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Author Topic: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner  (Read 1779 times)

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« on: November 22, 2009, 01:15:51 PM »
I have wanted to build a Baby flite streak for years.  I learned to fly with a combat kitten and then flew a Flite Streak with a Fox @ my first NATS in 1986 @ Lake Charles.  With Uncle Dennis doing all of these ECL, conversions, I really wanted to help out.  So I asked for a Baby Streak and a few weeks later, the USPS fairy dropped one off with an Arrowind 2040 2200Kv in-runner.  

Building the baby Streak was quite easy.  The laser cut kit was very nicely done.  All parts fit nicey.  The wood was pretty nice too.  With using the in-runner, I had to make only (2) changes to the plans for the conversion:

1.) Add a battery box in the outboard wing.  I achieved this by removing the shear web between the center rib and 1st rib.  I then added a 1/8" vertical grain balsa shear web 1.5" behind the spar to use as a battery stop.   I then used 1/32" hard balsa on top and bottom to seal the box.  I then planked as normal.  I sawed the LE from the center rib to the 1st rib and sanded flush with both ribs.  I made the bix fit a 3S Rhino 1050 pack.  

2.) Used a dremel and sanding drum and ground a hollow in both motor mounts to sink the motor in from the inboard side.  I then glued a piece of 1/16" ply on front to tie the front together and act as a stop for the motor.  

The motor and ESC are then held in place with tie wraps.  The battery is a friction fit in the battery box.

RTF weight is a bulky 10ozs.  I plan to fly on 42' of 0.008" lines.  The 2040 2200Kv turns a 4.7 x 4.2 prop @ 19,200 RPM on 3S @ 10 amps.  Should be a quick little bird.  I expect to go with smaller batteries for weight savings.

Enjoy,

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, indiana
« Last Edit: November 24, 2009, 09:03:04 AM by Archie Adamisin »
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY

Offline Jim Moffatt

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2009, 03:01:08 PM »
Excellent work Archie!  H^^  Very interesting to see an inrunner. Please keep us posted on how it flys. I'd especially like to know lap times. I use 40' and typically run 3.8 sec with my Baby Clown.  Your plane came in 1/2 oz under the Baby Clown, thats a real accomplishment. Also please post weight with the smaller batteries.

On the BC I use the mini Deans polarized connectors and have found they handle 12 or slightly more amps with no problems. Having multiple connector types is a pain but I found them to be worth all the bother. They are well matched to 1/2A sized planes.

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2009, 10:35:24 AM »
Jim,

I asked for an in-runner as I have been testing a few Turnigy 2040's with great success.  There is a bit of a weight penalty, but the performance has been really good on the bench.  It also made for an easy conversion so it really was a no brainer. 

According to my spreadsheets, I should be able to break the 3.0 sec barrier on 42'.  The 4.7 x 4.2 is the lightest of my 4.7 diameter props.  I have up to 7.8 pitch in that diameter.   VD~

I have put the batteries on a diet by removing the 5 inches of 12ga wire and deans ultra plug and replaced with 16ga and GWS plug.  I then removed the shrink wrap and replaced it with (1) layer of Kapton tape.  This reduced the packs to 2.8 ounces.  I then removed the Towerpro 18amp controller and replaced with Turnigy plush 10 amp controller.  This saved another .5 ozs.  So I am 1.25 ozs lighter.  Nothing like removing 12.5% of the RTF weight.

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, Indiana
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY

Offline Jim Moffatt

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2009, 01:01:07 PM »
Sounds excellent! At that weight it should be a real "fireball".  H^^ H^^.
I'm sure you are aware that motor calculators and spread sheets always lie!
I always do every conceivable calculation I can and then throw them away as soon as I start flying the plane.

With 40 to 42 ft the fastest lap I can get with my Baby Clown is 3.3 sec. And at that speed my battery only goes 3 1/2 min before governor sag. I cant imagine faster.

I cant wait for the next episode!

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2009, 09:58:15 AM »
Jim,

I have had pretty good sucess predicting lap times using the spreadsheet, but I agree, it is still a guess. 

I hope to have a flight report today if mother nature cooperates.  I programed a JMP-2 timer for 85% for 1.5 minutes and then increasing to 100% over the next 1.5 minutes.  3:00 total flight. 

I went to order some 700mah 3S packs and they are out of stock.  so, it will be my 1050's until I can get some lighter packs.  Should still fly fine.

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, Indiana
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2009, 05:33:59 PM »
Well, the Baby Streak flies.  WOW is it fast!!  3.2 sec/lap on 42' lines.  Flew level and symmetrical.  I need to adjust spacing to get the control response I want, but all in all a great (3) flights.  I couldn't get over how well it took off and landed with the single wheel.  It was off the ground in 3 feet and my first landing it rolled (1) lap after touchdown.

I would like to play with props, but this conversion worked great.  I used 440 mAh for a 3-minute flight.  The JMP-2 timer worked perfect.  The motor was cold after the flight as was the battery and ESC.  I flew it with all the heavy stuff just to see if the aiframe would fly at the heavier wing loading.  Reducing the weight will help move the CG back a bit to make it turn a bit tighter.  There was no tendency to stall at all in hard corners, but I would like to have a bit more control at that speed.

This conversion will work for many 1/2a's with beam type mounting.  I highly recomend it to anyone looking to do a 1/2 A conversion easily. 

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, Indiana     
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY

Offline Mike Gretz

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2009, 08:45:57 AM »
I like it!!!

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2009, 02:58:32 PM »
Flew the BFS again today with quicker controls and a 5.25 x 4.75 prop.  Flew good, but was slower than the 4.7 x 4.2.  It didn't slow down as much in the turns though.  Used 542 mah for a 3 minute flight.  Static current @ 85% throttle was 13.5 amps.  I will continue to collect data.  I am going to go and remove the heavy ESC lighten the batteries as I discussed earlier.  I will report hopefully agian this weekend if the weather holds.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!!

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, Indiana
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY

Offline Dennis Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2009, 03:07:10 PM »
Yeah Arch3 flew the Baby Clown and said he could do BETTER!   f~ 

His inrunner conversion looks like it is even easier thant the outrunner installations in this size bird.  I'm hoping the weather is clear on the day of the family Christmas Party - and that he brings it along. 

Hmmmm, maybe I should have a surprise waiting; the old age & treachery vs youthful exuberance...  >:D
Denny Adamisin
Fort Wayne, IN

As I've grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake!

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2009, 07:59:59 PM »
Well, I have put the BFS components on a diet and was able to save an appreciable amount of weight.  I reduced the ESC weight from 28 grams to 12 grams.  I reduced the battery weight from 98 grams to 80 grams.  I replaced the Towerpro 18 ESC with a Turnigy Plush 10 amp ESC.  I then removed the shrink wrap and heavy ga wired from the Rhino 3S 1050 pack.  I also cut the balance wires off and shortened them by 75%.  I then soldered on a JST connector with 16ga wire.  I wrapped the pack with Kapton tape to insulate it.  It moved the CG back over 1/4" and reduced the total weight to 9.3 ounces.  I originally posted that the RTF weight was 10 ozs.  I rezeroed the scale and it was actually 10.5 ozs before the mods.  Maybe it gained weight because of flying?  (Probably not ???)  There may be another 5 gram savings in removing the spinner, but I am using it to help keep from bending the shaft.  On a nose over or hard landing,the spinner will bottom out on the nose ring and take the blow.  I used this same technique on my Speed 400 racers and never bent a shaft.

As for the Adamisin Christmas Challenge??  BRING IT ON BABY!!!!!

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, Indiana       
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2009, 03:48:59 PM »
Flew the BFS today with the lightening mods.  What a difference.  I added a fair lead on the pushrod as I was getting some pushrod flexing that washed out the controls.  The lightening moved the CG back 1/4" and it now flies like a Flite Streak should!!  It turns on a dime.  I did 4 leaf clovers, 3 leaf clovers, overheads, vertical 8's, inside and outside squares.  Consecutive loops were a blast.  Lazy eights whipped up to blistering speed.  Don't really care about the wind up as in this sort model, it makes it a blast to fly.

I got (2) 3:00 minute flights on one charge.  I used 750 mah total for both flights.  Lap times were 3.0-3.15 sec/lap.  Lines were 42' 0.008".  This thing takes off and lands on the single wheel like a real stunter.  WHAT A BLAST!!!

Next step is to get a video.  It is going to be cold this weekend, but I will get a video as soon as I can. 

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, Indiana. 
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY

Offline bfrog

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2009, 06:46:46 PM »
Archie,

I found these batteries at http://cheapbatterypacks.com/?menu=A86A2A0F9D&sid=64671

They are listed under 18/27C packs so I am a little confused about the 12 C max rating but if your only drawing 11 or 12 amps it shouldn't be a problem. I've found that the Rhino/Hobbycity packs seem to be a little heavy.

They look really good for what you are doing and might even be a little lighter than what your using if you strip them down like you did to the Rhinos. Price is good too, only $15.95 ea .

Here's their specs:
Capacity:   1100   Length   Width           Height          Weight         C     maxC
Category:   HPS   2.76in   1.46in   0.71in   2.82oz   10   12
Cell Size:       70.00mm   37.00mm   18.00mm   80.00gm   Volt   Cells
Chemistry:   Lipo                                                               11.1   3

Bob
Bob Frogner

Offline bfrog

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2009, 06:52:16 PM »
Where is the source for the Arrowind in-runners? I did a search and could not find anything in the US. Is there a website that has some specs????

Thanks
Bob Frogner

Offline Archie Adamisin

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Re: Brodak Baby Flite Streak ECL Conversion using in-runner
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2009, 06:56:43 AM »
Bob,

The source for Arrowind motors in the US will be Brodak.  I know they don't sell direct. 

I know that the HC batteries are a bit heavy, but for the price, I don't complain.  I can get 3S 750 packs for $7 ea.  Turnigy makes 2030 & 2040 in-runners as well as Ammo motors from GP.  I have (2) Turnigy 2040 motors.  (1) 2080 Kv and the other 4850 Kv. 

Here are the available Arrowind 2040 in-runners:

Arrowind 2040-24 (This is what I am flying with an APC 4.75 x 4.2 S400 Prop)
2200 Kv
12A  ESC
0.5 A no load
9 A max current
205 mΩ resistance

Arrowind  2040-16
3340 Kv
18A ESC
1.2 A no load current
14 A Max Current
77 mΩ Resistance

Arrowind  2040-15   
3600 Kv
18A ESC
1.3 A no load current
15 A Max current
75 mΩ Resistance

Arrowind  2040-13   
4200 Kv
18A ESC
1.6 A no load current
17 A max current
49 mΩ resistance

Arrowind  2040-10   
5340 Kv
18A ESC
1.8 A no load current
18 A max current
32 mΩ resistance

I think you could safely go to the 3340Kv with a 4.5 x 4.1 prop, but the others are either EDF or gearbox motors.  You may consider for the weight savings to go to the 2030 motors as they would have plenty of power and save another 0.5ozs.  The following motors are available:

Arrowind 2030-23
3850 Kv
12A ESC
0.7 A no load
9 A max current
161 mΩ resistance

Arrowind  2030-19
5100 Kv
12A ESC
1.6 A no load current
11 A max current
94 mΩ resistance

Arrowind  2030-16   
5750 Kv
18A ESC
1.8 A no load current
13 A max current
73 mΩ resistance

All these motors are 2 pole.

Archie Adamisin
Muncie, Indiana
 
Archie Adamisin
Burlington, KY


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