I learned something new today.

[Tim Wescott]

And it's still morning!

When I haven't been crashing, I've been noticing that the intersections of my horizontal 8's are even more deformed than my loops, and tried to work on it.  This morning I was flying air patterns while breakfast was cooking, and I noticed that my hand traces just about the exact weird not-quite circles that my horizontal eights do.  It seems that I'm coming up against the limitations of my creaking, popping, binding shoulder joint, and that's being reflected in my flight path.

So: I got something to work on -- maybe loosening up that shoulder will help my eights!

[Glenn (Gravitywell) Reach]

Years ago my granddad had a dud shoulder.  It had reduced mobility which sounds like what you have.  He found an old wheel that was quite large (2'dia.?) and fixed it to a post in the basement with a large nail (granddad wasn't what we would call a finesse carpenter!).  He would crank the wheel in various ways a couple times a day and darned if his shoulder didn't come back....maybe this may help you?

[Tim Wescott]

Glen, I'm going to remember that.  If stretching and toning doesn't do the job, I'll build myself a torture wheel and try that.

[Pat Johnston]

Tim,
Back in the late 80's with the archery guys, I met Bob Asin who was 70 years old at the time.  He had bersitus in his shoulders and at the age of 65, first started doing archery.  Bob said that the bersitus went away.  Possibly a bit of exercise or even archery practice may work for you.  I suspect that your neck of the woods has an archery club.  We just started leagues here and I shot my first NFAA 300 round in about 18 years.  Had a blast.  Even nailed 38 "X" spots out of the 60 scored arrows.  Guess I haven't lost it completely.
Sorry I missed you at Salem.  Mom got Pneumonia, so we stayed home for her.
Pat Johnston
Archery Division
Skunk Works

[FLOYD CARTER]

In most cases, body problems do not cause poor-looking 8's.  Most flyers are so determined to show the judges that their intersections are VERTICAL!  (or HORIZ, as the case may be) that they hold the intersection much too long.  This results in an eight with a very big flat section in the middle!

We all know that.  But few actually do it right.

F.C.

[Tim Wescott]

I have to admit that I'm still concerned that the bottoms of my eights be above grade, so the intersections can be a bit wild and woolly -- but I'm getting better, and I want to get better the "right" way.

Getting two circles to smoothly intersect in a mathematically perfect manner isn't physically possible -- the required trajectory has infinite jerk -- so I guess I need to aim for "perceptibly perfect", or (in my case) perhaps just "good enough to get 25 points".

[BBury]

A few months back I had torn a rotator cuff. I spoke with a friend that steered me towards these exercises to maintain and help restore movement in an injured shoulder. I'm sure many of you may have seen these before but for those that haven't I can only hope you won't suffer the pain of a torn muscle.

Here are some links showing the “Throwers 10” that are recommended by sports medicine.

Throwers 10 video link:



Throwers 10 PDF document:
http://www.safethrow.com/ExerciseThr...r%27s%2010.pdf

[Dennis Adamisin]

Tim
You are getting some good advice on therapy for your should that should improve your 8's.  I must warn youthat the PT for the Hourglass is ... UNSPEAKABLE!   

[Randy Powell]

I suppose I could say that if you kept your hand in front of you rather than following the plane with your hand, it would be easier.

[John Stiles]

Condition your mind, it's not your shoulder's fault. Also try drawing a thousand figure 8s[kindergarten stuff] exactly like you wish to see them. Forget the torture wheel, they tried that on me at the VA but it didn't work.....the archery is a thought though....

[Tom Niebuhr]

Remember that horizontal eights are like two quarters next to each other. Body posttion is very important. The intersection is centered with your body.

Then it becomes an inside and outside loop next to each other. The "intersection" is just a transition...a kiss and change in direction. Too often just consentrating on the "intersection" will result in a vertical line line, while it is really a kiss.

[john e. holliday]

All the the 8's give me problems.   At the Ringmaster Marathon in Topeka only 4 flights were not the old time pattern.   Seems I go worse on each flight with the 8's, especially the over head.  People say pain is in the mind util they have it.

[Tim Wescott]

Condition your mind, it's not your shoulder's fault. Also try drawing a thousand figure 8s[kindergarten stuff] exactly like you wish to see them. Forget the torture wheel, they tried that on me at the VA but it didn't work.....the archery is a thought though....

Every time I see the deer nibbling on my garden I think of archery.  Or firearms.

But my aim is really bad.  I keep trying to talk the wife into letting me make one of the beds into a pit trap, but she keeps acting like I'm making jokes.

[Mark Scarborough]

Tim,, just throw that now "dipped" flight streak creation at the deer, they will never come back,, 

[Tim Wescott]

Tim,, just throw that now "dipped" flight streak creation at the deer, they will never come back,, 

Y'know, Mark, you say you think I should just get that plane in the air, then you go and make a statement that gives me an almost unbearable temptation to make the World's Lightest Rudder that is sculpted to look like it's been dipped in plastic (complete with the little drippy on the end, of course).  It's like saying you want your prize bull to be calm and peaceful at the same time that you're waving a red flag in front of it.

I think I know what I'll do if the thing turns out nose heavy, though...

[John Stiles]

Every time I see the deer nibbling on my garden I think of archery.  Or firearms.

But my aim is really bad.  I keep trying to talk the wife into letting me make one of the beds into a pit trap, but she keeps acting like I'm making jokes.

Cook her up a batch of deer jerky, and you will not have that problem anymore.

[Russell Shaffer]

If it's tail heavy, or just heavy in general, use the big Fox.

[Gerald Schamp]

Sometime watch Paul Walker's horizontal 8's, his 8's have a near perfect "click" at the intersection, even his verticals have the same "click", haven't seen it on the overheads though, can't lay on the ground in the circle and see if the "click" is there. But my point is like Floyd said, the intersection does not have a vertical or horizontal flat area in it. Try drawing two circles side by side to imulate the figure 8, imagine what has to be done to make that intersection work so you don't see a flat spot. Making round eights are one of my favorite practice things to do when flying. I can't do it but about 1 out of 10 trys, but when its right it sure feels and looks good. Gerald Schamp

[john e. holliday]

As someone stated, " Just lay two quarters side-by-side, better yet make it silver dollars".   I have tried drawing 8's with a pen/pencil on paper and found it is hard to make them look right.