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Author Topic: Allen head tools  (Read 1255 times)

Offline Lyle Spiegel

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Allen head tools
« on: November 17, 2021, 05:01:52 AM »
Im shopping for set of hex head sockethead drivers. Can't decide between "ball end" style or flat. Do I want Tee handle or screwdriver grip or simple L shaped.
what's everyone using or recommend? What is good brand? Craftsman or other?
Lyle Spiegel AMA 19775

Rick_Huff

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2021, 05:07:19 AM »
Lyle,
The ones from Jim Lee are the best I've used.  He makes both ball end and flat, and I'd recommend both.  The ball end drivers aren't designed for high torque.

Rick

Offline Craig Beswick

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2021, 05:12:19 AM »
I second Lees Machine shop. Excellent quality nothing is ever too much trouble.

https://www.leemachineshop.com/

Craig

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Online Ken Culbertson

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2021, 07:08:38 AM »
Since going electric I have been almost 100% Ball End Hex Drivers.  So many hex heads so few drivers!  The problem is that we need several of the same size and all you can find are sets.  I have resorted to buying inexpensive sets on Amazon even though they have to be replaced more often.  What I hate most is that everything I have to screw is 4-40 and everything I get seems to be metric. HB~>

Ken
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2021, 07:49:37 AM »
I get mine from Ace Hardware, they have sets and individual drivers. D>K
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2021, 08:19:54 AM »
Lyle,
The ones from Jim Lee are the best I've used.  He makes both ball end and flat, and I'd recommend both.  The ball end drivers aren't designed for high torque.

Rick


     Read this, then re-read it, and then post it above your work bench! A vey small percentage of what you need an Allen wrench for requires or needs to be the ball driver. Get a set of Bondous brand ball drivers with as big a size as you might need, then find a store that sell Eklind brand tools and they have those in T-handle sets and individually. Graingers and other industrial supply places carry multiple brands.  For the grub screws that are very tiny on wheel collars and prop hubs and such, check out the specialty drivers for the R/C car guys and test fit some of those. Most have replaceable tips.
   Now, all together, READ RICK HUFF"S POST AGAIN!  The hex at the high point of the ball is actually a bit undersize from the process of making it into a ball. It will screw up the socket in a few bolt heads just before it starts to round off and really make life miserable for you. Take all of the ball drivers that you have that are rounded off and cut them off with a Dremel cut off wheel but don't get them too hot. If you get it too hot it will get soft and round off easily, but you can dress it down with a grinder to fresh , hard metal if you are careful this time and DON"T GET IT TOO HOT!
   Now, once more just for extra credit READ RICK HUFF"S POST and then post it above your work bench!!
   Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee
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Offline John Rist

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2021, 08:39:36 AM »
https://www.mcmaster.com/hex-keys/   McMaster-Carr  has any type known to man.   They sell sets, individual, ball tip, regular tip, T-handle, Screw driver, and you name it.  I have found them to be very fast on shipping.   They also sell cap screws, nuts of all kinds, washers, and lots of other stuff.   They are my goto place for most hardware and tools I use in the shop.   About once a year I put together an order of tools, screws, washers, and nuts.  One big order cuts down on shipping cost.  D>K  Ps they also sell wire rope in the small sizes needed for lead outs.  https://www.mcmaster.com/wire-rope/
John Rist
AMA 56277

Offline Reptoid

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2021, 11:13:22 AM »
A Main hobbies has an awesome selection of sets and singles in many shapes and sizes. Shipping on small items is only $1.99 and they ship quickly. Check out their website to get a good idea of what's available:
https://www.amainhobbies.com/hex-wrenches-tools-maintenance-airplanes/c-quamsdhcytwryqgz
If you just need one or two high quality wrenches you can go with Jim Lee
Small ball end hex wrenches are handy for spinning in or out but std flat end is much better for torqueing or loosening tight screws. Ball ends will break off if overloaded and will also damage the socket in the screw.
Regards,
       Don
       AMA # 3882

Offline Brett Buck

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2021, 11:29:57 AM »
Oh dear, I have been tightening my engine mount screws with ball drivers for 35 years! Disaster has somehow avoided me.

     Brett

Offline bill bischoff

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2021, 12:38:10 PM »
Here's a tip. When you break the ball off in the screw head, it sometimes doesn't want to come out. Try extracting it with a strong magnet. This has saved me a lot of hassle on multiple occasions. Sorry for the mild tangent to the original question.

Offline Doug Moisuk

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2021, 02:14:28 PM »
I’ve managed to collect sets of them all over the years. I use them all at one time or another. But I probably use the individual ball ones the most.
Doug Moisuk
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Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2021, 02:36:59 PM »
Oh dear, I have been tightening my engine mount screws with ball drivers for 35 years! Disaster has somehow avoided me.

     Brett

    Yes, it probably has. But with your work load, ( going from what I have read in this forum) and your other hobbies/activities, you have probably only used yours about 1/10 as much in that 35 years as some people do in a flying season.. You also have an understanding of the tool, the fastener and what all is actually going on when you bolt in the engine. You probably make sure the engine is an accurate fit in the mount, and the holes are aligned, and you don't force things to fit as you mount your engines. And you probably make sure you have the tool square to the hole, even though you have a ball end, so the tool picks up the flats better. And I'll bet you use some sort of lock washer or thread locking fluid and don't try to over torque the fastener. In short, you are experienced. In my working career following behind and working with ham handed operators, and 35 or so years behind the counter of the hobby shop trying to help some people that can't be helped grasp some kind of concept of what they are doing. I've had to deal with that broken off ball in a fastener in a whirling piece of machinery that absolutely can't have it coming out in the wrong place at the wrong time. I've had to convince a customer that, yes, the screw in his "Belchfire SuperCar is screwed up, so is he Allen wrench, and he needs to buy new stuff, even though he doesn't understand why it won't work. I have been at this a long time and at this point I am sure I haven't seen it all!!
   And yeah, if I have to take the cowling off, and then the muffler to make sure all the engine mounting bolts are tight, that's what I do, because sometimes the end result of not doing that is far worse and takes far more time to rectify. Took me a long time to learn that lesson over the years!
    Type at you later,
     Dan McEntee
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2021, 06:22:24 PM »
It happens that I have a set of T-handle SAE hex drivers hanging on the side of my rollaway tool box, but what I actually use most is one of those sets of L-type in the plastic holder gizmo. Red is the French system, and yellow is the King's system, and the best thing is that the long legs have ball end, while the short legs have a simple hex end. Spin 'em in until snug with the ball end and tighten to desired torque with the short leg. PUT 'em back in the plastic holder gizmo!!!

In the shop, I have the big sets that contains up to 1/2" or I'd guess about 10 or 12 mm in the French set, but I don't carry either of those in my field kit for models. For that, I have similar ones that have much smaller sizes on the upper limit. In both French and King's sizes. Works fine, fairly inexpensive and easier to replace if one is buggered or lost. Replacing a missing T-handle can be difficult if you want the same size AND brand. Bondhus is my choice of brands.   D>K Steve
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In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.  In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.

Offline Mark wood

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2021, 11:28:21 AM »
Jim Lee. Just give a him a couple Benjamins and tell him to make you a party bag.
Life is good AMA 1488
Why do we fly? We are practicing, you might say, what it means to be alive...  -Richard Bach
“Physics is like sex: sure, it may give some practical results, but that’s not why we do it.” – Richard P. Feynman

Offline Brett Buck

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2021, 12:14:35 PM »
I think, that when you use ordinary blind nuts there is no real risk. I have full-length dural inserts in engine bearers and after a season of flying the screws really are stuck, regardless the proper oiling.
Allen keys are one of those things that buying quality tools makes the life easier, thus PB Swiss. L

    Right - I am using the wood to apply the preload, not attempting to stretch the screws themselves for preload. That means I don't need as much torque, which means a ball driver is plenty good enough. I might add, I have never broken one, not even the .050 size.

    For solid connections (like headers) you count on the stretch of the screw to apply the preload, in that case, I use conventional Allen hex keys in the conventional manner.

     I have had no issue at all with Bondhus drivers, which are commonly available and inexpensive. I have had some issues with various off-brand drivers rounding themselves out. On a few of these I cut off the ends and heat-treated it, no good, the steel was just not good enough

    By the way, I have been hearing about this for 50+ years - what the hell is "Dural" (Duralumin)? Near as I can tell it is something like 2024, but only in European sources do I ever hear the word "dural" and I have never found anyone who could explain what it was, other than it is aluminum/copper like 2xxx series.

      Brett

Offline Reptoid

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2021, 12:44:00 PM »
Here's the definition if anybody wants to know

Duralumin (also called duraluminum, duraluminium, duralum, dural(l)ium, or dural — a portmanteau of durable and aluminum) is a trade name for one of the earliest types of age-hardenable aluminum alloys. Its use as a trade name is obsolete, and today the term mainly refers to aluminum–copper alloys, designated as the 2000 series by the International Alloy Designation System (IADS), as with 2014 and 2024 alloys used in airframe fabrication.

Much like the term "Crescent Wrench" is used to describe many other generic brands of "Open end adjustable wrenches"
Or like "Allen wrench" is used to describe hex wrenches or hex keys. The "Allen" name is a registered trademark (circa 1910) of the Allen Manufacturing Company (now Apex Tool Group) of Hartford, Connecticut
Regards,
       Don
       AMA # 3882

Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Allen head tools
« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2021, 03:19:53 PM »

The funny thing is, that unlike with steels, stronger the aluminiums get, the more they are a pleasure to machine.  L

Wait a minute! You'd rather single point threads in 1018 than in heat treated 4340?   :o  Steve
"The United States has become a place where professional athletes and entertainers are mistaken for people of importance." - Robert Heinlein

In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.  In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.


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