Author Topic: Opinion on plane to use :) (Read 1808 times)

Bill Little · « **on:** December 11, 2011, 12:44:22 PM »

Hi All,

I have spoken to Brother Denny (hard guy to catch! LOL!!) about the Electric Super Clown power train and what to use it in next.

Thoughts:

Twister (Fancherised?)

Dolphin

Other profile?

Other "smallish" stunter?

Thanks!
Bill

Bill Little · « **Reply #1 on:** December 11, 2011, 03:16:39 PM »

Hmmmmmmmmm...................

Red Headed step child here.......... 24 guys view it, so far, and no one has an opinion?? Hard to believe..............

Big Bear

Dan Bregar · « **Reply #2 on:** December 11, 2011, 03:42:14 PM »

Ok Bill

The motor you have needs to run a smaller prop, like a 8x6 or 9x4.5 So, probably not good in the Fancherized Twister. How about a Ringmaster ?

Or maybe a light Shoestring on .012 lines. Or how about the old Veco Papoose ?

Zuriel Armstrong · « **Reply #3 on:** December 11, 2011, 04:00:53 PM »

Howdy Bill,

I would try the Dolphin. Smallish airplane with a thin wing too. Should built nice and light too.

Zuriel

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #4 on:** December 11, 2011, 05:10:07 PM »

We put a Super Clown system with the smaller red motor and put it in an Oriental and in a Vector with a 10x5 prop, both were flown on 63' lines - sweet! You have the later & 50% larger motor so it will loaf in those two birds, power usage might even come down a bit. I also agree that the Dolphin would be a great match, I am on Walter's waiting list for one.

BTW the Oriental over its lifespan has been saddled up with various data loggers, batteries and what not else and flew at up to 51 oz. In its last iteration it has the right-sized battery & Phoenix 45 plus Hubin timer to fly at 44 oz - that is happier!

I'd think any of the Fox 35 sized birds that can be built around 45 oz will do just fine...

William DeMauro · « **Reply #5 on:** December 11, 2011, 05:12:40 PM »

We are using a similar motor on an ARF Flight Streak. Like others have said Ringmaster, shoestring, plus the Buster, the old Cosmic Wind, Sterling P51, Sig Acromaster, JR Nobler,a light original Tutor.

Frank Imbriaco · « **Reply #6 on:** December 12, 2011, 07:28:54 PM »

Bill,

I chose Bob Hunt's RD-1 profile design. Simple and quick to build, lightweight and sport/competition capable with an economical E-flight Power 15.
Recommend you contact him for details.

Frank

Andrew Borgogna · « **Reply #7 on:** December 12, 2011, 08:43:52 PM »

RSM P-51 electric, but I am prejudice.

Andy

Bill Little · « **Reply #8 on:** December 13, 2011, 09:14:46 AM »

Quote from: Frank Imbriaco on December 12, 2011, 07:28:54 PM

Bill,

I chose Bob Hunt's RD-1 profile design. Simple and quick to build, lightweight and sport/competition capable with an economical E-flight Power 15.
Recommend you contact him for details.

Frank

Hi Frank,

Thanks for the suggestion. Aaron has had two RD-1s. First one was foam wing, the new one is a built up wing. That's a consideration along with an original Tutor or Dolphin. Probably a built up fuselage is what things are moving towards.

Bill

Tom Niebuhr · « **Reply #9 on:** December 13, 2011, 02:33:34 PM »

"Hobo" Will make big announcement soon.

Dan Bregar · « **Reply #10 on:** December 13, 2011, 05:17:28 PM »

Ty

Where does one find plans or a kit for the Cavalier ?

Dan

Bill Little · « **Reply #11 on:** December 13, 2011, 05:56:53 PM »

Quote from: Dan Bregar on December 13, 2011, 05:17:28 PM

Ty

Where does one find plans or a kit for the Cavalier ?

Dan

Hi Dan,

Not Ty (of course) but I would check with Tom Morris.

Big Bear

Bill Little · « **Reply #12 on:** December 14, 2011, 03:31:38 AM »

Well, maybe I will take pencil and pen to some vellum and come up with a design to use this power train in a *modern* built up fuselage stunter around 48"-50" WS.

Big Bear

Avaiojet · « **Reply #13 on:** December 14, 2011, 05:33:37 AM »

Quote from: Bill Little on December 14, 2011, 03:31:38 AM

Well, maybe I will take pencil and pen to some vellum and come up with a design to use this power train in a *modern* built up fuselage stunter around 48"-50" WS.Big Bear

Bill,

I'm all for designing you're own model! Kudos. Have you designed and scratch built a CL model before?

CB

Bill Little · « **Reply #14 on:** December 14, 2011, 07:53:09 AM »

Quote from: Avaiojet on December 14, 2011, 05:33:37 AM

Bill,

I'm all for designing you're own model! Kudos. Have you designed and scratch built a CL model before?

CB

Yes, but they were kinda based off another design. Nothing *totally* my own, but different enough to see a difference.

Big Bear

John Rist · « **Reply #15 on:** December 14, 2011, 09:01:02 AM »

Quote from: Bill Little on December 14, 2011, 07:53:09 AM

Yes, but they were kinda based off another design. Nothing *totally* my own, but different enough to see a difference.

Big Bear

Since Curtis put the tail in back (unlike the Right Brothers) Most all designs have been based on past history. It's all because God invented the laws of aerodynamics - we mortals are just having fun with his creation.

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #16 on:** December 14, 2011, 09:13:59 AM »

Quote from: Bill Little on December 14, 2011, 03:31:38 AM

Well, maybe I will take pencil and pen to some vellum and come up with a design to use this power train in a *modern* built up fuselage stunter around 48"-50" WS.

Big Bear

You could toss together a Classic sized I-beam in a weekend...

Bill Little · « **Reply #17 on:** December 14, 2011, 09:30:30 AM »

Quote from: Dennis Adamisin on December 14, 2011, 09:13:59 AM

You could toss together a Classic sized I-beam in a weekend...

Brother Denny,

If I can hold up for a weekend, I could build one that quick! But, the finish would take a bit longer.

Hmmmmmmmm............ maybe a Perroquet style.

Bill

john e. holliday · « **Reply #18 on:** December 14, 2011, 10:05:05 AM »

Quote from: Dan Bregar on December 13, 2011, 05:17:28 PM

Ty

Where does one find plans or a kit for the Cavalier ?

Dan

AMA Plans Service. Cavalier by John Simpson, 51 inch span, $20.00, AMA Plan #50118. If I remember right/read right, order a second of same plan for half price. Check it out.

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #19 on:** December 14, 2011, 11:53:05 AM »

Quote from: Bill Little on December 14, 2011, 09:30:30 AM

Brother Denny,

If I can hold up for a weekend, I could build one that quick! But, the finish would take a bit longer.

Hmmmmmmmm............ maybe a Perroquet style.

Bill

How about a 90% USA-1 (USA-7/8th?) then MONEYCOTE!

Dan Bregar · « **Reply #20 on:** December 14, 2011, 04:36:09 PM »

Thanks Doc !

Bill Little · « **Reply #21 on:** December 15, 2011, 04:56:09 PM »

Quote from: Dennis Adamisin on December 14, 2011, 11:53:05 AM

How about a 90% USA-1 (USA-7/8th?) then MONEYCOTE!

Brother Denny,

Don't think I haven't considered a smaller USA-1. I have a 7/8 Impact profile I did about 15 years ago and it is a surprisingly good flying model w/ a Byron Barker OS .40FP!

Maybe 85% which will give a 51" WS. (Jap Tissue, polyspan, light silkspan, but never
$ cote.

)

Big Bear

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #22 on:** December 15, 2011, 07:22:20 PM »

Actually a clear finish with the red & blue stripes would be really cool & LIGHT!

builditright · « **Reply #23 on:** December 17, 2011, 05:29:52 PM »

The Dolphin sounds good, watch for the kit...

Bill Little · « **Reply #24 on:** December 18, 2011, 10:03:38 AM »

Quote from: William DeMauro on December 11, 2011, 05:12:40 PM

We are using a similar motor on an ARF Flight Streak. Like others have said Ringmaster, shoestring, plus the Buster, the old Cosmic Wind, Sterling P51, Sig Acromaster, JR Nobler,a light original Tutor.

Hi WIlliam,

I missed the *Jr. Nobler" listed. I have a brand new one with a Fox .15X, it has a total of 4 lights on it.

Now: what would I have to do to put the electric system in the nose? Cut out the maple mounts? I could engineer it myself, but the nose might fall off on the first flight!

Bill

William DeMauro · « **Reply #25 on:** December 18, 2011, 08:21:03 PM »

Bill,
You would have to cut the maple mounts to make it fit. But after reading through this post and reading what Dennis wrote (he is the expert on these motors) I think that the Jr Nobler might be a bit on the small side for that motor seeing that he has used it to pull an Oriental. Is it the 2815-09 that you have or the 2820-07 or something else?
William

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #26 on:** December 18, 2011, 08:30:55 PM »

Quote from: William DeMauro on December 18, 2011, 08:21:03 PM

Bill,
You would have to cut the maple mounts to make it fit. But after reading through this post and reading what Dennis wrote (he is the expert on these motors) I think that the Jr Nobler might be a bit on the small side for that motor seeing that he has used it to pull an Oriental. Is it the 2815-09 that you have or the 2820-07 or something else?
William

The 2815 is a 3.5 oz motor. The pack that comes with the Super Clown is 8.75 oz. The Jr Nobler is something like 250 square inches - this combo don't look good my friends!

Bill. this power system is like the strongest 35 you have ever had - select & build accordingly! (the new Airon would have been a GREAT app)

Dan Bregar · « **Reply #27 on:** December 19, 2011, 04:31:37 PM »

Is it the BH-1850 or the BH-1838 mtr. ? Obviously by my previous post I thought it was a smaller motor running on 3S. If it's the 2815 mtr like I've been flying all season on my Magician on 4S, then it's too much for a Jr. Nobler and probably too much for a Super Clown. But Dennis knows for sure since he set up the systems, and he set me up in the spring with the 2815/09 which is beautiful on a 11X5.5 cut down to 10 1/2" dia. Gobs of power on 0 % Nitro. My 4S2200 is set up for uniflow and the mtr. never skips a beat.

William DeMauro · « **Reply #28 on:** December 19, 2011, 05:35:00 PM »

I too thought he had a setup for a smaller sized plane when he says "smallish stunter" so I started thinking of smaller planes. because these motors are pretty versatile sometimes its easier if we just know exactly which motor you have, then it's easier to make good suggestions. I messed up on the JR nobler. It didn't belong on my list. I have a 2820-07 and wouldn't hesitate to use that on anything that requires a 35-46. I will probably end up using it on a Twister,Banshee or Original Tutor. My son and I are currently working on a Twister.

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #29 on:** December 19, 2011, 05:36:45 PM »

Guru Dan speaks wisely! Brodak carries TWO versions of the 2815 motor and 2 versions of Super Clown motors:

* BH-1850 is the original "Red" motor. It measures out as a 2811, that is it is 4mm shorter & less powerful than the later Arrowind 2815 for the SC (more on that later). THis is the first motor I had installed in the Oriental in some iterations pulling over 50 oz of airframe. It works great with a 10x5 but labors with an 11x5.5 prop. Later I also modified a Vector to take this motor. This motor is designed to be front mounted (in the nose ring) but it has akind oif an oddball mounting pattern unlike any other motor out there.

* John B still had a sizable inventory of Super Clowns - with the odd mounting pattern already drilled - when his source for the red motor dried up. We needed new thin packs to fit in the wing and , we had to come up with a special version of one of the Arrowind 2815 motors. BH-1838 is the Super Clown motor from Arrowind - the one Bill has. It has a kv=1300 and is intended to fly with 3 cell packs like the 3S x 3300 slim pack that fits inside the Super Clown wing. This motor is also designed to be front mounted. Based on the esperience with the original red motor in the Oriental, we are excited that this new motor which is 4mm longer and the kv rating is in a more usable range - should be quite a bit more powerful and should be comfortable with an 11x5.5 prop - which echoes Dans experience with...

* BH-1843 is a different version of the 2815 that Dan uses on his Magician. It has kv=920 and is intended to use 4 cell packs, like the 4S x 2200 that serves Dan well while saving about .75 oz versus the 3S x 3300 pack. Dan uses this motor with 10" - 11" props which is a good match. This version (and all the other Arrowind motors) is also designed to be rear (firewall) mounted. This really comes in handy, especially on a profile!

All this is why I say the Super Clown system based on the Arrowind 2815 (BH-1838) is like the strongest 35 you ever saw - and perfect for "Classic" sized airplanes...

Bill Little · « **Reply #30 on:** December 19, 2011, 06:05:20 PM »

Thanks,Brother Denny!

I will see what happens with all this. I do not want to use it in another profile, been there done that (at least wen we get to take it out and fly it! LOL!! ). I am leaning towards a full fuselage stunter. Thinking along the lines of a Dolphin. WE haven't had one, and it is something we want to build. I figure in the electric game it is sorta like the IC game, doesn't hurt to have a bit too much power....

BIG Bear
AMM

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #31 on:** December 20, 2011, 05:50:07 PM »

A Dolphink would be great. I think thwere is room to slide the battery in from the FRONT with the no-cowl nose. It will call for some creativity on packaging some of the stuff but that is the way I will be going if/when I build mine.

Meanwhile I still have not figgered out how to stuff a pack in the Barnstormer!

bob branch · « **Reply #32 on:** December 20, 2011, 06:03:47 PM »

Dennis

Individual single cells. Just stuff em in here and there and wire them together!

bob branch

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #33 on:** December 20, 2011, 06:41:13 PM »

Quote from: bob branch on December 20, 2011, 06:03:47 PM

Dennis

Individual single cells. Just stuff em in here and there and wire them together!

bob branch

That will be the plan if we ever get to A123 cells - build them in!

I think the "normal" IC powered Barnstormer must have a vertical CG issue with the motor jug sticking up so high. I would like to center the pack on the wing - but that is also directly bechined the motor, no room at all. I have looked at angling the battery like you & Rick have done, but it does not look too good either.

bob branch · « **Reply #34 on:** December 20, 2011, 06:43:27 PM »

Dennis

Build a belly pod!

bob

Bill Little · « **Reply #35 on:** December 22, 2011, 04:00:09 PM »

Quote from: Dennis Adamisin on December 20, 2011, 05:50:07 PM

A Dolphink would be great. I think thwere is room to slide the battery in from the FRONT with the no-cowl nose. It will call for some creativity on packaging some of the stuff but that is the way I will be going if/when I build mine.

Meanwhile I still have not figgered out how to stuff a pack in the Barnstormer!

Hi Brother Denny!

Have you tried cutting back into the wing and moving the BC back ala Billy and Bob? it does work very well as I guess you know.

BIG Bear
AMM

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #36 on:** December 22, 2011, 04:42:32 PM »

Quote from: Bill Little on December 22, 2011, 04:00:09 PM

Hi Brother Denny!

Have you tried cutting back into the wing and moving the BC back ala Billy and Bob? it does work very well as I guess you know.

BIG Bear
AMM

That is ALREADY part of the plan! Is Billy Bob part of your local RMM chapter?

Bill Little · « **Reply #37 on:** December 22, 2011, 06:19:46 PM »

Quote from: Dennis Adamisin on December 22, 2011, 04:42:32 PM

That is ALREADY part of the plan! Is Billy Bob part of your local RMM chapter?

They are Honorary Life Members of the AMM, the RMM is a local chapter of the AMM.

BIG Bear
AMM

Steve Fitton · « **Reply #38 on:** January 05, 2012, 10:31:11 AM »

How bout a Patternmaster? That mighty e power setup should pull it fine!

In all seriousness, I like the suggestions of a small I beamer. Isn't the Argus really teeny?

Use all nitrate and tinted silkspan for the finish. Not only will it save weight and be easy to work with, all that nitrate will result in a spectacular blaze if the battery ever catches fire in the plane!

Bill Little · « **Reply #39 on:** January 05, 2012, 10:59:45 AM »

Quote from: Steve Fitton on January 05, 2012, 10:31:11 AM

How bout a Patternmaster? That mighty e power setup should pull it fine!

In all seriousness, I like the suggestions of a small I beamer. Isn't the Argus really teeny?

Use all nitrate and tinted silkspan for the finish. Not only will it save weight and be easy to work with, all that nitrate will result in a spectacular blaze if the battery ever catches fire in the plane!

HI Steve,

The Argus I built and have posted here has a 49" wingspan and weighed 36 oz. RTF. It is smaller than the '59 Ares and probably the smallest I-Beam of renown that I know of.

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM