Hey, Look what I found! Mirror Meet Pattern

[Ward Van Duzer]

Wow! When I was putting away the Stilomag info I came across this. An actual Mirror Model Flying Fair Score Sheet.

For those of you too young to remember, or perhaps lived on the left coast, The Daily Mirror was a New York newspaper that sponsered this extraviganza for many years. Winning flyers at the time were 'Red' Rhinehardt, and
Leroy Ducharme, Frank McMillan, Artie Meyers, Eddie Elasick, Harold Price and Jim Silhavy and many others I fail to recall.

Three flights were required to complete this G*D awful schedule. A few things should be noted...Take off dollys may be used. Level Flight manuvers (1 and 2) must be done UNDER 5 feet. Manuver # 27 is a CORKSCREW WINGOVER. (text got punched out!). Note also "Appearance Points". Remember, no appearance points in old time, then called STUNT. Also the Spot Landing.

[Tom Niebuhr]

Wardo,

I have a copy of the old MM pattern that Andy Lee sent to me a few years ago.

I don't know when the old Mirror Meet Pattern yielded to the modern, but I am certain that Artie Meyers and Ed Elasick flew the modern pattern. I was at the '61 Mirror Meet with Eddie and Artie, and we flew the modern pattern. I think Frank flew his Gambler (1957 M.A.N.) for his Mirror Meet win, but I am not sure which pattern was flown.






Leroy Ducharme, Frank McMillan, Artie Meyers, Eddie Elasick, Harold Price and Jim Silhavy

[Joe Gilbert]

The Tulsa Guldobbers had four contest in a row a couple years back  trying to revive the Mirror Meet Pattern. There was just not enough intrest to keep it going. I loved to fly the Mirror Pattern it was a good challenge.

[Tom Niebuhr]

I just talked to Frank McMillan. He won the Mirror Meet in 1956 as a Senior using his "Gambler" which was published in MAN in 1957. He flew the old Mirror Meet Pattern.  Frank still has the trophy!

We are pretty certain that Leroy Ducharme won with the old MM pattern and of course Red won with the MM pattern using his "Stunt Wing".  Did Red win it more than once??  I am certain that Artie Meyers and Ed Elasick flew the modern pattern.

The OTS pattern ended at the end of 1952, and there were interim patterns before George Aldridge, with assistance from others, came up with the current pattern, which was adopted by AMA for 1958. We would like to have inputs from others about what patterns were flown in various parts of the country and at the Nats between 1952 and 1958.

I have not been able to find out when the old MM pattern was put to bed.

[peabody]

Rich Giacobone gave me a copy of his several years ago....he finished third, I believe ....and he flies BACKWARDS!

[thomas farmer]

I went to two of the Tulsa Gluedobers Mirror meet contests and loved it. When they decided not to have any more Mirror Meet events, controle line will not be the same to me.

[EddyR]

In upstate NY Rochester,Ithaca,Binghamton contests in the mid 50's flying what we call old time stunt today with a reverse wingover and a three leaf clover.I remember because I did the three leaf clover wrong in two contests but still managed to place. I used a much modified AASr and a Nobler with Fox 35's and K&B 32's Also did some stunt and  combat in northern PA.I went to the 1957 NATS but did not fly stunt. What pattern was flown at that NATS?
Ed

[Ward Van Duzer]

'Red' Reinhardt was the only three time winner. 1949, 1952 and 1954. He was flying the Wing in '54 with the famed spot landing!

Two time winners were Richard Karp, Fran McElwee, Artie Meyers, Wayne Southerland, and Jim Silhavy.


W.

[Bob Reeves]

I can sure tell you it isn't an easy pattern to learn. As Joe said we held a Mirror Meet for 4 years and I only remember two, maybe 3 guys that were able to fly the entire schedule. I crashed a Super Clown ARF 3 times trying to do the Double Vertical Eight. That thing has so many twists and turns I kept forgeting which way I needed to go next and splat.

It was fun while it lasted but the interest was so low we had to give it up.

[FLOYD CARTER]

I believe I also read where the Mirror Meet pattern allowed two flights to complete that long schedule!

I flew in the All Western Opens in Phoenix in 1951.  They were using the OTS schedule as it is now (still).  I was actually doing pretty well until my tank got leaky (homemade tank) and Torp 29.

Floyd

[Tom Niebuhr]

Yes it took 2 flights.

Just looking at the maneuvers can make you dizzy or do I mean Daffy?

Ward,
Do you know what years people won? And were the SR or Open ? Maybe this will help us establish when the started flying the AMA pattern at the MM.

I wish I could have made to the Tulsa contest the last few years. I would have tried it. I have trouble remembering the OTS pattern (I have a VSC Elephant award to prove it) I would need at least 3 people calling the maneuvers for the MM pattern!

[EddyR]

Would anly one like a MM pattern at Huntersville?
Ed Ruane

[john e. holliday]

Tom, Joe and Bob,  the Tulsa mirror meet was always to close to NATS time for me.  I even studied the diagrams with hopes of coming some time.  I think later in the year would be a good time for it.  Of course the Ozark guys have their stunt meet later in the and no one shows up.   

[Roger Vizioli]

I just talked to Frank McMillan. He won the Mirror Meet in 1956 as a Senior using his "Gambler" which was published in MAN in 1957. He flew the old Mirror Meet Pattern.  Frank still has the trophy!

We are pretty certain that Leroy Ducharme won with the old MM pattern and of course Red won with the MM pattern using his "Stunt Wing".  Did Red win it more than once??  I am certain that Artie Meyers and Ed Elasick flew the modern pattern.

The OTS pattern ended at the end of 1952, and there were interim patterns before George Aldridge, with assistance from others, came up with the current pattern, which was adopted by AMA for 1958. We would like to have inputs from others about what patterns were flown in various parts of the country and at the Nats between 1952 and 1958.

I have not been able to find out when the old MM pattern was put to bed.

[/i]

Just confirmed, with Leroy Ducharme, it was the old pattern and he took two flights to complete it! Forgot to ask what year it was! 

Roger V.

[Ward Van Duzer]

First of all...Note that in the upper right corner of the first page of the schedule it allows for three flights to be scored!

Yes, I have a complete list of who (Jr. / Open) won and when. No mention of a change in pattern, however.
it'll take a while to prepare this list, mebbee later today!

Rog,
Just to clarify...the "old pattern" is the one I've posted above, the "new pattern" is the current AMA pattern?

W.

[Ward Van Duzer]

First of all let's get this much straight...None of this is available through the mighty brainpower of Van Duzer!

Only through the forsight and effort of Wynn Paul (and others) have we preserved this info. I just squirled it away.
Note that in 1946 Ernie Babcock won a full scale Ercoupe. And somewheres along the way "Red" won a Grumman canoe!

W.

[Tom Niebuhr]

Ward,

This is outstanding. A special thanks to Wynn Paul, and to you for squilling the info.

Now if some one has info on when the pattern changed. Like I said, I know that '60 an '61 flew the modern pattern.

[thomas farmer]

Tom, Joe and Bob,  the Tulsa mirror meet was always to close to NATS time for me.  I even studied the diagrams with hopes of coming some time.  I think later in the year would be a good time for it.  Of course the Ozark guys have their stunt meet later in the and no one shows up.   

[thomas farmer]

I understand that the Ozark guys are not doing the fall contest this year. That's too bad. Tom Farmer

[Roger Vizioli]

First of all...Note that in the upper right corner of the first page of the schedule it allows for three flights to be scored!
Yes, I have a complete list of who (Jr. / Open) won and when. No mention of a change in pattern, however.
it'll take a while to prepare this list, mebbee later today!

Rog,
Just to clarify...the "old pattern" is the one I've posted above, the "new pattern" is the current AMA pattern?
W.

Ward,
I believe so, will recontact Lee and also ask for the year he won.
Roger

[Roger Vizioli]

Ward,
I believe so, will recontact Lee and also ask for the year he won.
Roger

Contacted Lee.
He confirmed that the year was 1956.
It was the old pattern.
Lee flew an original design he named "The Captain".

Roger V.

[Tom Niebuhr]

Just looked closer and there are some interesting points.


*Contributors to developing the MM Pattern are a who's who: Aldrich; Curtis; Johnson; Palmer; Saftig; Still

* 7 min. flight time, 3 flights max.

* Level flight upright and inverted BELOW 5 ft. Low flying was encouraged! Now I know why many of the older fliers when was I young flew very low.

 Not clear where the bottom of the maneuvers should be, but you might assume at the level flight, low altitude.

[Roger Vizioli]

Just looked closer and there are some interesting points.


*Contributors to developing the MM Pattern are a who's who: Aldrich; Curtis; Johnson; Palmer; Saftig; Still

* 7 min. flight time, 3 flights max.

* Level flight upright and inverted BELOW 5 ft. Low flying was encouraged! Now I know why many of the older fliers when was I young flew very low.

 Not clear where the bottom of the maneuvers should be, but you might assume at the level flight, low altitude.

Tom,
We were really low when we had to do the "Touch and Go!'   
Roger