Author Topic: Electric R/C Flyer Wants to Try Electric C/L (Read 11382 times)

Terry Heddin · « **on:** May 04, 2014, 11:22:12 AM »

I have been fly & building since the late fifties. Flew lots C/L until the late '70s. Been flying electric R/C the last 5 or so years, so I am somewhat familiar with electric setup, but now I want to take a shot at electric C/L. I have an E-Flite PT-19 that I have flown the stink out of on R/C, and I still have the C/L conversion parts, so I think I will get an E-Flite timer, and start there.

But, I also have a Brodak Lightning Streak kit for .19-.35 glow. I would like to convert this to electric. My stash includes quite a few 2200mah 3s & 4s packs, several 35-60 amp Hobbywing style ESCs, and a couple of Turnigy 3542/6 1000kv motors. Can any of this be used with the L/S? Also, what should I look at for a timer?
Thanks
Terry

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #1 on:** May 04, 2014, 12:15:57 PM »

Disclaimer: I fly electric RC, but in spite of being a working electronics engineer, I fly slime powered CL. So much of what I say here is regurgitating things that others have said.

The components you listed should work. You'll probably find that for full stunt capability you need the 4S packs, but randomly picking one of each motor, ESC and battery from the pile should get you in the air.

If you use a Hubin timer then you really want to use an ESC that's got helicopter governing mode -- I don't know if those ESC's have it or not.

The Kieth Renicle timer is more expensive, and requires that you solder a wire to one of your motor leads, but once you've done that it'll regulate the propeller speed without needing a governing ESC.

For starters, you can hang your 2.4GHz transmitter on your belt, and use a receiver for the "timer". It's not stunt, but touch & goes are fun.

Mike Anderson · « **Reply #2 on:** May 04, 2014, 01:12:59 PM »

For sport flying, you really don't need a governing ESC or timer. The power increase that the Hubin timer (the fm-1 or 1a) is capable of is more than enough compensation for sport flying. The 3542-1000 will turn an 11-5.5 at 8500 - 9000 rpm at about 22 amps, so enough to easily fly with 'stuntable' power for 4 minutes or so. Any Hobbywing-type ESC of 30 or 40 amps will be adequate. This will all make for a very inexpensive re-entry to control line, and would be fairly easy to upgrade if you decide you might want to in the future.

William DeMauro · « **Reply #3 on:** May 04, 2014, 03:45:48 PM »

Terry,
The 3542 is a little big for the Lightning Streak. Get yourself one of the motors I recommended to you over on RCG. I have one of these on a Flight Streak http://www.hobbypartz.com/86mb91-3015-910kv.html and it works very well. Someone else here is using one on a Top Flite Nobler ARF with success. Everyone here Knows I am a big fan of the Hubin timers and the Castle speed controllers' but if you want to use a speed controller that you already have to save a few dollars the KR timer might be a better fit for you those are available from RSM Distribution http://rsmdistribution.com/index-2.htm . Eric Rule, the owner of RSM, should be able to guide you in getting exactly what you need. If you want one of Will Hubin's units he is on here too and you can search the member directory for his E-mail and he too can help you out.
William

John Cralley · « **Reply #4 on:** May 04, 2014, 04:48:08 PM »

Terry,

Both William and Mike give you good advice. I agree that you motor is a bit oversized, however, if you just want to get back into control line flying the motor and ESC should work. This will not be the ideal setup bit should get you in the air. As they say, it is just like riding a bicycle - you don't forget! Do expect to get dizzy (don't ask how I know).

Forget the eflight timer and get a Hubin timer. I think his email is whubin@kent.edu With his simple timers you set delay/rpm/duration with a
screwdriver and they cost around $10 to $15. Pretty foolproof!

Heck, email me your snail mail address and I will send you a spare Hubin timer that I have in my junk box.

John Rist · « **Reply #5 on:** May 05, 2014, 06:39:26 AM »

If you are going to be flying over grass you might want to consider the KR timer from RSM. It will protect everything in case of a prop hang up in the grass.

Terry Heddin · « **Reply #6 on:** May 05, 2014, 06:23:48 PM »

Well, I need to build the Lightning Streak, so I have some time to decide exactly what I am going to do.
I converted the PT-19 to C/L this past weekend, and since I have an extra unused transmitter, I am going to just use a receiver to operate the throttle for now.
Thanks for all the great input.

John Rist · « **Reply #7 on:** May 06, 2014, 05:54:59 AM »

Quote from: Terry Heddin on May 05, 2014, 06:23:48 PM

Well, I need to build the Lightning Streak, so I have some time to decide exactly what I am going to do.
I converted the PT-19 to C/L this past weekend, and since I have an extra unused transmitter, I am going to just use a receiver to operate the throttle for now.
Thanks for all the great input.

Good practice if you ever decide to join us scale nuts! I understand carrier also loves the 2.4 throttle. It is lots of fun to have throttle!

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #8 on:** May 09, 2014, 08:36:07 PM »

Quote from: William DeMauro on May 04, 2014, 03:45:48 PM

Terry,
The 3542 is a little big for the Lightning Streak. Get yourself one of the motors I recommended to you over on RCG. I have one of these on a Flight Streak http://www.hobbypartz.com/86mb91-3015-910kv.html and it works very well. <snip>

You guys are bad for my wallet! ....... I was so intrigued by our discussion on using these smaller motors that I grabbed a Flite Streak arf and am ordering one of the above motors for it. I just have to see how these smaller motors fly

Now if I could only figure out where to put the battery so it don't look like a second thought.

55chevr · « **Reply #9 on:** May 09, 2014, 09:15:26 PM »

you will like that motor on a Flite Streak ... I just mount the battery on an angle over the leading edge.

Paul Taylor · « **Reply #10 on:** May 10, 2014, 06:17:11 AM »

If its a ARF and not put together you could build a battery box/tray in the wing. Just throwing the idea out there. That way you gave it some thought.

William DeMauro · « **Reply #11 on:** May 10, 2014, 07:06:35 AM »

Here is one of the Flight Streaks that I have done.

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #12 on:** May 10, 2014, 09:32:24 AM »

Quote from: Paul Taylor on May 10, 2014, 06:17:11 AM

If its a ARF and not put together you could build a battery box/tray in the wing. Just throwing the idea out there. That way you gave it some thought.

That was my thought. What size batteries is everyone running in them. Looks like I will get to see what the world of 70c lipo charging is like

William DeMauro · « **Reply #13 on:** May 10, 2014, 04:11:09 PM »

Quote from: Bud Morrison on May 10, 2014, 09:32:24 AM

That was my thought. What size batteries is everyone running in them. Looks like I will get to see what the world of 70c lipo charging is like

Most of us are using 4s 2200 20-25c lipo's in planes this size. None of us are charging at 70C and I don't believe a charger is even available to go that fast. Incase you were talking about 70c discharging most of us are discharging the batteries at 10-15c tops while flying. Electric controline doesn't have very high requirements therefore most of us do very well with the lighter budget batteries.

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #14 on:** May 10, 2014, 05:27:38 PM »

Quote from: William DeMauro on May 10, 2014, 04:11:09 PM

Most of us are using 4s 2200 20-25c lipo's in planes this size. None of us are charging at 70C and I don't believe a charger is even available to go that fast. Incase you were talking about 70c discharging most of us are discharging the batteries at 10-15c tops while flying. Electric controline doesn't have very high requirements therefore most of us do very well with the lighter budget batteries.

I'm talking charging. No need to baby 70c cells on the chargers.

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #15 on:** May 14, 2014, 09:04:48 AM »

Quote from: William DeMauro on May 10, 2014, 07:06:35 AM

Here is one of the Flight Streaks that I have done.

I'm thinking of cutting a new fuse and extending the nose and tail so my battery fits.

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #16 on:** May 14, 2014, 10:16:22 AM »

Bud:
Here's some thought starters - the Conversion Kit I designed for the Brodak Ringmaster, I think it could be adapted to the Flite Streak. The pack is centered on the fuse and on the wing, it requires a reinforced notch about 1/2" deep in the LE plus a little swing clearance for the 4Sx2200 pack. The side of the battery box captures the LE so the resulting front end structure is stiffer than the average profile. The set-up uses an Arrowind 2210 motor which is 3.8 oz. The Ringmaster is very light so it is also borderline nose heavy but flies VERY well balanced there.

Your plan for a new fuselage would help accommodate this installation even better.

Edit:
Forgot to add, the Ringmaster conversion kit is Brodak #BH-1937, it and the other conversions can be seen here:
http://brodak.com/electric/conversion-kits.html

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #17 on:** May 14, 2014, 10:22:48 AM »

One of the nifty things I see happening with electric CL is that people are figuring out how to make a clean installation on a profile.

55chevr · « **Reply #18 on:** May 14, 2014, 04:28:24 PM »

Dennis - the Flite Streak nose is really short. The only way a battery fits is on an angle from the motor mount back to above the leading edge. I built 1" extended nose PDK Streak and the battery still wont clear the leading edge. I like your mount and I have one on the 38 special I am building. That has 1" extended nose as well.

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #19 on:** May 14, 2014, 06:43:27 PM »

Joe
Bud said he was thinking about a new fuselage, and for the ARF Flite Streak a lot of folks have done just that. The Ringmaster is 5.75" from the nose to the LE of the wing - that gives Bud one good starting point. Stretch the tail to match and he will have a great Flite Streak mod.

My feeling is that the battery MUST be pocketed, preferably on the inboard side or in the wing. I like the heavy stuff to be generally centered on the fuselage and wing for clean aerodyanmics and vertical CG.

THAT's what makes a clean profile conversions such a PITA!

Fred Cronenwett · « **Reply #20 on:** May 23, 2014, 05:19:49 PM »

If you don't have the timer put in the 2.4 Ghz receiver and fly with throttle control just like you would in RC. Install the bellcrank, I fly CL scale with 2.4 Ghz controls for throttle and flaps on one model. I use the BEC function on the speed control with the Tactic 650 2.4 Ghz transmitter and 624 receiver. Then replace the receiver with the time and you are all set. Just have to hang the transmitter on your hip and operate the throttle stick by feel.

Fred

Mark Mc · « **Reply #21 on:** May 26, 2014, 04:47:43 PM »

Quote from: Dennis Adamisin on May 14, 2014, 10:16:22 AM

Bud:
Here's some thought starters - the Conversion Kit I designed for the Brodak Ringmaster, I think it could be adapted to the Flite Streak. The pack is centered on the fuse and on the wing, it requires a reinforced notch about 1/2" deep in the LE plus a little swing clearance for the 4Sx2200 pack. The side of the battery box captures the LE so the resulting front end structure is stiffer than the average profile.
Forgot to add, the Ringmaster conversion kit is Brodak #BH-1937, it and the other conversions can be seen here:
http://brodak.com/electric/conversion-kits.html

Hmmm... I have a Flite Streak ARF that I stuffed this past summer and never rebuilt. The nose broke off about an inch behind the wing leading edge. I was going to rebuild it for a glow, but maybe I'll do it electric. I just happen to have all the components from the RSM .35-.40 package on hand from an electric R/C project. Since I have to re-attach the front end, maybe I should just order this kit and electrify now. Would you recommend this?

Mark

55chevr · « **Reply #22 on:** May 26, 2014, 07:08:48 PM »

There is a lot that will work with an ARF Flite Streak. I suggest you build a new profile fuselage and leave out maple engine bearers. I have used bass wood of just 1/8" plywood strip cut 1/2" wide top and bottom ... 1/16" doublers. You could lengthen the nose an inch as it might be tail heavy. This setup worked on a Tomahawk - similar model.

http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php?topic=12044.150

reply 150

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #23 on:** June 01, 2014, 08:26:12 PM »

Got sidetracked on a couple other projects. Ordered a couple batteries for the flite streak today will start figuring out best fitment when they get here.

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #24 on:** June 17, 2014, 08:30:02 AM »

After receiving my 4s 2200 packs for the Streak I was sitting there looking at it last night and just didn't like any of the methods of mounting them so I was just about to start cutting to lengthen the nose when I remembered when I raced rc touring cars we used saddle packs because the batteries didn't fit. So I looked up 4s 1100 packs and low and behold they are a little under 2 3/4" long. So I am ordering 4 of them to make 2 saddle pack sets and will mount one on each side of the fuse and parallel them for 2200 mah. Control line saddle packs...dunno why I didn't think of this to begin with. As for the 2200 packs I got, I ordered a TF nobler arf to put them in. Extra batteries good excuse to buy another plane.

Duke.Johnson · « **Reply #25 on:** June 17, 2014, 08:55:15 AM »

Please post pictures of your new set up when done. I like the idea. That would fix the problem I was having converting the Skyray35. the Skyray has a short nose too.

And I love your other idea, too. I have a few extra screws laying around. I'll tell my wife I need another new plane. She just bought me a new glider short kit for Fathers day.

55chevr · « **Reply #26 on:** June 17, 2014, 01:05:28 PM »

ARF Nobler will like the 4S 2200-s ... we have 2 of them using that battery

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #27 on:** March 06, 2015, 10:08:29 AM »

Quote from: Duke.Johnson on June 17, 2014, 08:55:15 AM

Please post pictures of your new set up when done. I like the idea. That would fix the problem I was having converting the Skyray35. the Skyray has a short nose too.

And I love your other idea, too. I have a few extra screws laying around. I'll tell my wife I need another new plane. She just bought me a new glider short kit for Fathers day.

Woohooo well over 120 days and I have not had any time at all to work on any of my planes. Did you ever try saddle packs on your Skyray?
I should be getting around to working on the Streak again in a couple weeks.

Target · « **Reply #28 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:21:26 PM »

Please post pictures of what the 2P 4S1100 packs look like if you get a chance.
Interested in having options for the next build, which will likely be the first of many electrics!

Regards,
Chris

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #29 on:** March 10, 2015, 07:10:19 PM »

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9492__Turnigy_1000mAh_4S_30C_Lipo_Pack.html

Target · « **Reply #30 on:** March 19, 2015, 06:34:25 PM »

Thanks, Bud.
Appreciate the link.

Regards,
Chris

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #31 on:** April 16, 2015, 09:51:03 PM »

Well I got a KR timer on the way and my power system.

Tacon Bigfoot10-2820-1100Kv
HobbyWing FLYFUN-40A
HobbyWing ProgramCard-For-Plane-ESC

William DeMauro · « **Reply #32 on:** April 17, 2015, 01:30:24 PM »

Hi Bud,
I think you are going to find that the bigfoot motor is going to be too big and too much motor for the Flite Streak or any plane in that size category. We have run power 10 sized motors on those such as the exceed 3015-910 and a 4s 2200 mah lipo. http://www.hobbypartz.com/86mb91-3015-910kv.html and this battery is also considerably lighter than the 2 1100 4s plus required wiring that you would need to do http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=21347 I am currently using a similar setup on a Streak except that I have the Castle Thunderbird 54 on it. Before anyone tells me I don't need a speed control that's that big on this plane, I already know that. The price was right ($10 at an rc swap meet) and I only use the plane to let other try electric or for training purposes so its good enough.

Bud Morrison · « **Reply #33 on:** April 17, 2015, 07:35:56 PM »

Will that lipo fit between the motor and wing without cutting into the wing ?

Ordered 2 of those batteries and one of those exceed motors. I have some other planes the 2820 will do well in.

William DeMauro · « **Reply #34 on:** April 18, 2015, 04:45:42 AM »

I and others here mount them on an angle. If you look at post 11 above you will see how I do it. For that type of a plane I don't get too hung up on how the battery is mounted.