Take apart fuselage sides

[Shorts,David]

Hi Take apart experts. Next question. Do I need my fuselage sides solid? That is to say, if I have a nobler kit with the wing slots already cut in the fuselage, would I need to plug them, cut new fuselage sides, or just leave it as is and glue my wing tab hardware to the edges of the fuselage side?

Mucho Thanks
David

[Dennis Toth]

Dave,
This depends on the style of "take-a-part" construction you select. I have done the Paul Walker "Impact" approach where the wing is one piece and bolts to formers at the leading and trailing edges with the bolt on tail feathers. For this you first build the wing and its mounting formers then with all bolted together build the fuse around them. If you  are using the Tom Morris (Okie Air Model Products) plug-in type you may need to build new fuse sides, there is a Windy video on the Big Job where he used this method. 

Best,    DennisT

[PJ Rowland]

I understand your question.

By the sounds of it ,this is your first takeapart?

Essentially any system you decide on needs to have the wing and fuselage components locking together in some mechanical way.
The fuse needs to accept the load from the wing. Most systems have a male and female sections that mate together and are secured with a few tiny bolts.

You cant really "glue tabs" to the fuse side walls, you would need some strength and most prebuilt take apart systems include these to be built into the formers for the fuse and wing spar for the wings.

Another system is a full wing and full fuselage. The wing joins the fuse firewall at the front and at the rear near the flaps.  This way you can have a full wing and a full fuselage it drops in from the bottom and you can have a cowl screw system hatch to hide it all.

Lots of options.

[Shorts,David]

So, I have a one piece wing take apart on my Oriental. I also made a pathfinder with the two wing halves, but didn't use a wing jig INCLUDING the fuselage, so it was a big "learning experience." This time I'm doing full fuse wing halves and planning on using a kit I have, so I'll probably cut my own fuse sides to make it solid. The Windy Big Job videos. Yes, thanks. Those are helpful, I didn't know his Big Job was a take apart. Helps seeing someone build it out of balsa to envision the process.

Because I had so much fun at the Nats, I'm thinking I need this for my return incase ground transportation is prohibitive.

[Ken Culbertson]

Another system is a full wing and full fuselage. The wing joins the fuse firewall at the front and at the rear near the flaps.  This way you can have a full wing and a full fuselage it drops in from the bottom and you can have a cowl screw system hatch to hide it all.

I have built several this way.  Really quite simple. Dowel(s) into firewall in front screws in back. Large fillets help.

Ken

[fred cesquim]

this picture may help you to see how a one piece wing can be done with the already cut fuselage sides

[Avaiojet]

this picture may help you to see how a one piece wing can be done with the already cut fuselage sides

Wow!

This brings back many R/C memories.

Nice work as usual Fred.

Charles

[Claudio Chacon]

Hi Take apart experts. Next question. Do I need my fuselage sides solid? That is to say, if I have a nobler kit with the wing slots already cut in the fuselage, would I need to plug them, cut new fuselage sides, or just leave it as is and glue my wing tab hardware to the edges of the fuselage side?

Mucho Thanks
David

David,
I will post some pics with my aproach to a take apart system. It's basically the same principle Fred Cesquim showed us, but this time with fuse mounted landing gear, which is perfect for the Nobler.
Let's see:

[Claudio Chacon]

Some more...

[Claudio Chacon]

...

[Claudio Chacon]

...

[Claudio Chacon]

And the last set...

[Claudio Chacon]

Same system, another plane...you can see here all parts together...

[Mike Alimov]

Hi David,
I think you need to decide first the overall take-apart scheme (i.e. which elements will be detachable and where/how), and the exact construction methods will follow.  That, in turn, will be determined by your planned method of transportation (van, car, or airplane).  It is possible to fit two take-apart planes into an international-size suitcase, if done correctly.  One piece removable wing and a one-piece fuselage help some, but you are still limited to car travel.

Here are some links to pictures and discussion (scroll for pictures, don't worry about language) showing different methods:
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/3v7B/PmDfKZLZV/


http://forum.rcdesign.ru/f95/thread254322.html

[Steve Helmick]

Start with the airline baggage rules and work backwards, toward the spinner. 

[fred cesquim]

Wow!

This brings back many R/C memories.

Nice work as usual Fred.

Charles

thank you Charles, all fine with you?
i am a bit off controline for a while, working on R/c for a costumer
hope to return to CL building within 2 months

[fred cesquim]

...

Chacon, this is world class craftsmanship! awesome work indeed!
congratulations

[Frank Imbriaco]

Claudio :

 Your craftsmanship is first rate !

Somehow, I think you already know that

[Avaiojet]

thank you Charles, all fine with you?
i am a bit off controline for a while, working on R/c for a costumer
hope to return to CL building within 2 months

Fred,

That's an interesting project.

From beginning or a repair? Nice detailing.

CB

[Claudio Chacon]

Chacon, this is world class craftsmanship! awesome work indeed!
congratulations

Well...Thanks Fred! Yours as well!
Do you have a pic of your finished bird?

Later,
Claudio.

[Claudio Chacon]

Claudio :

 Your craftsmanship is first rate !

Somehow, I think you already know that

Thank you Frank!

[fred cesquim]

Fred,

That's an interesting project.

From beginning or a repair? Nice detailing.

CB

thank you Charles, it´s a composite kit, but takes a lot work to be assembled and i have made extensive detailing to competition
now i am painting her
got the kit and will deliver ready to fly
 

[Avaiojet]

thank you Charles, it´s a composite kit, but takes a lot work to be assembled and i have made extensive detailing to competition
now i am painting her
got the kit and will deliver ready to fly

Fred,

I'll be looking forward to seeing more photos of your finishing progress.

CB

[fred cesquim]

Well...Thanks Fred! Yours as well!
Do you have a pic of your finished bird?

Later,
Claudio.

Hello Claudio, thanks a lot
yes, this one was finished a few years back for a friend, when i "came back" to control line after years devoted to RC only

[Claudio Chacon]

Hello Claudio, thanks a lot
yes, this one was finished a few years back for a friend, when i "came back" to control line after years devoted to RC only

Gorgeous!
A top notch piece without any doubt...
Your friend must be THRILLED with that puppy!

Congratulations!

[Gordon Van Tighem]

Here’s how I did my Veco Mustang, simple system.
Cowl and airscoop held on with super magnets.
G
(Now 5 years old and 2 airline trips, with no problems. Military ID gets it on for no charge)

[Steve Helmick]

The ONLY way to get one on an airliner (which was stated to be the goal), is to either build a really small model or use a 2 piece wing setup. All this stuff about dropping the 1-piece wing out the bottom of the fuselage won't be allowed onto an airliner.

Not that it couldn't be shipped at considerable expense, of course. Anything is possible if you pay the $$$ and have the time to wait. Some of our guys shipped 1-piece .60-sized models by Greyhound bus and generally survived and delivered in about 3 days from WA to AZ. Reno or Sacramento to Muncie might take a week. I never heard of anybody that had a problem with a damaged model, at least not that I recall. You're looking at a plywood box that probably will weigh 60 lbs with a 4 lb. model inside. Be sure to put some handles on it in appropriate places. Glue and screw all the joints.

Pickup of the box can be a problem. I found that the Seattle Greydog freight office was only open weekdays and limited hours. They also won't hold the box for more than a few days, or it'll be returned to the originating bus station. Not sure how long THEY would hold the box before giving it away or taking it home, but if your plane is back home and you're in Muncie, you wouldn't be happy. Be sure you know all their details or you could be very frustrated. Catch 33!  Steve

[Craig Beswick]

Steve,
If you are travelling with the plane box and I can't speak for US airline's, but ours in Australia and international departures, allow oversized luggage up to 8'. Generally to allow for surf boards and fishing rods etc. But it can be anything.

The weight is calculated as part of your checked luggage allowance. So you just need to know your weights and purchase enough so you don't get hit with excess baggage.

All the best.
Craig
Ps. Of course shipping the box alone would come into the hundreds of dollars.

[Mike Alimov]

It is possible to avoid oversized fees altogether...

[Shorts,David]

Thanks for all the input. Yes, as stated, I want a suitcase plane. I already have an plane with removable wing. And I have built a profile with removable wing halves. I was just looking for more info on how the wing halves join on a full fuse plane.

Mike, the pictures from Russia are a pretty good help, if I had the hardware. Also, the info about ready made cradles and exact dimensions was good info too. The windy videos with the big job, those are good and I'll continue watching them.

I also considered a hybrid, two wing halves that join independant of the fuselage, and then bolt into the fuselage like a one piece wing. I would put the belcrank in a 55% side of the wing, and the outboard would be 45%.

But, I decided to build a jack sheeks biplane kit I had lying around for a couple years first. Just started it today. I'll do removable one piece wings for that one because of the ibeam construction. And the wing span is only about 45". I could put it in a golf club case.

[pmackenzie]

I also considered a hybrid, two wing halves that join independant of the fuselage, and then bolt into the fuselage like a one piece wing. I would put the belcrank in a 55% side of the wing, and the outboard would be 45%.

I did a Vector 40 ARC I took to Poland and Australia this way. It worked fine and let the box be no longer than the fuse.
The structure for the wing to wing joint was all just wood, with a few blind nuts. Same for the fuse, basically done with the "Walker" method.

I was able to put the whole model in an added compartment Gorilla taped to the bottom of my Combat model box, so no extra bag fee.
It added something like 3" to the bottom of the box.
(Generally you can get away with a minimal fee for one oversize bag, but they kill you for a second one)

Not the best picture, but you can see where the wing joint is. The outboard flap connection is via a "lucky box".

[fred cesquim]

Thanks for all the input. Yes, as stated, I want a suitcase plane. I already have an plane with removable wing. And I have built a profile with removable wing halves. I was just looking for more info on how the wing halves join on a full fuse plane.

Mike, the pictures from Russia are a pretty good help, if I had the hardware. Also, the info about ready made cradles and exact dimensions was good info too. The windy videos with the big job, those are good and I'll continue watching them.

I also considered a hybrid, two wing halves that join independant of the fuselage, and then bolt into the fuselage like a one piece wing. I would put the belcrank in a 55% side of the wing, and the outboard would be 45%.

But, I decided to build a jack sheeks biplane kit I had lying around for a couple years first. Just started it today. I'll do removable one piece wings for that one because of the ibeam construction. And the wing span is only about 45". I could put it in a golf club case.

My bad, i was thinking of a full wing, this is a similar method to the Yatsenko system, maybe easier to replicate

[fred cesquim]

fuse method

[Claudio Chacon]

fuse method

A professional job, Fred, congrats!

Which is the weight of the "Nemesis"?

[fred cesquim]

A professional job, Fred, congrats!

Which is the weight of the "Nemesis"?

thanks Claudio, she´s 1,890kg read to fly, the goal was 1600-1700 but the balsa wasn´t contest and this was the first prototype with more wood than needed, i as doing the kit review so i had to build it with few deviations as possible.

[Claudio Chacon]

thanks Claudio, she´s 1,890kg read to fly, the goal was 1600-1700 but the balsa wasn´t contest and this was the first prototype with more wood than needed, i as doing the kit review so i had to build it with few deviations as possible.

Maybe not a "dreamed weight" but still competitive. I've seen Bene fly with his "Cheyenne" with a ST .51 in it at 2.050 grams (!) a rule book pattern. You know...

What FONT did you use on your Nemesis lettering? I like it!

Later,
Claudio.

[fred cesquim]

Maybe not a "dreamed weight" but still competitive. I've seen Bene fly with his "Cheyenne" with a ST .51 in it at 2.050 grams (!) a rule book pattern. You know...

What FONT did you use on your Nemesis lettering? I like it!

Later,
Claudio.

the shortcoming is my skill on flight, the plane is still fine to fly. hope to get more practice
here´s the font
https://www.dafont.com/pt/search.php?q=sofa&af=on&psize=s