Thierry,
At least how my CC ESC works, the power to the motor is turned off, but not the power to the receiver (or timer in the case of CL). I don't think the JMP-2 would rearm the ESC except at the end of the flight when the JMP-2 blips the throttle.

Of course I may have misunderstood you.

John

I just finished an Oriental arf electric a couple of weeks ago.  I went to school on John Paris' glow oriental profile which he was very competitive in Advanced and now Expert in. He really liked the performance and I have watched it fly a number of times and been impressed. With an Evo .36 it is 48 ounces dry, 52 ounces ready to launch.

Dennis writes up the one he did here and as you note there have been a lot of electrons thru his planes since he did it. . His nephew now has it and has flown it a lot and refined it a good bit. He reports it a very good flier as well and can report on his setup.

Mine also flies extremely well. I was very surprised. It corners very pretty well, exits maneuvers dead flat without any waiver and is very stable. I powered mine with a Turnigy 3536 SK at 910 kv. I would not recommend a non SK motor from Turnigy. The SK's have larger bearings and I have had failures of non SK turnigy motors in stunt applications. Rick Sawicki and Dennis both also have used this motor in light weight applications. I most usually use a 2826/12 axi in my stunters but neither the power nor the weight of the axi was called for in this project. Rick had repowered a 2826 axi powered Geiske Nobler last year with the 3526SK and it came alive at the weight change. As a comparison I fly a T-rex with authority on a 2826/12 with a 12X6EP prop on 4S. It has a lot of guts. But the Oriental is a much smaller plane. It doesn't need the power.  I use a phoenix 45 esc (again to drop weight) and 4S aerowind 2800 mah packs. I am currently turning an apc 10x5E prop a bit north of 11K rpm on 63 ft lines to yield 5.25 sec laps. Draw is under 1900 mah per flight and everything is cool temp wise. My ready to launch weight is 49 ounces so I am considerably under the flying weight of the glow version. I used the stock bellcrank and leadouts and stock horns. The flap pushrod is stock and the elevator pushrod is carbon fiber with ball joints at each end. I used carbon fiber gear. The motor mount is Rick Sawicki's design, the details are in my T-Rex build thread on this forum.  I do use CA hinges. Have used them in everything less than .60 size ships for the last 6 years and will not go back. If I were going to do any more .60 size ships I would use them there too, but I'm going to stay T-Rex size and smaller. I have had a strega electric but have found T-Rex outflies it by such a large margin I can't make sense of flying that size any longer. My personal preferences your milage may differ. I have not found any of the truisms about CA hinges to be true. Again, just my experience. Since returning to modeling both RC and CL 7 years ago I have used traditional kleet/dubro hinges and CA both in RC and CL. Only hinge failures I have had are pin type. Never once a CA one. Never saw a CA one fail on RC at our club even when done wrong.  But again that is one of those opinion things. We all can have our own.  

Anyway, its a power system that works well in the bird. I have the ground clearance for larger props because I fly on a rough grass field at home. Could go to 12 inches if I wanted but at 910 kv would not want to and can't find a need to with the bird so far. Have fun. Its a great flier!

bob branch

(edited for motor model number noted in next two posts - branch)

Thanks Dennis you are right, 3536 SK. 

bob

I'm going to resurrect this thread, as I have an ARF Oriental on the way, and, much to a old flying buddy's chagrin, I am NOT going to put a glo engine in it!!
I have a 3020-950kv Exceed Rocket motor (360w rating)that I hope to employ for the O, unless you all think it won't work.
Plan a 4S 2500 pack, 10x5 prop, and could use advice on governors and timers. I'm considering the KR timer, since I think there is a slight chance of the prop being stopped suddenly (hey, you never know, right??!), and I hear it offers ESC protection in that unplanned event

The big "concern" for me is figuring out what the best way is to-
1. Mount the motor- Front mount seems preferred and makes sense to me, but pics say radial rear would be simpler.
2. Easy battery securing, change out, and ventilation.
3. Correct CG. I read two things-
    a) Battery centered on wing LE.
    b) 1" cut out of wing LE in fuse.

I know darn well the battery isn't 2" long, so that doesn't jive in my pea brain....I'm thinking maybe the first one was with a heavier motor??

I should add the disclaimer that I DO NOT have the plane in hand, so maybe some of these concerns are going to have obvious solutions when I get it, but any advise, heads-up, or other do's or dont's from those that have been there, and done that, would be REALLY appreciated.

I posted in this old thread as it seems to have the most pictures of install (thanks Archie!), and I likely will add my own as well here when I get rolling.

What say ye?

Regards,
Chris Behm

Thanks Joseph!
How coincidental that you have the same motor in your bird.
I really appreciate the pictures, it looks like there is plenty of room in there for the components.

Are you running the 860Kv motor? I blew up the one pic, and that is what it looks like to me.
I wonder how my 950Kv will work out on 4S?
Are you running a 10x5 or a larger diameter prop?

Any other gotcha's you think I could use besides what is mentioned in this thread (like the checking for secure mounting of the main gear, etc).

Thanks for the pics, perfect!

Kind Regards,
Chris B

Thanks Joseph.
From what I have read in this thread and others about the Oriental, it sounds like this plane prefers and turns better with a 10" prop.
That being said, I'll not worry too much about it, and maybe the 950kv I have will work well anyway then.

I appreciate all the pics, I know it is a pain, but they are very helpful, and will be to others as well I believe.

Kind Regards,
Chris

Thanks again for the pictures, Joseph!

I am wondering if you have much vibration with the back wall style mounting? I'm inclined to think a front mount would be better from a vibration standpoint. Maybe I am over thinking it? Lots of RC folks use this same style of mounting, and it is clearly easier to execute. I like the way the original engine rails are used.

My ARF "O" should be arriving today, too bad I won't make it home until Saturday!

Thanks for the battery compartment pics too!

Kind Regards,
Chris

Cool seeing this old thread resurrected.

The Oriental that started this thread was originally built with a front mount, then changed to a rear mount that made it easier to try at least 5 different motors.  The "mule" also used at least a 1/2 dozen size props, 4 different ESC's 3-4 different batteries and two timers.  It was also flown with & without an Eagle Tree data logger.  We learned LOTS from this bird

Unfortunately it was crashed before we got around to the pusher prop...

I think that at least initially, I'll opt for the back mount and go from there.
In theory, if either the motor or prop is slightly off balance, I would think a front mounting would help keep it under control.
We can balance the props, less likely to do the right thing with a lopping motor (me, anyway).

I'll hope for the best.

Using to start-
Exceed 3020-950,
4S @ 2500 Lipo's,
10x5 APC E prop
ESC-TBD, thinking CC Ice Lite 50A
Timer- TBD...

I can't wait to get home and open the box with the O'....

Regards,
Chris

Good to know, thank you Dennis!

I'm a little late getting here. (I was also on vacation), but the 860 version or the 950 version are both fine. Pick one and use it. Those motors are very happy with the 11x5.5 APC thin electric pusher props on them. They are 3 bearing motors and most guys here are rear mounting them. A standard set of cheep e-bay bearings cost about $5 for that motor and some guys here have over 100 flights on the stock bearings. Like I've said a few times before Its a $20 motor don't get too hung up on the bearings. At 100 flights replace them and make the motor new again(Glow plugs usually don't last 100 flights and they cost around $5 these days) or toss the motor when they actually fail and buy a new one. Some guys here are pulling 50-53 ounce Caprice sized planes with those motors so they work for similar sized planes.

A local sun bird from Wisconsin showed up to our flying site recently with and Arftrick Oriental....with a Power 15, 4 cell. It had tons of static thrust at launch. It had been modified slightly in the rudder section but actually presented better with a 62 Ares rudder/fin. I was impressed.

I will use the normally sealed compartment above the "tank" compartment for the ESC and KR timer.
The battery will reside below that, in the normally "tank" compartment.

Each of these two areas will get its own inlet and outlet for air.
I have not yet decided if I will separate them with some 1/64 ply or not.
I might have to do a test run with and without, my guess is that most of the heat will be from the battery, and I might try to keep the ESC a little cooler if I can.

I added scoops to the cowl. This should keep the motor cool.

The outlets are a huge vent on the tank (battery) compartment hatch, and some cute little "exhaust pipes" above the engine beams for the ESC
Pics of progress.

I tried to be creative and made some mock engine exhausts that serve as outlet vents for the ESC compartment...I know, its kinda far back for a V engine! Oh well.
Pics tell the story.
I will "run" the engine by marking the inside of those exhaust pipes black with a felt marker before the maiden, I promise.

Thanks Crist-
Coming from a craftsman such as yourself, this is a nice compliment!

I'm looking forward to completing this plane and getting it in the air. I fly with a group that is pro glo power, I'm sure I will be getting some ribbing from them. However coming from RC sailplanes, E-power in C/L is a much more natural selection, and I won't have to become a motorhead.
That being said, last weekend I re-attained a couple of my old 1/2a C/L planes from 20 years ago that I had donated to a friend for his kids (which of course they never flew). Even scored a NIB .049 Medallion that he'd bought, and got back an old .19 Torpedo Green head, which I had never run.

Hope to work on the Oriental a bit more this weekend!

Thanks, Dennis!

I have a few more pics of progress.
At this point I have figured out the tank compartment installation, and the wing and tail are now glued on with CA, to be epoxied and a fillet added next. She's nearing completion! I'm a wee bit excited.

Pics of the tank area and above for the ESC. I made an extension for the KR timer. I wanted to be able to unplug the switch, and plug in the programmer, without digging out the timer from below(inverted) the battery tray. A "peep-hole" allows me to count the flashes with the battery not secured. I took the picture of the tray before this was drilled.

There will be a patch of velcro at the back of the tank compartment to keep the aft end of the battery from shifting. I might also tack a foam block on the outboard side of the fuse for it to rest on during flight.

I think this will work!

R,
Chris

Here is the battery inside the tank compartment.

Two different brands of batteries-
Hyperion 4S2800 HV(4.35V/cell)30C/60C----$42.95, free shipping over $100, 2 days transit.
260 grams.

Thunder Power 4S2700 (4.2V/cell)25C/50C---$54.92, $13 shipping from Atlanta, GA, backordered for 3 weeks. Second order cancelled.
255 grams

Guess which battery is likely to be my go-to now?

R,
Chris

Chris,
I have mine balanced at 6" from the trailing edge and I think it would corner better if it were further back like 5 3/4". But 6 should be a good starting point. I had the add 3/4 of an once on mine to get it to 6".
Hope that helps,
Joe

Correct

I flew the maiden flight of the Oriental yesterday and I am happy to report it all seemed to work well!
The wing has a substantial twist to it, and the direction was safe (rolling out), so it pulled like a mule, but flew very outboard tip down, and inboard tip down inverted. The gun and some cranking should get that sorted.

The powertrain worked perfectly. I'm very happy with that. After tweaks to the prop and motor speed, I had flown 2 one minute flights and a 2m30s flight on the TP ProLite 2700. That battery took 1108ma.
The last two flights were 2m30s each on the Hyperion HV2800 (rated at 2500 at regular voltage, and that's where I'm running it), and it took 1583ma. About 316ma/minute. So, I'm looking at 70% discharge for a 5m30-5m45s flight. I'm pretty happy about that. Average amp draw is 18.9x amps, that seems pretty reasonable.

The plane is pretty nose heavy, and the motor is not heavy. If I were to build out another ARF like this, I would definitely look towards cutting into the wing LE and making a tunnel through the fuse bulkhead at the wing LE to get the battery back some. I knew I should have done that, I'm a bit disappointed that I didn't trust my instincts building this. Oh well, next time. I'm not going to look back.

For this particular model, yesterday I hogged out some of the I/C engine bearers, and also cut open my compartment behind the tail wheel mount and put 3/4oz in there. That should help with the CG.
It might need more, I haven't measured it yet. I will work on the wing twist and try to get that worked out, otherwise the CG will be of little consequence.

I have a couple other odds and ends to do. Bush the main wheels, add the canopy, decals, etc. Its definitely a pretty plane and I can get used to not having to clean castor off of the plane! The control system is very smooth and free, I'm happy with my install as this is only my second build. And since I revamped the entire control system, I think it was worth it if I can get the warp out of the wing. It should last longer than the plane does. Learning is fun.

All in all, the ARF is a beautiful model, and a great value. I would probably try to find an ARC instead next time, just because with all the mods that I would make, its hard to keep the model pristine. Better to cover it after all is done I think, and to also have a unique looking model. Still, a great value!
I'm looking forward to flying this a lot, it should be a lot of fun.

Thanks to Joe and others along the way for all the pointers.

Another happy and successful outting with the Or Eee Ental....

We have the wing ALMOST straight now, just ever so slightly tip down....
I took off the training wheel time of 2m30s and instead set the timer to 5m30s so that my veteran flying buddy could run a full pattern with it.
He's a hard core glow fuel guy, and guess what? He LOVES the way the plane flies and corners. He gets a big kick out of hearing the "boost" from the timer after a hard corner on the square maneuvers. He's all smiles.

The plane pulls really hard. So far we have worked on straightening the wing, and added some tail weight to get the CG back a bit. I have 3/4oz back there, and with the 2500/2700 4S packs, its still a bit nose heavy.
It also has some slight hinging tendencies in the square corners, and once we get the wing flat upright and inverted we will see about moving the leadouts forward a bit. I have lessened the motor thrust to about 1.5 degrees, and its still pulls well in the overheads.

I'm replacing 1650ma to the pack after a full pattern on a 5m30s flight. Because of this economy (18a average draw), I might try a Thunder Power 2100 pack. Its about 2oz lighter and I might be able to pull that tail weight out too?
http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,40577.0.html

Anyhow, enjoying the plane and the next conversion would be a snap for me I think. Thanks for all the help.

R,
Chris

Great info, Peter...
My C/L mentor thinks we need to slow down the oriental also, and we have about a 5.0 second lap on 60' lines.
What prop are you turning? I think I have a 10x5 APC tractor on mine. I may take a few turns off of it, or maybe try a 10x4.5 wood prop.

Wow, you are running an 11x5 pusher, I'll have to check the Kv on that 15 motor you're running. It is likely a bit lower kv than mine I would guess. And I'm assuming you're running a 4s pack.
R,
Chris

Thanks Peter-

That's all very similar to what I have, although you are drawing more amperage with the 11" prop.
My motor is 950kv, I'm running a pair of 4S Hyperion 2500's and a pair of Thunder Power 4s ProLite 2700's, but I'm only putting back in about 1650ma after a 5m30s flight.
That's on a 10x5 prop.
In fact, I might drop down to the next size battery to save some grams up front, along with a smaller ESC. I think I might be able to get the 3/4oz weight out of the tail then, and maybe save @3 oz total. Then I would be in at 45oz.

R,
Chris