Nationals AMA

[john e. holliday]

I have been watching automobile racing on the Floracing site.  They cover all kinds of sports also.   I mainly like the open wheel racing as to me that is the real start of racing.  Last night was the fourth night of what is called the Chili Bowl Midget Nationals.  They do interviews with the drivers, owners and crew members.  Like the AMA Nationals there are people from all over this great land of ours as well as other countries.  I notice that like the USA AMA modelers there are areas where some excel really well in their event locally.   Then they come to the NATS and don't do so good or do better in some cases.  Also some of these teams travel all over to compete with their cars.   As one driver stated that is when you learn with your team how to set car up and to how to drive the car on different tracks.

I know we have hot beds of different events in the different areas of model plane competition.  I've seen it in my time of competing.  Navy Carrier is the event I did good in locally and a few places close.  Rat racing , Goodyear and F2C was the other events.  Oh I flew a little combat until rules kind of forced me out.  Now it physical plus age keeping me grounded.  The years I was winning in carrier I tried the NATS.  The first year was a learning experience.  But, I wonder how many have gone to the NATS with the thought they would win?  I know I was hoping to just place on the podium as the race car drivers say.  But, last night feature race was a thriller as all the races of this week have been.  But, like I have done I really put my self out of the podium finish by trying too hard or maybe not hard enough.  The second place driver would not even go to the podium and the interview you could see he was very up set.  I think he over drove his car in closing laps as he would go over the berm that was built up and lose speed.  He had the lead on last lap and I think would have won if he hadn't tried so hard.  But, we now have an individual who you might say owns Thursday night at the Chili Bowl as he has won seven straight years.

I look at our events of winners of our NATS competition which draws people from all over, even though it not like when the NATS was traveling around the country.  I know our guys in the Flying Eagles looked forward to the years the NATS would be in Grand Prairie TX or Chicago IL.  Now the west coast has twice as far to drive. 

Now closing if we had a facility like they do in Tulsa OK to hold our NATS in would it be feasable.  It would be indoors under one roof.  Nothing to worry about as far as weather unless one of the OKIE tornados came blasting through.  I just now sit here thnking if I was a billinaire would the people let me rent the facility and the AMA leb us have a control line NATS there how many would come?  Time to call it done said.

[Trostle]

Hi Doc,

I think trying to fly CL stunt indoors with no wind (as in absolutely no wind drift) is NOT a good idea.  We depend on drift to move turbulence/wake being produced so that consecutive maneuvers can be performed.  I have experienced with my own models the upsetting effects of hitting my own turbulence.  It is not "comfortable".  I witnessed a good friend (a National Champion) hit his own turbulence in the intersections of his vertical eights on a morning of absolute calm.  The model essentially turned 90^o instantly to the middle of the circle and crashed at his feet.  There was nothing he could do but try to get out of the way.

When practicing on a windless day, it is common for pilots to allow portions of their consecutive maneuvers to "drift" to one side or the other.

Keith

[john e. holliday]

I think that building the organizers use has big fans to move the air in the building.  But it was a thought to this old man.  Could call for a complete redesign or thought on flying stunt.  Look at what the over seas guys are doing with their electric powered foamies.

[Mark wood]

I think that building the organizers use has big fans to move the air in the building.  But it was a thought to this old man.  Could call for a complete redesign or thought on flying stunt.  Look at what the over seas guys are doing with their electric powered foamies.

The Wichita Wichihawks have access to indoor facility in Wellington, KS  and we are building several of Igor's GeeBee to fly there. Stay tuned, we are just getting underway. I have made seven kits and the construction hasn't yet fully begun.

[Jim Kraft]

Hey Doc. When my wife and I were first married we lived in Kansas City in 1960. They use to hold go kart races at the American Royal building in the winter. So, it could be done. Flying indoor would eliminate government regulations till they found us out and dreamed up some law that we were breaking. I loved the old days of flying in parks, school yards, and ball diamonds. Then one day someone found out we were having fun and complained. Things have not been the same since. Now anyone who fly's model airplanes is a potential terrorist. Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

We were fortunate to live the best years of this country. We have both seen the decline though and that is sad. Been happening for 70 years. When I was 6 or 7 years old building stick and tissue models in our garage, I never dreamed that someday we would have to register our models with the government.

[Howard Rush]

Hey Doc. When my wife and I were first married we lived in Kansas City in 1960. They use to hold go kart races at the American Royal building in the winter. So, it could be done. Flying indoor would eliminate government regulations till they found us out and dreamed up some law that we were breaking. I loved the old days of flying in parks, school yards, and ball diamonds. Then one day someone found out we were having fun and complained. Things have not been the same since. Now anyone who fly's model airplanes is a potential terrorist. Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

We were fortunate to live the best years of this country. We have both seen the decline though and that is sad. Been happening for 70 years.

I think people finally caught on to the leeches wanting the government to supply them with flying fields in parks, school yards, and ball diamonds. 

[Jim Kraft]

No Howard. They were flying fields that we let other people use for parks, ball diamonds, and school yards. Somehow it got reversed. And then we got pushed out altogether.

Now they are doing it to the RC guys. We use to fly RC from the local airport. Now you cannot fly within 5 miles of an airport.

[Mark wood]

No Howard. They were flying fields that we let other people use for parks, ball diamonds, and school yards. Somehow it got reversed. And then we got pushed out altogether.

Now they are doing it to the RC guys. We use to fly RC from the local airport. Now you cannot fly within 5 miles of an airport.

That's not entirely correct. It has always been part of the AMA safety code that operation within 5 miles of an airport requires coordination with the airport. It's the same today. The club simply has to get an LOA from the managing FSDO and the Airport authority. It's very difficult to do. I have an LOA for aerobatic operations at our airport. Our local RC club has one with two airports one of which is an air force base. Today because of the rampant drone operations by the uneducated, they've had to crack down and made what was, in essence, a handshake agreement into a law. It could be far worse, I've been to countries where any type of model aircraft are forbidden.

FSDO - Flight District Safety Office
LOA - Letter Of Authorization

[Jim Kraft]

The airport we use to fly from was not manned. Just a grass strip and an administration building. Later they paved the runways and added lights. We were always welcome to fly there. That was in the 60's and 70's. We moved from there in 79. I have no idea if anyone fly's there anymore. We had about 10 regular flyers in a small town of about 3500 population. We also flew control line in one of several city parks and ball diamonds. We had lots of fun and burned a lot of fuel. We use to scoop snow off the apron and fly till our hands got numb, and then run into the administration building to warm up us and our planes.

[Dave Hull]

Flying control line inside a building (or sandwiched between very close buildings) almost demands electric power, just based on noise. It is very disconcerting to fly with echos bouncing off walls and coming at you from multiple directions. They aren't even all in phase, so it's worse than you might think. Best solution was earplugs--and then a set of earmuffs over the top of that....

As far as the whole regulation issue, I would agree that the noise pushed our welcome out of local parks and schools. And, the liability. Before we blame "the guvment" too much, look at who was doing all the suing. It wasn't the guvment, it was people who didn't want to be bothered with other peoples' nuisances. I think this had a lot to do with population density; at least it seemed to in California. As the cities got bigger, there were more people doing those activities, and instead of an occasional nuisance, it became all the time. I'm sure there are other factors, but that is one.

As far as the newest regulations which redefine (or attempt to) everything as a "drone," getting the processes hammered out was painful--and it still isn't done. But as Mark said, it can be done. Our field is within the 5 mile radius and was likely one of the first shut down by the FAA while the whole LOA process was alpha-tested. The AMA/FAA announced a slight improvement in the altitude restrictions very recently where they took some of the discretization out of their grid system, which might help some. And, at least at our field, we have evolved to the understanding with the local FAA guys that "control line don't count."  A healthy place to be....

But I tell you what:  when Doc hits his number and becomes a billionaire this year, I'll help design the indoor control line stadium with a recirculating wind tunnel to feed one wall and suck it all up on the opposite side. It should come with a knob on the pit controller so you can pick a windspeed that is good for your plane, engine power level and state of trim. I figure we can also put in an overly intense light fixture we can move into place for the ProStunt guys who would rather fly outside and use their "look into the sun" skills which help differentiate them from a Joe Bellcrank, or three. Might even consider some auto-scoring features to help the judges out like verifying the extent of the takeoff role. And, I would like a "shade tree" installed inside by the pit area because, well, we're used to all crowding into the shade and doing most of our armchair flying from there. As long as that fits in Doc's building budget, that is.

The Divot

[Mark wood]

Our flying sight is two blocks away from the secondary gate of an air force base where they fly tankers out of. One day when I was out practicing, I had a visit from the Air Police. It was cordial but it was clear he was on a investigation and in communication with the base authority. He was particularly interested in whether my plane had cameras on it or not and it didn't at that particular time. First thing I did was introduce myself as retired ARMY and then took the time to brief him thoroughly on what it was we were flying and that being tethered doesn't fall under the category of a UAS. They had seen the airplane fly up over the tree line in a wing over probably. He left telling me he would put our operations on the board so we wouldn't have any future enquiries. It was a good outcome. 

[Dennis Moritz]

We lease space in a state park for control line. Ten year lease. AMA insurance required. Some reasonable regs. RC club leases in a different state park a couple of miles from us. We have a cooperative relationship with them, fly there too. The RC club hosts one day of our yearly two day contest. Rural areas on the East Coast manage to lease and find flying sites, various solutions.