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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: Chris Fretz on August 08, 2016, 06:33:59 PM
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Hey fellers I got a freebie the other day! Its one of those 4 piece airplanes I hope to make one again! The story behind it as I was told it got backed into by a car. It doesn't really look all that bad to me. What do you think? I was thinking of throwing a LA 46 in it, only other thing I have laying around is a LA 40. I suppose I'll glue the thing back together before I throw a engine in it.
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I have repaired crashed planes in the past but it depended on the extent of the damage. Sometimes it was not worth the effort to repair. The one thing I always worried about was alignment. Could I keep everything straight after a repair?
The wing looks to be in good shape. Is it undamaged? If so, maybe it is better to cut away the fuselage and tail group and use the existing wing with a new fuselage. Maybe you can save the tail group as well and re-use it.
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Hi Chris, As for me I do get as much kick out of resurrecting a smash as I do building new! I do agree with Jim that a carefully executed quick and dirty might be just fine if all parts are kept in alignment. What do have to loose but some time and glue! It just might work out well!
Once upon a time long long ago I combined a smashed Ringmaster with a Shoestring tail assembly. The wing came out with a drop but it flew just fine for a fun beater! Looked awful but I had many hours with this ugly duckling!
Phil Spillman
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Mine broke like that but just the crutches right behind the cowl. I was able to put an RC mount on it. It wasn't as easy as it sounds but it did fly just fine. Later I discovered the spar was broken. Bob Z. slapped it on his table and fixed it with CF cord in ten minutes where it would have taken me a week. It flew great, up to about 50 ounces after all the trauma. Then I flew it into a dust devil in an OH8 and didn't run fast enough to catch it. It's still in a grocery bag. It was still a competent contest plane and I was pretty sad for a day or so.
Rusty
After the broken nose
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/rknrusty/Airplanes/WP_20150820_005_zpsugjtutql.jpg)
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/rknrusty/Airplanes/WP_20150820_007_zpsx31etdnp.jpg)
This is after the final wreck, but you can see my RC mount. I added an 8th ply to the firewall, wrapped with glass, which worked well until...
Also note all hinges broke so I used monokote trim to make new ones.
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/rknrusty/Airplanes/0421161317_zpsht1eljtq.jpg)
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I have repaired crashed planes in the past but it depended on the extent of the damage. Sometimes it was not worth the effort to repair. The one thing I always worried about was alignment. Could I keep everything straight after a repair?
The wing looks to be in good shape. Is it undamaged? If so, maybe it is better to cut away the fuselage and tail group and use the existing wing with a new fuselage. Maybe you can save the tail group as well and re-use it.
The wing does look undamaged to me. Hi Chris, As for me I do get as much kick out of resurrecting a smash as I do building new! I do agree with Jim that a carefully executed quick and dirty might be just fine if all parts are kept in alignment. What do have to loose but some time and glue! It just might work out well!
Once upon a time long long ago I combined a smashed Ringmaster with a Shoestring tail assembly. The wing came out with a drop but it flew just fine for a fun beater! Looked awful but I had many hours with this ugly duckling!
Phil Spillman
I'll try to keep it straight. Mine broke like that but just the crutches right behind the cowl. I was able to put an RC mount on it. It wasn't as easy as it sounds but it did fly just fine. Later I discovered the spar was broken. Bob Z. slapped it on his table and fixed it with CF cord in ten minutes where it would have taken me a week. It flew great, up to about 50 ounces after all the trauma. Then I flew it into a dust devil in an OH8 and didn't run fast enough to catch it. It's still in a grocery bag. It was still a competent contest plane and I was pretty sad for a day or so.
Rusty
After the broken nose
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/rknrusty/Airplanes/WP_20150820_005_zpsugjtutql.jpg)
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/rknrusty/Airplanes/WP_20150820_007_zpsx31etdnp.jpg)
This is after the final wreck, but you can see my RC mount. I added an 8th ply to the firewall, wrapped with glass, which worked well until...
Also note all hinges broke so I used monokote trim to make new ones.
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u116/rknrusty/Airplanes/0421161317_zpsht1eljtq.jpg)
What happened to that poor airplane Rusty??
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What happened to that poor airplane Rusty??
Rusty.....
Lol
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There's some chance that you could get a new fuselage from Brodak, to stay with the ARF theme... wouldn't hurt to ask them. D>K Steve
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Wouldnt be hard to whip up a new fuse from scratch , or build one ' on ' the wing .
Slip the sides on , glue in nose formers etc , then go aft, keeping it aligned.
oriental in search here should find the plan , for General Information .
Having ' the bits ' youd just throw a ruler on THEM , might be more integrated than the current Fuse if its got splits & cracks/ coming undone aft ?? .
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... What happened to that poor airplane Rusty??
Rusty.....
Lol
Oh boy, that was a bummer. I was practicing out at the Fort. It was a typical windy day with bad thermals popping up everywhere and I was showing off for a new flying buddy. Third loop of the clover and I flew too far behind my head. When the lines went slack I started running but never got eyes on it. When I caught it, I was turning to see where it was, but by that time it was too late, pulling full up and there wasn't enough sky to make the loop out. Maybe I should have been pulling full down, I never did figure out which way it was going and it left a mother of a divot.
But after the 4 week repair and a few extra ounces the darn thing flew perfectly again, Monokote trim hinges and all... every hinge had broken on both wings. That's what happened. To add insult to injury, 6 months later(that's the last picture) I had another wind incident, turning way too soon at the top of an OH8. That was a complete grocery bagger. I really love the Oriental. It is a superior flying plane... in the right hands Lol.
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Oh boy, that was a bummer. I was practicing out at the Fort. It was a typical windy day with bad thermals popping up everywhere and I was showing off for a new flying buddy. Third loop of the clover and I flew too far behind my head. When the lines went slack I started running but never got eyes on it. When I caught it, I was turning to see where it was, but by that time it was too late, pulling full up and there wasn't enough sky to make the loop out. Maybe I should have been pulling full down, I never did figure out which way it was going and it left a mother of a divot.
But after the 4 week repair and a few extra ounces the darn thing flew perfectly again, Monokote trim hinges and all... every hinge had broken on both wings. That's what happened. To add insult to injury, 6 months later(that's the last picture) I had another wind incident, turning way too soon at the top of an OH8. That was a complete grocery bagger. I really love the Oriental. It is a superior flying plane... in the right hands Lol.
Bummer Rusty! Is that a FP40 you had in it?
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What is the verdict on the crimped Brodak leadouts? Are they trust worthy?
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What is the verdict on the crimped Brodak leadouts? Are they trust worthy?
I am sure others will chip in here with comments. I can tell you what I think.
Are they trustworthy? That depends. I have seen some last a long time and I have seen some fail during the pull test. I am not a fan of the crimped leadouts. Maybe others will disagree but I don't trust them. Swaging is a better method and it requires a swage sleeve of the proper size and a proper swaging tool. If you don't want to swage then wrap instead of crimping.
Is the lead out simply looped thru the bell crank? Looks like it is. On a smaller plane it will probably work well enough, for a while, anyway. I have seen this method go a long time and then I have seen early failures. That loop of wire will flex. Under load, it will "flatten." When load is removed, it will spring back. This flexing can fatigue it and it may fail.
There is a method of slipping the lead out thru some brass tubing that is bent in a teardrop shape. This is a better way to go. And, you don't have the bare wire rubbing on the bell crank.
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Bummer Rusty! Is that a FP40 you had in it?
Yes, that's the FP 40 Bob reworked for me after it started running away for no reason. He modified the combustion chamber and it ran like a magic stunt machine. Never fear, it's sparkling clean and on a shelf at the moment.
You know what, the leadouts' chances of lasting longer than the rest of your ARF are very good, even considering I know you're a pretty good pilot. If you were fixing up a kit or building a new one, I'd tell you to bush and wrap or swage, but in this case, I personally would just leave it like it is and fly it. Besides it's a royal pain in the ass to do otherwise. That bellcrank is made of tough stuff. It's a great flying plane.
Rusty
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Yes, that's the FP 40 Bob reworked for me after it started running away for no reason. He modified the combustion chamber and it ran like a magic stunt machine. Never fear, it's sparkling clean and on a shelf at the moment.
You know what, the leadouts' chances of lasting longer than the rest of your ARF are very good, even considering I know you're a pretty good pilot. If you were fixing up a kit or building a new one, I'd tell you to bush and wrap or swage, but in this case, I personally would just leave it like it is and fly it. Besides it's a royal pain in the ass to do otherwise. That bellcrank is made of tough stuff. It's a great flying plane.
Rusty
I'm thinking just throw it together an try it. I don't have anything laying around to fix it, except an extra Tom Morris belcrank with the leadouts already on it. But I really don't feel like screwing around putting it in. The elevator horn an pushrod clasp is pretty sloppy on this one, like the hole on the horn is pretty big an the connector is sloppy. Was yours like this? Everthing else is a tight fit. I was thinking the elevator being sloppy it might not be a good thing. I just can't seem to come up with a easy fix.
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Mine had some play, not too bad though. If you have a sloppy connection, the elevator is probably the best place for it to be. Maybe you can slice a piece of brass tube to solder into the hole. I've done that before. Or chop it off and put a thick enough piece of music wire with a z-bend in place of the crappy clevis. Those threads are metric in case you didn't know.
If you need more room in the tail, split it vertically and glue a 3/8" or 1/2" square stick in there to spread it out. I needed tail weight too, so I carved out the spacer and epoxied buckshot in the length of it... fishing sinkers, actually. And I cut an access hatch beside the horn and clevis. I was hoping to use a ball link but the ones I had were still too fat. Great Planes makes some narrower 4-40 ball links that might work. You can probably force thread them onto the metric rod tightly enough to be completely safe. I also sleeved my rod with CF tube to keep it from flexing.
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I just thought of something that might simplify the whole thing... Cut a hole in the side of the fuselage in front of the elevator, run the rod through to the outside and put a regular control horn on it. Then it's adjustable and you can use a ball link or whatever you want, and you can service it after the whole plane is assembled.
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Mine had some play, not too bad though. If you have a sloppy connection, the elevator is probably the best place for it to be. Maybe you can slice a piece of brass tube to solder into the hole. I've done that before. Or chop it off and put a thick enough piece of music wire with a z-bend in place of the crappy clevis. Those threads are metric in case you didn't know.
If you need more room in the tail, split it vertically and glue a 3/8" or 1/2" square stick in there to spread it out. I needed tail weight too, so I carved out the spacer and epoxied buckshot in the length of it... fishing sinkers, actually. And I cut an access hatch beside the horn and clevis. I was hoping to use a ball link but the ones I had were still too fat. Great Planes makes some narrower 4-40 ball links that might work. You can probably force thread them onto the metric rod tightly enough to be completely safe. I also sleeved my rod with CF tube to keep it from flexing.
You know I had the same idea last night about the brass tube. Good idea Rusty, Iam going to give it a try!
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I went this route, it was such a clean break. Maybe I'll be kicking myself later (when its hunting) but hey it was free.
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Looks good. I'd cover that repaired joint with fiberglass. That would make it pretty strong and help keep vibrations from shaking it apart.
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Back in the day, the word was, "got a match"? After we pulled the engine, etc. H^^
Ah, memories! Many a funeral pyre lit the dusk as we wandered happily homeward of a summer evening, planning the new and, we hoped, longer-lasting models we'd build as soon as we could scrape up the money for materials. Flying over grass, the engine would be full of dirt but nothing on it would be broken except, occasionally, the needle and spraybar. Even the white nylon prop. would survive. That was when we were learning loops, bunts and inverted with 2/3 scale Flite Streak clones - 1.5cc diesel engines, of course.
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Ah, memories! Many a funeral pyre lit the dusk as we wandered happily homeward of a summer evening, planning the new and, we hoped, longer-lasting models we'd build as soon as we could scrape up the money for materials. Flying over grass, the engine would be full of dirt but nothing on it would be broken except, occasionally, the needle and spraybar. Even the white nylon prop. would survive. That was when we were learning loops, bunts and inverted with 2/3 scale Flite Streak clones - 1.5cc diesel engines, of course.
John,
Liner is doing a great job with saving his model
I wish we could bring back the good old days. Oh well.
Charles
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Looks good. I'd cover that repaired joint with fiberglass. That would make it pretty strong and help keep vibrations from shaking it apart.
One step ahead of you Rusty! I put a layer of fiberglass on it already in the picture ;D Hey I'm a Captain #^ what comes after captain?
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One step ahead of you Rusty! I put a layer of fiberglass on it already in the picture ;D Hey I'm a Captain #^ what comes after captain?
O-5 commander. You know, in the navy anyway.
I figure a float flying man such as yourself would be considered navy
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O-5 commander. You know, in the navy anyway.
I figure a float flying man such as yourself would be considered navy
I'm still waiting for you to join me in floating airplanes Dane!!! :##
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Back together and ready to test. If I can only get some time to go flying, haven't flown much since Brodaks. I've been busy with other things plus its been pretty windy an rainy lately. I'm missing a cockpit I see but don't need one of those to see if its a keeper or not. I didn't do a whole lot of repair to it but its still 49oz as it sits. Watch me pull the leadouts out on the first flight n~ Ive never had that happen yet..
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Looks like it was never busted, good work. After a couple of repair episodes I think mine weighed 55 ounces and it still flew great. Good luck. Hope the weather clears up.
Rusty
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Looks like it was never busted, good work. After a couple of repair episodes I think mine weighed 55 ounces and it still flew great. Good luck. Hope the weather clears up.
Rusty
Thanks Rusty! #^
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Hey Chris, I just noticed you've got the only other 7 digit AMA number I've ever seen, than mine. Makes it a challenge to fit in with wing art, Lol.
I bet there's not an Expert PA guy anywhere with 7 digits. Wonder who'll be the first? I only know who it won't likely be.
Rusty
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Ive already made a change, hopefully for the better.
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Hey Chris, I just noticed you've got the only other 7 digit AMA number I've ever seen, than mine. Makes it a challenge to fit in with wing art, Lol.
I bet there's not an Expert PA guy anywhere with 7 digits. Wonder who'll be the first? I only know who it won't likely be.
Rusty
I joined for the first time this year so I just assumed I had a long number because of that. I didn't like it from the beginning! I emailed AMA asking if they could give me a 5 digit number and of course they could for only $100. I laughed an said screw that. It does suck Rusty, wonder if its ok to rap the number around to the bottom side too LL~
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When I started clipping oak branches with my 1/2As at the churchyard across from my house on August 25, 2012, I joined the AMA so I could fly at an RC club at Fort Jackson. Ha!, this week is my club anniversary Lol. That was before I even knew there was such a thing as bigger planes or contests. Hitting those trees turned out to be the 2nd best thing I'd done in my adult life.
Rusty
Here's my tree hitting video:
I joined the RC club the next day, and they let me fly CL on the runway. They were fascinated. That Baby Streak was the badassest thing I'd ever flown.
https://youtu.be/NiAl56Z3bb4
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When I started clipping oak branches with my 1/2As at the churchyard across from my house on August 25, 2012, I joined the AMA so I could fly at an RC club at Fort Jackson. Ha!, this week is my club anniversary Lol. That was before I even knew there was such a thing as bigger planes or contests. Hitting those trees turned out to be the 2nd best thing I'd done in my adult life.
Rusty
Here's my tree hitting video:
I joined the RC club the next day, and they let me fly CL on the runway. They were fascinated. That Baby Streak was the badassest thing I'd ever flown.
Nice video Rusty! My joining this site has done wonders for me, joined AMA, joined a club, flew at Brodak's an got 1st in Beginner, not to mention the wealth of knowledge so far ;D but speaking of trees, they do jump out an bite sometimes.
https://youtu.be/nnlXs_Zv0X8
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Haha, Damn. That was way more spectacular than mine. Looked like a poplar with those big ol leaves. You really brought em down. We both hit it inverted.
You need to hook up with the Philly Fliers and get your ass down here to Huntersville in October.
Rusty
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Haha, Damn. That was way more spectacular than mine. Looked like a poplar with those big ol leaves. You really brought em down. We both hit it inverted.
You need to hook up with the Philly Fliers and get your ass down here to Huntersville in October.
Rusty
Lol actually that was my dad, I forgot to tell him to back up cause I nipped that tree a couple flights before that. It's a Maple tree. I was pondering going down there, will see how the money situation goes first.