Airon

[Steve Lotz]

Did this this design ever get published? Are accurate plans available anywhere?

Steve

[john e. holliday]

Have you tried the AMA plans sectio n?  Seems I remember an Airion from way back.

[Steve Lotz]

If I remember correctly, the 3-view showed a tremendous amount of engine outthrust. I wonder if that was correct. I thought the 3-view was pretty crude.

Steve

[Ken Bird]

I'm not certain where I got this scan from but here is a .jpg from the AAM Bob Hunt mentioned.

Ken

[Phil Spillman]

That is a sharp plane which looks a lot like the ARES!

Phil Spillman

[Matt Colan]

I'm not certain where I got this scan from but here is a .jpg from the AAM Bob Hunt mentioned.

Ken

30 coats of Testors blue paint?! That had to be brushed on!!

[Steve Lotz]

That 3-view is much better than I remember.

[Ken Bird]

30 coats of Testors blue paint?! That had to be brushed on!!

The good old days! Also note the .018 lines…

[Ken Culbertson]

The good old days! Also note the .018 lines…

A lot to note.  Prop arc is below the wheels.  Today's takeoffs would be impossible as would landings if the prop was not set right.  Amazing airfoil.  Sort of works if you have huge flaps and fly fast, which we did in the 60's, especially East Coast.  Leadout position suggests an aft CG since adjustable was still a few years out.  Having flown as a Junior and Senior during that period, I can understand having a winning record meant you actually beat someone.

Try 30 coats of dope over today's balsa to come out at 37oz?   We brushed and wet sanded color back then.  A lot of planes didn't even have a clear coat.  Spray guns were the toys of the big guys with jobs and money and foam was what was on the top of your dad's beer.

Ken

[Tom McClain]

I have a copy of the true Airon plans drawn by John Davis that Tod Lee gave me.  Interested?

John Davis had Steve Wooley's Argus and Jim Vornholt's Airon.  From those he made reverse engineered plans.

[EddyR]

 Bill little was building one from corrected plans I sent him . Davis measured the model as i talked to him on the phone. The wing was 1” wider at the center than the small three view shows. Also there was more leading edge sweep. Most of the other numbers are close. Landing gear was not as wide as small plan shows. Burnie Ash  the designer used the same flaps and elevator over and over as he built new planes
  EddyR

[Jay]

Years ago I asked the same thing. Seems that Bill Little and Allen Brickhouse were
supposedly working on getting a plane built and plans printed.
I assume that the project got shelved when Allen passed and Bill dropping out off the hobby.  It's a classic legal plane since it was printed in American Modeler which I have a copy.  Sure would love to see it come to fruitation.

Jay

[Tom McClain]

I have a copy of the true Airon plans drawn by John Davis that Tod Lee gave me.  Interested?

John Davis had Steve Wooley's Argus and Jim Vornholt's Airon.  From those he made reverse engineered plans.

These plans are correct unlike the one in American Modeler. John Davis had Jim Vornholts  Airon and Steve Wooleys Argus. These were the original ones until they were donated to the AMA museum after John died. Bob Hunt did a video of them when John had them. John reversed engineered the plans for both airplanes. Tod Lee shared them with me.

[Robert Zambelli]

As I recall, there was a plane similar to the Airon, called the Atom.
By Art Pawlowski (sp)?

Anyone have photos or plans?

I guess I just have a thing for I-Beam stunters!

  Bob Z.

[Dave_Trible]

I have Atom Plans, but no way at the moment to reduce and post them.  Very much like the Ares (and flown at the Nats BEFORE the Ares).  The wing is noticeably thicker than the Ares.  I MIGHT get a copy built this winter.  Another I'd like to track down any plans for is Apollo by Eddie Cameran.  It and he were right in this same group as well.

Dave

[Trostle]

As I recall, there was a plane similar to the Airon, called the Atom.
By Art Pawlowski (sp)?

Anyone have photos or plans?

  Bob Z.

Fred Carnes chronicled the history of the Detroit I Beams.  In the October 1997 issue of Flying Models, Fred gave a history of Art Pawloski and the development of the Atom leading to winning the Walker Cup as the National Stunt Champion as a Senior in 1958.  Fred developed plans from the actual 1958 model which were published in that FM issue.  Outstanding article, outstanding plans and an outstanding airplane.

Also, Bob Hunt is to be commended for encouraging and publishing Fred Carnes' work.

Keith

[John Kelly]

    Hey Bob, Long time no see, hope you're doing well.

[EddyR]

 Here is one of the I-Beam models Fred featured in his articles. As far as I know this is the e only Saturn built other than the original. I had the original to look at when building this copy of the 1957 Tester best finish award. The original is still in one piece but not flyable. I flew this one two years ago. I put Rustler 40 in it 10 years ago. I am guessing 700+ flights on it. Never crashed it.

[Rick Campbell]

In the late 80s or early 90s, I drew a full size plan from that three view. It ended up in the hands of a gentleman from Indiana (name escapes me) who had one of the original Airons hanging in his garage. He made corrections on the plan and that plan ended up with Tom Dixon. I think the plan Tom drew from that is pretty close.

[Rick Campbell]

I found the photos the man from Indiana sent me. He also had a Ballerina. Nice guy, I do believe he's since passed.

[Rick Campbell]

After more thoroughly reading the thread, I see the man with whom I corresponded was John Davis. A couple more pics.

[Rick Campbell]

Look how low to the ground it is. Very cool.

[EddyR]

  Tom Dixon Aron plans are not even close. I had a set of those and I drew the corrected drawings on top of them and sent them to Bill Little. Bill and I lived less than 100 miles apart and traded many plans. Bill and I flew together many times. There were quite a few set of plans that only I had and I sent them to him just before he became so ill. Example the Veco TOM TOm  that many on here asked me for. I no longer have any plans except my swept wing stunt plane from 1963.
EddyR

[Serge_Krauss]

I have Atom Plans, but no way at the moment to reduce and post them.  Very much like the Ares (and flown at the Nats BEFORE the Ares).  The wing is noticeably thicker than the Ares.  I MIGHT get a copy built this winter.  Another I'd like to track down any plans for is Apollo by Eddie Cameran.  It and he were right in this same group as well. Dave

Dave -

The late Gary Tultz knew Eddie Kammerer and built a version of the Apollo some time around 2005-7. Roger Strickler inherited Gary's plans and models. I don't know whether he still has the Apollo or the plans. I have some of his plans, and thought I might have gotten those for the Apollo, but I just looked and didn't find them. I remember Gary telling me that he remembered how Eddie arrived at the design, and he just did what Eddie did, starting, I think, with the Ares. Maybe Roger still has the plans. I know that I've seen them at Gary's place and later with Roger, maybe at last year's Cleveland contest, when he had many items to sell. If you want his contact information, send me a message.

SK

[Dave_Trible]

Serge I'd appreciate whatever you can do to help.  I'll send a pm and you can forward info there. Thanks for digging up the photo.  I uploaded that a couple years ago.  Ron O'Toole sent that to me after I was fortunate to meet him then.  Eddie is the one I haven't met in person but I'd like to have a chance to build his airplane.

Thanks!

Dave

[Rick Campbell]

Dave -

The late Gary Tultz knew Eddie Kemmerer and built a version of the Apollo some time around 2005-7. Roger Strickler inherited Gary's plans and models. I don't know whether he still has the Apollo or the plans. I have some of his plans, and thought I might have gotten those for the Apollo, but I just looked and didn't find them. I remember Gary telling me that he remembered how Eddie arrived at the design, and he just did what Eddie did, starting, I think, with the Ares. Maybe Roger still has the plans. I know that I've seen them at Gary's place and later with Roger, maybe at last year's Cleveland contest, when he had many items to sell. If you want his contact information, send me a message.

SK

The Airon in the B&W photo is clearly not the same as the one Bob posted, or the one I posted. That makes THREE different Airon models. Stunt history is so cool. Great thread.

[Steve Lotz]

If Apollo plans exist, I'd like a set too!

Steve

[Serge_Krauss]

Serge I'd appreciate whatever you can do to help.  I'll send a pm and you can forward info there. Thanks for digging up the photo.  I uploaded that a couple years ago.  Ron O'Toole sent that to me after I was fortunate to meet him then.  Eddie is the one I haven't met in person but I'd like to have a chance to build his airplane. Thanks! Dave

Dave and Steve - I sent Roger an e-mail last night, telling him of your (Dave's) interest. He has not been in the best of health, and I hope he's well and able to let us know about those plans. I'll keep you informed.

SK

[Steve Lotz]

Thank you.

[Tony Drago]

What is he name of the plane upper right corner? Too much of a glare on the wing to read it.

[Tony Drago]

That's Ron O'Toole with his Aeolus. The rage back then was to name your stunt model after a Greek god. I guess we all were more influenced by the Iliad and the Odyssey than we thought when it was required reading in high school...

Bob Hunt

Bob. Thank you.

[Dan McEntee]

That's Ron O'Toole with his Aeolus. The rage back then was to name your stunt model after a Greek god. I guess we all were more influenced by the Iliad and the Odyssey than we thought when it was required reading in high school...

Bob Hunt

   Thanks for clearing that up Bob!! Ron O'Toole lives near me and I see him now and then at local stores and such. He was an inactive club member for a while but hasn't been to the field in a ling time. When I was working at contract packaging company, the truck driver for one of the printing companies we did business with was a guy named Lou Zeller , who was a cousin I think of Gary Zeller, and when I mentioned to him one time that I flew model airplanes for a hobby he asked me if I had ever met Gary, but that was well before my time when, Ron O'Toole, Bob Tucker, Art Schaefer, and Gary Zeller were big in the midwest contest circuit. At Schaefer's Hobby Shop one of their original Tucker Specials is still hanging on the wall with the original Formula S that I have mentioned before., Neat photo !  I now seem to remember Ron telling us that he used to get teased about mispronunciations of that name! And I do remember having to read The Iliad and the Odyssey in high school English class.
   Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

[Rick Campbell]

This thread seems to have evolved away from the Airon and into "various I-beamers." As long as we're going there, I'd love to know more about this plane:

[Dave_Trible]

This is obviously Gerry Phelps,  who we just lost in the past few months.  From this angle it’s hard to tell much about the airplane.  I could be one we’ve been talking about or something Gerry cooked up.

Dave

[Serge_Krauss]

I don't think I've ever seen a picture of Jerry that young! Could that be an "Argus" variant?

[Dan McEntee]

This is obviously Gerry Phelps,  who we just lost in the past few months.  From this angle it’s hard to tell much about the airplane.  I could be one we’ve been talking about or something Gerry cooked up.

Dave

     I have a model that begins with a "J" in my mind but can't get it out. Or maybe a mix of Airon and Atom? It looks like it has more stabilizer area than the Airon and a different tip shape, but a lot of elevator area like all the rest of the models pictured. From what you can see it's a clean looking ship.
    Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

[Tom McClain]

Steve, plans went out today by FedEx surface. Should be there in 5 days.  Recommend OS 35 MX S with xoar 10/6 propeller.

[Tom McClain]

I don't think I've ever seen a picture of Jerry that young! Could that be an "Argus" variant?

I think it is an Argus by the tail feathers. Here’s mine.

[Dan McEntee]

I think it is an Argus by the tail feathers. Here’s mine.

  Back when I first started flying stunt semiseriously and met Jerry. he was flying a model of his design called the Avion and I fell in love with it. He told me that it was sort of a rip off of Steve Wooley's Cobra and a larger derivative called the Deitrick (bad spelling!) Cobra. I think he knew Steve Wooley pretty well. The red model he is holding has a straight fuselage top unlike the Cobra. I'm gonna guess this may be his take on the Cobra with a straight top fuselage. It would be nice to see a side or 3/4 view. I told Jerry that he was lucky that he flew clockwise, because I loved that Avion so much I was likely to steal it from him if I knew I could fly it! What a great guy jerry was!
   Type at you later,
    Dan McEntee

[EddyR]

 I remember seeing one of Steve’s Argus models with a bubble canopy. This model looks larger with longer tail moment. I do know that every model we built back then was just a little different then the one before it. The limiting factor was the Fox .35. Some people were in to Johnson motors that were stronger and ran well. Many of the Detroiter models had Johnson motors. Some people at that time were into the Fox .59. I used a .59 in my 1963 model that i just got rid of because of my moving to a apartment four years ago. Even the k&B .45 and McCoy .40 were vert popular.
EddyR

[Steve Lotz]

Steve, plans went out today by FedEx surface. Should be there in 5 days.  Recommend OS 35 MX S with xoar 10/6 propeller.

Check will be in the mail tomorrow. Just so happens I have both the recommended items. Tom Lay OS Max-S.

[Tom McClain]

Check will be in the mail tomorrow. Just so happens I have both the recommended items. Tom Lay OS Max-S.

OS 35 jet stream silencer would be good too.  Also a MACS flow thru muffler.