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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: fielding mellish on May 04, 2015, 11:40:06 AM
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Gentlemen,
Long-time sport flier here, but new to the forum. I've been perusing these threads, and am impressed with the wealth of information and the expertise here, but mystified by some of the attitudes on the forum and in the control line community as a whole.
This is after all, a hobby. Most of us took up control line flying as kids, and we still build and fly to re-capture the excitement of our youth. But methinks some are taking things too seriously. Heated debates over contest rules, appearance points, and such leaves me shaking my head. And the East/West rivalry is baffling.
It was at VSC that I first heard of the East/West divide. I could not believe the petty and mean attitudes on this issue. My job takes me all over the country, so I'm used to "regional pride" attitudes, but this was unexpected. To hear middle aged men angrily arguing about model airplanes is simply bizarre.
I sometimes wonder if the competition environment is good for the hobby. I've been to VSC three times (as a spectator) and enjoyed it, but the contest atmosphere seemed to bring out the worst in some guys. A few of the big names (George Aldrich, Big Art, and Bill Netzeband) were really nice to meet, but a few others were downright rude. When you finally meet a boyhood hero and he turns out to be a jerk, it's a bit deflating. I've heard that VSC was very casual in its early years, more of a fun-fly than a contest. To me, that's the way a model event should be: a simple get-together with lots of flying but no scoring, no cut-off dates, no rigid definitions of Old Time or Classic, no restrictions on scaling or modifying of a design.
A few years back, a PAMPA survey concluded that most (80-90%, I think) of control line enthusiasts considered themselves sport fliers, with little interest in contests. I'm in that category. I get a lot of enjoyment from scratch building, then flying the finished model. I might personalize a design slightly, to the horror of vintage purists, but that's my own way of experiencing the hobby. Since I don't fly in contests, I'm not concerned if a model doesn't fit someone's definition of "legal". If I see a guy flying a model that doesn't fit my tastes, that's his business and I hope he enjoys it. But if he scolds me because I built my model with equal span wing panels instead of following the plan with a shorter outboard panel, it's annoying. This is a hobby, right?
One final point: Control line models fly on the surface of a hemisphere, at least while the lines are tight. We maneuver them around that hemispherical surface, and the effect is fun to do and fun to watch. But calling this "aerobatics" is silly, and calling it "precision aerobatics" is downright pompous. Again, aren't we taking things a bit too seriously? Lighten up, guys!
Now excuse me while I fly my Lil' Jumpin' Bean....
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There's good and bad in every group and I've met allot of very nice people in this hobby but the craziest emotionally damaged mentally ill daddy issue wack jobs I never wanted to meet have been model airplane fliers. You spend your life in the basement building planes it does something to you.
Anyway, you have to take something seriously, it's what separates us from the animals.
MM
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We take ourselves seriously because no body else will.
LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~
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I am relatively new to this hobby.
I totally agree that it should be fun and not too serious. I don't think competition is a bad thing and good natured ribbing is very entertaining.
I have met super people in this hobby and the one who stands out as having the best attitude is Joe Gilbert. If I had to pattern myself after someone it would be him. Excellent pilot, but more importantly humble and willing to help a guy who is getting started. He spoke to me as if I was one of the guys and not the newbie hack that I really am.
There are others just as good, so it's not just Joe, but he has stood out to me recently.
I will continue to fly and compete for fun of it. If I ever get good at it I hope to keep a sense of humility. East/West rivalry is good if it's done the way described by the OP.
You catch more flies with honey folks... and we need more flies!
Ron
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I don't understand -- what could possibly be more important that flying tricks with toy airplanes?
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Interesting. Echoes of one Mr. F. Cummins of some years past albeit more politely said which is much appreciated.
Too seriously? I don't know how you could quantify that. For me competition was always serious and I had fun with it. My hobby led me to my profession, that's pretty serious to me as well. But I guess its really what drives you. To a "sport flyer" it is no doubt far too serious when you hear about the conflicts over rules, points, judging, etc. To you all I can say is don't read that stuff, there are plenty of "fun" posts with fun stuff. Competitors are on the opposite end of the spectrum and are tuned into the serious side just for the "fun" of it. Or, whatever blows your skirt up, the right way to enjoy it is however you like it! It's not objective at all, its all subjective depending on each individual's perspective. For someone to tell me I take it too seriously is to be told there's something wrong with me, my motives, my methods, my goals. To the competitor the goal is vastly different than that of a "sport" flying, but believe me, they can both have copious amounts of "Fun" with their vastly different flying activities and motives. So please, let's not have this discussion again, enjoy whatcha do and take it to whatever level of seriousness is your bag and let others do the same.
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I have met super people in this hobby and the one who stands out as having the best attitude is Joe Gilbert. If I had to pattern myself after someone it would be him. Excellent pilot, but more importantly humble and willing to help a guy who is getting started. He spoke to me as if I was one of the guys and not the newbie hack that I really am.
There are others just as good, so it's not just Joe, but he has stood out to me recently.
I sat next to Joe and his wife at the VSC banquet some years ago. Pretty good guy and very knowledgeable. He is known as a very good wind flier, a handy skill.
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Anyway, you have to take something seriously, it's what separates us from the animals.
No, what separates us from animals is that animals are afraid of vacuum cleaners.
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I don't understand -- what could possibly be more important that flying tricks with toy airplanes?
Tricks?? Toys ?!? I fly Aerobatic Maneuvers with a Model Aircraft! Tricks are for kids, and Toys are my '02 Vette and '65 Citabria...
Sheesh! Some people!
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I think I am somewhere in the middle of the pack. It has been said that when you are home you long to travel and to find adventure, and when you are away from home, you long for home. That is where my modeling usually is. When I am flying competition I long to be just a sport flier, and when I am a sport flier, I long for competition. I have flown either R/C or control line competition since the late 60's and have always loved it. But, as I get older and realize that winning is not the only thing, I seem to enjoy the hobby more. It is really hard for me to just go out and practice to improve my flying. But, then, I do love it when I do that perfect maneuver, of course they never come out that way at contests. LOL
Sometimes I think I have lost my first love, and just want to build my own design and go out and fly for fun. For those of you that think that fun fly's are not competition, you should go to an R/C fun fly where everybody tries to outdo the others with either the most aerobatic plane or the most detailed giant with more power than most motorcycles have. This hobby is for everyone that has an interest in things that fly and enjoys being around others of like mindedness. It will also teach you many life skills that you can learn no other way. It will teach you to be humble when you win and gracious when you loose. And there is also the friendships of others that I would not have known otherwise. Some of the greatest acts of kindness I have seen from modelers giving to others even in a contest to help them in anyway possible, and then get beat by the person they helped and did not care.
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Competition is great as a learning and development tool for me personally.
When the learning curve flattens out, I tend to lose interest.
Luckily I don't know squat about C/L flying yet.....
The main thing to do is have fun. If it is contest flying, great. If its sport flying, equally great.
Along the way, teaching a guy that has less knowledge than you is as important as learning from the guys that have more knowledge than you. In my opinion. H^^
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They live under bridges
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I can't add much to Randy, Ron, Tim and the others' excellent replies, just that I flew for sport fun since I was a kid not even really knowing that competitive control line sports existed. Being in my 50s, I guess I seem middle aged to a 102 year old like yourself, Fielding. But I am genuinely overwhelmed by the fun we all have at contests in the short three years I've been involved. It seems everyone at every level wants to help me learn. Of course I'm still under the influence of the warm fuzzy I always have after Huntersville every Spring and Fall, but only because of those good souls was I finally able to greatly exceed every goal I set for myself this weekend. I was so comfortable among all the competitors that I flew better than I ever have in practice. That's amazing to me.
Okay, I wasn't planning to go there. What I wanted to comment on is why you say it's not aerobatics. With all the details of building, aligning, trimming, practicing and collaborating that have to come together precisely for one to make it or break it in attaining a good score, how is that not precision? How can building aerodynamic surfaces that repeatedly go exactly where they're supposed to, with only two wires on a handle not be aerodynamics? How can seeing how good you can accomplish that not be healthy for mind and body... and fun for sport and competitor alike?
As I said, I'm fairly new at this and am becoming moderately successful from a personal point of view. I did not know there was an East-West rift, maybe I'll learn about it some day. I kinda hope not. But I'm having more fun than I ever had before in mt adult life, and am proud to be a part of it. And my wife loves my participation too. Especially since I learned to appropriately divide my time between play and duty. That was an effort on my part that also made me a better husband and father.
So for someone who started off saying I had nothing to add, I guess I really did Lol.
Take care, Fielding, you ol' geezer. I hope I live to be 102 too.
Rockin' Rusty
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No, what separates us from animals is that animals are afraid of vacuum cleaners.
LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~
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I did not know there was an East-West rift...
There isn't, despite pokes by me.
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Age 102? "Moose Knuckle, Oregon"? Is that anywhere near "Elk Snout"? According to the AAA Road Atlas, there's no such place as "Moose Knuckle" in Oregon. Sounds like a phony registration to me. Even the name is suspect. Anyone agree?
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Wikipedia says that a "Moose Knuckle" is one's male bits as seen when one wears really tight pants. Presumably while listening to the Bee Gees and trying to hustle an Olivia Newton-John look-alike at a fern bar.
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Informative ... yet it doesn't answer my question.
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It's plausable Mike, could be phony, thing is, the content is thought out. So my guess is it's phony, but only to stay anonymous to avoid backlash.
When I posted earlier today the age was 92... I remember that because I was wondering who it was who posted. And thinking I would love to be able to fly at 92, or even make it to 92 for that matter.
Ron
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The problem with saying 'dont take it seriously' ... its only a toy plane is that for some of us its more than that..
thousands of dollars spent on equipment, travel to contests, international air travel, consumables... time away from family..
Practice time.. contest prep.. build time all of these factor into the conversation.
generally you just want everything to be fair and accurate. I take exception to those who say its just a fun hobby. For me its the top pointy end of competition that becones fun.
Sure if your doing something outside the rules im going to have a problem with that. Line thickness for example is considered petty by some but to adhere to the rules and make a winning package after spending THOUSANDS... is part of the appeal.
As an outsider the east coast / west coast thing is just funny... but certainly present....
Vsc.. lighten up,?? Why its a major contest now.. play by the rules in competition thats it...
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To echo the sentiments above, to me it's not serious. I just like building, sometimes flying. It's something to do at night to settle my nerves after a crappy day at work. I plan to enter a competition next year just to say I did it. And maybe to tweak a few noses by entering adequate, but certainly not showpiece planes. I understand people who're serious about it. Just because I can't get mentally invested like they do, doesn't mean their feelings aren't real. Kinda like how I don't understand rap music.
I had a great time at Delta Park a couple of weeks ago. It was my first time to go to a contest. I can say that I didn't meet one person who wasn't nice to me. They answered all my questions, asked me when was I going to fly (I didn't bring anything, I was just there to watch and learn), and encouraged me when I talked about my likes. Watching the carrier guys was fun, but not for me. Speed? Not for me. Advanced precision? Not for me. But I can see myself entering Beginner or N30 just for the fun of it. I enjoyed looking at the super detailed and expensive (to me) planes, and enjoyed seeing them fly. I was also excited to finally see a TEOSAWKI in person and watch it fly. Profile Pathfinder? Cool! Beat up campaigners? Yeah, Buddy!
But I also appreciated the guys who not only took their own performances seriously, but stood outside the circle observing others, maybe to pick up a little gram of knowledge, learn some new body english, or see a mistake they could avoid themselves to get their score up an extra point or two. I can definitely appreciate dedication.
And, if structured competitions aren't your thing, start your own unstructered fly-in. That's what I did with the FICPT19FIIYGI Day. Just a bunch of guys having fun and nothing serious at all.
It's all about what YOU want. After all, we are the center of our own world, so we might as well make it conform to what we want it to be.
Mark
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Meanwhile Mr. Mellish is currently online watching us skitter about like he kicked an ant hill.
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I don't understand -- what could possibly be more important that flying tricks with toy airplanes?
ahem,, precision tricks Tim,,
serious,, if there were not competitions, I probably would not fly,,
we each have our own approach, and derive our enjoyment in different ways,,
room for us all,,
side note, if you happened across me 10 or 15 minutes prior to an official, you might think I am a jerk too,,
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side note, if you happened across me 10 or 15 minutes prior to an official, you might think I am a jerk too,,
Absolutely. A competitor has to tune out distractions before they come to the starting line. The mental part of the game has already begun, and the casual observer might not realize this and take it personally. The only person I want to talk to at all is my pit man. And only about the task at hand.
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Long-time sport flier here, but new to the forum. I've been perusing these threads, and am impressed with the wealth of information and the expertise here, but mystified by some of the attitudes on the forum and in the control line community as a whole.
This is after all, a hobby. Most of us took up control line flying as kids, and we still build and fly to re-capture the excitement of our youth. But methinks some are taking things too seriously. Heated debates over contest rules, appearance points, and such leaves me shaking my head. And the East/West rivalry is baffling.
The "East/West" conflict is a delusion of a few people in New Jersey and Pennsylvania, and as phony as it gets. Just like "Elitists VS Real Fliers", it was concocted entirely from whole cloth to serve as a way to rally people for a war that existed to serve a few people's egos. Every so often they whip it up again, just because they have so much invested in the argument that they can't bring themselves to stop.
Virtually everyone involved gets along fine, a few bad apples cause wildly disproportionate amount of conflict. It's nothing to concern yourself with.
Brett
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What a coincidence that a modeler using his real name in this forum would have the same name as the main character in Woody Allen's movie, "Bananas." LL~
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I take fun very seriously. Nothing casual about it.
Shug
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Whoooo Buddy! #^
Me too. Sort of!
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I take fun very seriously. Nothing casual about it.
Shug
Yeah, man, if it was easy, the fun light would flicker out way too soon. For those that relish a challenge anyway.
Rusty
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What a coincidence that a modeler using his real name in this forum would have the same name as the main character in Woody Allen's movie, "Bananas." LL~
Anonymity is a hallmark of the "hornet's nest kickers" technique.
Brett
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I take it seriously I have perfected the figure nine maneuver, and when I grow up I hope I have as much fun flying as Shug Emory & Dan Banjock.T.J.
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Gentlemen,
Long-time sport flier here, but new to the forum. I've been perusing these threads, and am impressed with the wealth of information and the expertise here, but mystified by some of the attitudes on the forum and in the control line community as a whole.
This is after all, a hobby. Most of us took up control line flying as kids, and we still build and fly to re-capture the excitement of our youth. But methinks some are taking things too seriously. Heated debates over contest rules, appearance points, and such leaves me shaking my head. And the East/West rivalry is baffling.
It was at VSC that I first heard of the East/West divide. I could not believe the petty and mean attitudes on this issue. My job takes me all over the country, so I'm used to "regional pride" attitudes, but this was unexpected. To hear middle aged men angrily arguing about model airplanes is simply bizarre.
I sometimes wonder if the competition environment is good for the hobby. I've been to VSC three times (as a spectator) and enjoyed it, but the contest atmosphere seemed to bring out the worst in some guys. A few of the big names (George Aldrich, Big Art, and Bill Netzeband) were really nice to meet, but a few others were downright rude. When you finally meet a boyhood hero and he turns out to be a jerk, it's a bit deflating. I've heard that VSC was very casual in its early years, more of a fun-fly than a contest. To me, that's the way a model event should be: a simple get-together with lots of flying but no scoring, no cut-off dates, no rigid definitions of Old Time or Classic, no restrictions on scaling or modifying of a design.
A few years back, a PAMPA survey concluded that most (80-90%, I think) of control line enthusiasts considered themselves sport fliers, with little interest in contests. I'm in that category. I get a lot of enjoyment from scratch building, then flying the finished model. I might personalize a design slightly, to the horror of vintage purists, but that's my own way of experiencing the hobby. Since I don't fly in contests, I'm not concerned if a model doesn't fit someone's definition of "legal". If I see a guy flying a model that doesn't fit my tastes, that's his business and I hope he enjoys it. But if he scolds me because I built my model with equal span wing panels instead of following the plan with a shorter outboard panel, it's annoying. This is a hobby, right?
One final point: Control line models fly on the surface of a hemisphere, at least while the lines are tight. We maneuver them around that hemispherical surface, and the effect is fun to do and fun to watch. But calling this "aerobatics" is silly, and calling it "precision aerobatics" is downright pompous. Again, aren't we taking things a bit too seriously? Lighten up, guys!
Now excuse me while I fly my Lil' Jumpin' Bean....
Troll.
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Troll.
Correct.
Brett
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There was an obvious Troll in the Combat forum recently under an even stranger name. I'll see if I can find his posts. MOds can check the IP and see if they're the same.
Rusty
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This is obviously a Troll but why does he want to visit my home and then pee in my swimming pool?
I'll bet he's afraid of vacuum cleaners!
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I couldn't find the one I mentioned above. Maybe deleted by our Master.
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This is obviously a Troll but why does he want to visit my home and then pee in my swimming pool?
That's just what they do. You should see the crap that goes on behind the scenes - all from the same few people for literally decades. At this point, sending nasty-grams around, usually anonymously, *is* the sport for them. For the most part, they don't even fly airplanes any more, and even their own buddies won't talk to them. This is their hobby - trying to tear down a great event and make the people who do it seem like a pit of vipers.
The internet was like manna from heaven. Most of them were too lazy to write actual letters on paper (although not all...) and certainly didn't mail them to thousands of people. Now, they can broadcast their nonsense to thousands of people instantaneously for free.
I have never met a group of people that are almost uniformly good people - argumentative and competitive to the last, but basically good people. Then these loonies crept in along the edges, and delight in tossing turds into the punchbowl every now and then, claiming to be "champions of the downtrodden" but really just acting like that smart-ass kid who got beat up a lot in elementary school.
There's no real conflict between the competition fliers and the sport fliers, but they keep claiming it in the most snarky possible way.
Their own posts frequently offer good opportunities to undermine their points.
Brett
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Mellish (or whomever) started by proposing that "some" take contesting too seriously. Not a "troll", but a conclusion many of us come to at times.
He would have been better off with documented examples, instead of generalities. Ignoring this oversight, his basic premise isn't so far off.
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Mellish (or whomever) started by proposing that "some" take contesting too seriously. Not a "troll", but a conclusion many of us come to at times.
He would have been better off with documented examples, instead of generalities. Ignoring this oversight, his basic premise isn't so far off.
Floyd,
I enjoy participating in model airplane contest. I am serious when I compete. I enjoy being serious when I compete. That is why I enjoy going to contests to be really serious about the competition part.
I can understand why some do not need to be so serious to enjoy their participation in this hobby at whatever level they choose. But I certainly do not begrudge them that attitude as some are critical of me or others who really get involved with the competition part of the hobby.
Keith
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Mellish (or whomever) started by proposing that "some" take contesting too seriously. Not a "troll", but a conclusion many of us come to at times.
He would have been better off with documented examples, instead of generalities. Ignoring this oversight, his basic premise isn't so far off.
It's way off. The "point" is to disingenuously pretend to be asking a reasonable question and then launching into another "east VS west" argument and watching what happens. The event he describes as a continual argument and one-upsmanship is *not a part of the stunt event*, or at least in any way I have ever seen.
There are a tiny few people who have taken it as their life's work to try to be self-styled gadflies, with many times no point other than to be disruptive. The classic cover is to post anonymously as a "concern troll", generally acting as if they are trying to be helpful and are concerned about our problems, but very quickly become the problem. Then react with mock offense when they are "put upon" by people who disagree with them and call them on it. "Look at me, asking a really simple question, and you are all jumping down my throat, I told you so, everybody is against me I am being persecuted". I predict the latter to start any moment now.
We have seen it *over and over* again, we know the trick, and won't fall for it. I heard the same sort of crap in 1982 when the "east/west" thing started (as "3 guys in New Jersey VS Ed Robbert and Wynn Paul", shift to "The West Coast" in about 1986 or so, and then more recently, Frank McMillan, Ted again, Paul Walker, then Bill Rich - all guys working hard for the event, instead of sitting around anonymously bitching about it. The "culprits" change from year to year but the "victims" stay the same, or at least, the purported "victims" rabid supporters stay the same. That's *33 years!*.
No Sale.
Brett
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No, what separates us from animals is that animals are afraid of vacuum cleaners.
Not so, most Amazon parrots LOVE vacuum cleaners.
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It's way off. The "point" is to disingenuously pretend to be asking a reasonable question and then launching into another "east VS west" argument and watching what happens. The event he describes as a continual argument and one-upsmanship is *not a part of the stunt event*, or at least in any way I have ever seen...........
No Sale.
Brett
I thought it wasn't an unreasonable point (not really knowing the history of the argument) but "But calling this "aerobatics" is silly, and calling it "precision aerobatics" is downright pompous." I thought was just insulting to everyone who flies stunt.
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Why are these guys always from Oregon..... ;D
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I thought it wasn't an unreasonable point (not really knowing the history of the argument) but "But calling this "aerobatics" is silly, and calling it "precision aerobatics" is downright pompous." I thought was just insulting to everyone who flies stunt.
Yeah, it started out with a point that got us talking, even if we're a little defensive, it's always good to reflect on ourselves, but that part about precision and aerobatics was not only insulting but ignorant. He obviously hasn't explored our engineering forum. The place makes my eyes glaze over but if you want to know exactly how our machines work, that's where the precision is most evident. That was the part that inspired my first reply.
Why are these guys always from Oregon..... ;D
Scott, the soil in that area is particularly rich and fertile for growing left brains, especially after the ash fell from Mt. Saint Helens. If not properly cultivated they can reach maturity with no analytical skills. However with proper nurturing, fully functional brains are also produced. It's well known that many of our world's top aerospace geniuses also grow there, many of whom contribute heavily to Precision Aerobatics right here at Stunthangar.
Rusty
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Scott, the soil in that area is particularly rich and fertile for growing left brains, especially after the ash fell from Mt. Saint Helens. If not properly cultivated they can reach maturity with no analytical skills. However with proper nurturing, fully functional brains are also produced. It's well known that many of our world's top aerospace geniuses also grow there, many of whom contribute heavily to Precision Aerobatics right here at Stunthangar.
These guys always talk about how overblown "Precision Aerobatics" is - which might be true if anybody ever called it that. Everybody calls is stunt like it has been for 60+ years. Just an example of how there are crude attempts at "sophistry" to try to make a silly point.
Brett
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A phony name, from a phony town, who claims to be 102 years old (phony also). Why on earth would anyone even consider answering this clown.
Left Brain?...more like Mush Brain!
If there is any point to this at all it's simply to build his ego and make him think He's normal like other people!
Randy Cuberly
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His identity should be revealed. Hiding behind a fake name to stir up trouble does none of us any good. Expose him and give him the boot. If he had any stones he wouldn't be hiding his identity. That's my definition of a coward.
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His identity should be revealed. Hiding behind a fake name to stir up trouble does none of us any good. Expose him and give him the boot. If he had any stones he wouldn't be hiding his identity. That's my definition of a coward.
Sounds about right to me, Mike.
Peter Steinmeyer of Arvada, Colorado - who calls himself "fielding mellish" here - also uses what he calls "throwaway"email addresses to hide behind ...
I can understand there are those who want to hide, but my understanding is this forum requires real names. You might share your thoughts with him at dersteinmeister@aol.com ...
Dennis
y1
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Sounds about right to me, Mike.
Peter Steinmeyer of Arvada, Colorado - who calls himself "fielding mellish" here - also uses what he calls "throwaway"email addresses to hide behind ...
I can understand there are those who want to hide, but my understanding is this forum requires real names. You might share your thoughts with him at dersteinmeister@aol.com ...
The other thing common with trolls and gadflies is their lack of knowledge of things like "traceroute" and "whois".
I actually don't think it's a good idea to email him. Just serves the purpose he was trying to achieve.
Brett
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Some comments from my YouTube sight on Carolina Criterium Videos. Makes me wonder if it is the same guy.
Shug
tker 4 days ago
Comp makes it OK to fly U/C at our age. It's a game....like golf. Sometimes I think Comp. takes the fun away from just flying U/C in the schoolyard. Comp is a big mans game. Serious. Perfection, Pressure. Too Serious for model planes. Didn't we have, or have we had, enough pressure in our lives already? I don't know. Maybe it's just me. These guys are better U/C flyers than me anyway, but I still have fun. What are these comp guys trying to prove?
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shugemery 3 days ago
I was drawn to the competition as it gave me a goal. Seriously Fun to me. There is room for competition, sport flying, the Sunday flyer and all in my opinion. It distracts me from life's other pressure. As they say.....fly your flight and you'll be allright.
tker 7 hours ago · LINKED COMMENT
But model plane flying is going to be dead with just 10% comp flyers. Maybe less than 10%. Comp flyers are arrogant people who cannot stand newbies. They are above everyone else. They all have PHD's in Engineering. They all fly perfect, in a perfect world. Don't step on my lines you dork! See what I am saying?
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shugemery 5 hours ago
Sorry but I disagree with you. Many did not fly perfectly...myself included. No one I have met has been the least bit arrogant. Many were blue collar. You must have had a bad experience along the way and got tainted. See what I am saying?
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I don't think its the same guy Shug. The guy commenting on your post sounds like someone I know, but he doesn't live in Colorado.
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"fielding mellish"....???
YGBSM
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"fielding mellish"....??? YGBSM
Here is where the character comes from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bananas_%28film%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bananas_%28film%29)
Bananas is a 1971 American comedy film directed by Woody Allen and starring Allen, Louise Lasser, and Carlos Montalban. [....] Fielding Mellish (Woody Allen) is the main character, but he does not appear until after the opening credits. [....] Mellish is a neurotic blue collar man who tries to impress social activist Nancy (Louise Lasser) by trying to get in touch with the revolution in San Marcos. He visits the republic and attempts to show his concern for the native people. However, nearly killed by the local caudillo, only to be saved by the revolutionaries, he is then indebted to help them. Mellish clumsily learns how to be a revolutionary. When the revolution is successful, the Castro-style leader goes mad, forcing the rebels to place Mellish as their President.
When traveling back to the U.S. to obtain financial aid, he reunites with his activist ex-girlfriend and is exposed. In a classic courtroom scene, Mellish tries to defend himself from a series of incriminating witnesses, including a reigning Miss America and a middle-aged African-American woman who facetiously claims to be J. Edgar Hoover and is taken seriously by the whole court. One of the witnesses does provide testimony favorable to Mellish, but the court clerk twists it to make him appear thoroughly dishonest.
Here are some dialogue, so you may understand why this nym was selected by the OP:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0066808/quotes (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0066808/quotes)
Nancy: Have you ever been to Denmark?
Fielding Mellish: I've been, yes... to the Vatican.
Nancy: The Vatican? The Vatican is in Rome.
Fielding Mellish: Well, they were doing so well in Rome that they opened one in Denmark.
Witness: I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I've known Fielding Mellish for years and he's a warm, wonderful human being.
Fielding Mellish: Uh, would the clerk read that statement back please?
Court Clerk: "I've known Fielding Mellish for years and he's a rotten, conniving, dishonest little rat."
Fielding Mellish: Ok, I just wanted to make sure you were getting it.
Judge: You're out of order!
Fielding Mellish: I object, your honor! This trial is a travesty. It's a travesty of a mockery of a sham of a mockery of a travesty of two mockeries of a sham.
YHBT.
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With some editing this thread could be in a Woody Allen Movie. An early funny one. Answers the opening question.
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Beware the sly humorist. (No! Not me! Way too complicated and sophisticated an approach.)
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Seems to me this guy has accomplished exactly what he intended by starting this thread.
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Urban Dictionary › define › term=Moose...
Mobile-friendly - A male version of camel toe. Dude, your jeans are so tight your moose knuckle is showing. by Johnny Z June 07, 2003.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Maybe it's time to close this thread? :!
Regards,
Chris
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Maybe it's time to close this thread? :! Regards, Chris
Close or delete. If the OP had problems during a CL meet, best thing would have been to afterwards write or talk to an appropriate CL representative or president of the club, organization, etc. who were there. A tactfully written letter can sometimes make leadership aware of issues that they may be possibly unaware of, so they can deal with it in future to ensure that it doesn't occur again, or if it does, be prepared to deal with it appropriately.
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And hide from our own posts? It'll wear itself out soon. The OP hasn't done anything to perpetuate it... oops, now I'm doing it. But I'm not uptight about it, some good introspection went on for a while, but it's fizzled out now. I'll unsubscribe, watch.
Click
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[quote author=fielding mellish link=topic=39214.msg401448#msg401448 date=143076120
<snip> One final point: Control line models fly on the surface of a hemisphere, at least while the lines are tight. We maneuver them around that hemispherical surface, and the effect is fun to do and fun to watch. But calling this "aerobatics" is silly, and calling it "precision aerobatics" is downright pompous. Again, aren't we taking things a bit too seriously? Lighten up, guys!
Now excuse me while I fly my Lil' Jumpin' Bean....
Why don't we all endeavor ourselves to lower our standards to your level? The Walker cup is just an old tarnished trophy, right?
I don't fly competition because I feel i'm not up to the skill level I need to be, but I admire the guys that do.
Control line would have died off years ago if it wasn't for one modeler trying to out fly another for the title of "National Champion".
[/quote]
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And if it were not for guys like me, (the loosers), there would be no winners. You guys that win owe it all to us. LOL
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One final point: Control line models fly on the surface of a hemisphere, at least while the lines are tight. We maneuver them around that hemispherical surface, and the effect is fun to do and fun to watch. But calling this "aerobatics" is silly, and calling it "precision aerobatics" is downright pompous. Again, aren't we taking things a bit too seriously? Lighten up, guys! Now excuse me while I fly my Lil' Jumpin' Bean....
Why don't we all endeavor ourselves to lower our standards to your level? The Walker cup is just an old tarnished trophy, right? I don't fly competition because I feel i'm not up to the skill level I need to be, but I admire the guys that do. Control line would have died off years ago if it wasn't for one modeler trying to out fly another for the title of "National Champion".
Competition serves a purpose and it would be unfair to completely eliminate it. I think we need to differentiate serious competition from fun flies. I'd think most like fun flies, as it is more of a participatory nature than competition with lower ranking elements to allow a wide variety to participate.
But it is through competition that we have many of the fine performing models along with the engines. The pushing of technology has helped to develop new methods and means, better porting, strengthened and lighter hardware, and etc.
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I've run across a few "Sport Fliers" who have no desire to improve their models or their flying skills, no interest in doing any "pattern", apparently failing to understand that this radically improves the lifespan of their planes. If they don't care, I probably shouldn't bother to explain it to them? ??? Steve
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Yes, there are some people who could care less about improving their plane or flying. As long as they are happy with what they have, why discourage them. My grand kids have finally said they want to fly for the fun of it.
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...this radically improves the lifespan of their planes. If they don't care, I probably shouldn't bother to explain it to them? ??? Steve
Boy, you got that right. It was the hardest lesson for me to learn coming from a lifetime of freestyle 1/2A antics. Or as my buddy and coach calls it, Whifferdills. I still lapse now and then, most notably after the first complete pattern with my newest plane. I thought I had 2 minutes of fuel left, so started re-doing some stunts. In my defence, practicing. But it cut off during corner #10 of the the square 8 and I had to land inverted. Could've been worse, I had altitude to work with and floated her in to a soft grassy inverted landing.
Since then I have not done anything but fly flat and land after the Clover. I have my Baby Streaks, combat wing, and others if I just can't stand not showing off.
Rusty
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Yes, there are some people who could care less about improving their plane or flying. As long as they are happy with what they have, why discourage them. My grand kids have finally said they want to fly for the fun of it.
I've found that most folks who just fly for "fun" decide, after a fairly short while that it doesn't particularly hold their interest anymore and they "drift" away on their own. No goals usually ends in boredom!
Certainly this is not an "absolute" but is generally true! It's the nature of the Human Beast! y1 y1 D>K
Randy Cuberly
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Personally, I think that some people don't have the discipline or desire to improve.
Its much the same flying high performance, slope sailplanes. Some folks I know are talented aerobatic freestyle pilots, but when you ask them to race their plane on a course, the don't fair well. Its the "precision" aspect that causes them problems. When they have to turn their plane in the same spot every time in varying conditions, they have trouble. Its because they have not been forced ever to do that.
There is nothing wrong at all with sport flying, nor flying in comps. Its a matter of what catches your interest. For some folks, MEASURABLE improvement is what they need to make them happy. They are normally goal oriented folks.
Others just want to unwind and don't want to feel any pressure. Those folks just like to hang out with like minded people that have the same hobby.
I feel that ALL of us have BOTH of those people in us, just some more than the other.
Are we really so different? Both sport and competition flyers love to feel the pull of the handle, right??
I personally don't see any reason for a rift. I think that some people just like drama....
Regards to all, comp and sport. ;)
Chris