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Author Topic: Did You Get Your Shot?  (Read 19562 times)

Offline GallopingGhostler

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #150 on: March 05, 2021, 10:34:54 AM »
My mother is Japanese. What ever happened to, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me?"

 :! I thought the only woke members in Stunt Hangar n~ were those who perpetuate the Fox Hurl Event :o over a vilified brand name. LL~

Online John Miller

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #151 on: March 05, 2021, 10:35:49 AM »
If having to use Tylenol for pain is a real problem with the vaccine, I won't be able to have the shots.

I have extreme pain from damage I received when I was accidentally electrocuted in 2012. I have to take Gabupenten (sp) and Tylenol for the pain. Used to also take Oxycontin but weaned myself off the Opiate 3 years ago. I could not go for more than a few hours without what I'm still taking before the pain goes through the roof.

Might be a blessing in disguise.
Getting a line on life. AMA 1601

Offline Mike Griffin

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #152 on: March 05, 2021, 11:23:07 AM »
"When people walk around flouting no masks and no vaccinations all I can think of is how selfish they are. They choose to roll the dice and say it's their right. What they don't consider is that they may infect others that are at risk."

I am so sick of this guilt trip attempt.  Since when did it become anyone's responsibility to watch out for your well being?  You want to wear 37 masks and stay in your basement, fine, it is a free country.  Dont tell me I have to do the same - again - it is a free country.

So sick of this bullshit virtue signaling.

Mike

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #153 on: March 05, 2021, 12:15:48 PM »
Well said Chuck!!!

This additionally leads me to wonder if some the good folks here would prefer to have all the Asian Americans corralled and isolated as was the Japanese during WWII. Those who promote a negative ideology ideally only fuels the hatred and attack on good people, many have been beaten, stabbed not to mention the abuse Asian children receive in school and on line. What good does it do to castigate these people? Let's move on and deal with our problems at hand instead of dwelling on the basis for them; such energy could be well spent in a more productive way.

Secondly, If only the conspirator theorist would spend as much time attempting to validate a theory compared to time spent conjuring it in a manner so as to be as graphic and tantalizing to the gullible we'd be much farther ahead.

Steve

 

    What in  the hell does this have to do with getting a vaccine shot? Or not??

   Read Brett's post, # 152. This is exactly what I have been talking about. Is dying from one disease more important than any other??  Are you more dead from dying from Covid  than the next guy dying from something else??? What do you think the death toll is from the ramifications of all the BS we have been put through for the last year??  With all the restrictions on hospitals and doctors visits, how many people have succumbed to relatively minor afflictions but because of fear and restrictions did not get treated?  This whole affair has been about power and money, playing with people's lively hoods and their health in general. One thing that I have figured out so far in life is that none of us are getting out of this alive. You live, and then you die from something. Politicians put this thing under a microscope and made it much bigger than it should have been just to push an agenda. "Don't let a good crisis g to waste!!"
    There have probably been more people die from tuberculosis, emphysema, asthma and other respiratory illnesses. No one is saying it in the main stream media but the one common factor among most of the legitimate deaths has been underlying medical conditions such as obesity and diabetes. Are you going to start pointing fingers at those people now as potential spreaders???  There is way more to this than just catching a virus and whether you need a shot or not!!
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Offline GallopingGhostler

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #154 on: March 05, 2021, 12:38:51 PM »
Politicians put this thing under a microscope and made it much bigger than it should have been just to push an agenda. "Don't let a good crisis go to waste."  There is way more to this than just catching a virus and whether you need a shot or not!!

There is more to it, as you say, but the problem I have run into are those, who allow me to share my opinion only if it is their opinion. Thus, I don't confuse them with facts or logic, letting them stumble with their perfidy nonsense to others.

Offline Mike Griffin

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #155 on: March 05, 2021, 01:14:59 PM »
"This whole affair has been about power and money"

AMEN Dan

Offline ericrule

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #156 on: March 05, 2021, 01:45:21 PM »
I certainly agree with the folks who feel the politicians have created the crisis and rode it as far as they can! Power and control of the population is what they desire. I remember my father telling me years ago "you can tell a politician is lying if his lips are moving". That has held true as long as I have been alive and I am certain it will prove true long after I am dead. mw~ mw~ mw~

Offline Steve Dwyer

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #157 on: March 05, 2021, 02:22:12 PM »
Eric,

I couldn't agree with you more about politicians wanting power and control. They lie for the benefit of themselves with little concern for others. As proof look what's happened in Texas, one recently elected politician abandoned his voters when the going got tough. And now in attempt to appease the mob they have failed they've decided to relax all efforts towards protecting people, it's insane. The stars are all lined up in Texas, give it a month and watch the outcome. History in the making.

Steve

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #158 on: March 08, 2021, 09:42:28 AM »
I am 100% behind anyone that wants to not get the shot for whatever reason.  I am also 100% behind someone suing you if you decline the shot and they can prove you gave it to them.  It cuts both ways. 

   That's OK only because you can never prove anyone gave it to you. The idea that you could sue someone for "giving you" a disease (without willful intent) is nuts. Of course, knowing you have Wuhan, and then going and intentionally coughing on people, that's willful intent, and arguably assault.  Having asymptomatic Wuhan that you don't know about, and transmitting it to someone in casual contact is not.

     People worried about communicable diseases have a ~100% reliable alternative - isolation. They also have a reasonably reliable solution - vaccination, which, if you are pessimistic, gives you 75% immunity. So it is (now, or at least very shortly) in the control of everyone to *protect themselves*, at least as well against this as any other random risk. The notion that there can be no risk, ever, is a function of modern thinking. Essentially Wuhan is a pretty typical and now endemic disease, and even though it is 2021 - we are still almost as helpless against it as they were in the 1300s. All you can ever hope for is that the risk disappears into the background.

    The analogy with measles is apt - it was killing about as many people as Wuhan is going to, *every single year for the better part of a century* in an era with much lower population, and not only did no one figure it was much of a problem, parents would sometimes intentionally expose their kids to it just so they got immunity. Even the profile of deaths is very similar- trivial risk for children (*trivial*, not zero) and wildly disproportionately increased risk rising with age.

    The reaction to measles before the vaccine makes a fascinating comparison to Wuhan about the really basic lack of modern knowledge about  various risks they are subject to. Asbestos, lead, ionizing radiation, same thing - these risks are all blown wildly out of proportion by historical standards and many people are willing to absolutely destroy anything positive about modern civilization to avoid what would have been completely trivial risks before about 1970.

      Brett

Offline John Park

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #159 on: March 08, 2021, 11:04:09 AM »
Asbestos, lead, ionizing radiation, same thing - these risks are all blown wildly out of proportion by historical standards and many people are willing to absolutely destroy anything positive about modern civilization to avoid what would have been completely trivial risks before about 1970.

      Brett
At my first school, the central heating pipes were insulated with asbestos, which was plastered wet round the pipes, allowed to set, and just painted over.  We used to relieve the boredom of lessons by picking holes in it with our fingernails.  Later, when we roamed the woods with our air rifles, we'd carry half a dozen slugs in our mouths to speed up reloading.  That was in the 1950s.  Makes you wonder how we survived, doesn't it?

John
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #160 on: March 08, 2021, 11:50:40 AM »
At my first school, the central heating pipes were insulated with asbestos, which was plastered wet round the pipes, allowed to set, and just painted over.  We used to relieve the boredom of lessons by picking holes in it with our fingernails.  Later, when we roamed the woods with our air rifles, we'd carry half a dozen slugs in our mouths to speed up reloading.  That was in the 1950s.  Makes you wonder how we survived, doesn't it?

   Good example, very similar to our schools - the ceilings were just open-frame and sprayed an inch thick with asbestos, which you could see floating in the air when the sun shone in.

  Another one - lead is now a deadly poison causing developmental problems in children and heavy-metal toxicity in adults (in sufficient quantities). During the time that tetraethyl lead was common in motor fuel we fought two psychotic dictatorships to a destruction, went from flying around in biplanes to putting a man on the moon and sending probes to every major planet, and gone from 50% of the world living continuously on the edge of starvation to having "poor" whos biggest problem is obesity.   

     The current world cowers in terror from every perceived issue, even those where *the people behind them have admitted that they lied about them for effect*, waiting around for someone to fix it for them.   This latter cowardice has exploded since the 90's - maybe we ought to put the lead BACK in motor fuel!   That's of course just a joke because the same cowardice and foolish inability to gauge risk caused the lead to be removed in the first place. Many people have never had a single real challenge in their entire lives, or been in any real danger, so they blow the minor inconveniences out or proportion into existential crises.

     Brett

 
« Last Edit: March 08, 2021, 12:34:02 PM by Brett Buck »

Offline EddyR

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #161 on: March 08, 2021, 12:53:43 PM »
 I have not read any of these post except the last page as i clicked on it by accident. I was very surprised that anyone would use measles as proof that Vaccine do not work. Measles has gone from millions a year to 73,000 word wide  because of vaccine.  I am aware of this as I was told I had measles 20 years ago when I was vaccinated as a kid. I did not have it was it was a reaction from a medicine change that took months for it to show in my system. BECAUSE OF THIS WHEN i GOT MY SHOT i HAD TO STAY FOR OBSERVATION FOR ONE HR AND THE CALL BACK EACH DAY FOR A WEEK. I had no reaction at all, not even are pain in the arm after the shot.
 QUOTE  It is one of the leading vaccine-preventable disease causes of death.[19][20] In 1980, 2.6 million people died of it,[7] and in 1990, 545,000 died; by 2014, global vaccination programs had reduced the number of deaths from measles to 73,000.[21][22] Despite these trends, rates of disease and deaths increased from 2017 to 2019 due to a decrease in immunization.[23][24][25]
Ed
 CDC for 2019
Number of deaths for leading causes of death:
Heart disease: 659,041
Cancer: 599,601
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 173,040
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 156,979
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 150,005
Alzheimer’s disease: 121,499
Diabetes: 87,647
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 51,565
Influenza and Pneumonia: 49,783
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 47,511
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Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #162 on: March 08, 2021, 01:09:27 PM »
I have not read any of these post except the last page as i clicked on it by accident. I was very surprised that anyone would use measles as proof that Vaccine do not work. Measles has gone from millions a year to 73,000 word wide  because of vaccine.  I am aware of this as I was told I had measles 20 years ago when I was vaccinated as a kid. I did not have it was it was a reaction from a medicine change that took months for it to show in my system. BECAUSE OF THIS WHEN i GOT MY SHOT i HAD TO STAY FOR OBSERVATION FOR ONE HR AND THE CALL BACK EACH DAY FOR A WEEK. I had no reaction at all, not even are pain in the arm after the shot.
 QUOTE  It is one of the leading vaccine-preventable disease causes of death.[19][20] In 1980, 2.6 million people died of it,[7] and in 1990, 545,000 died; by 2014, global vaccination programs had reduced the number of deaths from measles to 73,000.[21][22] Despite these trends, rates of disease and deaths increased from 2017 to 2019 due to a decrease in immunization.[23][24][25]
Ed
 CDC for 2019
Number of deaths for leading causes of death:
Heart disease: 659,041
Cancer: 599,601
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 173,040
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 156,979
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 150,005
Alzheimer’s disease: 121,499
Diabetes: 87,647
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 51,565
Influenza and Pneumonia: 49,783
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 47,511

    Re read the post Eddy, I think you are mis-understanding his point. Go back to Post #152 I think it is and you may get the idea. I happen to agree with him.
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #163 on: March 08, 2021, 01:31:34 PM »
I have not read any of these post except the last page as i clicked on it by accident. I was very surprised that anyone would use measles as proof that Vaccine do not work. Measles has gone from millions a year to 73,000 word wide  because of vaccine.  I am aware of this as I was told I had measles 20 years ago when I was vaccinated as a kid. I

  Missed my point completely - because I used this as an example where a vaccination DOES work. I support getting vaccinated for Wuhan, it's not likely to be more dangerous than any other vaccine.

    Brett

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #164 on: March 08, 2021, 08:25:30 PM »
  Missed my point completely - because I used this as an example where a vaccination DOES work. I support getting vaccinated for Wuhan, it's not likely to be more dangerous than any other vaccine.

    Brett

   The point being not about vaccinations- those are good and I highly encourage everyone to get one for Wuhan. I think there is some reluctance simply because of the source - press, Biden administration, Fauci - have so consistently and obviously lied to everyone about this from the beginning. I understand people's anger, but vaccination, by itself, stripped of the BS, is a very good thing that has helped save untold millions of lives in other cases, including the measles.

   The other point being - Wuhan and the Measles (before the vaccine)  have remarkable similarities in terms of mortality, age-related mortality profile, transmissibility, and mechanism. The statistics look *extremely similar* in almost every respect.

     But, when measles was endemic, we managed to live through it with barely a notice. Wuhan, we have tried to turn the entire country into an isolation ward with devastating side effects and a casual dismissal of our most important formative principles/rights. You have to wonder, if measles mutated to make the vaccine ineffective, would we do the same thing? Or would we look at someone who suggested that and say "that's the dumbest thing we ever heard - it's *the measles* for God's sake, who cares?"

    Brett


     

Offline Dick Pacini

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #165 on: March 08, 2021, 10:59:35 PM »
Got my 2nd shot this past Wednesday.
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Offline EddyR

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #166 on: March 09, 2021, 06:59:56 AM »
I do know where you are getting your measles facts but i lived through the 1940-50’s and the death rate for children was less than 500 per year in the US. All children came down with it and my parents were afraid to let me go to the movies or any place with a group of kids.  Comparing  500 to 550,000 a year is hiding one,s head in the sand. Measles and polio was a very big scare in the 1950’s
   





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Offline Frank Imbriaco

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #167 on: March 09, 2021, 07:15:10 AM »
So we got our second Pfizer vaccine on Feb 9 down here in sunny Florida. Thank you Gov Ron DeSantis !
Our friends and relatives back in NJ are just starting to get appointments or if lucky, got just one.
 In recent days and weeks, a lot has been made of the Brazilian strain of Covid.
Happy to read  today that the Pfizer vaccine neutralizes it; highly effective.
Stay well, all.

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #168 on: March 09, 2021, 10:10:56 AM »
I do know where you are getting your measles facts but i lived through the 1940-50’s and the death rate for children was less than 500 per year in the US. All children came down with it and my parents were afraid to let me go to the movies or any place with a group of kids.  Comparing  500 to 550,000 a year is hiding one,s head in the sand. Measles and polio was a very big scare in the 1950’s
 

    The numbers came from the same World Health Organization that supplied the 550,000 number....   And, Wuhan deaths among children are far less than 500, because, just like measles, it was disproportionately lethal for older people. Kids got it as kids, not many died, and then were immune, but if you got it when you were old, it was extremely dangerous.

   And, in any case, *we did not attempt to turn the entire country into a prison camp* no matter what the numbers.

      I agree that polio was the disease that terrified everyone, but that the transmissibility and mortality rate was much lower than measles. It was terrifying because you might end up in an iron lung for the rest of your life. That's one horror I think I am glad almost no one today has seen.

    Brett

   

   

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #169 on: March 09, 2021, 11:04:57 AM »
Seen a photo of the nurses at a influenza site in early 1900's in which it was verified 500,00 people dead.  The USA was still not full size yet and didn't have 50 states.   And we consider 500,00 a catastrophy in 2020. S?P
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Offline Mike Griffin

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #170 on: March 09, 2021, 03:04:07 PM »
From Fauci's latest briefing

Offline Chuck_Smith

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #171 on: March 10, 2021, 01:00:01 PM »
Seen a photo of the nurses at a influenza site in early 1900's in which it was verified 500,00 people dead.  The USA was still not full size yet and didn't have 50 states.   And we consider 500,00 a catastrophy in 2020. S?P

Well gee John, what do you call half a million people dead? Even if the data was GROSSLY skewed and half of the reporting was wrong, that's still a quarter of a million people dead. You need a smaller denominator?  And the sad part is, a lot of the deaths were preventable.

I guess this is my WTF? moment.

Chuck
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Offline EddyR

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #172 on: March 10, 2021, 03:54:13 PM »
 North Carolina has been one of the slowest ones to offer the covid shots. In many parts of the state it is still impossible to get a shot. I signed up in early January  and just got first shot two weeks ago and had to drive 60 miles to get that one. Second one next week. I live in rural Stanley county and no one offed shots any where near us.  We got our first shot at the hospital that Rebecca worked at and they changed the location two times.
  If you watch TV you would think NC is leading the Us in shots but we are almost last
Ed
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Offline Al Ferraro

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #173 on: March 10, 2021, 06:19:12 PM »

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #174 on: March 11, 2021, 12:38:54 AM »
Well gee John, what do you call half a million people dead? Even if the data was GROSSLY skewed and half of the reporting was wrong, that's still a quarter of a million people dead. You need a smaller denominator?  And the sad part is, a lot of the deaths were preventable.

    There is no doubt that this is a real disease and a real bad break. But, I doubt that a lot of the deaths were preventable - or rather not preventable without impractically draconian measures. I made a prediction about a year ago about how many people would end up dead, based on purely assuming that the death rate per exposed person was as it was indicated early on, and assuming that everyone in the country would be exposed. It was 300,000 to 500,000, we are currently at 529,000 and rate falling rapidly (as herd immunity + vaccinations take hold). The error in the estimate is because it became clear shortly into this that the death rate was a tiny bit higher than orginally calculated. That also assumes that other measures (like masks and washing hand obsessively) were entirely cosmetic, and the only way to slow it down/spread it out was isolation.

     The lockdowns and selective isolation of sensitive populations *slowed down the spread* but *didn't prevent it* in almost all cases. Slowing it down, as originally attempted ("14 days to flatten the curve" which is now 365 days and counting...) saved a few lives by mostly preventing the hospitals from being overwhelmed, and, as implied by "flattening the curve" and also made it last much longer than it would have otherwise. It didn't appear to change the death rate per exposure at all.

    So, we knocked it down slightly - but at what cost? Poverty, by itself, is good for 40,000 deaths a year per percent unemployment. That's a rough estimate of what was saved by dragging it out longer - but unemployment went up by 11%  at peak as a result of the lockdowns. So even if you think the deaths is the sole and only important figure of merit, you saved 40,000 and cost 440,000 from the side effects.

    This is just math and universally-accepted  population and mortality statistics, anyone can do the same. There was probably some minima between draconian lockdowns saving lives and the side effects of draconian lockdowns causing poverty-related deaths, but it appears we traded lingering mortality due to economic reasons of 400,000 or so dead for a for a 7-10% reduction in Wuhan deaths.

   So yes, all this knocked down slightly on the deaths from one case, but at an appalling cost, even if you just look at the dead and ignore the other effects.

    Brett

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #175 on: March 11, 2021, 06:11:05 AM »
Interesting video.
Al
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0IHZCwbLiizO_uNAFwIk45nIg

     Yes it is an interesting video, but would carry a bit more authority is we knew who this man was and what school/lab/company he was representing. Some sort of ID that we can look up and verify. And maybe even some other entity backing up what he is presenting.
   
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Offline Steve Dwyer

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #176 on: March 11, 2021, 06:59:13 AM »
Better yet Dan, let's set thus guy down with Fauci and the CDC and see how the outcome stacks up. If we listen to this guy we can no longer call it the "Wuhan" that's a positive.

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #177 on: March 11, 2021, 08:54:30 AM »
Better yet Dan, let's set thus guy down with Fauci and the CDC and see how the outcome stacks up. If we listen to this guy we can no longer call it the "Wuhan" that's a positive.

    I've lost any faith in Faucci, WHO and the CDC a long time ago. They are on record as giving out mis-information. This man isn't the only one with sheep skins and pedigrees that are saying the same thing over the last year. I have said this from the beginning that the way that the virus is not and miss on who it seriously affects, something is missing in what we are being told. Even the elderly quite often have no or very mild symptoms. it all depends on your personal immune system. A lot of illnesses and diseases can vary on severity depending on a persons genetics. Most people relate diabetes with obesity, but I know a whole lot of people that are as skinny as a rail and are diabetic, and also over weight people that are not diabetic.  People have very short memories. This is not the first time a Corona Virus has been involve with a break out, but has been the first one that has been made into a political football.
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Offline Steve Dwyer

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #178 on: March 11, 2021, 09:51:39 AM »
You can find and read studies and reports for hours on the complexity associated with distinguishing SARS-COV-2 from the many infectious flu influenza related respiratory complications that have existed for years. I recall occasionally I would see someone walking by wearing a mask and would wonder if he was dust or allergy sensitive, look at us now. Where are we going from here? As new virus strains are developing science is already anticipating modified vaccines. How many vaccine cards will I have to keep in the future and what will they learn about compatibility and accumulative effect if any?

You think the learning curve has been vertical for folks like Fauci, wait until the information coming forth get real confusing, I thinks it's the tip of the iceberg. One thing for sure I'm going to stick to wearing my N-95 well into the future and enjoy the politics. What ever they decide to attribute this growing death rate to I don't wish to be part of it, it's not my time yet!!!

Steve

Offline Skip Chernoff

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #179 on: March 11, 2021, 11:04:14 AM »
My wife and I had our 2nd Moderna shot yesreday. I've had no reaction except some soreness where the needle went in. On the other hand my wife is running a fever of 101.6 and has aches and pains all over. They say this is quite normal for 2nd shot Moderna. I'll keep an eye on her..........PhillySkip

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #180 on: March 11, 2021, 11:24:10 AM »
My wife and I had our 2nd Moderna shot yesreday. I've had no reaction except some soreness where the needle went in. On the other hand my wife is running a fever of 101.6 and has aches and pains all over. They say this is quite normal for 2nd shot Moderna. I'll keep an eye on her..........PhillySkip

   That means it is doing something. The reaction to viruses (coughing, sneezing, fever, etc) is not the virus itself causing it, it is your immune system reacting to it - the fever, for instance, forms to "burn out" the virus. The less efficient your immune system, the bigger the reaction.  So it probably means that she had little natural immunity to it in the first place. By the same token, your lack of reaction probably means you had significant immunity already (most likely had already been exposed and had a mild immune reaction - which is what happens in the vast, vast majority of Wuhan cases).

  So that is all good news, I think.

    Brett

   

Online Ken Culbertson

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #181 on: March 11, 2021, 11:50:06 AM »
Second shot yesterday.  In two weeks I will be able to do legally what I have been doing all along.

Ken

Tiny headache, some sore muscles and that be that.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2021, 09:51:55 PM by Ken Culbertson »
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Offline bob whitney

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #182 on: March 11, 2021, 01:29:58 PM »
got my 2nd shot today through the VA
rad racer

Offline Skip Chernoff

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #183 on: March 11, 2021, 02:03:33 PM »
Brett,thanks for that info. Today was the first really nice day here in Philly with temps around 75.I was planning on going flying but decided to stay with my wife "just in case"......so what you're  saying is I could have gone to the field and practice that pesky square 8.....Be safe,Skip

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #184 on: March 12, 2021, 04:55:00 AM »
When fishing I often hang with medical doctors, surgeons and a great veterinarian. All these guys have PhD's in medicine and in most cases decades in their professions. They are what I think of as "Subject Matter Experts". To a person they all say that mask wearing is effective and that's why they wear them when doing surgery. They think Covid 19 is dangerous too. They urge people to get vaccinated. I also listen to the virologists and people at the CDC.


I'm inclined to listen to them more than some old-timers on a model airplane forum who claim to know better. Especially so considering some of the aerodynamic "wisdom" I read from a few of them. (BTW, that's my personal choice for all you "don't take-away-my-freedom" folks.)

Call me a fool.

The Mrs. got her second shot this week. Moderna. Felt a little flu-like for that afternoon but woke up the next AM and all is well. I get my first shot Monday, can't wait. Billfish and dolphin tournaments by the end of May. Woohoo! (Wahoo?)

Chuck
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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #185 on: March 12, 2021, 07:39:50 AM »
Finally got my appointment day for the 16th. Just waiting to be contacted as to the location and time.

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #186 on: March 12, 2021, 08:35:31 AM »
Chuck,

  If you go to FactCheck.org or just Google "The Evolving Science of Face Masks and COVID-19"  we can find a fair conclusion on the effectiveness of mask wearing to reduce the risk of developing or spreading the Covid-19 virus. They tell it like it is, of course if someone is still hung up on a mask infringing on their rights I guess it doesn't matter to them anyway.

Steve

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #187 on: March 12, 2021, 08:45:34 AM »
     so what you're  saying is I could have gone to the field and practice that pesky square 8.....Be safe,Skip
     You did the right thing by staying with her, keep a close eye on her till she gets over the reaction to the vaccine. People are calling in to the radio station NJ 101.5 and are telling their experience after getting the shot. It turns out more Women are having problems after getting the 2nd Moderna shot more than men with high fever and aches & pains, some even ended up in the hospital.
     Thanks for sharing Skip, and I hope she feels better real soon.
Al

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #188 on: March 12, 2021, 09:01:02 AM »
How many vaccine cards will I have to keep in the future

Steve

Steve.....this reminds me that I still have my US Army shot record card from 64'.
There was a time when I would rather be shot that lose that card!!

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #189 on: March 12, 2021, 09:16:47 AM »
Chuck,

  If you go to FactCheck.org or just Google "The Evolving Science of Face Masks and COVID-19"  we can find a fair conclusion on the effectiveness of mask wearing to reduce the risk of developing or spreading the Covid-19 virus. They tell it like it is, of course if someone is still hung up on a mask infringing on their rights I guess it doesn't matter to them anyway.

Steve

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #190 on: March 12, 2021, 09:54:44 AM »
If you go to FactCheck.org or just Google "The Evolving Science of Face Masks and COVID-19"  we can find a fair conclusion on the effectiveness of mask wearing to reduce the risk of developing or spreading the Covid-19 virus. They tell it like it is, of course if someone is still hung up on a mask infringing on their rights I guess it doesn't matter to them anyway.

If you go to FactCheck.org or just Google "The Evolving Science of Face Masks and COVID-19"  we can find a fair conclusion on the effectiveness of mask wearing to reduce the risk of developing or spreading the Covid-19 virus.

  Is it in any way surprising left wing organizations like factcheck.org declare that their initiatives work?  You treat factcheck.org like it is some scientific orgnization - it was created to ensure that the left could define "fact" how they chose. And make people who know nothing about it sound like they know what they are talking about, in their endearingly sanctimious/self-righteous way.

      NO studies before about March 2020 found that wearing a randomly-chosen mask, and that alone, was effective in slowing or preventing the spread of a virus - any virus, Wuhan Flu is not consequentially different - and that was how even the sainted Fauci started out. He wasn't lying to help Trump. He wrote an article for JAMA indicating exactly that. Starting in March, a spew of "studies" said wearing masks as a great idea came out, when the left switched from "trying to suppress the spread is racist", to "Trump is killing you!!!!!!" He of course fell in line and changed, presto-chango, despite the fact that there were no studies due to lack of time and lack of any process controls in a few months.

   Cut to July-ish when there HAD been enough time to do such a study. No clinical difference in the occurrence or severity wearing a mask. That was available for about a day, until the outcry from the left caused it to be taken down as "dangerous". I linked to it here. Dangerous to what?  People offering a worthless non-solution "solution" to curry political favor. Since, of course, everyone involved got the message, say the wrong thing and you are getting cancelled.

   This is an absolutely *textbook* and blatantly obvious case of manipulating "science" and political organizations deciding to define "fact" to their own ends and using the means available to give the ignorant. Compare to this hypothesis:

   March 2020- We have a new virus with no known significant immunity.  We are doing more-or-less nothing useful to retard the spread (and can't, in any practical sense), so the number of deaths will be .1-.15% of the exposed population - the assumed death rate per exposure in April 2020, minus a few who hunker down in nearly complete isolation. 330,000,000*.001 = 330,000, knock that down to 300,000 to cover outliers. 330,000,000*.0015 = 495,000. Figure a year for a vaccine has any significant effect, so predict 300,000 - 500,000 dead.

     Cut to March 2021 - actual dead 529,000 and rapidly diminishing with minimal effects of vaccination. That represents a 5% error in the original death rate per exposure
.16% VS .15%. In reality, figure that the exposure is not 100%, and the actual death rate per exposure is more like .17-.18% - which is in fact consistent with the other known statistics.   So, in the first few weeks it was possible to predict the effects within single-digit percentages.

    That is actual science, data science in this case. And in fact, it probably takes about that long to make any reasonable study. It presumes that masks do nothing at all, along with all the other silly "solutions" offered. Isolation *does* work, people in at-risk populations should (or at this point, should have, since it is past-tense) isolate to the maximum extent possible, people under 60 should probably just go on with their lives, get a bad cold for a week, and go on with life. And don't bother posting anecdotal "well, a 18 year old got it and DIED". That is a statistical anomaly, and the entire premise includes *random error*, that is, for all intents and purposes, luck (chaos...).

   Brett

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #191 on: March 12, 2021, 11:30:15 AM »
I get my second one on the 18th!

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #192 on: March 12, 2021, 02:01:36 PM »
Left, Right in the Middle whatever, taking away all Fauci finger pointing, before and after fact checking and Democratic "manipulation"  the bottom line is masks have a benefit and have been proven to reduce the spread of the Covid-19 virus to and from the individual.

Additionally early on when the country was trying to comprehend whether the virus hitting NYC came from Europe or via the west coast early implementation of mask wearing and social distancing in the densest populated city in the country resulted in "bending the curve" in what was a seemingly hopeless situation. At the same time other parts of the country were continuing with planned mask less parties and events (mardi gras 2020) resulting in catastrophic consequences only weeks later followed with the beginning of the political nonsense over mask wearing.

If only we had a leader at the time that had set the example and his approximately 60 million far-right followers had worn masks we'd have enjoyed ourselves last July instead of hopefully this July. Refute it all you will the writing is on the wall masks help reduce the spread, I didn't say eliminate but they are a benefit.

Steve

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #193 on: March 12, 2021, 02:59:41 PM »
If only we had a leader at the time that had set the example and his approximately 60 million far-right followers had worn masks we'd have enjoyed ourselves last July instead of hopefully this July. Refute it all you will the writing is on the wall masks help reduce the spread, I didn't say eliminate but they are a benefit.

  This is just political screed,  not an argument.

   If you can predict the answer within 5% a year out,  assuming NO MASK or any other real "defense", you can probably assume that the assumptions were correct. I though the left was all about "science"?  Form a hypothesis, predict a result, perform an experiment, check that result matches prediction. Sounds OK to me.

    Brett

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #194 on: March 12, 2021, 04:24:26 PM »
Left, Right in the Middle whatever, taking away all Fauci finger pointing, before and after fact checking and Democratic "manipulation"  the bottom line is masks have a benefit and have been proven to reduce the spread of the Covid-19 virus to and from the individual.

Additionally early on when the country was trying to comprehend whether the virus hitting NYC came from Europe or via the west coast early implementation of mask wearing and social distancing in the densest populated city in the country resulted in "bending the curve" in what was a seemingly hopeless situation. At the same time other parts of the country were continuing with planned mask less parties and events (mardi gras 2020) resulting in catastrophic consequences only weeks later followed with the beginning of the political nonsense over mask wearing.

If only we had a leader at the time that had set the example and his approximately 60 million far-right followers had worn masks we'd have enjoyed ourselves last July instead of hopefully this July. Refute it all you will the writing is on the wall masks help reduce the spread, I didn't say eliminate but they are a benefit.

Steve

     Well, you had a leader in place that got things to where they are today. Biden didn't take office until January 20th, remember?  Anything positive about this that you can point out was put into play by the Trump administration.  Grandpa Joe is just parading around, being propped up by Jill and his other handlers, taking advantage of a situation and taking credit for what had already been put into action. It just takes time for it to play out and over lapped into his administration. And he's making claims about numbers and such that don't stand up to criticism. The death and infection rates have been in free fall since the holidays, when everyone was predicting another  "surge"  that never happened.  There hasn't been enough vaccine in circulation long enough to have that kind of effect. And on the effectiveness of masks, Faucci and the CDC want you to wear two or three now!! Grandpa Joe is wearing two now when he is on camera. If they were that damned effective, why isn't one enough???? For the whole past year it's been one contradiction after another. There are just as many PHD's out there that can contradict the "science" presented by Faucci and the CDC as there are that push it. Countless examples of horse and pony shows put on by the MSM to push the fear mongering agenda. I'm sorry that people died, but you know what, people die every minute of every day. Even if you believe the number of deaths, a VERY high percentage of those ha underlying health issues that put them at risk of any kind of infection. Even as the number of infections and deaths are dropping like they fell off a cliff, the MSM is still pushing the fear mongering and their agenda to try and hold the course. I have real reservations about the death total, when it has been proven from the beginning that the numbers have been padded and exaggerated. If you stepped off a curb and got hit by a truck and were infected, you were listed as a Covid fatality!  And no one in authority has the conscience to correct that because it doesn't fit the narrative. The MSM won't report on anything like that.  And as far as the vaccines go, how safe are they, and how skilled are the people applying it?? The first one rushed to the market is so fragile it has to be kept at -90F degrees !! Lots of stories out there about doses being wasted, ruined because of the refrigeration issue, and then you add the human element into administering it. They have been crying the blues about the shortages of medical staffs during this whole affair, and if that is true and they are still needed, who is administering them? The janitors?? How well are these people trained? Are the bad reactions and even deaths that have been re[ported due to human error and incompetence's ? We are talking big numbers here in a really short amount of time and plenty of opportunity for people to screw up. And one thing that you can count on people for , is that they are very capable of screwing the pooch!

  Type at you later,
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #195 on: March 12, 2021, 08:04:35 PM »
For the whole past year it's been one contradiction after another. There are just as many PHD's out there that can contradict the "science" presented by Faucci and the CDC as there are that push it. Countless examples of horse and pony shows put on by the MSM to push the fear mongering agenda. I'm sorry that people died, but you know what, people die every minute of every day. Even if you believe the number of deaths, a VERY high percentage of those ha underlying health issues that put them at risk of any kind of infection. Even as the number of infections and deaths are dropping like they fell off a cliff, the MSM is still pushing the fear mongering and their agenda to try and hold the course.

    The basic problem is that we are experiencing a sickening and shameful mix of "safety culture", "cancel culture", and plain old fear. The left and the "Safety culture" (which are mostly the same people) have been running from one mode of apocalyptic doom after another for many decades how - overpopulation/starvation, ice age, global warming, "facism" (which means anyone or anything they want to bad-mouth). They finally got one that was sort-of legitimate, this is a real epidemic with real danger for some, it's not the end as they had long prophesied, but certainly not just made up from whole cloth like all the others.

  Wuhan or any other infection diseases don't scare me - it's that people are not only *willing* to live their lives in abject terror, they *wallow* in the disaster, and even worse, instead of questioning various little Hitler's made-up-on-the-spot mandates and "science", they are ACTIVELY SEEKING OUT THE GOVERNMENT TO GIVE THEM ORDERS so that they can feel "safe". Even when *they know for certain that the same people have intentionally and repeatedly lied to them*, which we know for certain because the people lying *have admitted it*, and are even proud of it!

   That - supposedly grown adults in the USA are living in fear to the point that they effectively demand that the government order them around just to feel better - is a *far* more dangerous situation than a virus. Even that filthy b*stard FDR knew that was the biggest threat.

     Brett

p.s. by the way, teh backlash is already starting in earnest. The prime movers on draconian illegal lockdowns, and former darlings of the left - Cuomo and Newsom - are well on their way to getting ousted. Newsom is going to undergo a recall election, although I doubt that will end up passing (although Gray Davis was pretty certain he was safe, too, this far out...) and the butcher Cuomo is effectively gone already - although the reasoning behind that is, again, almost literally insane. Killing tens of thousand of old people, he probably would have survived, but play grab-ass with the secretary - that's apparently that is too far. It's sleazy and abusive, but - maybe 10- 15,000 people are *dead*.

    There's really no excuse, while there was a lot people didn't understand at the time, the one unequivocal thing we did know was that it could wipe out an old folks home in a week, because that was how this all started, up in Washington. Another example of reasoning of the left.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2021, 10:36:42 PM by Brett Buck »

Offline GallopingGhostler

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #196 on: March 12, 2021, 10:38:24 PM »
I think the Amish have it figured out.

Offline Dave Harmon

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #197 on: March 12, 2021, 11:58:16 PM »
LOL, I still got that yellow shot card too from 1975. How long do those shots last?


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But I ain't takin a chance....just as I thought I was out, they drag me back in!!

Offline Chuck_Smith

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #198 on: March 13, 2021, 04:40:33 AM »
  Is it in any way surprising left wing organizations like factcheck.org declare that their initiatives work?  You treat factcheck.org like it is some scientific orgnization - it was created to ensure that the left could define "fact" how they chose. And make people who know nothing about it sound like they know what they are talking about, in their endearingly sanctimious/self-righteous way.

      NO studies before about March 2020 found that wearing a randomly-chosen mask, and that alone, was effective in slowing or preventing the spread of a virus - any virus, Wuhan Flu is not consequentially different - and that was how even the sainted Fauci started out. He wasn't lying to help Trump. He wrote an article for JAMA indicating exactly that. Starting in March, a spew of "studies" said wearing masks as a great idea came out, when the left switched from "trying to suppress the spread is racist", to "Trump is killing you!!!!!!" He of course fell in line and changed, presto-chango, despite the fact that there were no studies due to lack of time and lack of any process controls in a few months.

   Cut to July-ish when there HAD been enough time to do such a study. No clinical difference in the occurrence or severity wearing a mask. That was available for about a day, until the outcry from the left caused it to be taken down as "dangerous". I linked to it here. Dangerous to what?  People offering a worthless non-solution "solution" to curry political favor. Since, of course, everyone involved got the message, say the wrong thing and you are getting cancelled.

   This is an absolutely *textbook* and blatantly obvious case of manipulating "science" and political organizations deciding to define "fact" to their own ends and using the means available to give the ignorant. Compare to this hypothesis:

   March 2020- We have a new virus with no known significant immunity.  We are doing more-or-less nothing useful to retard the spread (and can't, in any practical sense), so the number of deaths will be .1-.15% of the exposed population - the assumed death rate per exposure in April 2020, minus a few who hunker down in nearly complete isolation. 330,000,000*.001 = 330,000, knock that down to 300,000 to cover outliers. 330,000,000*.0015 = 495,000. Figure a year for a vaccine has any significant effect, so predict 300,000 - 500,000 dead.

     Cut to March 2021 - actual dead 529,000 and rapidly diminishing with minimal effects of vaccination. That represents a 5% error in the original death rate per exposure
.16% VS .15%. In reality, figure that the exposure is not 100%, and the actual death rate per exposure is more like .17-.18% - which is in fact consistent with the other known statistics.   So, in the first few weeks it was possible to predict the effects within single-digit percentages.

    That is actual science, data science in this case. And in fact, it probably takes about that long to make any reasonable study. It presumes that masks do nothing at all, along with all the other silly "solutions" offered. Isolation *does* work, people in at-risk populations should (or at this point, should have, since it is past-tense) isolate to the maximum extent possible, people under 60 should probably just go on with their lives, get a bad cold for a week, and go on with life. And don't bother posting anecdotal "well, a 18 year old got it and DIED". That is a statistical anomaly, and the entire premise includes *random error*, that is, for all intents and purposes, luck (chaos...).

   Brett

Brett,

You disappointed me. I generally expect a much more sophisticated and cogent argument from you than most here, and I always look forward to your insights.

Attacking Mr. Dwyer's sources and then going on for several paragraphs with un-cited claims to the contrary strikes me a as a bit - shall we say - unpolished for a learned colleague.

I get it, it's the internet and anybody can say anything, but we need to be smart enough to back up what we say either with professional authority (which neither of us have
 wrt virology) or credible sources. Just throwing stuff out as "facts" is not exactly taking the highest road, would you agree?

Peace,

Chuck

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Offline Steve Dwyer

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Re: Did You Get Your Shot?
« Reply #199 on: March 13, 2021, 08:32:47 AM »
Chuck,

I’d say you are being too gracious the responses here fall under Philosophical Determinism where a person finds it difficult or impossible to change or accept beyond one’s thinking. In our case, the tactic is if you throw enough s_ _ t on the wall you can only hope eventually something will stick. It’s so degrading from someone we’d like to respect.
 
As for governor finger-pointing let’s not forget the last four years where our illustrious former president’s failure to act early on, promoting congested gatherings, and lying about receiving the vaccine himself resulted in “butchering” if you wish over half a million people. Not saying I love Cuomo but if you want to descend as you have into his “groping” (arm and waist touching), compare it to the great goomba saying he just grabs them by the P_ _ _  Y. Sounds a little like the pot calling the kettle black?

Staying safe here wearing a mask, distancing, and thanking the good lord we finally have someone to lead us out of this dilemma.

Just plain tired of beating a dead horse here, think I’ll move on to something more constructive. Do as you may, the weather’s improving so I can shoot those models before the grass circle firms enough to walk on.

Steve



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