ARF Ringmaster?

[frank mccune]

    Hello:

   
   What are your thoughts on an ARF or ARC Ringmaster?

                                                                                              Frank

[Gerald Arana]

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

Jerry

[John Rist]

If the price was right and it was very light and it was electric I would buy an ARC Ringmaster.

 

[George Hostler]

I think it would be a good option to the Flite Streak ARF.       

[Mike Keville]

Good Lord, NO!  The origerinal Ringmaster should be preserved in its original state and not be subjected to ARFs, ARC or electronic B.S.!

(Just one old fahrt's opinion, of course.)

[George Hostler]

Just think though, if there were an ARF Ringmaster, then these people could have a successful fly off!

Great American ARF-OFF, Davis, CA:
http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php?topic=31996.0

There would be more people to do the one weekend Ringmaster Fly-A-Thon in Fall. 

To differentiate the ARF Ringmaster from a kit or scratch built Ring, we no longer use the Fox .35 Stunt. OS 25LA-S, or even a Chinese .20 to .25 running a wet 2-cycle would help to differentiate the sound, plus the lack of heavy vibration would help the ARF last longer. 



Rice over American Iron! 

(LOL, I ride motorcycles, too. I think the fact Fox continues to make the .35 Stunt is a tribute to a timeless design that still performs well day in and day out.) 

[John Cralley]

Good Lord, NO!  The original Ringmaster should be preserved in its original state and not be subjected to ARFs, ARC or electronic B.S.! (Just one old fart's opinion, of course.)

Too late!! Here is one of my ELECTRIC S-1 Ringmasters. 

[John Stiles]

Too late!! Here is one of my ELECTRIC S-1 Ringmasters. 

Can you send me an ARF? How much? Turn-key electric?? 

[john e. holliday]

Did not someone try this several years ago with prebuilt Ringmasters?

[Mike Griffin]

Did not someone try this several years ago with prebuilt Ringmasters?

Yes Doc, it was me.  They were not ARF they were ARC, and they did not go over very well.  I was building the wing, the fuselage came ready to sand and paint, I was drilling the motor mounts for whatever engine the customer was going to install, I hinged the stab and elevator together and the rudder was precut.  Basically all the customer had to do was glue the wing in, glue on the the stab and elevator and rudder, cover the wing, and paint.  It was just a matter of opening the box and putting the plane together and do some final sanding.

Shipping costs were not cheap because of the size of box it took to ship it.  I think I sold them for around $135.00 + shipping if I remember right.  I thought it was a good idea but it just didnt seem to catch on.

Mike

[Mike Griffin]

My sentiments concerning a prebuilt ARC or ARF Ringmaster are like Mike Keville's, to me the Ringmaster along with a couple of other designs is almost a sacred thing.  Eric Rule told me it is by far still the biggest selling kit he has and as a distributor for Eric, I can vouch for that in my sales also.  The only reason I tried doing the prebuilt Ringmaster a few years ago was because there seemed to be some folks out there that either did not like to build for whatever reason or were just to busy to build and wanted something they could assemble that took very little time and go fly.  If you look at the RC market, I would venture to say 99% of that market is ARF or RTF.  I did not mind building the Ringmasters for other folks because I love to build so much.

When the preshaped solid leading edges became hard to find, RSM and Brodak came out with the 3 piece leading edge and I have built many of these wings using that method and if you use the sheer webbing on the back side, your wing will be fine and just as strong as the solid and not fold on you with less weight.  I never had one fold.

Anyway, the point being I did try to do this as a service and there just was not that much of a demand for it so I quit doing it.  I have on special occassion done a few since but very rarely.

Mike

[George Hostler]

Greatest problem you got Mike, is the ones done in China are done at their low labor rates, which is difficult to compete with. The TF Flite Streak is only $80 at Tower and I've seen it discounted less than that elsewhere and during Tower sales or free shipping incentive.

[Mike Griffin]

Absolutely George.  They have those sweat shops using 13 year old girls to put these things together.  That is why they call them Almost Ready to Fail...

Mike

[George Hostler]

Mike, the quality control issues are another issue of themselves. I have watched our country being slowly destroyed from within by our federal government policies toward trade and excessive environmental regulation. The purpose of excise tax is to increase the cost of overseas goods so our own industries can compete. Now nearly everything in our stores from groceries to clothing and automobiles are constructed from other countries, except perhaps final assembly in some cases. Except for services, the small business sector has basically been ruined. Large corporations now rule. The laws have become so complex, that capital crimes are being ignored (we spent more for police and military protection 100 years ago) in lieu of welfare programs. A simple violation of endangered species or environment nets prohibitively excessive fines, more than murder or thievery.

The ARF's of the 1960's and 1970's were relatively more expensive because they were made in America, but then we didn't mind paying a little more for them. It kept our industries in business. I think we also took better care of our stuff as a result. We didn't throw away planes, we repaired them and learned to live with our mistakes. We learned to live within our means.

I could go on and on, but these are things that the sleeping American populace have allowed occur with our crooked politicians, beyond our control.

[Mike Griffin]

George I wholeheartedly agree and that is all I can really afford to say because it would be very easy for me to turn this thread into a rant about the direction this country is heading and this is not the forum on which to do it.  I will say I have made a concentrated effort to try and buy American made products only and found it to be an exercise in futility.

Thanks for you input
Mike

[RknRusty]

I've only recently learned about the popularity and respect for the Ringmaster. As a lifetime 1/2A only flyer, a year ago I built a Baby Streak and suddenly felt like I had flown my first plane that was more than just a toy. Not too long after that, I acquired and rebuilt a badly wrecked Shoestring and started getting interested in the larger stunters. My first impulse was that I must build a big Streak. But now that I regularly talk with Ringmaster builders I'm wondering how much difference there is in performance for fun flying and learning to properly fly the pattern. Any more than just a matter of pilot preference?

Rusty

[john e. holliday]

I can remember having both the Flite Streak and Ringmaster.   Both were flown with my McCoy .35 Redhead.   Even with the elevators moving way past 50-60 degrees each way the Ringmaster was easy to fly and do aerobatics like loops, eights and inverted flight.   The Flite Streak was quicker in response to the control inputs to me, but was mastered in short order.  Even with elevator movement at less than 40 degrees each way.   Never really put either plane on the balance point.  Every plane I built was slightly nose heavy until I learned to add tail weight.  Both were great flying planes and I now have an RSM S-1 Ringmaster kit and a Flite Streak kit plus a Ringmaster Imperial thanks to Walter Umland.

Walter, I hope you are behaving yourself and following the doctors orders.

[George Hostler]

George I wholeheartedly agree and that is all I can really afford to say because it would be very easy for me to turn this thread into a rant about the direction this country is heading and this is not the forum on which to do it.  I will say I have made a concentrated effort to try and buy American made products only and found it to be an exercise in futility. Thanks for your input, Mike

Mike, I understand where you are coming from and yes, it would not be fair to continue down this path as the hobby should be for fun and within topic. I have enough unbuilt CL kits plus plans I have wanted to scratch build that an ARF would be a little out of place for now, even if offered. I have a certain satisfaction in my craftsmanship and there is no ARF that will replace that. Plus, if something goes wrong during the flight, I know who built it (me) and chances are that it will not fail structurally, rather it be due my pilot error or other factor.