TRS's effect CL?

[Paul Taylor]

Do TFR's from the FAA include CL?
We have a air show in our area.

I would like to go but hate the traffic and long lines.  

[john e. holliday]

I believe control line is exempt.   I was out flying one day and when I got home I had an E-Mail about the KC area.   

[Brett Buck]

I believe control line is exempt.   I was out flying one day and when I got home I had an E-Mail about the KC area.   

   I think this is correct and thats what the AMA told me about it.  As far as the FAA is concerned, control-line models are not aircraft as they are tethered to the ground. Whether or not this would help you if someone decides to call the FAA is open to debate.

     Brett

[Avaiojet]

   I think this is correct and that's what the AMA told me about it.  As far as the FAA is concerned, control-line models are not aircraft as they are tethered to the ground. Whether or not this would help you if someone decides to call the FAA is open to debate. Brett

What's the longest length lines a CL model was flown on? Successfully.

Charles

[steven yampolsky]

   I think this is correct and thats what the AMA told me about it.  As far as the FAA is concerned, control-line models are not aircraft as they are tethered to the ground. Whether or not this would help you if someone decides to call the FAA is open to debate.

I could not find any confirmation of that! TFR test usually has two statements that lead me to believe there CL is allowed. When we had the president vacationning on Martha's Vinyard, we received an official TFR document.

https://www.faasafety.gov/files/notices/2013/Jul/130726_Marrthas_Vineyard_Advisory_Final.pdf

In it, it explicitly states that "model aircraft operations" are prohibited. AMA website also has a copy of FAA's TFR guide. In there there is no mention of CL exepmtion: http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/100820TFRAuthority.pdf

[Ara Dedekian]

           TFR ??

[Avaiojet]

I could not find any confirmation of that! TFR test usually has two statements that lead me to believe there CL is allowed. When w ;De had the president vacationning on Martha's Vinyard, we received an official TFR document.

https://www.faasafety.gov/files/notices/2013/Jul/130726_Marrthas_Vineyard_Advisory_Final.pdf

In it, it explicitly states that "model aircraft operations" are prohibited. AMA website also has a copy of FAA's TFR guide. In there there is no mention of CL exepmtion: http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/100820TFRAuthority.pdf

So I could fly a stunt kite? 

Charles

[Dan McEntee]

           TFR ??

    TFR= Temporary Flight Restrictions. These are in effect whenever the President travels, usually a 100 or 150 mile radius from his location. This includes all full size aircraft and all R/C model aircraft. I forget which President it was, but a local guy with his own personal small heli, a Hughes or R-22, flew IFR from an airport in St.Charles County, MO to his house in North St. Louis County, and relatively short straight line flight across the Missouri River. He says he didn't know about the TFRs in effect at that time, but figured something was up when he was getting close passes by some F-15s out of the Missouru ANG!
    And I do believe that C/L is exempt as Mr.Hunt says and it has been discussed here before.

   Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee

[Avaiojet]

    TFR= Temporary Flight Restrictions. These are in effect whenever the President travels, usually a 100 or 150 mile radius from his location. This includes all full size aircraft and all R/C model aircraft. I forget which President it was, but a local guy with his own personal small heli, a Hughes or R-22, flew IFR from an airport in St.Charles County, MO to his house in North St. Louis County, and relatively short straight line flight across the Missouri River. He says he didn't know about the TFRs in effect at that time, but figured something was up when he was getting close passes by some F-15s out of the Missouru ANG!
    And I do believe that C/L is exempt as Mr.Hunt says and it has been discussed here before.

   Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee

Without reading the TFR, I'll stick my neck out and say that NO model airplane gets an exemption. I was always lead to believe this included model rocketry. I've been wrong plenty of times, but I don't believe I'm wrong on this.

Steven,

Great U-Tube stuff! Kudos.

Always promoting the hobby, especially the building. What's in the works, anything?

Charles

[Brett Buck]

Without reading the TFR, I'll stick my neck out and say that NO model airplane gets an exemption. I was always lead to believe this included model rocketry. I've been wrong plenty of times, but I don't believe I'm wrong on this.

   You are right, in a way. No model aircraft are exempted. Control-line models are *not model aircraft*, and thus need no exemption.

    Brett

[steven yampolsky]

   You are right, in a way. No model aircraft are exempted. Control-line models are *not model aircraft*, and thus need no exemption.

Can point to an FAA document that identifies CL as motorized kites?

[Brett Buck]

Can point to an FAA document that identifies CL as motorized kites?

  I am unaware of any FAA document referring to "motorized kites". Call the AMA and they can tell you where to look,

    Brett

[Joey Mathison 9806]

The e-mail notices I receive from the AMA for the TFR stated Remote Control Model  Airplanes are prohibited and control line and free flight should use discretion.

[James_Mynes]

Control Line use discretion... So if you're in the middle of an overhead eight and a Tomahawk missile impacts three feet from you, your discretion was misguided.
Bummer.

[Dan McEntee]

      http://amablog.modelaircraft.org/amagov/2012/09/07/it-didnt-really-happen-but/

    A little searching turned up the above link to an article by Rich Hanson of the AMA. I don't have time to find the mention of C/L models being considered "tethered kites" but I remember reading that it came out of the FAA's mouth to AMA's ears. The above mentioned article spells out what is covered under the typical TFR, and it specifically states radio controlled models. No mention of C/L or free flight models, so they are not included. Also notice that it does not mention kites. I'm pretty sure the tethered kite comment was in an AMA email I received, but don't have time to go through each email right now to find it. If you do not get the NOTAM  (Notice To Airman) emails from the AMA, you can check them out at  http://www.modelaircraft.org/membership/clubs/notams.aspx , and they have all the current smart phone stuff also.
    I'm a dummy at this search stuff, so if I can find it anyone can find it. If you desire the information, all you have to do is look.
   Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

[steven yampolsky]

I find it a little disconcerting that there is no official document that we can refer to. I see a strange parallel taking place between GA pilot community and modelers.

Over the past 6 months, Pilots have been detained all over the country for hours at a time without cause. Regular citizen that flew from one US airport to another. There are NO official documents that would give those piltos a means to challenge the detainment or unlawful searches.
There is an NGO tasked with protecting GA pilot's rights called AOPA(Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association). Before detentions started happening, AOPA pounded its proverbial chest with proclamations that they are working with the government to protect our rights. Now all they can do tell the pilots to surrender their constitutional rights.

The lesson here is that no amount of claims made by an NGO(AMA is a non-government organization) can protect you when burly marines in black suits show up and start plincking your model with their 9mm. Unless there is an official clarification coming from FAA or DHS, we cannot assume that CL flying is somehow OK.

If you decide to still fly, make sure you have an ID with you, all your tickets are paid, the smell of marijuana is gone from your car, alimony is paid and there are no outstanding warrants. 

[john e. holliday]

Some of you guys slay me.  Do you think a normal control line plane is going to show up on radar?   I have flown CL many times when there was notice in the KC area.   In fact I was the only type of model airplane activity in Shawnee Mission Park for a few months.   Now the radio site has so many restrictions, you can't hardly find anyone flying.  And with the hedge tree on the edge of the circle I am now limited on line length.