Testing Methanol Alcohol?

[Steve Helmick]

Looks like we (NW Skyraiders) are about to come into about 150 gallons of free "meth" (aka methanol alcohol). The guy giving it to us is a boat racer, and is giving that up. It comes in 15 gallon jugs, apparently. I was figuring on mixing a sample (maybe 10 oz?) of 80-20 fuel from each jug and testing it to see if it would run fer chit. We can probably find a few NIB IC engines to bench test.
1)  Is there a cheaper and simpler way, like chemically?
2)  If it's NFG (Not Fuel Good), what's a good way to dispose of the bad stuff? I already have thought about Pete Ferguson's swimming pool; that's out, for some reason.

  Steve

[Douglas Ames]

I'd research the specific gravity to see if there's any moisture in the fuel? Maybe there's another way?

[Howard Rush]

I can test it.  I have a volumetric flask just for that purpose and a scale good for .01 gram.  Bring me a sample in a nicely sealed vessel, and I'll give you the word.  Better yet, bring me one of them jugs for my personal use. 

Who's the boat racer?

[Derek Barry]

I test ethyl alcohol on a pretty regular basis but not in my stunt engines...


Derek

[Jim Kraft]

Hey Drerek; Maybe you should try some of that moonshine and castor for fuel. Just don't drink it or you will be the fastest guy on the planet. LOL

[phil c]

Try digging up an hydrometer, maybe at a brewing supply store.  Pure methanol has a specific gravity of .7913.  It goes up when water gets in it, so any change in the reading is likely enough to cause problems.  Each .0001 change is about 1/10 of 1%.  There is also a special hydrometer that works on either methanol, alcohol, or a mix that uses a scale from 0 to 100%.  The Traille scale.

[Paul Smith]

Assuming this test goes as suggested, how much water is tolerable in methanol?  Is it supported to be a perfect world?

The cops claim to be able to measure the amount of ethanol in a person's breath to an accuracy of 00.08% with a cheap hand-held instrument. 
I think a machinsit would have a hard time measuring a 100" piece of steel to +/- .08" with enough accuracy to stand up in court.

[Brian Hampton]

Assuming this test goes as suggested, how much water is tolerable in methanol?  Is it supported to be a perfect world?

From an experiment I did several years ago I found that about 3% water on a warm/hot day would cause all the oil to suddenly come out of solution and drop to the bottom of the container. The amount of tolerable water was extremely temperature dependent, the warmer the fuel the more water before the oil dropped out. There was a difference between synthetic and castor with castor tolerating slightly more water. Also this was done with a zero nitro fuel so I can't say if nitro has any affect on the oil dropping out.

[Tim Wescott]

• Give 15 gallons to me
• Watch this forum for oddball questions

I got curious and decided to search around to see if anyone made some magic indicator paper that you could dip into your methanol to see if it had water in it -- no dice.  The two pages I found both said to use a hygrometer.

This page
http://karting.4cycle.com/showthread.php?t=346503
has a post saying you can filter your methanol through a chamois cloth (presumably a real one from a dead baby deer, but the poster did not say).  It also has a post pointing to this page, which I also found in my web search:

http://www.make-biodiesel.org/Quality-Testing/testing-methanol-for-purity.html

So I guess a hygrometer or an accurate measuring cup and a scale is the way to go.  (I'm not sure if a postal scale is accurate enough, but if it is you can calibrate your measuring cup by filling it with distilled water.  Hmm -- just like high school chemistry class, but without any budding young socialites bouncing around to distract you from your work).

[Howard Rush]

So I guess a hygrometer or an accurate measuring cup and a scale is the way to go.

Here's the cup: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volumetric_flask

Here's the scale: http://www.oldwillknottscales.com/my-weigh-ibalance-201.html

One probably needs a thermometer, too.  Dick Fowler posted a link to a density chart a few years ago.   I figured the accuracy, but forgot it.  It's adequate.  Steve could either bring some methanol over or buy his own equipment.  I suppose I could take the rig to a club meeting.  My meeting attendance has been better lately because I like the waitress. 

[Dave_Trible]

I test ethyl alcohol on a pretty regular basis but not in my stunt engines...


Derek

Where's that IOC drug testing list......

Dave

[Peter Ferguson]

So the next item in the scavenger hunt is free nitro. Anyone local have some ?

[Tim Wescott]

I experimented with mixing my own fuel last year.

If you can tolerate some synthetic in your mix, the cheapest source for nitro that I found is high-nitro car or helicopter fuel.  Start with a gallon of that, then figure out how much castor and methanol to add to get the desired mix.

There are racing fuel places on the web, but they want $$ for nitro, with shipping on top of that.  I'd quote what I remember, but even if it's right it's probably changed.  Google is your friend.

The recipe that I used came from a guy in New England who's on the Ringmaster forum.  One gallon castor, one gallon high-nitro fuel, three gallons methanol.  It gets you five gallons of low-nitro, high-castor fuel for, in my case, about $12/gallon.

Or, call around all the places that advertise racing fuel, and see what turns up in the way of nitro.

[Howard Rush]

Or, call around all the places that advertise racing fuel, and see what turns up in the way of nitro.

It's an ongoing scavenger hunt.  Whenever I'd move to a new town, one of the chores along with forwarding the mail was to find a nitro source.  Find somebody who actually races something: dragsters, motorcycles, boats.  They are our kind of folks and will refer you to somebody who will refer you to somebody who has nitro.  Methanol is a little easier.  You gotta test both to see what you're getting, though. Sig and McMaster-Carr are good castor oil sources.  You can use Klotz synthetic oil, but I prefer Ucon LB-625.  The distributor for that is here in Bellevue, but there is effectively a 50-gal. minimum. 

[Steve Hines]

Fox is the cheapest place to get caster oil, only $20 a gal. shipping is not that bad. I ordered a case two years ago work great.

Steve