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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: Miotch on July 31, 2023, 03:38:39 PM

Title: Hard for me to accept plane surgery is needed: Overcoming builder bias
Post by: Miotch on July 31, 2023, 03:38:39 PM
I suspected my top wing shifted when I was gluing the cabane struts in.  OK, I knew it because I had to reshape the "I" struts when it was dry.  So I convinced my eyes it wasn't that bad because I have the ability to rationalize almost anything rather than perform surgery on a plane near completion.

Well, I got lucky in that it did fly, although you could clearly see the elevator was nearly all the way down as it went around with Ace Test Pilot Joe Gilbert at the helm.  After talking to him, I decided to do something I should have done before: carefully measure the angle of incidence of the top wing relative to the bottom wing.  I was shocked at just how far off it was.  I didn't have a meter with degrees, so I set the bottom wing level and then measured the leading and trailing edges of the top wing relative to the level surface the plane was on.  If I had to guess, I would say it was at least 6 degrees off.  I'm lucky I still have a plane to perform surgery on.  You can see just how far I had to raise the trailing edge by the last picture showing one of the shims I made for the "I" struts.

So I cut the rear cabanes, inserted extentions and then split a piece of streamlined aluminum tubing and epoxied it over the front of the struts.  I will wrap them in silkspan and hand paint them white.  I also adjusted the elevator/flaps.   If it flies well now, I might build some new and improved "I" struts. Although the shims should work well enough.

I read somewhere on here something Bob Hunt wrote about not being afraid to perform major surgery when it is needed.  That helped me mentally, because I'm always afraid I'll make something worse when I cut into it.
Title: Re: Hard for me to accept plane surgery is needed: Overcoming builder bias
Post by: Motorman on July 31, 2023, 05:34:25 PM
Some of my planes have Frankinrudder.
Title: Re: Hard for me to accept plane surgery is needed: Overcoming builder bias
Post by: Ken Culbertson on July 31, 2023, 06:37:22 PM
I just spent 2 days completely redoing the controls on my new ship.  Absolutely worth it.

Ken
Title: Re: Hard for me to accept plane surgery is needed: Overcoming builder bias
Post by: Dick Pacini on July 31, 2023, 08:25:28 PM
Jack Sheeks always flew his new planes "in the clear" so if surgery was needed, it didn't require refinishing to hide the alterations.  He used K2R Spot Lifter to remove all traces of castor oil and fuel residue.  Once cleaned, he would put on one of his great finishes.
Title: Re: Hard for me to accept plane surgery is needed: Overcoming builder bias
Post by: Joe Gilbert on August 01, 2023, 08:05:46 AM
Well done Mitch!

Joe Gilbert
Title: Re: Hard for me to accept plane surgery is needed: Overcoming builder bias
Post by: Miotch on August 01, 2023, 09:49:38 AM
Jack Sheeks always flew his new planes "in the clear" so if surgery was needed, it didn't require refinishing to hide the alterations.  He used K2R Spot Lifter to remove all traces of castor oil and fuel residue.  Once cleaned, he would put on one of his great finishes.

Now THAT is a plan !!
Title: Re: Hard for me to accept plane surgery is needed: Overcoming builder bias
Post by: Dan McEntee on August 01, 2023, 11:37:03 AM
  Search out some threads by John Miller on setting up a biplane model, especially a stunt model. In short, I think you want the lower wing , engine thrust line, and stab pretty much normal, or if you wanted to, add 1degree positive incidence on the stab. Then the upper wing gets 1 degree or    so NEGATIVE incidence, I'm pretty sure, to counter act all that drag. The model will still glide like a smooth stone, but should be predictable. I have a 38 Special kit stashed that I want to build and I think such instructions are on the plans for that model. Everyone of those that I have seen fly look pretty impressive and look like a lot of fun. I want to maybe revisit the SIG WW-I combat biplanes with the same treatments and see how it helps those models. Good luck with the rehab!
  Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee