Crist
You can get everything directly from Igor the timer is 100 Euro the Jeti spin 66 is 120 and the Jeti box you can get here in the US from http://www.espritmodel.com. Ask Igor for the timer with accelerometer. He usually has those in stock. The ESC's he has to get directly from Jeti.   

Thanks guys.
Spent my vacation time checking out locations where we might retire next year.  I missed being at the Nats!

The manual says:
Following picture shows regulation line and all ESC settings in blue color.
I see a green color Or am I color blind?

Greetings Robert-Jan

Do I have to use the Spin 66? or could I use the Spin 44 for my smaller models?

Hello Chris, timer works with any ESC with governor, but most of heli escs are slow. They have low pass filters, you must use some which is quick enough. The best I found is SPIN. Even SPIN PRO is slow, because they did not copy "heli 3D" mode from old SPIN. Slow reaction means that while timer already needs to brake, esc is still keeping high rpm, what is the last thing you want. The timer is tested with SPINs so I recommend to use spins. Also timer and also SPINs both use the same program box, so it is good solution. You can test other ESCs but I think you will be disapointed. However is you can find some usefull, we will be thanksfull :- )))) .. I did not and I have full box of different escs which I cannot use :-)))

The Spin 60 does not seem to be available in the USA.  I tried the Spin Pro but as Igor stated it does not work well with his Timer.  I could buy it from Igor but money exchange and shipping add a lot to the cost.

Linheart

Hello Chris, timer works with any ESC with governor, but most of heli escs are slow. They have low pass filters, you must use some which is quick enough. The best I found is SPIN. Even SPIN PRO is slow, because they did not copy "heli 3D" mode from old SPIN. Slow reaction means that while timer already needs to brake, esc is still keeping high rpm, what is the last thing you want. The timer is tested with SPINs so I recommend to use spins. Also timer and also SPINs both use the same program box, so it is good solution. You can test other ESCs but I think you will be disapointed. However is you can find some usefull, we will be thanksfull :- )))) .. I did not and I have full box of different escs which I cannot use :-)))

Here's a comment.  This is exactly the comment you'd get from me if you called me up to hire me as a consultant on your control-system project.  You'd get it for free in the initial phone call, but if you said "lets run with it", in the back of my head I'd be rubbing my hands gleefully over the billable hours to be logged:

Depending on the behavior of any given ESC, you could defeat, or partially defeat, such a low-pass filter by putting some lead (i.e. some derivative, possibly band-limited) into your speed command.

The downsides are that (1) it would have to be tuned to each model (and possibly software load) of ESC, (2) if you got it wrong you could easily get some nasty high-frequency oscillation that may or may not be fixable for any given ESC, (3) the 'fix' could easily be subject to saturation, which could lead to hard limit cycles^* that would lurk in your system until some particularly violent maneuver or blustery day, then start causing problems at a contest, and (4) whether it would work at all would depend on the details of how a particular ESC does its low-pass filtering.  Since ESC software is generally written by software engineers, and since software engineers can sometimes cook up some appallingly bad signal processing algorithms^**, you can pretty much expect that implementing this measure on any given ESC will have a result ranging from phenomenally good to phenomenally bad.

Personally, if I were in your shoes I wouldn't want to touch it with a ten foot pole -- but if it avoids a problem that you don't want to touch with a twenty foot pole, then you know its out there.

* A "Limit cycle" is mathematician's way of saying "oscillation": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limit_cycle.  I use it here because it's more precise when you're talking about nonlinear systems.  A "hard limit cycle" is an oscillatory mode that doesn't start up until something happens to excite it -- think of a pendulum clock that needs to be started after winding, or an old car with loose steering that doesn't start shimmying until you hit a pothole.

** This is why I wrote a book for software engineers on implementing control systems, in fact.

This reminds me of the old exam question of how to find the height of a building with a mercury barometer.  I'd just ask the guys who made the ESC for block diagrams of each mode.

The whole thing reminded me of a conversation I had with one of my more practically-oriented profs when I was an undergraduate.  The gist of which is that rather than trying to maneuver around a poorly-built plant, you should fix it.

In this case that means sticking to ESC's that don't have that lowpass feature, or that allow it to be bypassed.

In my experience, if you happen to be working with one of the sorts of software engineers that designs poor signal processing algorithms through ignorance, you pretty much have to get the entire code base and plow through it -- and even then, if there's two things that are interacting that shouldn't, you sometimes can't find out about it without schematics and/or test articles, and lots of sweat.

Which is really just another reason that having, and sticking to, a list of known-good ESCs is the way to go.

Helicopter pilots swear by the YGE ESCs.

I just ordered 3 new types, I hope they come soon, but biggest problem with heli ESCs is, that they usually do not allow brake in governor mode, and F2B rules need well working brake.

We will see.

May be I can tell what I did NOT try and which can work, for example Schulze F2B and TMM "X" version. The first was not available when I wanted to try it and second lok promising, but when I had chance, the software was not doing what I wanted (it was too fresh) and it is more expensive then Jeti anyway. However the second has in flight brake, so it can be quicker then Jeti.

Good point, and another reason for you to make a stunt ESC.

I've got other, stinkier, fish to fry.

If there's anyone out there that wants to take up the overall circuit and software design responsibilities and just let me push them around on the details, I'd be happy to share expertise.

Maybe using ESCs designed for muti-rotors with external governor is the key

This is from castle:

Multi-Rotor
Multi-Rotor throttle types operate similar to Airplane throttle types, but the throttle input signal is filtered in a different manner.  This setting allows the ESC to change the throttle OUTPUT at very fast rates. Improper, or rapid, throttle advance can lead to excessive ESC current spikes and ESC failure!  If throttle input is rapidly changed at low load RPM, brushless motors can draw excessive current while accelerating the rotor and propeller which will quickly lead to both ESC and motor failure! This mode should only to be used in proven systems or by qualified system experts.  Endpoints: <1.11ms Arm/Motor Off, >1.89ms Full Throttle.

External Governor
External Governor is used when an external electronic system is being used to control the ESC throttle input in an attempt to maintain a specific RPM.  From a stopped position, output power will slowly advance limited by 'Spool-Up Speed'.  Once a steady rpm to throttle condition is detected, the ESC will give complete throttle control to the external system and allow throttle to change at very fast rates until the next time the ESC throttle input is moved to the OFF position.  As a result, improper throttle inputs (after the initial spool-up period) can lead to excessive ESC current spikes and ESC failure!  Also note that, once full throttle control is given to the external system, rapid RPM changes are possible.  This can pose a risk of dangerous, uncontrolled RPM increases in response to commands from the external system.  Endpoints with Auto-Rotate disabled:  <1.11ms Arm/Motor Off/Reset slow spool-up, >1.89ms Full Throttle.  Endpoints with Auto-Rotate enabled:  <1.0ms Arm/Motor Off/Reset slow spool-up, 1.0-1.11ms Motor Off, >1.89ms Full Throttle.

Regards  

Hi Gang,
That's why I went back and forth with the folks at Castle (a few years back now!) and the response speed, both the basic ESC and the governor loop, can be adjusted over a nice wide range compared to the original heli-only needs.
And Howard ... nobody gives up anything resembling what they think is their secret sauce.
I was forced to speak in imprecise terms through two different Marketting intermediaries (good folks nonetheless) in order to make our needs clear.
Still, with patience and a little spit, an elephant and a flea ...

take care,
  Dean

Now maybe you can understand why I made my external governor timer. It was my attempt at offering anyone a simple way of getting constant rpm to fly stunt without breaking the bank. I get regular requests for building a C/L esc, or getting the Chinese esc manufacturers to just "modify" their existing esc's to do what my system does et. etc. Like Igor says, they will do this for you......how many thousands do you want?? I also have a flying buddy named Henry, who designs control system like Tim does, and he has offered to give me the basic design for an esc to work from. I would love to do this but it will only be done as a learning experience to understand more about exactly how brushless motors work. Even a simple timer system like mine has taken years to fine tune (ask Andy Borgogna) and get to the point of being made well enough to sell, so to tackle an esc for only C/L would be not be financially viable. Even just the initial outlay for the design and prototyping would be substantial.

The other request I also get is to add a sensor for active regulation like Igor has done. Why would I want to do something like that?? Igor has already done this......very successfully as well! I don't want to speak for Igor, but I know that it took around 4 years of development to do this and Igor could never recover that sort of cost in monetary terms. I am extremely happy with the support that I've had with my timer system, and it works well enough for the vast majority of us, and certainly as well or better than most IC power packages.

Keith R

Exactly, but I am happy that I did it, I learned so much about c/l flight mechanics, that it was worth of that :- ))) It was eye opening :- P

This is definitely something that you should do because you want to enjoy the experience, or because you want to donate your work to the modeling world, not because you'll get your money back.

How about out of patriotic zeal for the glory of the American stunt team?

At least one third of which is, well, kinda odd?

Have you checked your email yet?

Thanks for doing the research Igor.

Jose, he is just poking fun at his buddy, Howard.  Howard is clearly singled out as the "odd" one in this conversation.

Tim hope your not discounting a naturalized AMERICAN, as an American that you would not help.
Please tell me I'm wrong.

Jose -- you need to visit Howard's basement.  Preferably with someone who knows what bodies are buried, and can talk Howard into going into detail.

That's all the more I'm gonna say.