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Author Topic: I/C vs. EP  (Read 726 times)

Offline andreas johansson

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I/C vs. EP
« on: August 01, 2009, 02:02:45 PM »
Hi guys!

I have read sometimes that E-CL is ALMOST as good as I/C. What is it with E-CL that isn't as good as I/C from a technical standpoint? For myself, I think E-CL is wonderful, and its working very good for me.

Please guys, no flamewar now. Lets have an open minded discussion and without the need for me to put my army issued flak jacket on.

Andreas
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Alan Hahn

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Re: I/C vs. EP
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2009, 03:55:35 PM »
Well one thing for sure is that our reflexes deteriorate with EP. No more running out of the pilot's circle when the engine quits during just after the last loop in the clover--because the fuel runs out.  HB~>

Also you lose the ability to make excuses about the engine run.  n1

So your skill set (of excuses) will begin to deteriorate. No where to hide mediocre piloting skill ( :'( )

Offline Leester

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Re: I/C vs. EP
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2009, 04:09:17 PM »
I know what you mean about the engine run stuff  HB~> HB~> Crist keeps reminding me that I wouldn't have that problem with E/C   LL~ LL~
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: I/C vs. EP
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2009, 08:26:59 AM »
Well there will be a whole new set of excuses coming out of the circles with E-power.  In St Louis this year it was too cold and erractic runs.  I can also see/hearing battery lost charge.  Timer went bad.  Didn't charge long enough.  And I know there will more as time goes on.  Right now it is not feasable for me to go electric even tho I tried until I found out my order was lost.   R%%%%DOC Holliday
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Alan Hahn

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Re: I/C vs. EP
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2009, 08:49:02 AM »
Well there will be a whole new set of excuses coming out of the circles with E-power.  In St Louis this year it was too cold and erractic runs.  I can also see/hearing battery lost charge.  Timer went bad.  Didn't charge long enough.  And I know there will more as time goes on.  Right now it is not feasable for me to go electric even tho I tried until I found out my order was lost.   R%%%%DOC Holliday

I am not sure what cold has to do about it. I have flown electric with snow on the ground. A lot easier than with glow. The only thing is that you should keep the batteries at a reasonable temperature until you are ready to fly. That is easy enough to do with styrofoam "coolers" (are they "heaters" in the cold??  ;) )

Now of course we all have excuses (some more than others!), but that doesn't depend on our motive force!

Offline andreas johansson

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Re: I/C vs. EP
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2009, 08:55:44 AM »
Why does people have excuses at all? It is FUN to fly, right?  :)

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Offline Keith Renecle

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Re: I/C vs. EP
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2009, 01:54:48 PM »
Hi Andreas,

This is a very good question, so I will give you my own "1 years experience" point of view. I think that everyone already knows and understands just why a good, consistent engine run is vital for a really good stunt performance. If a glow engine is slightly off the correct setting, then you will most likely have a rich or lean run, and not achieve the power required. This is true especially in rough conditions, where you certainly need a good engine run. What's good about having an over-sized engine, like a .75 or so, is that you have excess power, and can get away with a lot more if the setting is not perfect. However, the rich or lean setting is still a problem, because of over or under running of the time allowed. Any competition person will readily admit that winning means having total confidence in yourself and the equipment.

With EP you immediately have the confidence of knowing that you can have a consient engine....sorry.....motor run. If the rpm is a bit off either way, then with a good governor system, it really does not make a huge difference, because you will still have solid power at the different rpm. The other important point is that you can repeat this setting easily regardless of weather changes. I have flown in a few serious competitions where you have to fly directly after a thunderstorm, and trying to figure out how to get the engine run and time sorted out, is a nightmare.

As far as power and control go, I believe that electric stunt is as good or better than any I/C engine set-up. If this not true, then why do so many top fliers use electric? Ask Kim Doherty, Bob Hunt, Igor Burger, Paul Walker etc. if they find that EP is any way inferior to I/C. With the price of the batteries coming down through the years, and the performance going up, I believe that E/P will be THE way to go in a few years time.

I must admit that I threw myself into the deap-end when I flew in the last world champs with my first electric stunter. It just felt so good and solid in the rough European weather. If the weather had stayed cooler, the motor would have worked for the whole contest. The motor, rated as a .28 glow, swung the APC 12 x 6 E prop in my 1.9 kg. stunter with such authority, that I did not believe the MVVS factory specification. When the weather warmed up, I burned out 2 of these motors, but just the taste of this sort of silent power, gave me enough inspiration to carry on, and now I have a fairly decent set-up that continues to improve.

The other really neat thing that I enjoy, is the data that is available electronically with data recorders like the Eagle Tree stuff. When you think of getting power data from an I/C engine, then this is a lot more difficult. How many data charts have we all seen from I/C engines in stunt models through the years? I know Scott Bair did this years ago, but that was with some serious bench testing, and not in the air.......as far as I remember. To improve performance, you need the feedback data, and with electric power, this is a lot easier.

I still enjoy my engines.......including my diesels, but EP is another good way to fly and certainly in no way inferior.

Keith R
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Offline Dennis Toth

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Re: I/C vs. EP
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2009, 10:13:26 PM »
Interesting question, I've been flying ECL for a little over a year and find that basically it is the same as a "good" IC setup. Power is power and more power is always better than less but consistant power matched to a good airframe trumps all. ECL is that consistant type of power. We are just beginning to develop designs that are ECL first not converts. The advantages that ECL have are in the details. You can easily adjust the CG on an ECL ship by shifting the battery thus eliminating trim nose or tail weight. You can easily use reverse rotation props that give an extra feel of confort on outside corners. You can easily do short test flights to dial-in the trim with the motor at its full consistant power setting. You can use lighter finishing material that stay looking fresh and new without oil getting under it. No smell or mess to clean up (unless your grease handed IC flying bud picks up your ship) so less complaints from your other half, maybe even more time with them. One of the biggest is freedom to fly in local areas without noise problems. This allows ECL guys to practice more and that's what will win contests.

Best,               DennisT


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