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Author Topic: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)  (Read 2566 times)

Mike Griffin

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A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« on: May 05, 2013, 12:16:21 PM »
I cannot seem to find any previous plans for a control line version of the A10A Thunderbolt so I have a question for those of you who are really good at this kind of thing (which I am not).

Here are the specs for the A10A:

Length: 53 ft 4 in
Wingspan: 57 ft 6 in
Height: 14 ft 8 in
Wing area: 506 ft²
Airfoil: NACA 6716 root, NACA 6713 tip
Empty weight: 24,959 lb

Is it possible to take these specs and reduce everything down to numbers that would be a .40 -.60 size control line model?  For example:  The wingspan is 57ft 6in on the full scale plan.  If I wanted at model with a 54" wing span, how would you use math to reduce it down to that size and make all other specs work out to have the proper numbers everywhere else and be of the proper proportions?   Is this possible without having to get into a lot of complicated math I would not understand?

If I had the right numbers for designing a model of it such as wingspan, wing area, root chord, tip chord, fuselage length and width.. etc etc....I would like to draw one up....I just dont know how to do the math.

Mike
« Last Edit: May 05, 2013, 01:41:04 PM by Mike Griffin »

Offline Bill Little

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2013, 12:18:48 PM »
Hi Mike,

I have seen some R/C plans for a semi scale A-10.  It used electric ducted fans.  A little large for C/L, but could easily be reduced if wanted.

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Mike Griffin

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2013, 12:32:08 PM »
Thanks Bill.  If you can remember where you saw them let me know and I will track them down.

Mike

Dennis Leonhardi

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2013, 11:50:30 PM »
Buy a Sterling (Estes) 1/2-A profile A-10 and scale it up.   :)

They're cute - was Mike Pratt involved in that one, huh Mikey?


Dennis
 :)

Offline Trostle

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2013, 12:09:27 AM »
I have some suggestions for you if you would want to consider doing one up yourself.

I assume you are wanting to do sort of a sport "semi-scale" CL model and not looking to have something to do a serious stunt pattern.

You could use an almost scale wing planform, except the wing on the full size aircraft has a straight center section with a dihedral break sort of mid span.  Do you want to go scale? Or do you want to have a simple swept LE and TE.  Are you wanting to put flaps on this?  I would discourage if this is just for a sport type airplane.  With any kind of dummy nacelles on the rear of the fuselage that approach scale size, it will not be for serious stunt.  The real airplane has a relatively long nose.  Your sport ship will need to shorten that nose significantly, and then you start loosing some of the "scale like" appearance of the full size aircraft.

Just some rough numbers.  If you want to have something near shape of the original wing, your initial goal for a span of about 54" will give you around 510 sq in or slightly more, with the same aspect ratio of about 5.6 which is in the aspect ratio range of most stunt ships.  (This includes flaps if you use them.)  Your number will vary depending on taper ratio, tip shape, and how you deal with the straight center section.  And you would probably have no dihedral, unless you want to go "more scale", then you will have to deal with the mid span dihedral brake.  Just for starters, your horizontal tail would want to be about 20% of the wing area so that would give you slightly more than 100 sq in. I have an idea the horizontal tail on the full size aircraft is very generous and could even bemore than 20% of the wing area which is good.

Regardless if this is to be sort of a semi-scale or some sort of a sport ship, there will be compromises with that long nose and how to deal with those large rear mounted engine nacelles.  There will have to be a lot of compromises, but that is part of the challenge of doing semi-scale CL airplanes.  Now, if you just want something like a sport scale airplane, just take a set of 3-views, take them to Kinko's and enlarge them to your 54" span, you will have 510 or so sq in and an airplane that will resemble the A-10 with a propeller in front and the need to put a lot of lead in the tail.  Good luck.

Keith

Dennis Leonhardi

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2013, 12:09:49 AM »
I cannot seem to find any previous plans for a control line version of the A10A Thunderbolt so I have a question for those of you who are really good at this kind of thing (which I am not).
...

Mike

Mike, I think an (electric-powered) RC version was published in the March 1977 issue of Aeromodeller ... don't know how scale that is, or if it helps, but maybe someone here has that issue or plans?

Then again, a fellow who lives about 40 miles from me has a superb A-10 powered by two turbines ... He's won the Top Gun competition, with Dave Shulman flying for him.  Don't know what he might have to offer ...

Dennis
 :)



Offline Trostle

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2013, 01:18:34 AM »
here is a decent 3-view.

Offline Trostle

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2013, 01:19:58 AM »
And this should help in getting some of the proportions to look right.  Really important stuff for a sport scale or semi-scale stunt ship.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2013, 01:50:41 AM by Trostle »

Dennis Leonhardi

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2013, 02:20:19 AM »
Here's some inspiration -

http://jetadic.com/main.html


Have at it Mike!


Dennis

Offline Paul Smith

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2013, 06:15:45 AM »
Dave Dilutas of The Cloudbusters built a scale A-10 many years ago.  It had Fox 35 Stunts with props in the engine pods.  Nice looking.  Flew OK.
Paul Smith

Offline Avaiojet

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2013, 07:35:33 AM »
Mike,

I draw outlines of aircraft all the time for modelers/customers from 3-views, where plans are not available. Not only "outlines" but also panel lines and revit line location. Formers also, and sometimes construction. Mostly for larg scale models.

I do these drawings on vector format. Said this many times. Allows them to me produced as paper drawings at any scale or span!
 
I've made some big stuff!

You've seen some of the small drawings I do for CL.

I'll have no difficulty drawing "outlines" for any size model you need of the A-10.

I can also increase wing area, shorten the fuselage and change the moments so you have a nice looking model that offers itself well to the CL flying circle.

With your building experience, these drawings should be enough to get you started. Profile or built-up.

My personal suggestion would be twin DF Electric.

Not sure, but I think RCGroups, (google) could have info which would be healpful?

Could be a nice project.

Let me know.

Charles

P.S.

Mike, I dug this drawing up and took a shot of the screen. 140" in span. Did it a year ago for a modeler and the project is still in progress.

Vector art from a nice accurate 3-view. can be drawn on paper any size.

EDIT for photo insert.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2013, 09:10:37 AM by Avaiojet »
Trump Derangement Syndrome. TDS. 
Avaiojet Derangement Syndrome. ADS.
Amazing how ignorance can get in the way of the learning process.
If you're Trolled, you know you're doing something right.  Alpha Mike Foxtrot. "No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."  Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten. "No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot."- Mark Twain. I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.   Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."  "Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Offline Luiz Carlos Franco

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2013, 08:41:45 AM »
Try this link.
Might give some ideas

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1778689

BOL

Luiz

Mike Griffin

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Re: A10A Thunderbolt (For Control Line Scale or Semi Scale)
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2013, 03:17:38 PM »
Keith I sent you an e mail.

Thanks

Mike

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