Will these "ARFs" be on the shelf soon?

[Steve Fitton]

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/kim-jong-un-sent-model-airplane-drone-south-korea-alleges-n69481

I'm waiting for a Yatsenko Shark to be the next drone recovered, but maybe the NorComs don't have enough $$ to afford one(!)

[Steve Helmick]

Shouldn't there be a BOM rule for Drones?  Steve

[Brett Buck]

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/kim-jong-un-sent-model-airplane-drone-south-korea-alleges-n69481

I'm waiting for a Yatsenko Shark to be the next drone recovered, but maybe the NorComs don't have enough $$ to afford one(!)

    Everyone is making fun of this, but this could be fairly effective for some purposes, and its certainly cheap enough to be disposable.

     Brett

[Mark Scarborough]

there are some pretty sophisticated quad copters available with FPV ( read the ama mag,, they talk all about them),, FPV first person view,,
IOW, you have a camera in the plane, you watch it through mini monitors,, while you fly,,,
some of the quad copters have an autonomas "return to base " feature,, in other words, they know where they are, and where they came from,,

its VERY sophisticated stuff, for very little money,,
like Brett says,, dont laugh at these,, they could be pretty affective for some uses,, and you or I can buy one today,,

of course,, I am pretty sure they would suck to fly the hourglass with,,,,

[Dan McEntee]

   Wasn't one of the very first remotely piloted vehicles used for observation put up by t6he Israelis during one of the 70's era conflicts? There was something on 60 Minutes about it back then. Basically a Senior Telemaster with a camera on it that they bought mail order from Hobby Lobby in Tennessee? I don't know how to look this up or research it but I do remember people talking about it back then. I don't see too much to worry about if they found pictures on it, which I take to mean that it had a digital camera on board and couldn't transmit images. I'm surprised something like this wasn't discovered long time ago.
  Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee

[Paul Smith]

The Buffalo Hunters used Aerobee target drones over Hanoi, controlled by C-130's over Laos.  The drones were parachute-recovered and caught midair (sometimes) by a CH-3 helicopter.

The big breakthroughs that make modern drones possible are GPS navigation and satellite communication.

I remember stories of the old photo satelites of the 1960's that had to drop film containers back to Earth.

[Douglas Ames]

I like this little guy...
Top Secret for many years.
Makes you wonder why the Vietnam war wasn't better managed with the intelligence capabilities we had.

[Sean McEntee]

I like this little guy...
Top Secret for many years.
Makes you wonder why the Vietnam war wasn't better managed with the intelligence capabilities we had.

The D-21 made 4 test flights being lauched off of M-21s (SR-71 variant).  3 of the 4 launches resulted in losses, to include the last test flight, in which the D-21 suffered an engine failure and resulted in a collision that killed the Launch Control Officer.  After that disaster, it was redesigned and launched from wing pylons of B-52s.  Though more sucessful, it only flew 4 operational missions over China.  Again, 3 of the 4 aircraft were lost and the D-21 program was cut.

The big breakthroughs that make modern drones possible are GPS navigation and satellite communication.

UAVs in that period were VERY expensive and not very practical given the state of electronics and construction methods of the time.  Equipment was big, bulky, and difficult to transport.  Even up until the late 80's, designers couldnt build a truely robust and reliable system

Then a man named Abraham Karem of Leading Systems Incorporated designed the B-45, codnamed "Amber".   Faced with bankrupsy, LSI was purchased by General Atomics, and everything in the UAV world began to change....

[55chevr]

"Makes you wonder why the Vietnam war wasn't better managed with the intelligence capabilities we had."


The VN war was managed?

[M Spencer]

Is That a Thunder Tiger ?
" A drone South Korea said crashed near the border town of Paju on March 24. "

" The official said this aircraft was found to contain pictures of military installations and even the residential quarters of Seoul's presidential compound, "
Probably trying to check out the style to which they've become accustomed down there .

[Brett Buck]

I like this little guy...
Top Secret for many years.
Makes you wonder why the Vietnam war wasn't better managed with the intelligence capabilities we had.

      If anything, part of the problem seemed to be excessive information gathering capabilities. It fooled them (Johnson, McNamara) into thinking that it was entirely practical to micro-manage the entire war from the White House down to the point of deciding individual air strike targets down to which hut to hit.

    One thing that seems to cut across all political affiliations is that Robert McNamara was near the top of the list of people who have damaged our country with his bloodless bean-counter mentality and massive arrogance. He was completely unrepentant right to the end, he still though he knew better than anyone else.

     Brett

[55chevr]

............................58,272

[Brett Buck]

............................58,272

    Right, and never once did I hear any admission of guilt, remorse, or in any way, acknowledgement that the people running it had made even the slightest mistake.

    Brett

[Douglas Ames]

      If anything, part of the problem seemed to be excessive information gathering capabilities. It fooled them (Johnson, McNamara) into thinking that it was entirely practical to micro-manage the entire war from the White House down to the point of deciding individual air strike targets down to which hut to hit.

    One thing that seems to cut across all political affiliations is that Robert McNamara was near the top of the list of people who have damaged our country with his bloodless bean-counter mentality and massive arrogance. He was completely unrepentant right to the end, he still though he knew better than anyone else.

     Brett

Exactly my point.
With today's state-of-the-art data and intelligence gathering capabilities, we are seeing some of the same failures at the Executive branch as VN. (Benghazi comes to mind)

Drones are an evolving reconnaissance tool.

Didn't intend the thread to go off into a political tangent.

[55chevr]

Mr McNamara's War.   What a jackass.

[Mike Keville]

Mr McNamara's War.   What a jackass.

=========================================
Agreed.  I was there.  Were you?

[55chevr]

Detachment A421, Delta Co. 5th SFGA ..... Jan - Nov 1968

[Mike Keville]

1st Cav Div., '65-'66.

Thanx for your service!

[Hoss Cain]

Mr McNamara's War.   What a jackass.

HA, HA Ha. For you youngsters that don't know, McNamara went to L. Johnson's side from Ford Motor C0. where he was responsible for the infamous garbage car, the Edsel. He also was the forerunner and demanded one airplane for all services. The F-111 later had some good things but it was really a piece of junk for the multi-missions it was designed for. I can never forget when a short time before I left the USAF, an executive order from the whitehouse came down through the chain-of-command to the lowest levels. It stated as it came for USAF Headquarters, "Immediately no U.S. Airforce person will refer to the F-111b aircraft as the "SWITCH BLADE EDSEL"  For you youngsters, the Edsel was a failure as an automobile. The F-111 was an early attempt at swing-wing aircraft. With ordnance and straight wings, it had to have a tanker about every hour and remain subsonic.
Now some will decline that this info is not good for this CL forum. However IMO anyone worth being a CL model airplane pilot will probably like these tidbits of aero-history.

[Paul Smith]

The Linebacker II offensive in December of 1972 was the lone example of fighting to win.  With his reelection in hand, President Nixon finally unleashed 200 B-52's to bomb Hanoi into submission, and operation that took only eleven days.  Fifteen B-52's were shot down by 1,500 SAM missiles - a guided missile that was designed by the Russians to bring down a bomber with a single shot.

It is a pity that we lost almost 1,000 airplanes and over 59,000 by waiting nine years to pull the trigger.  The Enemy Within, US communist protesters, succeeded in persuading President Johnson and his congress to fight to lose.   In retrospect, Johnson was a war hawk patriot compared to current leadership.

[Dan McEntee]

1st Cav Div., '65-'66.

Thanx for your service!

   Hey Uncle Mikey, did you see in that other thread who else is 1st Cav now? He has the hat and everything! You'll have to ask him to do hi Robert Duval impression yourself!

    Type at you later,
    Dan McEntee

[Steve Scott]

I thought this was one of the earlier 'drones'...
My dad saw plenty of these after breaking his foot while on a practice jump with the 17th ABN.  He was laid up in a London hospital.  Said 'As long as you could hear them you were OK.  When the engine cut out, everyone ran for cover."  The V-2s came in at supersonic speed so there was never any warning.

[Scott Richlen]

if you flip that North Korean drone over, you'll probably find one of those AMA stickers "If found, please return to..."

Scott