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Author Topic: Smoke is bad, right?  (Read 958 times)

James_Mynes

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Smoke is bad, right?
« on: September 20, 2013, 04:13:57 PM »
Shouldn't an Arrowind 35A ESC last more than 20 flights?
I let the smoke out of it today.  :(

Offline John Cralley

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2013, 04:34:18 PM »
Smoke is BAD for sure! The most likely reason for smoking an ESC is that you have somehow exceeded the AMPs that it can handle.

If you are using one of Brodak's electric component package deals, I would contact them with the particulars and see if they will replace the ESC.
John Cralley
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James_Mynes

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2013, 05:05:17 PM »
It was the second flight of the day. I actually turned the RPMs down last week, and haven't touched the settings since. When I plugged the battery in for the second flight I heard a snap and saw smoke from the ESC. I immediately unplugged the battery and put it in the shade for about 20 minutes. Then I plugged it into my charger and it showed 100% on all three cells. It took about 10 minutes at 0.5A for all three green lights to come on, indicating full charge.
I don't think I can ask Brodak to replace it. When I got home I unhooked everything and took the ESC off, hooked the power leads to a 12V lead acid battery, and the rest of the smoke came out. Then I took it apart as much as I could (without using a hammer) and found a small burnt pinhole near the center of both front and back circuit boards.
Obviously one of the components failed. Not being an electronic wizard, that's all I can say with any confidence.

Offline RC Storick

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2013, 05:05:53 PM »
Shouldn't an Arrowind 35A ESC last more than 20 flights?
I let the smoke out of it today.  :(

I have found that smoke is very bad and they don't work without the smoke in them. I have not figured how to put the smoke back in anything with out new parts.
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Online Dennis Adamisin

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2013, 06:51:32 PM »
What John C said.  Call or write Brodak, tell them what happened.
Denny Adamisin
Fort Wayne, IN

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Offline Doug Moon

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2013, 07:28:00 PM »
I had that happen recently.  I plugged in the battery and it made the beeps and everything initialized just like it should.  I stepped back about 20' and began to start the throttle.  At 10% throttle the rotors should start to spin.  This time nothing happened as I passed that mark.  About ONE SECOND later I heard it, a "pop" and flames shot out one side of the model.  I immediately hit the throttle shut off and ran over to it stopping a few feet short just in case it flared up again.  It was smoking out of the top of the canopy but no flames.  I let it sit for quite a while before trying to handle it. 

Further inspection later revealed the problem.  The outrunner motor had a bad bearing and it would wobble on the shaft.  It was barely noticeable.  If the side of the motor touched the inside while trying apply throttle it would not spin.  The electricity had no where to go but the esc and it let go.  I was advised by several different people from several different sources that when I replace the ESC I should replace the motor as well.  Pinpointing the exact problem in those systems can be difficult and risky if you haven't found all of the problem and proceed forward.  I would have never found the bad bearing as it was not something I would have thought to look for.  The guy who did find it showed it too me and now I know what to look for. 

I would recommend you replace the motor as well.  Sure would be a bummer to plug in your new ESC only to hear the very same "snap" sound, or worse start a fire.
Doug Moon
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Offline Curare

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2013, 08:09:14 PM »
Sorry to hear you've let the smoke  I've toasted my fair share of ESC's, it's a bit of a given. Maybe you need some of this

Greg Kowalski
AUS 36694

James_Mynes

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2013, 05:44:45 AM »
Doug, I don't think the motor is the culprit. The snap I heard was immediately upon connecting the battery. I didn't get the little tune or the prop wiggle, just a snap and some smoke. Then, with everything disconnected and 12v applied, more smoke.
I'm not saying it's impossible that the motor is bad, just that I doubt it played a part.
I guess I'm not giving up glow power just yet.

Offline Dean Pappas

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2013, 03:39:59 PM »
Magic smoke is good, after all it's what makes them fancy parts work, but you're supposed to keep it inside the parts.
Greg, isn't Lucas "prince of darkness" electrical smoke of the exotic positive-ground type?

later,
  Dean
Dean Pappas

James_Mynes

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #9 on: September 23, 2013, 05:20:23 AM »
What John C said.  Call or write Brodak, tell them what happened.

Dennis,
Thanks for the advice. I called on Saturday, Patty said she had to check on something and would call me back. On Sunday she called and wanted my address so she could send me a new one. I think she dropped your name as the person she had to consult with.
Brodak's customer service gets an A+ in my book!

Online John Rist

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2013, 06:41:53 AM »
A KR timer will protect the speed controller against the bad bearing in a motor.  Their is no cure for infant mortality, or random failure in a speed controller.  However with a KR timer you can use a cheep speed controller and the sting is less.  I understand that this setup does not provide data logging however most sport flying doesn't need it.  Also the KR timer will work with expensive speed controllers also.  Just turn off the rpm control in the speed controller and let the KR timer do it's thing.  That way a bad motor will not destroy your expensive speed controller.
John Rist
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Online Dennis Adamisin

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #11 on: September 23, 2013, 09:29:20 AM »
Jim:
Could you check one more thing?  I have a Super Clown with a prop adapter that can just barely bottom out against the motor case, not enough to lock it up but enough to rub - learned to make sure that the prop adapter was not pushed all the way back when I tightened the prop.

In my case it would turn smooth but it was not free-wheeling.  If there is a rub, you wil get a current spike at start-up that could give you some grief.
Denny Adamisin
Fort Wayne, IN

As I've grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake!

James_Mynes

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2013, 01:15:04 PM »
Jim:
Could you check one more thing?  I have a Super Clown with a prop adapter that can just barely bottom out against the motor case, not enough to lock it up but enough to rub - learned to make sure that the prop adapter was not pushed all the way back when I tightened the prop.

In my case it would turn smooth but it was not free-wheeling.  If there is a rub, you wil get a current spike at start-up that could give you some grief.

Dennis,
I just double checked the prop adapter, it's not rubbing. When I installed it I saw the possibility of interference there, and used a .010 feeler gauge behind the prop adapter to give it some space. There's very little end play on the shaft, almost undetectable by hand/eye. Pushed in, there's still clearance behind the adapter.

Offline Curare

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2013, 04:07:25 PM »
Magic smoke is good, after all it's what makes them fancy parts work, but you're supposed to keep it inside the parts.
Greg, isn't Lucas "prince of darkness" electrical smoke of the exotic positive-ground type?

later,
  Dean

Dean, yeah the prince of darkness indeed. I currently own a classic mini that has some 'disturbing' electrical isues.

Not suprising when all lucas electrics work on three settings; Dim, intermittent and off:D
Greg Kowalski
AUS 36694

Offline John Hammonds

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Re: Smoke is bad, right?
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2013, 05:25:17 PM »
Loose Unsoldered Connectors And Splices.

The Lucas motto: "Get home before dark."

The other three switch settings--SMOKE, SMOLDER and IGNITE.

And finally Why do you think us English drink warm beer? Lucas made refrigerators too.

TTFN
John.


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