News:



  • June 20, 2025, 03:29:17 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Author Topic: Sizing electric planes - general procedure  (Read 2419 times)

Offline Matt Piatkowski

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 740
Sizing electric planes - general procedure
« on: October 04, 2015, 06:03:05 AM »
Hello,
Is 2826/10 or/12 Cobra equivalent to about 50 size ICE like Magnum XLS 52 or rather like Magnum Pro 45?
Is 2820/12 Cobra equivalent to about 40 size ICE like OS Max 40 or rather like EVO 36?

I have now the Black Tiger 4250C and it suppose to be equivalent to 61-74 ICE like EVO 60NX, Jett60 and ROJett 74.

What I am looking for is some kind of general procedure to size properly my future electric planes.

I know that power can be used to compare engines and motors but, what is quite common these days, the glow engines manufacturers and sellers frequently massage the performance data to impress the potential customers and generate more sales. The static ( on the ground ) power of ICE with certain prop can be calculated using the RPM and torque but measuring the torque requires the test device that I do not have. I can certainly build such simple test device and use the electronic kitchen scale to measure the pair of forces and the distance between these forces to get torque but perhaps there exists another method. 

Somebody most likely asked this question before and the answer is somewhere on Stunthanger.com.

Where is it?

Thanks,
Matt

Offline PerttiMe

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • ******
  • Posts: 1182
Re: Sizing electric planes - general procedure
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2015, 07:11:58 AM »
Comparing just engines to motors doesn't really work. ESC, prop and battery need to be "in balance".

The answer is here:
http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,12044.100.html
I built a Blue Pants as a kid. Wish I still had it. Might even learn to fly it.

Offline William DeMauro

  • 21 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 800
Re: Sizing electric planes - general procedure
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2015, 09:07:30 AM »
I agree
Comparing just engines to motors doesn't really work. ESC, prop and battery need to be "in balance".

The answer is here:
http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,12044.100.html
AMA 98010

Offline Fred Cronenwett

  • 2016 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 2093
    • Lafayette Esquadrille
Re: Sizing electric planes - general procedure
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2015, 04:56:05 AM »
Cobra motors have a great set of charts available on how much power and RPM with different props that can be used to help size a motor to a model

But the method I use is watts per pound of model, the rule that has proven to work is to have 100 to 150 watts per lb of model, so if I have a 10 lb CL scale model I need 1000 t0 1500 watts of power, then I am good shape.

Then I look at the prop size to make sure it can clear the ground and other parts of the plane if is a twin. Some motors are designed to spin small props while other motors spin larger props. I really don't care about the RPM since I am flying with throttle control.

I ignore the name they give the motor. The battery, propeller and motor combination will determine performance

Fred
Fred Cronenwett
AMA CLSCALE7 - CL Scale
Model Aviation CL Scale columnist

Offline Tim Wescott

  • 25 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 12895
Re: Sizing electric planes - general procedure
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2015, 12:01:47 PM »
The rule that I have memorized is 7 watts/ounce on average and 11 watts/ounce peak.  So about 120W/lb average and 180W/lb peak.  That's for a stunt plane.  The better motors list an average current draw and a maximum; that plus the battery voltage will give you an idea of whether you're on track.  Some motors do the math for you and list average and maximum power; just be aware that the rating is for their maximum number of cells, not for just any old number (motor power is more or less determined by it's ability to shed heat, and nearly all the heat is generated by current passing through the motor -- so without getting way to complicated for humans, the more "honest" rating is current).
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Target

  • C/L Addict
  • 2019 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 1692
Re: Sizing electric planes - general procedure
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2015, 10:17:44 PM »
Matt-

I pondered the same thing as you did when I got my ARF Oriental and wanted a motor for it.
The safest way is to look through the setup thread, and pick either the same exact motor as someone else used in the same plane (or same size and weight plane), or use a motor that has about the same weight characteristics.

A few observations-

Most folks use a 4S pack for .35-.40 glow sized stunters. A Kv about 860 to 950 should work for those voltage packs, with the higher KV favoring a smaller prop and the lower favoring a larger one.
Some people are using 5S and 6S packs in their larger planes.

A decent rule of thumb is the motor weight should be about 10% of the RTF plane weight (6oz motor for 60oz plane) and be capable of running at 150w/lb continuously.

My example can be found in the "Shocking the Oriental" thread originally started long ago when less people flying electric. I picked a fairly small motor, an Exceed Rocket 3020-950kv, it weighs about 4.5oz. My plane is flying at 48oz, and uses 1650ma from a 2500 4S pack during a 5m30s flight, turning a 10"x5" APC prop. It has plenty of power, and is only drawing an average of 19 amps.
Coincidentally, another pilot with the same plane and same Exceed Rocket 3020 motor, but this one a 860kv, chimed into the same thread, before I got the maiden flight handled. He's using a 11"x5.5" prop with the lower KV, and says his setup works great as well.
I think my motor is only rated for @ 360w, but it works great flying the plane, putting out about 19A x 16(?)V = 314W...
Sooo, at the 48oz weight I'm flying at, I am only using an average of 105w/lb. I'm sure that withe the KR timer I have set to the #4 gain setting, its putting out a little more juice in the climbs, but it seems pretty miserly on the electrons to me.
I hope some of this info is helpful to you.
Good luck in your electrification.
Regards,
Chris
Regards,
Chris
AMA 5956

Tags: