as far as electric is concerned I think we are looking at it all the wrong way. I'm not an electric "fanboy" specifically but have been exclusively electric since my return to CL 18 months ago. Electric was the only option for me, my wife has respiritory issues so smells and chemicals are a real problem. Even building/covering is an exercise in logistics and it's unlikely I will ever return to a wet set up.
Think back to the "Tamiya off road buggies", Simple wind up timer, mechanical speed control, Mabuchi motor and a set of Nicads... Nothing wrong with that and the philosophy still applies. People either bought them broke them and walked away or bought them broke them bought spare parts and used them again or like in my case bought them broke them fixed them myself and eventually moved onto more serious set ups and eventually on to national competitions.
Taking each part of the powertrain in turn.
Motor. Everyone assumes outrunner/inrunner but let's not forget the humble "Brushed motor", Ony 2 wires, generally made to lower tolerances (Will run with a bent shaft if necessary as the air gap between magnets and stator is massive when compared to you average brushless motor). Requires no special "plumbing" just connect to a battery and it bursts into life.
Battery. Everyone assumes Lipo's But what about Nimh (Since the safety police took Nicads out of the equation). OK heavy but extremely robust, No special charging chemistry required (Desirable but not compulsary) Can be charged straight after a flight, Can be topped up as necessary, cheap, excellent discharge curve. Also A123 let's not forget them, OK need a special charger but tough as old boots, can be topped up, not destroyed by running flat, Can be charged in the plane. Both types stand more chance of delivering the goods the following year after being thrown in the shed over the winter months than your average Lipo set up.
SC (Speed control - Notice no "E" in front of it)
Again we immediately think of electronic.... Necessary if you are using a brushless set up, but for brushed? Erm no, a simple mechanical unit With say 3 speeds like in the Tamiya kits of old or a variable resister set up where RPM is adjusted by turning a small knob. It would obviously have to be a lot smaller than "the car version" and given that we don't need no governers, Brakes, Soft Start etc perhaps an cheap electronic version is viable all it has to do is be able to (Manually) adjust the speed via a pot or something prior to flight. It also does not need to carry the amps that the car versions do, Dragging a 2LB 4WD Tamiya Hotshot from stationary up to speed is a bit different to doing the same thing to a controline model.
Timer Like with everything above don't think controline timers with start delays, ramping up RPM's different flight speeds/times all it has to do is start and stop the motor after a predetermined (Adjustable on the ground) time. (Like a simple free flight timer) Hell even a clockwork version would work. (Like the old KSB timers)
Charger. In it's most basic form let's say clockwork again, ok it's only going to safely give 70% charge at best but 1000's of them were sold with Tamiya combo's. 90 secs of flight time to a complete beginner seems like an eternity. Better to have the person land and want to slot the "next" battery in or get the current one recharged becaue it did not fly long enough rather than end up going for 5 minutes and being sick or falling over with the inevitable destruction of the model. The simplest "proper" electronic charger for nimh cost very little as well.
So.........................
The overall package does not have to be "State of the art"
but it does have to look professional and not like it was knocked up in someone's garden shed. We are not trying to fly a pattern here, just go round and round and up and down, let's not try to make something you can learn the beginners schedule with. If it can do a loop perhaps inverted? Then you either have the persons interest or you never really had it when they purchased the thing in the 1st place. It's a tool to get the person wanting more, no thought of reusing the parts in something else (But the parts should be available in the event of accidents). If their interest is pricked they will naturally move on to the next stage (Which may be another more expensive ARF/RTF option such as the electric Superclown or IC equivalent or perhaps even [Shock Horror] actually build something from a kit).
I've concentrated on electric because despite the phenoninom in RC cars I think being able to walk out of church (If that's your thing) in your sunday best and go fly a toy plane with your kids without ending up with everyone and everything smelling like a backstreet auto shop is the way to go. Wiping down models etc is not top of your list when you 1st start out plus if it don't smell it may well end up living in the house rather than stuffed at the back of a cold damp garage over winter. (Also if it stays in view it's more likely to be remembered next time the sun comes out).
There are so many things out there nowadays to entice the younger generation and the best we can hope for is to get a very small slice of the cake, Once we have our slice it's important not to scare the person off. I'm more than prepared to expect that 99% of those who give it a try will move on to something else pretty quickly. 99% of the 1% left will drift off when they discover girls, motorcycles, Football etc but if the experience was a favourable one there is a possibility that (Like me) they will return in later years with a more mature outlook and hopefully the finances to give it a good go 2nd time around. I think CL flying will always belong to the "older" generation and sadly people like Matt (Colan) will always be the 1% of the 1%. I see exactly the same situation with my "Other pastime" which is Crown Green Bowls. My son got really into it when we was around 13, now (at 21) he plays Rugby and chases girls, He still has his bowls though and I'm confident he will get back into it at sometime in the future simply because he really enjoyed it. I've seen other kids fade away only to return 15 years later. Controline is no different, consider it as building for the future, real life gets in the way for most people (Marraige, kids, trying to afford the morgage) I'm now redoing a lot of the things I did as a kid but that would never have happened without it at least being a moderate success 1st time around.
Finally crashing...... We all did it to begin with and those Cox PT19's etc didn't like hitting the tarmac (And they would not take off easily from soft grass) and the spares were not cheap. I think they are much maligned and if the survivabilty had been better they would be looked on a little more favourably. A Depron or balsa sheet model would have a much more realistic chance of survival (or Repair).
I think Black Hawk models are <so> close to getting it right and I'm thankful for their determination to make controline as accessable as possible to the novice but the prices I see banded about for an electric version of one of his combo's is horrific, (Not a slight on Larry in any way but I can put something together cheaper than that at retail prices). I'm not suggesting using "tat" but just because it isn't up to the job of of flying to intermeadiate level does not mean it cannot be good quality. It cannot be cheaper to put together an RTF RC model than a CL model surely?
Whew, what a long (And probably sometimes irelevent) diatribe, but that's what I think. Flame away..
TTFN
John.
Topic: It's the demographics (Read 8673 times)