Author Topic: Bob Shaw Contest at Tripletree---Who's Coming? (Read 24100 times)

Les McDonald · « **on:** April 27, 2015, 01:58:36 PM »

I will be in South Carolina during that weekend and you can bet your "Bippee" I'm going to be there, at least on Saturday afternoon.
(No, I won't have a plane)
This contest could be the beginning of some great strides foward for the stunt event. Through the generosity of Bob Shaw, the vision of Pat Hartness and the endless efforts of Mark Weiss and his crew this "control line at Joe Nall thing" seems to have taken on a life of it's own.
It deserves some serious attendence. Fitzgerald, Walker, Moon, Hernandez, Werwage, Barry, Stevens, Rush and all you other hot shots should give this some thought. Hope to see you guys soon!

bob whitney · « **Reply #1 on:** April 27, 2015, 02:05:46 PM »

it is too bad that it is the same weekend as a local contest here in FLA do we support our local club or go for the gusto???

peabody · « **Reply #2 on:** April 27, 2015, 02:39:01 PM »

It's interesting....we submitted our sanction EIGHT MONTHS ago...
Bob Shaw LIVES in Venice and had done NOTHING to support wither the MCRC/TBLF contests or the Indiantown events....

Tom Niebuhr · « **Reply #3 on:** April 27, 2015, 02:53:17 PM »

Les,
I wish I could be there.

Allan Perret · « **Reply #4 on:** April 27, 2015, 04:02:59 PM »

I been following c/l at Joe Nall for the last 3 years. When I heard about this year being the 1st sanctioned event I decided to sign up. Cant wait..

Steve Fitton · « **Reply #5 on:** April 27, 2015, 05:03:19 PM »

I will have to miss it I'm afraid. My wife will be out of town at a conference and I will be taking small children to various activities all weekend.

Doug Moon · « **Reply #6 on:** April 27, 2015, 07:17:00 PM »

Quote from: Steve Fitton on April 27, 2015, 05:03:19 PM

I will have to miss it I'm afraid. My wife will be out of town at a conference and I will be taking small children to various activities all weekend.

You could say you are taking them to aeronautical school and then show up at the Joe Nall for the lab portion of the class.....

Gene Martine · « **Reply #7 on:** April 27, 2015, 07:58:44 PM »

I'll be there with my new SV 11, should have enough time on it to put up some good flights.
See you all soon.
Gene

Paul Walker · « **Reply #8 on:** April 27, 2015, 08:08:06 PM »

If someone were to offer significant cash prizes I might consider a VERY long cross country trip to attend.

RknRusty · « **Reply #9 on:** April 27, 2015, 09:56:14 PM »

I'm already signed up and will be there. I'm going to drive up on Tuesday or Thursday and put in a couple of patterns just to get tuned up, and then I'll help out at the circles however I can. Really looking forward to it.
Rusty

Howard Rush · « **Reply #10 on:** April 27, 2015, 11:08:34 PM »

Quote from: Paul Walker on April 27, 2015, 08:08:06 PM

If someone were to offer significant cash prizes I might consider a VERY long cross country trip to attend.

Cash? They can't even afford appearance points.

Jerry Haupt · « **Reply #11 on:** April 28, 2015, 05:22:39 AM »

Looking forward to coming down from Dayton, and also looking forward to some weather more conducive to stunt flying. The weather in Ohio has been either cold, wet or windy and usually all three at the same time. Plan to stop in Asheville for a couple days and visit the Biltmore estate and other sites. Any place to fly in Asheville while visiting?

Jerry Haupt

Mark Weiss · « **Reply #12 on:** April 28, 2015, 10:18:50 AM »

Les, thank you for your encouragement for others too attend. I read all the posts and offer these comments. Paul, I wish I had the cash for you to come. There are no appearance points this year in an effort to get as many pilots to come as possible. Bob Shaw has had a long standing relationship with Pat Hartness, the owner and founder of Triple Tree before it became a 501c-3. Bob and Pat have put out all the money and sweat equity into making part of this facility a permanent top notch CL site. They even built a permanent pavilion that is top shelf quality.

For whatever reason, probably not rational, Pat, Bob, and I (along with others) are locally trying to do all we can to encourage more CL before it fades away into an app on someone's iPhone. There has been a lot of begging and a lot of support from some organizations who have made the flying experience of over 1350 new pilots possible. In the stunt world, I am a nobody and that is OK. I don't have all the answers but do have the energy to do what I think is in the interests of most. I am open to all suggestions about the training flights that we do each year as well as running a contest. Fortunately for me, I have had a cadre of wonderful CL stunt guys who show up each year to have some fun and get into the circles with the kids and their parents.

Before signing off, if you are coming to fly on Saturday, please shoot me an email so I can get you a shirt and have you entered into the proper class (email is: ama82824@yahoo.com)
Respectfully,
Mark

Bill Little · « **Reply #13 on:** April 28, 2015, 10:25:29 AM »

Thanks for the heads up, Les! I really wish I could be there, but it won't happen this year.... Have a lot of fun, Les, and all the other guys who participate!

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM

Howard Rush · « **Reply #14 on:** April 28, 2015, 12:31:05 PM »

Quote from: Mark Weiss on April 28, 2015, 10:18:50 AM

There are no appearance points this year in an effort to get as many pilots to come as possible.

A commonly held belief east of the Mississippi is that by not awarding appearance points you get better participation. I think the opposite is true. A bunch of good-looking airplanes makes a contest more appealing to spectators and modelers alike. Pretty airplanes make stunt look like it's worth doing. I was attracted to stunt by seeing the stunt planes at the 1962 Nats. The same thing attracted Bill Werwage: "They looked like Easter baskets." I don't know how to construct an experiment to determine which is right, but I see more entries in Western stunt contests.

One misconception that many Eastern CDs have is that AMA stunt rules require a contestant to build his own airplane. There is no such requirement for skill-class stunt. There hasn't been for many years. A person who didn't build his own plane is only ineligible for half a maneuver's worth of appearance points.

EddyR · « **Reply #15 on:** April 28, 2015, 03:54:55 PM »

Jerry It now cost $74 a person to get a day pass to the Biltmore.

outragious

Will Davis · « **Reply #16 on:** April 28, 2015, 07:55:29 PM »

Les,

You will enjoy the event at Triple Tree, 5000 foot runway , models everywhere, lakes, hangers, good food, good shade if it is hot, modelers from all over the world , first timers and retreads

I compete in control line stunt, but have attended the Joe Nall since the early 90's, if you like things that fly, joe Nall is well worth the trip , regardless of your preferred discipline .

We camp all week, cannot get over the night flying with those bright led lights , looks like a ELO light show , , grilling out, great family environment ,

Not willing to get into the appearance point /BOM discussion , As Mark Weiss stated , he is open to suggestions to make the event better.

The spectacle know as Joe Nall is hard to describe , When you see a Nascar Size model airplane hauler parked next to a pop up tent, and everyone is having fun , kids running around playing with model airplanes ,tricked out golf carts, vintage and hot rod scooters, it is a sight to see.

Attached is a brief walk around video I shot a couple years ago in the hanger ,

Will Davis

bob whitney · « **Reply #17 on:** April 28, 2015, 08:53:13 PM »

Quote from: Paul Walker on April 27, 2015, 08:08:06 PM

If someone were to offer significant cash prizes I might consider a VERY long cross country trip to attend.

\

i have been told it is a lot further to the east coast from the west coast than it is to the west coast from the east coast
lets see ,one trip to the Tri citys Nats, 4 to Oragan for the reganals and three to wittier narrows for team trials 4 trips to Tucson for VSC and cabin fever

RknRusty · « **Reply #18 on:** April 28, 2015, 08:55:26 PM »

Will, that was a nice walk through, thanks for showing us.

Wayne took me on a quick tour of the hangar on the second Saturday last year. I was particularly fascinated with the "Spirit of Triple Tree" and its mirror finish. I was spilling questions faster than Wayne could answer them.
Be seein' you soon,
Rusty

Howard Rush · « **Reply #19 on:** April 28, 2015, 10:41:41 PM »

Quote from: Will Davis on April 28, 2015, 07:55:29 PM

Attached is a brief walk around video I shot a couple years ago in the hanger

Wow, there are some humdinger airplanes there.

Will Davis · « **Reply #20 on:** April 30, 2015, 01:26:32 PM »

Another video, this one done by Stan Berger at stansphotos, he even hot a few control line shots .

EddyR · « **Reply #21 on:** April 30, 2015, 01:29:37 PM »

I registered so I will be there

Ed

Paul Walker · « **Reply #22 on:** April 30, 2015, 02:12:19 PM »

Quote from: bob whitney on April 28, 2015, 08:53:13 PM

\

i have been told it is a lot further to the east coast from the west coast than it is to the west coast from the east coast
lets see ,one trip to the Tri citys Nats, 4 to Oragan for the reganals and three to wittier narrows for team trials 4 trips to Tucson for VSC and cabin fever

Bob,
You don't want to get into a contest with me about who has driven more miles to contests over the years. Just for the Nats and Team Trials I put in 10,000 miles on odd years and 5000 on even years. That doesn't count the NWR or GSSC competitions, or the other NW contests which are about 700 miles for each of those.

So, just for the Nats and TT's since 95 I have logged 25 cross country trips to Muncie at 5000 per trip is 125,000 miles just for those. From Spokane to the Carolina's is even further. One also must consider their family and their desire for what they want for "vacation" time.

However, saying all that, it would be nice to go to that some day. Also it looks like my chance at Brokak's is gone now though.

Maybe I could talk them into a cross country trip with the travel trailer to visit some of the nice contests across the country and see their sights as well some time in the next few years!

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #23 on:** April 30, 2015, 02:25:14 PM »

Quote from: bob whitney on April 28, 2015, 08:53:13 PM

... 4 to Oragan ...

That's Ory-Gone for you eastern folk. Ora Gun if you want to pronounce it right.

Howard Rush · « **Reply #24 on:** April 30, 2015, 03:04:06 PM »

I looked into going. I would either drive (5 days in each direction, staying at hotels enroute) or fly, which involves dealing with TSA twice and trusting them not to damage the model I want to use at the Nats. Alaska Airlines now flies direct from Seattle to Charleston, but round-trip fare is about $1K. Atlanta might be cheaper. Driving, I could hit the NW Regionals on the return trip, freeloading at Gordan Delaney's on the way and going through Burns, OR, famous for being where the son of the world stunt champion went to high school. Either way, I would need to find a place near Triple Tree to practice for a couple days after the trip. TT itself looks pretty crowded then.

May I suggest that if you want to have a big stunt contest, you have it some other time? If the contest has sufficient attendance to be a big deal, you will need more than the three circles for practice and they would neet to be available for a few days before the contest. I wouldn't think you'd want to kick the kids off the learn-to-fly circles at the Joe so some geezers could practice stunt. If the contest were a week before or after the Nats it could attract people from elsewhere who are in the neighborhood for the Nats.

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #25 on:** April 30, 2015, 04:39:20 PM »

Quote from: Howard Rush on April 30, 2015, 03:04:06 PM

May I suggest that if you want to have a big stunt contest, you have it some other time? If the contest has sufficient attendance to be a big deal, you will need more than the three circles for practice and they would neet to be available for a few days before the contest. I wouldn't think you'd want to kick the kids off the learn-to-fly circles at the Joe so some geezers could practice stunt. If the contest were a week before or after the Nats it could attract people from elsewhere who are in the neighborhood for the Nats.

Oh my God, Howard, they've barely started and you're giving them grief over it?

Actually, I think that the idea of having a stunt contest during the Joe Nall is a great way of helping RC'rs who've been seduced by the dark side to come back. But it'll be hard to keep it from being a combined contest/exhibition.

FLOYD CARTER · « **Reply #26 on:** April 30, 2015, 05:11:04 PM »

Thanks for the nice hangar tour. The floor is really beautiful! It only reminded me of the oil spots and grime that was on my hangar floor.

Les McDonald · « **Reply #27 on:** April 30, 2015, 08:25:27 PM »

When I started this thread I simply wanted folks to know I would be there. That's no big deal but I get out so infrequently I'm embarassed because I don't recognize anyone anymore. Everyone is just so old looking! Of course I look exactly as I did in 1984 except the glasses, grey hair, saggy skin-----
Anyway there's a few things mentioned here that I would like to comment on.
First) Rich, I understand your frustration since I received your contest flyer right after starting the thread but The Joe Nall is a big deal, organized by big people that are working the big picture so getting the sanction for the Tripletree contest was probably pretty easy for them. That being said I know for a fact that Mr Shaw has put forth some very major contributions into PAMPA and the stunt event so if he feels like driving on the lawn he's going to be allowed.
Second) Mark, your organizational expertise and energy is not only of exceptional quality it's much appreciated. The "Fun Central" thing that you and the crew have been doing create the most grassroots, almost primal feeling of model planes and that's why people love it. Oh, and yea, I've watched the Propwash Videos of the "Warbirds Over Delaware".
Third) Howard and Paul, plus the other big guns I mentioned were "tongue in cheek" but I did get your attention. Howard I agree completely with you about appearance points. Pretty airplanes are the major reason most people get involved, APs are part of the tradition.
My main point was that Tripletree could be a wonderful venue for a major contest someday. It would need to be a three or four day event that stands alone but I think this one day affair is going to be alot of fun for the East Coast guys and I certainly hope they get a great turnout.
I no longer have skin in this game but I do see Mr Shaw, Mr Hartness and Mr Weiss making a serious commitment to promote the stunt event and in some little way I wanted to beat the drum a bit!

Brett Buck · « **Reply #28 on:** April 30, 2015, 08:48:30 PM »

Quote from: Howard Rush on April 28, 2015, 12:31:05 PM

One misconception that many Eastern CDs have is that AMA stunt rules require a contestant to build his own airplane.

That was intentional. The idea was to spread FUD about the BOM to make their argument better. No one would care at all if a few rich guys couldn't buy an airplane to fly in the NATs. People *might* care if those bad Elitists were keeping people out of their local contests because of BOM. The fact that it's not true doesn't really matter as long as you spread enough FUD. Then you can maybe play class warfare, get an astroturf campaign going, and then get your way.

Brett

Brett Buck · « **Reply #29 on:** April 30, 2015, 08:50:32 PM »

Quote from: Paul Walker on April 27, 2015, 08:08:06 PM

If someone were to offer significant cash prizes I might consider a VERY long cross country trip to attend.

Oh, yeah, money meets are just the ticket!

Brett

Howard Rush · « **Reply #30 on:** May 01, 2015, 12:43:01 AM »

Quote from: Brett Buck on April 30, 2015, 08:48:30 PM

That was intentional. The idea was to spread FUD about the BOM to make their argument better. No one would care at all if a few rich guys couldn't buy an airplane to fly in the NATs. People *might* care if those bad Elitists were keeping people out of their local contests because of BOM. The fact that it's not true doesn't really matter as long as you spread enough FUD. Then you can maybe play class warfare, get an astroturf campaign going, and then get your way.

Naw, I doubt if they are up to anything sneaky. They just aren't aware of the current rules. Some probably are aware and want to emphasize to prospective contestants that they won't be turned away if they show up with airplanes they didn't build. Maybe we should tell folks on our contest announcements that there's no BOM at our contests, too, lest some folks think we will forbid them to fly airplanes they didn't build.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #31 on:** May 01, 2015, 07:38:58 AM »

I like d the short video and the unusual shot of the CL circle while some one was flying. I can also understand a person thinking a contest might bring in more people. When I was trying to start a club years ago it was going great with us just getting to the circle and taking turns flying. Then some one suggested a small balloon burst competition followed by 1/2A combat. People quit coming out to fly for fun as a group. Should have kept it as a fly for fun with family pic nik thrown in every so often. Now, is the Joe Nall just an over size fun fly for the different facets of RC? I do remember CL was added to introduce people to it that some had never seen it. I would love to come just to spectate and fly when I could, not when I have to. Guess I've lost the competition urge in my old age, but I love watching people fly plus have fun.

dennis lipsett · « **Reply #32 on:** May 01, 2015, 10:36:35 AM »

Quote from: Brett Buck on April 30, 2015, 08:50:32 PM

Oh, yeah, money meets are just the ticket!

Brett

From what I've been told you can drive through the gate and just smell the money. Several hundred thousand dollar travel units are common and multi thousand dollar models are so plentiful they are an eyesore. Don't worry about eye candy. For those who think that R/C flyers are hacks and can't build squat this just might be the eye opener that is required for some c/l snobs. myself not included LOL.

Dennis

Brett Buck · « **Reply #33 on:** May 01, 2015, 10:49:43 AM »

Quote from: Howard Rush on May 01, 2015, 12:43:01 AM

Naw, I doubt if they are up to anything sneaky. They just aren't aware of the current rules. Some probably are aware and want to emphasize to prospective contestants that they won't be turned away if they show up with airplanes they didn't build. Maybe we should tell folks on our contest announcements that there's no BOM at our contests, too, lest some folks think we will forbid them to fly airplanes they didn't build.

Well, I have to disagree. The CDs and fliers just hear it, and go by what they hear. The ARFers are the ones spreading the rumors and the many 'true stories" about people getting shunned, tossed out of contests (always in the West) by those evil elitists. All these stories are oddly lacking in detail and specificity. Much like the stories about engine controls being "illegal" and that those bad elitists rushed through an AMA rule to prevent engine controls to get even with Windy. Never mind that there wasn't any such rule (until this year, of course*) at the time, any time before, or after. That comes up about once every six months here, same with the "I can't fly in contests because I have an ARF".

It started about 15 years ago. I am not going to spend a lot of time searching it out, but you can find SSW posts to this effect starting in about 2000-2001.

Brett

*note that I wouldn't have proposed the 2.4 gHz (and only 2.4 gHz) rule if Windy was still active - because it would have provided "evidence" of bad elitists like myself out to get him! No on ever gave a millisecond thought to "getting" anybody, but that never stopped the accusations.

Shug Emery · « **Reply #34 on:** May 01, 2015, 11:03:02 AM »

I do wish I could attend. Fact is I was so surprised to see that this is in Woodruff, SC. My Dad's side of the family is from Enoree...a small mill town close-by. I have family in Woodruff.
Shug

Mark Weiss · « **Reply #35 on:** May 01, 2015, 05:11:54 PM »

Here are the facts from the horse's mouth. Blame me if you all need a target. There are several threads going on all about CL at the Nall and this contest. First, the contest was my idea and not Bob Shaw's and not from Pat Hartness. The idea of a contest came from feedback I got last year at Brodak from many pilots with whom I spoke. I am the co CD there with Will Davis.They said a contest would draw more experienced people than a fly in. The name of the contest came from me out of respect for Bob Shaw's investment in the CL circles and the new pavilion. I asked Pat if this was OK with him and he agreed. The contest request went through the regular AMA channels and was approved by all along the line. The contest sanction was not bought by someone's money as suggested on a thread!

Joe Nall attendees range from wealthy to barely getting by. I know for I am in the CL circles for 7 full days nearly 9 hours/day. If this group are among the elite, we are all in trouble. Most attendees camp by tents or simple rigs, not the half million variety. The entire intent of our efforts which began four years ago was and is to bring more attention to CL and get younger folks interested. The idea of having experienced pilots was two fold: one, for them to enjoy the facility and second to help with the student training. Several attendees have asked about having a contest at Triple Tree during the Joe Nall week.

The land that has been dedicated to our CL community could have been used for many other model aviation needs. Pat and Bob agreed with my request four years ago for they both have a special fondness for CL flying. With the help of many others, I am proud of what we have accomplished in the first three years. The feedback from all the attendees who have taken the handle each year has been overwhelming. It costs a lot of personal money and several months each year to make the CL at the Joe Nall what it is. It has been worth it all.

The only negative comments and feedback have come from our own control line brotherhood and I find that very disappointing. The RC community has embraced us and their top guns come down and try CL and find it harder than they thought! Of course, we knew that already.

Please, lets all base our comments on what is best for CL and please base them on the facts. I will do my best to make the experience at the Nall as favorable as I can for both the newcomers as well as you, the guys I have admired for many years. For three years, I have asked for ideas and assistance and remain wide open. I don't have all the answers but I do know a smiling face on a newcomer when I see one. It is a wonderful thing. Thank you Guys. Mark

Doug Moon · « **Reply #36 on:** May 01, 2015, 09:07:35 PM »

Mark,

Keep up the good work. We all appreciate it. Don't sweat the control line guys grumblings, it's a common thing around these parts.

If I could swing that contest I would in a heartbeat. I pitched it to my wife last year as a family vacation ending there for a couple of days then back home. But the kids, 11 9 and 7, have to miss too much school at this time of year and there is a ton of activities going as well.

The problem for me is I would find it very hard to get away from the main flight line. I might just spend more time watching other disciplines than I would at the circles. I never get to see any of that stuff and would really love to get an up clos'e and personal with it and learn more about it. I have 2 years in the bag now with RC helicopters and its just the teeny tiny tip of the iceberg. I am having a blast with it and would bring them along with my newest stunt rig. The wife and kids better be in shape if we do ever make it because I will be on the circles, then on the flight line, then on the circle, then on the flight line, then over the water, then comes the night show!!! Throw in some fishing with my kids and who could ask for anything more!!! Chills, just thinking about all that cool model flying in one spot!!!

I read someone say you need the contest away from the event so it can be specific. Well, they have a point but at the same time if you do that then its the normal crew in that area who fly stunt contests. Will the RC guys fill up the aerodrome to watch or participate in the CLPA contest? Not sure if it has had that big an impact yet, plus they already have a trip planned there for the main event. With the contest during event now you have at least one circle removed from Fun Central for a day for the CLPA regulars to compete in. Many of the Nall regulars have seen Fun Central they know what is up! It's the place to be! I am wondering if they know about the contest and plan to enter...?? I am wondering if the push for CLPA entries should be from that crowd as well.

As far as names go for the contest I think Derrk Berry (AKA D-Bear) will be there and that "sum b---h" flys stunt about as good as anyone on the planet, even while laying on his back!

Thanks again for your efforts, keep it up. Control line thanks you.

Max and my Goblin 570.

dale gleason · « **Reply #37 on:** May 02, 2015, 07:10:12 AM »

Doug cannot be allowed to have the last word...

I will add some general information here, at the risk of inducing more "grumbling". "Grumbling" is what we do. The question is....who is "we"?

I feel "we" are a split personality and each personality is all good, but somewhat difficult to understand. One difficulty is there are so many disciplines, but, in this case, lets stick with Stunt.

100% of all Stunt flyers enjoy what they do, else they wouldn't do it. It's a fun thing to do. But, now we must define "fun". Fun for some is competition, ie, beating the other guy. Beating him like a drum. He's your best running buddy, but, on the circle, it's all business. (ever try to talk to Bob Gieseke as he was walking out to the handle?) (ever read "Stiletto Chronicles?) As soon as the contest is over, win or lose, there is a Gentleman's smile on the winner's face, and a congratulatory smile on the losers'.

The Nationals (under the auspice of AMA, under the auspice of NAA, under the auspice of FAI) has Event 322, which is unique to the United States of America, for it is stipulated that in that event, the competitor must build the aircraft he competes with. For the relatively few who enjoy this Competition Event, the expense is high, the dedication is huge, the reward is great. For the playing field to be level (no pun) all must abide by the rules, all must build their own plane. Their ability to do this is judged severely, and the result of this "Appearance Judging" is added to the total score. The building aspect is contested as much as the flying portion and the results of these efforts is truly art, mind-boggling art.... But, it's fun. Maybe "satisfaction" is a better word than "fun". Whatever the word, it's a labor of love, but without it, there would be no 322, which would be a tragedy.

The remaining flyers, who may or may not compete (which oddly enough, is still 100%) fly for the sheer fun of it. Flying is fun, flying is satisfying. Perhaps to some, Designing, Building, Finishing, all that....maybe not so much. But, the joy of cranking up a motor and actually controlling a miniature aircraft in flight is an unbelievable rush*. (Careful, don't want to start a "grumble" session on electrics).

My understanding of the Joe Nall is that it is the "Mother of all Fun-flies", like Brodak's with RC, planes, helis, anything that flies....and now Control Line! It's a tremendous venue for folks of like mind to congregate. Unlike the Nationals, its goal is not to determine the Champion flyer, but to expose as many as possible to a great hobby with many aspects that can be enjoyed by anyone at any level. The sponsors are to be hugely thanked.

This is my take on it, just recently modified in my own mind.

Respectfully submitted,
dale g

*"unbelievable rush"? hard to believe.....

Doug Moon · « **Reply #38 on:** May 02, 2015, 05:38:13 PM »

Quote from: dale gleason on May 02, 2015, 07:10:12 AM

Doug cannot be allowed to have the last word...

I will add some general information here, at the risk of inducing more "grumbling". "Grumbling" is what we do. The question is....who is "we"?

I feel "we" are a split personality and each personality is all good, but somewhat difficult to understand. One difficulty is there are so many disciplines, but, in this case, lets stick with Stunt.

100% of all Stunt flyers enjoy what they do, else they wouldn't do it. It's a fun thing to do. But, now we must define "fun". Fun for some is competition, ie, beating the other guy. Beating him like a drum. He's your best running buddy, but, on the circle, it's all business. (ever try to talk to Bob Gieseke as he was walking out to the handle?) (ever read "Stiletto Chronicles?) As soon as the contest is over, win or lose, there is a Gentleman's smile on the winner's face, and a congratulatory smile on the losers'.

The Nationals (under the auspice of AMA, under the auspice of NAA, under the auspice of FAI) has Event 322, which is unique to the United States of America, for it is stipulated that in that event, the competitor must build the aircraft he competes with. For the relatively few who enjoy this Competition Event, the expense is high, the dedication is huge, the reward is great. For the playing field to be level (no pun) all must abide by the rules, all must build their own plane. Their ability to do this is judged severely, and the result of this "Appearance Judging" is added to the total score. The building aspect is contested as much as the flying portion and the results of these efforts is truly art, mind-boggling art.... But, it's fun. Maybe "satisfaction" is a better word than "fun". Whatever the word, it's a labor of love, but without it, there would be no 322, which would be a tragedy.

The remaining flyers, who may or may not compete (which oddly enough, is still 100%) fly for the sheer fun of it. Flying is fun, flying is satisfying. Perhaps to some, Designing, Building, Finishing, all that....maybe not so much. But, the joy of cranking up a motor and actually controlling a miniature aircraft in flight is an unbelievable rush*. (Careful, don't want to start a "grumble" session on electrics).

My understanding of the Joe Nall is that it is the "Mother of all Fun-flies", like Brodak's with RC, planes, helis, anything that flies....and now Control Line! It's a tremendous venue for folks of like mind to congregate. Unlike the Nationals, its goal is not to determine the Champion flyer, but to expose as many as possible to a great hobby with many aspects that can be enjoyed by anyone at any level. The sponsors are to be hugely thanked.

This is my take on it, just recently modified in my own mind.

Respectfully submitted,
dale g

*"unbelievable rush"? hard to believe.....

Very well said my friend!

RandySmith · « **Reply #39 on:** May 02, 2015, 06:25:33 PM »

Quote from: Mark Weiss on May 01, 2015, 05:11:54 PM

Here are the facts from the horse's mouth. Blame me if you all need a target. There are several threads going on all about CL at the Nall and this contest. First, the contest was my idea and not Bob Shaw's and not from Pat Hartness. The idea of a contest came from feedback I got last year at Brodak from many pilots with whom I spoke. I am the co CD there with Will Davis.They said a contest would draw more experienced people than a fly in. The name of the contest came from me out of respect for Bob Shaw's investment in the CL circles and the new pavilion. I asked Pat if this was OK with him and he agreed. The contest request went through the regular AMA channels and was approved by all along the line. The contest sanction was not bought by someone's money as suggested on a thread!

Joe Nall attendees range from wealthy to barely getting by. I know for I am in the CL circles for 7 full days nearly 9 hours/day. If this group are among the elite, we are all in trouble. Most attendees camp by tents or simple rigs, not the half million variety. The entire intent of our efforts which began four years ago was and is to bring more attention to CL and get younger folks interested. The idea of having experienced pilots was two fold: one, for them to enjoy the facility and second to help with the student training. Several attendees have asked about having a contest at Triple Tree during the Joe Nall week.

The land that has been dedicated to our CL community could have been used for many other model aviation needs. Pat and Bob agreed with my request four years ago for they both have a special fondness for CL flying. With the help of many others, I am proud of what we have accomplished in the first three years. The feedback from all the attendees who have taken the handle each year has been overwhelming. It costs a lot of personal money and several months each year to make the CL at the Joe Nall what it is. It has been worth it all.

The only negative comments and feedback have come from our own control line brotherhood and I find that very disappointing. The RC community has embraced us and their top guns come down and try CL and find it harder than they thought! Of course, we knew that already.

Please, lets all base our comments on what is best for CL and please base them on the facts. I will do my best to make the experience at the Nall as favorable as I can for both the newcomers as well as you, the guys I have admired for many years. For three years, I have asked for ideas and assistance and remain wide open. I don't have all the answers but I do know a smiling face on a newcomer when I see one. It is a wonderful thing. Thank you Guys. Mark

Hi Mark

Again do not worry about the grumbles and gripes your hearing, you and the others are doing a great service for Control line, and modeling in general. Just go about this as you have, the few that don't understand, or don't like it are nothing to worry about or change anything for

Regards
Randy Smith

Randy Cuberly · « **Reply #40 on:** May 02, 2015, 08:17:36 PM »

I have a major GRUMBLE....I can't go!

I think that's where some of the frustration here comes from. It's simply called being left out by circumstances beyond control!

In spite of that I know that organizing something like this is a tremendous amount of hard work and that it's totally impossible to please everyone. Trying only results in more frustration and potential failure.

My hat's off to the organizers and all the folks that are putting in effort to make this happen.

Being "Blamed" for an effort like this should be thought of as a "Badge of Honor".

Randy Cuberly

Fred Cronenwett · « **Reply #41 on:** May 03, 2015, 06:54:22 AM »

Jennifer Alderman the Associate Editor of Model Aviation will be there at the event, I sent her an E-mail and told her that there will be stunt contest there this year. She knew about the fun fly portion from years past, but sounded excited that it has grown into a full CL stunt contest. Hopefully she drops by the circle and sees what is happening.

Having a CL stunt contest at an RC event is great, you just might some guys who currently fly RC to come back to CL, some of those guys just don't how far CL has come over the years.

The best part is that it's happening at a huge RC event!

Fred

Lyle Spiegel · « **Reply #42 on:** May 05, 2015, 10:35:05 AM »

I'll be traveling from Albany NY. I need to get motel reservation. Would like to know where other out of town attendees will be staying. Thx Lyle

Les McDonald · « **Reply #43 on:** May 05, 2015, 02:40:10 PM »

I won't be attending the contest after all and needless to say I'm disappointed.
A minor family "burp" has come about created by my brother in law and his cat!
I normally blow off this sort of thing but the cat part is important to Roberta so I need to stay home and help her.
She puts up with alot of nonsense from me so I figured this would be in my best interest.

I wish everyone the best of success and thanks once again to Mr Shaw, Mr Hartness and especially Mark Weiss.

Mark Weiss · « **Reply #44 on:** May 05, 2015, 02:51:23 PM »

Les,

I am sorry I will not get a chance to meet you. Thank you for your support and maybe next year we can welcome you to Triple Tree. We are up to 32 registered pilots.

Mark Weiss

Allan Perret · « **Reply #45 on:** May 05, 2015, 04:37:47 PM »

Hey Mark: no blame to be dolled out here, only congrats. Dale, Doug, and the two Randys summed it up pretty good. So I'll just say I am thrilled to be one of the 32 registered pilots.

dale gleason · « **Reply #46 on:** May 05, 2015, 05:27:19 PM »

OK Allen, you're representing District VIII, not to mention Loosyana, so do us all proud. We all know you will!

dg