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Author Topic: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?  (Read 1724 times)

Offline Dennis Adamisin

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Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« on: October 16, 2007, 10:01:16 AM »
Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
Does anyone have an EXPERIENCE with the Electri-fly Rimfire outrunners?  They seem to have a LOT of motors to choose from, with different kV ratings within any given size and with several compatible/interchangeable mounts - meaning you can set up on one motor and swap out several others 'til you get the "fit" you are looking for.  They come with a rear mount and prop adapter but they can also be turned around with the addition of a collar style prop driver.

They are also "fiscally feasible"; that is they (and I) are fairly CHEAP!  Thus, for the experimenters they seem to have a lot to offer, but wondering if anyone has any direct longer term experience with them in CLPA or RC?  RC Universe had a "knock" on the park flyer sized motors - apparently the set screws in the prop driver are not consistently torqued down, so folks were losing props.  Electri-fly has issued a Tech Notice on their website too:

http://www.electrifly.com/index.html


Thanks in advance for your responses!
Denny Adamisin
Fort Wayne, IN

As I've grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake!

Alan Hahn

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2007, 11:43:09 AM »
Dennis,
No experience with the Electri-fly, but I am building up some with the Scorpion Brand. Here is a link to their distributer
http://www.innov8tivedesigns.com/
What I like is that for most (if not all) of the motors, you can look at a table and see how they perform on a variety of electric props and standard lipo setups. At least it allows you to get in the ball park.
By the way, the Brodak stock motor has no retaining screw (it isn't needed the way we mount the motor at the nose--because the prop is pulling the motor together, not apart). However if you take the motor off, you can pull it apart. It is only the magnetic field holding the two parts together. So if you go for  firewall mount, you should check to make sure that the retaining screws or clips are attached to the back of the motor.

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2007, 12:22:00 PM »
Looks good. I found one motor which is very similat to Dualsky XM 4250/6 which worked well with my A123 batteries: 42-50-800

I will try to find some distrubutor here.

Offline Will Hubin

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2007, 08:50:03 AM »
     I have been working with Rimfire motors for many months, first on a test stand and recently in an ARF Flite Streak (intended for use as a primary trainer). The motor currently on the Flite Streak is a 35-30-1450kV Rimfire.
     I replaced the Flite Streak’s single-tire landing gear with a long, far-forward gear that uses two 2 ½” tires. On 46-foot lines, the plane takes off very readily from thick grass and flies 5.5 second laps on only about 12 amperes (about 120 watts). On my test stand, the longer version of this motor (35-36-1000kV) will absorb 400 watts, turning a 10x5E APC at 11,000 RPM.
     I haven’t tried to compare the efficiency of these outrunner Rimfires with, say, the Axi motors, but they are smooth and powerful—and available with a good price and a good warranty. I’ve not had any problems with them.
     I’ve used the Rimfires with the Electrifly ESCs (also sold by Tower) and my own timer/controller. The Electrifly ESC provides only the choice of brake on or off. The common timer/controllers, I believe, will not work with the Electrifly ESC because it requires a non-standard handshake sequence before it will power up. It requires a sequence of a few seconds at minimum throttle (1 millisecond pulse width at about 50 Hz), a few seconds at maximum throttle (2 ms pulse width), and then another few seconds at minimum throttle. It has been simple, however, to incorporate this sequence into my timer/controller.
     My timer/controller uses an 8-pin microcontroller, a small potentiometer (pot) to control idle time (minimum RPM after the pushbutton is pushed, currently from about 2 to about 60 seconds), another pot to control flight time (currently from about 1.5 to 6.5 minutes), and a third pot to control the maximum power (currently from about 75% to 100% power). I also modulate the power to provide some compensation for the power/RPM reduction as the battery discharges, based on test-stand data. My controller uses a professionally-made circuit board, measures about 1” x 1.5”, and weighs about 0.3 oz.
     Another advantage of the Tower/Rimfire system, including the motors, the ESCs, and the Triton II balancing charger, is that they are all compatible with each other, without having to solder any connections (like the Brodak Super Clown system, with which I have also been using my own timer/controller, dating from before the Brodak Fly-In).

Alan Hahn

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2007, 11:03:16 AM »
It would be interesting to hear more about your timer controller too! Maybe a new thread.

Offline Dennis Adamisin

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2007, 06:28:05 PM »
Will:
I see that was your first post - WELCOME to the Hanger!  H^^

I second Alan's request for a stand-alone thread on that very capable-sounding controller of yours.  Can you also tell us more about the Flite Streak - battery, prop, etc. 

The two Rimfires you mentioned are two I have been looking at for different projects.  In fact I have been messing with a 35-36-1200 (nothing of note to say yet)
Denny Adamisin
Fort Wayne, IN

As I've grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake!

Offline RandySmith

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2007, 10:18:15 AM »
Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
Does anyone have an EXPERIENCE with the Electri-fly Rimfire outrunners?  They seem to have a LOT of motors to choose from, with different kV ratings within any given size and with several compatible/interchangeable mounts - meaning you can set up on one motor and swap out several others 'til you get the "fit" you are looking for.  They come with a rear mount and prop adapter but they can also be turned around with the addition of a collar style prop driver.

They are also "fiscally feasible"; that is they (and I) are fairly CHEAP!  Thus, for the experimenters they seem to have a lot to offer, but wondering if anyone has any direct longer term experience with them in CLPA or RC?  RC Universe had a "knock" on the park flyer sized motors - apparently the set screws in the prop driver are not consistently torqued down, so folks were losing props.  Electri-fly has issued a Tech Notice on their website too:



Hi Dennis , they do have a large selection, you may want to take a look at the Quantum series motors I sell  as they are also very "fiscally feasible"  ;D
Plus they have a very large selection in the sizes we would use, and have AXI equiv. motors , they look to be good quality.

this is from my Vendor post

Pro-Peak Prodigy ll processor controlled charger $89.00
Astro Flight electric motor handbook $15.95
AFI Whatt Meter for setting up engines $49.95
Wattage direct current meter $45.00

NEW  Quantum Brushless motors

Quantum 2814/05  (equiv. to AXI 2814/10 ...$42.00
     "       2814/06  (equiv. to AXI  2814/12)....$44.00
     "       2814/08  (equiv. to AXI 2814/16 )....$46.00
     "       2814/09   (equiv. to AXI 2814/20)....$48.00
     "       2820/04   (equiv. to AXI 2820/8).....$51.00
     "       2820/05   (equiv to AXI  2820/10).....$54.00
     "       2820/06   (equiv to AXI 2820/12).......$56.00
     "       2826/04   (equiv to AXI 2826/8)........$56.00
     "       2826/05   (equiv to AXI 2826/10).......$56.00
     "       2826/06   (equiv to AXI 2826/12)........$56.00
     "       4120/05   (                             )........$82.00
     "       4120/06   (equiv to AXI 4120/06).........$82.00
     "       4120/07   (equiv to AXI 4120/18)........$82.00

              AXI MOTORS
AXI 2826-8 motor $98.00
AXI 2826/10 motors $98.00
AXI 2826/12 motors $98.00
E-Flite power 32 motor $89.99
E-Flite power 25 motor $84.99
AXI prop shaft and mount kit $15.00
               
         
         PolyQuest NEW 20 Li-Poly Packs                             
               
    Item Price
4000 mah 14.9 v 4 cell pack $149.00
4400 mah 14.9 V 4 cell pack $169.00
CALL for other cell pack prices
Li Poly balancer guards $13.90
Deans Hi amp connectors CALL for price
Zigras ZTRON timers C/ L $30.00
Castle Creations Phoenix 25 ESC $75.00
Castle Creations Phoenix 35 ESC $95.00
Castle Creations Phoenix 45 ESC $109.00
Castle Creations Phoenix 60 ESC $129.00
Castle Creations Phoenix 80 ESC $149.00
Castle Creations USB programmer $24.95

Randy   www.aeroproduct.net

Offline Will Hubin

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2007, 03:42:05 PM »
Props: I've used the 8x4E APC, the Graupner 8x4 CAM (Hobby Lobby), and the HLAN2924 8.5x5 (Hobby Lobby) mostly.

Batteries: Initially NiMH because I trying to make a trainer that doesn't use crash-sensitive LiPo. The Electrifly 1100 mAh ($20) is marginal but may work with shorter lines. The 2000 mAh (also from Tower, at $30) certainly works, for 5.5 sec laps on 46' lines. LiPo do give longer flights and less weight. But I've just bolted on the 35-36-1000kV (same bolt pattern as the 35-30-1450kV) and found that it turns up about 11,000 RPM from a Tower 2100 14.8V LiPo (in my backyard), on an APC 9x4.5E prop. If Les Nering is willing, we'll check it out tomorrow. (This last setup weighs 28 oz with the 8 oz battery.)

I've been flying a second, beat-up ARF Flite Streak on an Atlas 2909/20 with some of the same props. It also works, using Hobby Lobby's NiMH batteries.

Timer/controller: I plan to check and confirm compatibility of my timer/controller with the helicopter mode of the Jeti ESC (the one recommended for the AXi motors), and then probably make it available as a lower-cost alternative to the ones now available. It is relatively easy, in principle, to make a microcontroller generate the output expected of the throttle channel on a radio receiver (a signal that goes from 0 to 5V for 1 to 2 milliseconds every 1/50 second or so).

Throttle/emulator/test stand controller: I've made a little box that connects to the BEC of all ESCs and that generates such a signal, based on the rotation angle of a small potentiometer; it can be used to program ESCs, to test a motor in a plane, and to test a motor on a test stand (presumably while measuring the current and voltage with something like Medusa Research's Power Analyzer +. A great way to play in winter!

Offline Will Hubin

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2007, 05:51:30 PM »
Les says he'll fly in any weather, even snow. But it was just 43F this morning.

The Flite Streak with the 35-36-1000kV flew a little over 4 minutes with the Electrifly 4S 2100 mAh battery, with a lap time of 4.42 to 4.52 sec/lap, with plenty of power for the maneuvers. It could use longer lines, evidently. Recharging took only 1160 mAh so it could have flown a good 5 1/2 minutes without exceeding 75% of battery capacity. It looks like a viable powerplant for stunt!

The second, old Flite Streak was a lot of fun to fly on new 41-ft lines. With a 1700 mAh Hobby Lobby NiMH battery, it was recording 4.9 second laps. It could have flown up to a little more than 4 minutes on that battery -- or four 1 minute flights for introductory lessons.

Offline Will Hubin

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2007, 02:44:34 PM »
Waiting out snow and high winds, Les and I finally found a day (after it warmed to 40 degrees) for testing the Rimfire 35-36-1000kV with longer lines (56 ft, eyelet-to-eyelet). The result was completely successful—5.0 second laps with plenty of power for the full pattern. (Because the new Flite Streak turned out to have a slightly warped wingtip which caused it to have extra line tension upright and weak line tension inverted, I put the motor on my two-ounce-heavier old Flite Streak (30 oz).

I’ve also made my timer/controller and a test stand driver/throttle emulator available to others (new threads).

Offline Will Hubin

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Re: Electri-fly Rimfire Motors?
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2007, 08:04:27 AM »
I have checked that a Phoenix ESC will control an Electrifly motor in the constant RPM (heli) mode.


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