stunthanger.com
Electric Stunt => Gettin all AMP'ed up! => Topic started by: Crist Rigotti on December 14, 2015, 09:23:25 PM
-
OK guys, time to start another stunter. This one will replace the Legacy 40 that I crashed this year.
Some vitals:
Average Wing Span = 56 in
Wing Area = 581 sq/in
Wing Aspect Ratio = 5.28
Flap Area Ratio = 16.8%
Tail Ratio = 27.9%
Tail Aspect Ratio = 4.6
Target weight = 50 oz
Motor will be a Cobra 3515/18 740Kv
Battery will be either a Thunder Power 5S 2700mah ProLite or a 5S 2450mah Zippy Compact
The ESC is a Jeti Spin 44 using Igor Burger's Active Timer
Here are some pdf's of the preliminary drawings.
The wing will be a Lost Foam type and be covered with Monokote along with the flpas, stab, and elevators. The fuselage, fin, and rudder will be covered with 2/10 CF and SIG dope will be used per my usual practice.
Enjoy the drawings!
12-17-2015 - Added a more detailed full sized drawing to the DL list.
-
Very nice. Do you load the battery from the side?
Um, regarding your vitals, if the wing span is 56 inches and the wing area is 581 square inches, the aspect ratio is 5.40. Aspect ratio is defined as span squared over area. As for the "volumes", they appear to be flap area / wing area and tail area / wing area. Tail volume is something else. There is no such thing as flap volume.
-
Very nice. Do you load the battery from the side?
Um, regarding your vitals, if the wing span is 56 inches and the wing area is 581 square inches, the aspect ratio is 5.40. Aspect ratio is defined as span squared over area. As for the "volumes", they appear to be flap area / wing area and tail area / wing area. Tail volume is something else. There is no such thing as flap volume.
Thanks Howard.
No, top load.
I'll double check the A/R calc again. The trouble is that the wing tips have a taper to them so what is the real wingspan....usually less. i think I figured it out to about 55.375 in.
Concerning volumes, that's what I call them. I changed them to read ratios. Yes, flap area divided by total wing area. Same thing for the tail. Yes, tail volume is really different from Ted's article if I recall correctly.
-
I'm doing the Lost Foam wing jig first. I glued the template drawings to 1/16 ply with 3M 77 spray glue. I usually have a 3/4 ramp into the LE and a 1 ramp off the TE. The LE ramp is angled at 30 degrees and has a 1/8 radius when it hits the LE. I do this to aid me when I cut the foam. This method allows the cutting wire to flow freely into the rounded LE of the airfoil. I also made the TE a little thicker (about 1/32) at the tip due to the wire having to travel slower when cutting. The slower moving wire has a tendency to "undercut' the foam slightly more than the rest of the airfoil. Especially with 1# foam. This jig is made with 2# foam.
After the airfoil is cut out the foam is sanded smooth and the LE flash is rounded off. The cradles are then sanded and trued if need be. These were right on the money!
Then I copied the rib locations to the foam to be cut into individual rib jigs. The cradles will be glued together and the the rib, spar, and TE sheeting will be drawn onto the cradles. Stay tuned.
-
Hi Crist, I haven't frequented the forum lately. Just saw the demise of the L-40 Sorry !! Good luck on the new plane, I'll keep an eye on your progress... Merry Christmas and Happy New Year !!
Leester, Bear and Helga !! BTW GO HAWKS !!
-
Thanks Lee, hope you and Helga have a Merry Christmas too!
I did some more work on the LF jig. I cut out the individual templates for each rib, transferred the spar. rib, brace and TE sheeting onto the jig. I also smeared some glue on the edges of the templates. I also cut out the LE buck and glued it to 1/2 plywood base. I tried a novel way of clapming down the foam to the plywood. My bench has some holes for the fuselage jig and I used them to lace some #64 rubber bands through and kept in place with a small length of dowel then held down on the other side with a pin. Worked out great!
-
I added a more detailed full size plan set to the OP.
-
I finished smearing the glue and sanding the LF jig blocks. They are ready to start making ribs.
The LE buck is dry and I made up 2 LE sheets. Each is made up from a 2" center piece and 2 3" end pieces. The center sheet is cut from a 4" wide 1/16 A grain 5.8# balsa sheet. This allows the grain to run parallel to the LE so it will wrap around it without any problems. The end pieces are made from 8# balsa. The "taper" is cut from each end piece. I have the grain running parallel to the spar. So the taper is cut where the end piece meets the center piece. I feel thus gives me the most strength. The 3 pieces are joined using thin CA glue as per Bob Hunt's method. One the glue has cured, the LE sheeting is then sanded with 220 grit and a sanding bar. A quick hit with the vacuum and there are ready to be molded.
I soak the LE sheeting in hot water in the bath tub. No ammonia used at all! I let the sheeting soak for at least 45 minutes. Then the excess water is rubbed off and the the sheet is blotted on both sides with a paper towel. Time to go on the LE mold. I use 2 pieces of masking tape about 3" longer on each side about 4 inches in from the end of the sheeting. I then place the mold in position and then pull up the root side of the sheeting onto the mold. Sorta rolling the sheeting onto the mold. I then use the tape to hold it into position. Then I do the same near the tip.
I use 4" wide bed sheet material to wrap the sheeting to the mold. This won't mar the sheeting like an ACE bandage will. (Thanks to Al Rabe for this tip.) I start at the root side and have the end of the wrap on the bottom of the mold then I start winding. I have the end on the bottom so it doesn't mar the balsa. The far end of the 4" wrap is secured to my bench with a short piece of maple motor mount and a spring clamp. I proceed to wrap the mold with about 50% overlap keeping the bed sheet material nice and smooth. We don't want to mar the balsa. When I reach the end of the wrap and there is more balsa to be wrapped, I use a piece of masking tape to secure the end of the first wrap and start a second wrap just like the first. The second wrap is secured with masking tape also. The whole thing will be left out in the sun fro a few days to dry real good. Then the second LE sheeting will be molded. I found out if you pull the sheeting off the mold too soon, it has a tendency to "open" up and not be the true shape that we want it to be.
-
8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
Marcus
-
Crist, you sure do great work. Will be keeping track of this one.
-
Thanks John.
Been cutting out ribs and such. Pictures and more on Monday.
-
I use 4" wide bed sheet material to wrap the sheeting to the mold. This won't mar the sheeting like an ACE bandage will. (Thanks to Al Rabe for this tip.) I start at the root side and have the end of the wrap on the bottom of the mold then I start winding. I have the end on the bottom so it doesn't mar the balsa. The far end of the 4" wrap is secured to my bench with a short piece of maple motor mount and a spring clamp. I proceed to wrap the mold with about 50% overlap keeping the bed sheet material nice and smooth. We don't want to mar the balsa. When I reach the end of the wrap and there is more balsa to be wrapped, I use a piece of masking tape to secure the end of the first wrap and start a second wrap just like the first. The second wrap is secured with masking tape also. The whole thing will be left out in the sun fro a few days to dry real good.
Thanks for the bed sheet tip.
I won't be putting anything out in the sun, though. If you leave something out in the sun here, it just gets wetter.
-
Cool radio, does that get FM?
MM
-
Cool radio, does that get FM?
MM
It's a 1936 Philco 60B radio that I restored electrically and the also redid the cabinet. It receives AM and SW only. No FM.
-
I've been cutting out ribs, making LE and TE, and molding the 2nd LE sheeting. I made up my spars using 8# 1/16 balsa. Getting close to start assembling the wing.
-
Like those spars. Can you post a close-up of one of the ribs.
-
Cool construction. It took me awhile to figure how you get the ribs onto the spar.
-
Hi Crist. I admire your radio restoration. I'm also into restoration of Heathkit and other old ham radios.
Floyd
-
Like those spars. Can you post a close-up of one of the ribs.
How's this? More pictures in a few posts down.
-
Thank you Howard. I've used this type of construction before but never used wing mounted LG. This one will have the LG in the wing.
-
Hi Crist. I admire your radio restoration. I'm also into restoration of Heathkit and other old ham radios.
Floyd
Thank you. I don't know if you are aware of it, Brett Buck does this stuff too! It is a nice change of pace and it is a great feeling to hear a 70 year old radio play again! I have years worth of radios to restore. My next "radio" project will be a B&W TV from the early 50's.
-
OK, lots got done today. I finished the prep work and started building the wing. Left side first then the right side.
First thing I wanted to show you guys was the jig & fixture I use to notch the spars for the ribs. I built a sliding fixture that I hold the spar against either for a straight cut or an angled left or right cut. The saw is a cheapie Harbor Freight saw. It is cheap but gets the job done. In reality it is pretty gutless. The blade is 1/16 wide and I set the height to 1/4 inch above the floor of the fixture. The hardest part is making sure you cut the correct angle at each rib location.
BTW, If this looks like a Morris Millennium type of construction, you're right. But it has my take on it. I might call it the Lost Millennium wing construction. I used the Lost Foam jig to cut out the ribs and the jig blocks to build the wing. The LE does have a 1/16 sheet running from root to tip. This 1/16 is wider that the standard Millennium construction. This is when the wing is ready for the LE sheeting, I plan on cutting off the 1/4 inch Millennium LE, leaving the 1/16 and then go back to the Lost Foam jig to glue on the molded LE. I'll let you know how it works out. I did take the left wing panel and placed it in the LF jig and it fit perfectly. I know what you're asking. Why didn't just go with the LF construction? Well my foam near the TE has a very small scallop to it. About maybe 1/32 inch. Guess I'm out of practice of cutting foam. I think also that the foam is 2# stuff and I hurried the wire ever so slightly, which produced the small scallop. Morris Millennium wing give dead straight TE.
I taped down a full size drawing of my wing to my building glass. The TE jig blocks are glued to the glass using medium CA. The ribs are then put into the spars by sliding the spar through the large hole in the middle then the rib is rotated to its position on the spar. You'll notice that the spar location is marked on each rib. When all the ribs are on the spar except the root and tip ribs, the ribs are inserted onto the TE. Each rib has a 3/32 slot cut into it for this. The 3/32 comes from 3 layers of 1/32 balsa with the middle layer going cross grain and skipped at each hinge location to form the hinge slots.
Then the ribs are positioned on the 1/16 LE again using 1/16 slots. The 1/4 inch large balsa "LE" are used only to help keep the LE straight and also fits the jig blocks. I made the 1/16 LE sheet 1/8 inch wider than normal so I could pin a 1/8 square against the 1/4 balsa. This is my "locator" for the LE of each rib. Once the ribs are glued to the LE 1/16 sheet it was removed. I'm sure the pictures will make this a lot clearer.
I then make sure the ribs are positioned and that the TE are up against the 1/4 balsa. Then the TE are glued with medium CA and a Teflon tube to control the amount of glue used. Then the LE is glued. On to the spar. It is glued to the root and tip ribs first. Then I used a straight edge to align the spar so it is nice and straight. I also check it it is vertical. The the top of the spar is glued. I then pull the wing panel from the TE jig blocks and turn it over to get the bottom. The TE is inserted into the jig blocks and the LE jig blocks are weighted down as before. The TE then the LE are glued then the spar is straitened and glue like the top side. The wing panel is flipped over and the wing is sanded lightly with a long bar sander and the TE sheeting is glued on using Pica Gluit. The it is flipped back upside down to get sanded and the TE sheeting added.
That's where I'm now. I also have the LG mounts epoxied and drying over night. Those will go in tomorrow and the LE sheeting will be added.
-
More pictures.
-
One last picture of the shop. Enjoy.
-
Wow! That is a really cool construction method. Can't wait to watch this build thread. Thank you for taking the time to document everything!
-
Back to the radio for a minute, beautiful job on the chassis restoration. Were you able to restore the dial or is that a reproduction? I am sure it never looked that good when new. I have a similar-vintage Zenith in a stand-up cabinet that produces beautiful sound, on AM and SW. All original, though the tubes have been replaced from time to time. Bought it for $5 at a rummage sale around 1960.
Oh, and the model is pretty impressive too. Nice touch building in the trailing edge partial ribs in advance, never thought of doing it that way. Your shop is too clean to be real, must be a retouched photo.
-
I'm lovin'it!!!
Marcus
-
Back to the radio for a minute, beautiful job on the chassis restoration. Were you able to restore the dial or is that a reproduction? I am sure it never looked that good when new. I have a similar-vintage Zenith in a stand-up cabinet that produces beautiful sound, on AM and SW. All original, though the tubes have been replaced from time to time. Bought it for $5 at a rummage sale around 1960.
Oh, and the model is pretty impressive too. Nice touch building in the trailing edge partial ribs in advance, never thought of doing it that way. Your shop is too clean to be real, must be a retouched photo.
Thank you.
The dial is a repro from Radio Daze. The original was broken.
Be careful playing the Zenith with all original parts. The electrolytics and paper caps can cause real problems.
-
This morning I epoxied in the LG mounts.
While the LG mounts were drying, I added the TE shear webs. They are made from 1/16 4.5# balsa. I used my shear web cutting jig to get the right size. Remember that the grain goes vertical. The TE shear webs support the TE sheeting but more important they give the TE area great strength by making the TE area a box. Very strong with very little weight gain.
I included a quick peek inside of the TE to show the 1/32 lamination's and how a hinge slot was formed.
The LE sheeting next!
-
I've been debating on the best way to do the LE sheeting. I see going 1 of 2 ways.
First is just like the Lost Foam method which means cutting off the Mille LE and sanding the 1/16 balsa nice and straight. Also I won't be able to use the Mille jig blocks on the TE. Maybe not a big deal since the TE shear webs were added.
Second was to split the LE sheeting on the center line and glue it to the wing ala Mille method. This would require a careful cut and a good fit at the 1/16 sheeting on the very LE. The good is that I can keep the Mille jig blocks not only for the TE, but the LE as well.
I thought about the 2 methods for awhile then I decided to take a nap! Now that I'm retired, thinking wears me out. :)
The decision is coming.......stay tuned! Kinda like the LeBron thing a few years ago, huh? LOL!
-
OK, I decided to keep the Mille jig blocks and split the LE sheeting. It worked out good! I don't know how well I did with the joint at the 1/16 LE sheet till I cut off the Mille LE pieces. Right now the LE sheeting is glued on with Pica Gluit, and the 1/16 6.6# cap strips have been added top and bottom.
I then glued the halves together with some 15 minute epoxy ala Lost Foam method.
On to the bell crank mount and the sheeting. This thing is strong and hopefully light.
-
I love the construction of this wing. Too bad you have to hide it under paint. H^^
-
I love the construction of this wing. Too bad you have to hide it under paint. H^^
I hear ya. I'll hide it under Monokote though. y1
-
I have a feeling that some transparent Kote would go well....
Marcus
-
Marcus, I'm sure it would!
Today I built the tip weight box and made up my bell crank and lead outs.
First the tip weight box.
I make the sides my boxes from 1/8 Lite-Ply 1" tall with the grain going vertical. 2 pieces are 7/8" wide and 2 are 1 1/8" wide. These are glued using thin CA to form the box and then trued up on my disc sander. I then use 1/64 ply for a "skirt" for the cover. On 3 sides they are 3/4" tall with the grain going vertical and 1 side is 1 1/2 tall. This side will be glued to the main spar doubler at the outermost rib bay.
The bottom is 1/8 Birch ply with a 4-40 T-Nut installed in the center. This is glued to the box using thin CA. I then bevel the edges with my disc sander to prevent the edges from "digging" in anywhere while I do the installation of the box.
I then make a mark 3/8 down from the top to locate my 1/64 ply skirt. These are glued on with CA one at a time and trimmed with my disc sander. The last piece that is 1 1/2" tall is glued like the rest.
The cover is made form 3/32 Birch ply with a 7/64 hole in the center. I then glue a 4-40 washer centered over the hole with thin CA. This will prevent the 4-40 socket head screw from digging into the cover. I then cut a hole in some 1/32 balsa to clear the washer. I used 3/8 balsa for the top layer and drill a 7/32 hole in the center. A small piece of 7/32 OD aluminum tubing is then epoxied into the hole. This will form a nice neat "pocket" for the head of the socket screw. When dry I sanded the "bottom edge flat and glued to the 1/32 balsa using medium CA. To align the top 3/8 balsa I inserted a 4-40 socket head screw into the aluminum tubing, then down through the 7/64 hole in the top 3/32 ply piece. It'll be a tight fit and you may have to open the hole up slightly. When dry I'll saw it down and do a final fit using my disc sander. Then the cover, while being screwed to the box will be sanded down flush with the LE sheeting.
The tip weight box, unsanded cover and screw weighs 9 grams.
-
I mounted the tip weight box in the outer most rib bay. When I made up the spars, I used a piece of 1/16 balsa as a shear web to cover the entire bay. The tip weight box will be glued to this balsa along with the LE sheeting.
To locate the box I pushed a pin down through the LE sheeting to locate the 1/16 shear web and the angle ribs. Once these were located I drew a line there and placed the box on that line and traced around the remaining edges to locate the cut out in the LE sheeting. I cut along the marks and did some small detail sanding for a good fit. I want the box to be snug up against the shear web. Once located properly, I then used medium CA to glue the box the the shear web from the hole in the web and the hole in the tip rib. I then glued the box to the LE sheeting using thin CA. The 1/64 ply skirt will first be sanded down to the LE sheeting then the cover will be carved and sanded to its final shape.
-
On to the bell crank.
I make my bell cranks from 1/8 linen phenolic. They are4 inch cranks with a 5/8 push rod throw. Yeah I like "slow" controls. Once the shape is cut out, filed and sanded to shape, I epoxied on 5/16 squares on either side of the crank where the post will go. This serves 2 purposes. It provides more bearing surface, but most important it keeps the crank from tipping on the shaft. Once cured, I drill a #30 hole for the 1/8 music wire post. The #30 drill is just slightly larger than 1/8 and gives a nice fit for the post.
Time to solder the crank in position on the post. I sand and clean the post. I then drilled a 1/8 hole straight down using my drill press through some hardwood maple motor mount stock that I have. The post will be tight fit in this hole. I then use a 4-40 fender washer and a 1/8 line eyelet on the shaft. These are soldered to the shaft. The shaft is flipped over, the bell crank is installed on the post, fender washer, and finally another 1/8 line eyelet. Again these are soldered to the post. When cooled, it is cleaned with acetone and some circuit board cleaner to remove any flux residue. The crank should spin freely but with out any tipping. I added some chain lube and now it's ready for the lead outs.
I use .027 stranded lead out wire I got from MBS Supply. Good people! I also bush the bell crank with some 1/16 OD brass tubing that has been annealed with a propane torch till cherry red then allowed to cool naturally. Each tube is 2 1/2 long.
I mark the center of each tube and thread the LO so that about 2 1/2 to 3" sticks though. BTW the bell crank holes for the LO is 5/64" with the edges ever so slightly beveled with 1/4 drill. I insert the tube to the halfway mark and bend both ends around till they meet. If I see that one end is a little longer, I hold the short end still and keep bending the long end till the match. I put a small bend in the LO so that both ends are parallel so I can wrap them a lot easier with copper wire. I use 28awg wire from MBS Supply. I tape the free end to the LO and then put some pull on the LO end to make wrapping easier. I wrap them like the AMA book, fold the free end back and wrap them again. Both ends are then twisted together, cut off, and folded along the the wrapped section. I then use 1/8 clear heat shrink tubing 5/8 long to hold it all together. This way it will remain flexible.
I then bolt on a 4-40 ball link I get from Tom Morris.
The crank, post, ball link, and lead outs weighs 20 grams.
-
Good work as usual Crist
-
Good work as usual Crist
Thank you Bob.
-
Hope I can remember all of this on the weight box.
-
John,
You won't have to remember. Just follow this thread!
I made up the bell crank supports from basswood just like the LF method. I notched them where the ribs and spar pieces were. These were epoxied in using 30 minute epoxy and let cure overnight. Then the bell crank was epoxied to the supports. I had to cut out some spar material to clear the ball link screw. I did mount the bell crank about 1/8" high to be sure I clear the LG mounts with the LO. Maybe the bell crank could have been a little lower. I also relocated a rib vertical support a little further aft just to be sure the LO don't get hung up on it.
I then sheeted the tips and center section using 6.5# balsa using my Pica Gluit. Once dry I removed the wing from the Mille jig blocks and cut off the 1/4 balsa Mille LE. The joints were very good. I think what I'll do next time is to make the LE sheeting up as before but instead of molding them, I will just true up the LE then glue it straight down on the 1/16 piece of balsa. When dry, then wet just the outer side of the sheeting and then glue it down over the ribs and spar. Then trim it to width.
I gave the wing a quick sanding down with some 220. BTW I'll use the LF jig to support the wing from now on.
I also sanded the tip weight box cover to the airfoiled shape.
I drew a line 1/16 in toward the hinge line on the TE to guide me when I taper it. I'll sand that next. Then on to the LG mounts and wing tips.
Weight so far as it sits - 6.7 ounces.
-
Looking real good Crist.. I sure hope the Tornado's missed you !!! The National news mentioned your town as having been hit by the bad weather..
-
Thanks Lee.
No tornadoes, but severe weather. We are all OK. North Dallas got hit big time.
-
Next up I sanded the TE to a tapered shape. I did not round the TE yet. Waiting for the wing tips, then it'll get rounded.
I use a piece of 1" masking tape along the TE overlapping the cap strips about 3/8 inch. The tape overlap helps prevent from "catching" a cap strip with the sandin bar when sanding the TE. Also I use the tape as an "indicator" when I'm planning down the TE. When I hit the tape with the block plane, time to stop and switch to the sanding bar. One of the pictures shows the TE after sanding. The "guide" line is just visible.
Then I worked on the LG mounts and covers. I used 6# 1/4 balsa on each side and 6# 1/8 balsa fore and aft. These were fitted and glued in using thin CA.
The covers are 1/32 ply with 6# 1/4 balsa filler and 7/32 al. tubing for the socket screw pockets. These were epoxied in using 30 minute epoxy. Then trimmed to fit and sanded down to the airfoil. Again masking tape was used like on the tip weight box cover. The covers will be reduced on each side to allow room for the Monokote. Of course they have to be notched for the LG wire yet.
-
The LO guide is made up of 3 pieces of 3/32 bass wood. Then laminated with the center piece the grain is running vertical. I used medium CA to glue them together. I then drew a center line and placed a mark every 1/4 inch for each adjustment. I then drilled each hole at a slight angle so the LO exit the tip pretty close to straight. I used a 7/64 drill. Then I created the slot using my ancient Dremel jig saw. I run in from one side. The I use a small piece of 1/64 ply to close the gap with some thin CA. I used some sandpaper to sand and enlarge the slot for the LO wire. I then tapped each hole using a 6-32 tap. Once done, a quicK hit with some thin CA. Then re-tapped again. Some sanding, etc to clean it all up. The LO adjusters will be 2 6-32 socket head screws, hence the 6-32 threads in the LO guide. Then the guide is sanded down to 1/4" wide with my disc sander.
I made up the wing tips using 5.5# balsa. I traced the top view and then pinned each tip to the wing to trace the airfoil. Then to the band saw. Once they were sawn out, I drew a center line on the outside for a guide when rough shaping. I then used my disc sander with a "rolling" motion to rough shape each tip on the outside. I then traced a line about 1/8 in as a guide to aid the hollowing. I used a Sullivan 1/2 carbide ball in my Dremel tool and slowly "carved" out the insides of each tip. When done a few minutes with some 120 grit and they were ready to glue on. The inboard tip had the LO guide added. The tip edges were moistened with water and glued on with Pica Gluit. Then tape clamped to dry.
The tips with the LO guide weighs 14 grams.
-
Crist, that wing is a masterpiece, well done
You sure are getting it together at an impressive pace too.
I'll be watching this build with great interest.
Dan
-
Thanks Daniel.
Today I sanded the tips to shape and rounded the TE. Did some touch-up sanding elsewhere and cut out for the flap push rod. All that's left to do is to terminate the LO some minor filling here and there and then detail sanding. Then it'll be ready to cover.
I always add a drop or 2 of thin CA on the tip TE to preserve the shape. Look closely!
The wing weighs as it sits with LG covers and screws, and tip weight box cover and screw - 203 grams - 7.14 ounces.
-
Holy mackerel! That is wonderful, Crist! Makes me want to throw my new wing in the garbage and turn out the shop lights!
-
Holy mackerel! That is wonderful, Crist! Makes me want to throw my new wing in the garbage and turn out the shop lights!
Thanks Jason. I know you build light too being a FF modeler! The wing is straight. dead nuts straight, and very rigid! I'm a happy camper.
-
Today I built the stab between naps. I'm feeling a bit under the weather. Posts will be slow over the next few days till I feel better.
I used 2 pieces of 7.8# 3/16 x 1/2 balsa and some 1/32 balsa to form the hinge slots for the TE. The LE and tips were built with the same stuff. I used medium CA to glue them together. Then on the LE and TE I used some .007 unidirectional carbon fiber to stiffen them up. the CF was glued to the LE and TE using medium CA.
The "ribs" are 7.3# 1/8 balsa. These were stripped a little higher than the LE and TE so they could be sanded down flush. I really don't like it when a rib goes below the LE or TE. The ribs and sheeting were glued with thin CA. I put 2 holes in each rib to allow air to escape through a 1/4 hole in the bottom sheeting when I Monokote the stab. And any subsequent tightening up in the future. The sheeting is 1/16 7.4# balsa.
The top sheet was glued to the ribs using Pica Gluit and the the LE and TE with thin CA because the sheeting butts up against the CF.
Then it was all sanded down, the TE rounded and the LE brought to an ellipse shape. The tips rounded off and the TE tips were given the thin CA treatment. All that's left to do is detail sand it then it'll be ready to cover.
The stab as it sits weighs 35 grams. 9 grams under budget.
-
Wonderful stuff. I'll be coming back to this thread for inspiration and reference once I get my own projects back to positive progress.
-
Ash,
You're one reason why I take the time to do this build log.
I built the elevators today. Very similar to the stabilizer except there is no CF on the LE and TE edges. The framework is made up of 1/2 x 3/16 9# balsa with a piece of 6# 1.32 balsa in between. These were glued using medium CA. The root and tip filler was made up from 5.8# 3/16 sheet and the same 1/32 balsa. Again glued using medium CA. The frame work was glued together using Pica Gluit and the 1/8 7.3# ribs were glued in using thin CA. A hole was punched into each rib to allow air to escape when Monokoting. The exit holes will be next to the hinges.
The horn clips are made from 1/8 Lite-Ply and 1/64 plywood. The 1/8 Lite-Ply is less than the 1/8 O.D. aluminum tubing so the 1/64 ply gets to the right dimension and also adds some strength. Note the grain of the 1/8 Lite-Ply is vertical.
The location of the horn clips is determined by using some 1/32 plywood pieces 3/4 wide and about 1 long. These are slipped into the stab TE hinge slots and the elevators are then slip on the extruding plywood. I marked the location of my offset horn location and filed a small slot in the stab TE to locate and keep the horn in position. Then the clips were turned upright and 90 degrees to the elevators. A small mark was then made near the LE of elevator on each side of the clip. I then disassembled the elevators from the stab and used a 90 degree triangle to draw the cut lines on the elevator. A quick trip to the jig saw and the clips were ready to glue in. They were glued to the elevators using thin CA.
I then made up from 1/16 bass wood the "pocket" for my Rabe Rudder horn. This was glued to the root of the right side elevator on the bottom. I then capped that off with another piece of 1/16 basswood. The left elevator same the same treatment sans pocket.
Then then were sanded smooth and are ready to get tapered. That will happen tomorrow. I'll use the Perret Bar method.
Each elevator weighs 20 grams as they sit. I'm expecting them to loose 25% or 5 grams when tapered. If they come out to 14 or 15 grams each when all done, then they will be right on budget. I think I can make that weight.
-
Hi Crist
The new bird looks phenomenal. The quality is outstanding and it looks like you should finish well ahead of your target weight - your power system is never going to know there is an airplane behind it!
Keep the pictures coming.
-
Thanks Crist for this, the pictures sure clear up what this old man is reading. H^^
-
Happy New Year everybody!
Thanks Dennis and Doc.
I tapered the elevators using the Perret Bar method. See here reply #10: http://stunthanger.com/smf/building-techniques/building-tapered-flaps/
The TE are 3/32 high and will remain squared. I rounded off the LE, then added the notch for the control horn wire (3/32). I then assembled the thing and trimmed and sanded the tips. Again, a couple drops of thin CA was used to preserve the crisp corners.
The elevators came to 14 grams each. Right on target!
I did some figuring today and between the wing, stab, and elevators, I'm under budget 27 grams, almost an ounce. BTW my budgets are for a 49 ounce airplane. I'm shooting for 50 ounces knowing that some weight will creep in. So far so good!
On to the flaps.
-
...your power system is never going to know there is an airplane behind it!
I've had power systems like that. That's why they make us put safety cables between the bellcrank and engine in combat planes.
-
I've had power systems like that. That's why they make us put safety cables between the bellcrank and engine in combat planes.
Something like this?
-
Christ, this is amazing. Thank you for posting the pics. I'm going to take some of your ideas and incorporate what you got going on in my next big plane. I got three 1/2a's to finish up first.
-
Christ, this is amazing. Thank you for posting the pics. I'm going to take some of your ideas and incorporate what you got going on in my next big plane. I got three 1/2a's to finish up first.
Glad you can glean something useful. Say hi to Alan S. for me.
-
Something like this?
Hee Hee.
Dean
-
Been down with the flu lately so not much has been done. Tomorrow I post pictures of my flaps.
-
Yuck! Hope you are feeling better, Crist.
-
Feeling a little bit better.
On to the flaps.
I decided to go with flat solid flaps. The material I used was some 1/8 7.8# and some 1/32 8.5# balsa. I cut out the blanks out of the 1/8 sheet with the grain running parallel to the TE. I then glued the 1/32 sheet so that it would be true cross-grain to the 1/8 balsa. I laid out the hinge locations on the 1/32 balsa and cut them out. I then transfer the hinge locations to the top and bottom sheets using a pen. I then use some masking tape to prevent any epoxy glue in the hinge slots.
I use some MGS L285 laminating resin to glue each flap together. I carefully measure out the proper proportions on a 10X (I can measure down to 1/10 gram) scale adapter I made. I saw this in a magazine and it was either Larry Renger or De Hill was the author. I spread the epoxy on using my notched tool and the removed each piece of tape, then apply the 1/32 balsa to the 1/8 sheet. Then the other sheet gets its epoxy applied, then it is put into place. The excess epoxy is then wiped away and then weighted down on a flat surface over night.
When fully cured I trimmed the flaps to the the proper size except the root side. Those will be trimmed when I install the horn clips.
-
I make the horn clips just like I did with the elevators. 1/8 Lite-Ply and 1/64 ply laminate. Glued using medium CA. The aluminum tubing is glued in using medium CA on both sides. Then the clips are cut out and the height is made very close to the height of the flap. The clip location is done by installing the flaps using 1/32 ply for the hinges and centering the flap horn. The clips are placed on the flaps and their location is marked on each flap. The flap is removed and a line is drawn from the mark along the root of the flap using a 90 degree triangle to the LE. The flap is trimmed and the clips are glued in place using medium CA. The clips are then capped with 1/8 basswood with medium CA. The 1/8 basswood is notched for the control horn wire.
The flaps LE and TE were sanded round and the the tips were rounded to match the wing tip shape.
Each flap weighs 31 grams. This is 6 grams over budget for each flap. 12 grams overall with now a 15 gram under budget for the build so far. These flap are nice and straight and stiff. Well worth the extra weight "penalty".
-
Now to see if I can do this on the B-25 flaps,
-
Crist, I have been following and enjoying your build. Great to see you recovering from the flu.
When you are laminating such as the flaps, are you slightly sealing the wood with dope or equivalent prior to epoxy? It seems that the epoxy can absorb and leave little for the bond, or if more is used, then more weight.
-
Crist, I have been following and enjoying your build. Great to see you recovering from the flu.
When you are laminating such as the flaps, are you slightly sealing the wood with dope or equivalent prior to epoxy? It seems that the epoxy can absorb and leave little for the bond, or if more is used, then more weight.
Fred, Good question. No sealing done. I did think about that though. Maybe next time. BTW, adding the 1/32 balsa and the extra gluing added 6 grams to the weight of each flap. The balsa was about 3 grams and the glue amounted to 3 grams.
In this case a little glue penetration isn't so bad. It does add stiffness to the flap. Now on a sheet covered foam wing, where the glue attaches to foam, and foam isn't that strong, then yes sealing the wood and using a minimum amount of glue would be desirable.
-
Clever flap layup! Now I'm thinking of variants with thinner skin layers and multiple lightweight 45 degree core layers to trade some bending stiffness for torsional stiffness. Probably not worth the weight and fuss.
I would have automatically used PVA to glue that up, on the basis that the water content evaporates away, presumably leaving slightly less glue weight. That would need to be tested for truth before diverging from your very careful epoxy application, of course.
Are you going to cover the flaps in glass, veil, silkspan or something other?
-
Christ, i want to try this on the banshee flaps. Is the flap joiner wire OD and aluminium tube ID "the same" for a snug fit? I'm guessing 1/8" stuff?
-
Christ, i want to try this on the banshee flaps. Is the flap joiner wire OD and aluminum tube ID "the same" for a snug fit? I'm guessing 1/8" stuff?
Yes, I uses 3/32 horn wire on this sized stunter and then I use 1/8 OD aluminum tubing. It's a slip fit and then combine that with the length of the tubing 1 inch in my case, it's pretty precise. It allows for the removal of the flaps using a continuous hinge pin.
-
Clever flap layup! Now I'm thinking of variants with thinner skin layers and multiple lightweight 45 degree core layers to trade some bending stiffness for torsional stiffness. Probably not worth the weight and fuss.
I would have automatically used PVA to glue that up, on the basis that the water content evaporates away, presumably leaving slightly less glue weight. That would need to be tested for truth before diverging from your very careful epoxy application, of course.
Are you going to cover the flaps in glass, veil, silkspan or something other?
Ash,
Thank you.
Concerning PVA glue, it's been suspected that it doesn't dry over large areas such as doublers and such. I use epoxy because I know it will cure properly and will stay that way impervious to moisture and such. In other words I think it also aids to stabilize the flap and help eliminate any future warping.
The flaps once sanded with 600 grit will then be covered with Monokote. Another reason I want them as stiff as possible now.
-
After another good nap this afternoon and a good hearty supper, I'm feeling better now. Not the best, but better than the last week or so. Thanks to everybody's well wishes.
With the flaps out of the way on to the fin and rudder.
The fin is made from 2 pieces of 1/8 6# balsa and 1 pieces of 1/32 7# balsa. Again a laminated structure with the grain going crosswise on both the fin and rudder. The rudder is made from some scrap 1/8 7.5# balsa and 1/32 7# balsa. Again the grain of each piece is going a different direction. This will create a nice and stiff rudder. I've had rudders that were made from too soft balsa and they were a pain to deal with. We're talking a gram or 2 difference. Besides the rudder seems to always to bumped up against something!
The other rectangular piece are for the rounded fairing on the LE near the fuselage. This will be glued to the rest of the fin with the grain going the correct way.
Again glued using MGS L285 epoxy. The entire fin gained a total of 2 grams with the gluing and the rudder still stayed the same (less than 1 gram I figure).
They have been weighted down to cure overnight.
I'm guessing these will make budget if not just a few grams over, we'll see tomorrow.
-
Crist, If you don't mind me askin', what keeps the bellcrank post from sliding up and down?
Thanks,
MM
-
Crist, If you don't mind me askin', what keeps the bellcrank post from sliding up and down?
Thanks,
MM
It is epoxied to the basswood strips. When the wing is inserted into the fuselage I use fiberglass on the center section and inside up along the fuselage walls about 3/8 inch. This FG will also keep it in place. Stay tuned for details.
-
The fin and rudder are finished. I use some 1/32 basswood at the top of the rudder and on the fin part that rudder butts up against. On the rudder this will keep a nice crisp edge and on the fin it also keeps a nice crisp edge but more important it adds a lot of strength to the small overhang. It won't break off so easily.
Both the fin and the rudder came in 1 gram each under budget. Final sanding needs to be done for each before finishing.
-
Thanks Lee.
No tornadoes, but severe weather. We are all OK. North Dallas got hit big time.
Garland: Looks like B-52's bomb it for three days straight.
-
Well I've made a decision. I'm going to build another stab and elevator set. The existing set has an A/R of about 4.6. It looks like current practice is about 3.5 to 4.0. My earlier versions had 4.0 but this time I thought I'd stretch it out to 4.6. Reading the posts on the forum and looking at other successful designs made my mine up to go with 4.0.
I've already drawn up a new stab and elevator set. I have to wait now till I get my order of .007 unidirectional CF along with some 2/10 CF veil to procede.
-
Ash,
Thank you.
Concerning PVA glue, it's been suspected that it doesn't dry over large areas such as doublers and such. I use epoxy because I know it will cure properly and will stay that way impervious to moisture and such. In other words I think it also aids to stabilize the flap and help eliminate any future warping.
The flaps once sanded with 600 grit will then be covered with Monokote. Another reason I want them as stiff as possible now.
Yes, there are circumstances where PVA doesn't dry inside a laminate, like when vacuum bagged or pressed inside impermeable plattens. I use it for large/wide guitar laminates and it will always dry if there's a way (through the wood pores) for the moisture to get out. Epoxy is definitely better for stability, stiffness and moisture resistance. Worth a few grams penalty, even if there was one.
-
This evening I terminated the Lead Outs and made up the flap push rod. I already had an elevator push rod made up from another build.
I use Tom Morris CF push rods, ball links, and terminal ends. I also us 7/32 OD aluminum tubing as a ferrule over the end of the push rod to keep them from splitting.
Once I determine the length of the push rod I wrap a layer of masking tape around it and make my mark. I then use my trusty Dremel jig saw to cut the push rod. I then sand the ends square and rough up the outside about 1 inch on each end. This is so the JB Weld adheres real good when gluing on the ferrules.
I mix up the JB Weld and then clean the inside of each end of the rush rod with a pipe cleaner and some acetone. Then I wipe the outside too. I use a round toothpick to "trowel" in some epoxy into the end. I then butter up the RH terminal end real good. I then very lightly tap the terminal end into the push rod. I wipe most of the excess epoxy and smear it onto the outside push rod for the ferrule. I then put the squared end of the ferrule over the end of the RH terminal end and slide it down till it bottoms onto the rounded portion of the terminal end. I forgot to mention that each ferrule is 3/4 long with the RH ferrule has one end still "rolled" over from my K&S tubing cutter. The other 3 ends the rolled over portion is disc sanded off and the end cleaned up square. This "rolled" end is what sits on top of the rounded portion of the RH terminal. See pictures.
The LH side is done similar but the ferrule is put onto the push rod first then the LH terminal end is inserted into the push rod. Then the whole thing is cleaned up and set aside to dry.
-
I bent up the 1/8 MW landing gear this morning and fiddled with some details on the LG covers. Trying to take care of all the little things now before I start the fuselage and another stabilizer/elevator.
-
Do you use a jam nut against the ball link? Are those the same 4-40 ball links that Dubro makes?
Thanks,
MM
-
Do you use a jam nut against the ball link? Are those the same 4-40 ball links that Dubro makes?
Thanks,
MM
No jam nut needed with nylon on metal threads. Like I said before, I use Tom Morris ball links, push rods, and terminal ends.
-
Well I decided to build another stabliizer and elevator set. Instead of an A/R of 4.6 this set is 4.0. I have the elevators built but haven't tapered them yet. That's next. Pretty much the same build as the first set. Also they weigh the same. On to the tapering!
I have to wait till my order from CST arrives for more .007 CF laminate before I start the stab.
-
I finished the elevators tonight except for the tips which will be finished when the stab is done so I can match the tips. The elevators weigh 23 grams total for both. About 5 grams lighter than the first set!
-
Ok, silly question... But I'm asking because I'm cheap! Lol
The aluminium tubes that you used on the first set, are they being reused here? Or will you keep the first set for another plane?
-
Ok, silly question... But I'm asking because I'm cheap! Lol
The aluminium tubes that you used on the first set, are they being reused here? Or will you keep the first set for another plane?
I'll keep the first set and either us it on another plane or sell them/give them away.
-
Crist, borrowed your method of the weight box. Looks a lot better than my previous ones. Thanks.
-
Crist, borrowed your method of the weight box. Looks a lot better than my previous ones. Thanks.
Good for you.
-
I decided to redo the fin too. I built this one up and sheeted it with 1/16 5.6# wood. The frame is made up from 1/16 6# and 1/32 6# wood. The picture shows the second side with the glue applied ready for the skin.
-
The fin is sanded and came out 2 grams lighter but it is stronger. All finished except for detail sanding.
I made up the fuselage bulkheads. F2 the motor mount is made from 1/8 copper clad circuit board with the copper etched off. F3 and F4 are made from 3/32 6# balsa with epoxied 1/64 ply on each side. F5, F6, F7 is 1/16 6# balsa, F8 F9, F10, F11 is made from 11# 1/16 balsa, and F12 is 6# balsa with 1/64 ply epoxied to the aft side.
-
I cut out the fuselage sides today. They are 5.9# 3/32 with the nose spliced on which was 6# balsa. I have 1/64 doublers gluing on overnight. No pictures for now. Tomorrow I'll provide some meaningful pictures.
My CF will be in tomorrow too. Thursday will be a busy day.
-
I continued to work on the fuselage. The doublers were glued on using MGS L285 epoxy. I shimmed the nose of each side up when gluing on the doublers.
I use 1/64 ply doubler for the tail wheel mount. These were glued in using medium CA. I also inset 3/32 birch Ply for the adjustable rudder push rod mount. Also cutout for the stabilizer.
I placed the fuselage sides on the drawing with the tops of each up against each other. I then draw the bulkhead locations, etc. I carefully cut out for the wing using a template I created by drawing an outline using R2 as a guide. Then measured out 1/16 for the wing sheeting. I then applied a layer of packing tape to each side and cut it out.
The next picture shows the front end. I epoxied the 1/4 square x 1/2 long spruce anchor points for the battery tray. I then used some TE stock to add some extra beef to the motor mount. I know the grain is going the wrong way and the "fit" isn't perfect, but it will add some strength and also acts as a "guide" when gluing on the motor mount.
Here is a picture of the disconnect and the switch mount on the other side. These were made from 3/32 birch ply and then inset and doubled over with the 1/64 ply doubler.
Here is a picture of the motor mount doubler and the curve put in when I glued on the 1/64 ply doubler.
-
This picture shows where I "inset" the top hatch 1/4 inch down into the fuselage. My previous hatch started at the top of the flat fuselage and when I finished sanding, the edge that mated to the fuselage ended up coming to a sharp point. Which was difficult to put a finish on. I decided to lower that edge down and thus eliminate that sharp edge. More pictures to come when I build the hatch. BTW, the parting surfaces are lined with 1/32 basswood.
This picture shows the hatch for the elevator horn to gain access to adjust the length of the push rod, and to adjust the slider on the horn. Again it is lined with 1/32 basswood. The hatch cover is lined with 1/32 basswood. This gives a nice clean crisp edge for the hatch.
This picture shows the template I made using my R2 lost foam rib and added 1/16 sheeting to it. Then cut it out. BTW, it is covered with packing tape on each side.
-
I finished building the second stabilizer. This one has an aspect ratio of 4:1 instead of 4.6:1.
The stabilizer was built pretty much like the first one so no details will be given.
The combined weight of the second stab/elevator is 60 grams verses 63 grams for the first set. I saved 3 more grams.
This weekend I'll join the fuselage sides and work on getting it ready for the molded top, bottom, and hatch "blocks".
When the fuselage is done and after all the detail sanding is finished, I'll list the weights of each component.
In the picture, the top set is the first set with 4.6:1 and the bottom set is the second set with 4:1. The second set has 2 inch less span. 27 vs 25.
-
Hi Crist,
any chance you can post your weight "budget"?
That sort of info seems to be hard to find for F2B models.
Thanks,
Pat MacKenzie
-
Hi Crist,
any chance you can post your weight "budget"?
That sort of info seems to be hard to find for F2B models.
Thanks,
Pat MacKenzie
Sure.
-
Have you decided on a paint scheme yet Crist? ;D
-
Have you decided on a paint scheme yet Crist? ;D
Not exactly. It'll be red, white, and blue though! y1
-
It'll be red, white, and blue though! y1
Really??? LL~
Just kidding Crist, the build looks great, as clean as it gets! y1
-
Really??? LL~
Just kidding Crist, the build looks great, as clean as it gets! y1
Wayne,
I know you're busting my chops!
Thanks.
-
I joined the fuselage sides today. I used my trusty home made jig pieces and one of my benches. This time I had to notch my bench so F3 with the rounded top would allow the fuselage top to sit flat on my bench.
I begin by cutting triangle notches along the center line of my fuselage BOTTOM view. This is then taped to the bench making sure the drawing center line is along the center line of my jig. Then it is covered with wax paper. Then my jig blocks, carriage bolts, washers and wing nuts are added. I then align the edge of the jig blocks to the outside edge of the fuselage sides. I then insert the fuselage sides carefully lining them up to the drawing. Then I add the bulkheads and I use a small 90 degree triangle to get the bulkheads vertical. I then adjust the tail post so that it is centered and the fuselage sides are vertical too. Once everything looks good, I then glued the bulkheads and tail post in with thin CA. After that I pull the fuselage from the jig and then used medium CA with a thin Teflon tube to double glue the bulkheads. I then added 1/4 TRI stock to the front of F3 along the fuselage sides. These were mainly so the cooling air would flow "cleanly" from the intake into the battery compartment. I'll show picture of that tomorrow. I also used 30 minute epoxy to glue in the G10 motor mount and the battery mounts to the 1/4 square spruce anchors previously installed.
-
Here are some pictures of the front end. You can see the motor mount doublers, the 2.5 degrees of right thrust, the battery mounts, and the 1/4 TRI stock added to the front of former F3. As it sits it weighs 83 grams - 2.9 oz.
-
Before I do anymore work on the fuselage I decided to add some bracing to the aft end so when making the mold for the top and bottom sheeting I don't distort the fuselage. The bracing is 1/16 x 3/16 #11 balsa added to just the aft section. The top and bottom bracing runs from different corners to provide great stiffness. The cost in weight was 1 gram! The fuselage now weighs 84 grams.
-
Crist,
Will your battery access be from the bottom or from the side?
-
Crist,
Will your battery access be from the bottom or from the side?
Top.
-
I made up the bulkheads today. The 1/16 bulkheads are made from 7# stock. The 1/8 bulkheads are made from 5.5# stock. The plans were cut out and I used 3M 77 spray glue to adhere the plans to the balsa. Then the bulkheads were cut out. I used some acetone on a paper towel to "soak" the plan to remove it from the balsa. Then a quick wipe down and a few strokes of sanding and they were done.
On to the ply bulkheads for the molds.
-
Today I made the forms to mold the top and bottom blocks.
The bulkheads are made from 2.5mm birch plywood and the base from 2 pieces of 1/4 inch ply wood glued with Gorilla glue. I used the 3M 77 method for the bulkheads and a lot of disc sanding time!
The 1/2 plywood was then trimmed to size using the fuselage as a guide. I marked the bulkhead locations and used thin CA to glue them to the ply base. Next up will be the blue foam.
I used some enamel paint on the edges of the bulkheads to act as a sanding guide.
BTW, there are 4 separate forms. Both top and bottom forms are pushed together when I took the pictures. They separate at F6.
-
I cut and glued in the blue foam. I think the blue foam is closed cell 2# foam. I first cut it to the required height with my hot wire. Then I cut out the "top view" with my band saw. Then I sectioned each piece with the band saw and disc sander. I epoxied each piece in using MGS 285 epoxy. They were then weighted down to keep them true till the epoxy cures.
-
I sanded down the molds and I am applying several coats of WBP. Pictures when finished.
I added the motor bay top sheet and the 1/2 cross grain nose today. When dry, I'll true up the nose and then install the nose ring. Then the chin block will be trial fit, shaped, and then hollowed. Then glued on. By then, maybe the molds will be ready to start molding balsa.
-
Here a few pictures of the molds that I made. After sanding them to shape, I applied 2 coats of WBP. They are still drying.
-
This evening I made up the chin block. I don't know what density balsa block I used. Though I suspect it was pretty tough to carve out! I'll finish sanding the whole nose once the top and bottom sheeting has been molded.
I also added the nose ring. I used 1 piece of 1/16 ply and 1 piece of 3/32 bass wood. The bass wood is the part that the spinner will fit up against. I make the nose rings like this so I can do any final detail sanding for that perfect fit of the spinner. Ever try sanding birch plywood?
-
No more????? :'( :'(
Marcus
-
I made the tail wheel mount using 2 layers of 1/16 birch ply. I then added a 4-40 blind nut for the hold down screw. The plywood was then glued in using epoxy. The vertical brace is 3/8 square maple motor mount material which was then epoxied in. I'll drill the hole for the tail wheel wire tomorrow.
-
While the tail wheel mount was curing, I made up the tail wheel assembly. The wire strut is .078 music wire. I feel that 1/16 is too thin and wobbly. Then the 1/16 axle is bound to the main strut with copper wire and soldered. Then a washer is soldered to the axle, the wheel, then another washer. Btw, I glued the rubber tire to the hub using medium CA. You notice that the stooge connection is the main strut and the wheel axle is soldered on. This is for safety reasons. Never solder the stooge connection to the strut. If the solder joint fails, you launch your plane at a bad time.
The weight of the rather long tail wheel assembly is 8 grams.
-
I love the tail hook! Alan and i were using T- pins pushed in backwards to hold yoyo string. He was flying a tomahawk and i was flying my brodak basic trainer one day and experimenting with stooge set-ups. This looks significantly nicer!
-
I love the tail hook! Alan and i were using T- pins pushed in backwards to hold yoyo string. He was flying a tomahawk and i was flying my brodak basic trainer one day and experimenting with stooge set-ups. This looks significantly nicer!
Yeah, it works real well. Sure beats using a line clip.
-
I pulled the molded top and bottom sheeting from the molds today.
The top front and bottom front were made from 1/16 7.8# balsa because I wanted some strength up front and also the hatch was going to be made from this molding.
The bottom aft was made from 1/16 5.8# balsa.
The top half was made from 2 pieces of 1/32 5.7# balsa. This was because of the tight radius at the tailpost and I found out that using 2 pieces of 1/32 glued then molded into a very strong piece. Before the 1/32 pieces are put on the mold they are soaked in water, then "dried" off using a paper towel, and the first piece gets some watered down Pica Gluit brushed on the entire surface, then the second piece of 1/32 gets put on top of that. Then they are put on the mold and then wrapped with 4 inch wide bed sheets. BTW, the mold MUST be covered with waxed paper first. The glue will seep down to the mold and without the waxed paper, you will glue the balsa to the mold. Trust me it will happen.
After drying, the bottom edges are trimmed using a #11 blade attached to the same material as the base and then just run along the side to trim.
I locate the formers by marking their locations on the outside of the fuselage first, then taping the shell in place and transferring the marks to the shell. Then the marks are extended to the inside. Then the formers are glued in using thin CA. Once done, I then "drag" the completed assembly across some sandpaper that is glued to a flat surface to give me a 'true" edge to glue up against the fuselage side.
The angled portion of the exit scoop is made from 1/32 5.7# balsa.
I'm working on the top front pieces this evening. This will yield the top front portion and the hatch. More pictures to follow tomorrow.
The weights so far is:
Front bottom - 4 grams
Aft Bottom - 5 grams
Aft Top - 11 grams
Total so far 20 grams. I'm thinking about 30 grams total which will include the hatch.
-
Such a clean build....
Love it!
Marcus
-
My gosh I feel like such a HACK!
-
This molding pictures is a lot better than some I've seen. Also, have you considered 'Parchment Paper' in the place of waxed paper. Doesn't contaminate the glue and I also use it to seal my paint jars.
-
Thanks Marcus.
Dennis, keep hacking away! y1
Doc, yeah I thought of parchment paper. Maybe next time.
On to the final details of the fuselage.
-
Great job Crist !!! Larry L. taught you well VD~ VD~ VD~ VD~ LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~
-
Great job Crist !!! Larry L. taught you well VD~ VD~ VD~ VD~ LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~
Thanks Lee. Larry would be proud, wouldn't he?
Stay warm!
-
OK, some more details of the fuselage molded sheeting.
First up the top forward piece that is right behind the battery hatch.
Not much there except getting the angled former correct. As it went, a little more angle crept in. No big deal. I used my disc sander set at the angle and trued up the angle end. Then did the same on the hatch. This ensures a perfect fit for the angled bulkheads.
-
The hatch was next. It is made from 1/32 ply wood for the base, 1/8 7.8# balsa for the "straight" sides, some bulkheads and the molded sheeting. After assembling the hatch, I took it to the disc sander to match the angled bulkhead. See the above post. Then I added a 1/32 bass wood to both the front and angled bulkheads. This gives me strength but most of all a nice clean edge for the parting surfaces. BTW, the aft portion of the bulkhead where the hatch butts up against was treated to the 1/32 bass wood for the same reason.
The the forward 1/16 ply tongue was added along with some 1/4 x 1/8 x 3/8 spruce "locators" were added to the aft end. The hatch will be held down by 2 super magnets. 1 in the hatch, and 1 in the angled bulkhead. This worked great on my electric Legacy-40. R.I.P.
I also added the stabilizer platform. This was made from 1/8 7.9# cross grain balsa. 2 holes were added. The aft one matches the hole in the stabilizer bottom sheeting so the air can escape/flow through the stab, especially when touching up the Monokote. The forward hole will aid when gluing in the stab.
-
The last fuselage detail that needed to be done was the ESC mount. It is made from 1/8 Lite-Ply and 1/4 square spruce. It was assembled using medium CA and epoxy to glue it to the forward battery mount. The ESC will hang out in the breeze with this type of mounting. I also have an opening in the lower bulkhead to allow cooling air to flow over the ESC.
-
Here are some pictures of the completed fuselage. From here I cover the wing and stab with Monokote, then begin assembling the plane. I've been working on this plane for 5 weeks now.
The canopy is just rough cut out and will be final fitted after the fuselage is covered with 2/10 CF veil.
Weight is 149 grams or 5.3 ounces. 9/10 of an ounce under budget. My guess is it is really 1 ounce under budget because I still have the full bulkheads in the wing cutout and some trimming of the top and bottom sheeting near the tail post. These will be trimmed during assembly.
-
A quick check as to where I am with my weight budget. Final detail sanding still has to be done, but this is where I am right now.
Wing - 15 grams under
Flaps - 12 grams over
Fuselage - 27 grams under
Stab - 6 grams under
Elevators - 7 grams under
Fin & Rudder - 2 grams under
Total is 45 grams or 1.64 oz. under budget for a 49 ounce airplane. I know some weight will creep in. Also the budget didn't include the 8 grams for the tail wheel.
Real happy with the weights so far!
-
Crist, you're going to win a Nobel Prize of some sort for this project. Thanks for taking the effort to document the build with (really sharp) photos and clear written description of the thought process as well as the building process. I have picked up a lot of ideas I want to try. Never too old to learn new tricks! I have an electric China Clipper at about the same stage you are at now, and I want to see how you decide to secure the battery and how to attach the battery hatch. I have used magnets on mine but they may be too powerful for easy removal, we will see.
-
Christ, amazing work as always but one thing weirds me out.
Why do you need a stooge hook? Aren't you running a timer with a delayed start?
-
Crist, you're going to win a Nobel Prize of some sort for this project. Thanks for taking the effort to document the build with (really sharp) photos and clear written description of the thought process as well as the building process. I have picked up a lot of ideas I want to try. Never too old to learn new tricks! I have an electric China Clipper at about the same stage you are at now, and I want to see how you decide to secure the battery and how to attach the battery hatch. I have used magnets on mine but they may be too powerful for easy removal, we will see.
Thanks Mike. Stay tuned for the magnet install.
-
Christ, amazing work as always but one thing weirds me out.
Why do you need a stooge hook? Aren't you running a timer with a delayed start?
Thank you.
Yes, I am using a timer and a delayed start. I still use a stooge as a matter of safety. Pressing the button and then walking out to the plane, something can happen. Like I trip or my lines get tangled, get distracted, my lanyard gets tangled, any number of things. Without a stooge, when the motor spools up and I'm not ready, then I could be in trouble. With a stooge I won't be. It's not a safe practice to leave the model unattended (restrained).
-
Not much done today due to a home project.
I did manage to apply 2 coats of nitrate dope to the motor and battery bays to weather proof them. I also added 3/10 CF to the lower skin to beef it up some. Seeing it is below the battery I might have a tendency to put my hand on the bottom when installing a battery.
-
This has been a lesson on building a competition stunt plane. I agree about using a stooge if you fly by your self a lot. But, with electric after landing what happens if some thing in the program goes hay wire? I'm still an old die hard IC person. ???
-
This has been a lesson on building a competition stunt plane. I agree about using a stooge if you fly by your self a lot. But, with electric after landing what happens if some thing in the program goes hay wire? I'm still an old die hard IC person. ???
Well Doc, then I would have a problem. At least with a stooge, I've cut the chances of having a problem by 1/2!
-
This has been a lesson on building a competition stunt plane. I agree about using a stooge if you fly by your self a lot. But, with electric after landing what happens if some thing in the program goes hay wire? I'm still an old die hard IC person. ???
You carry a large screw driver in your pocket and stake the safety thong before you go out.
Crist, can't wait to see how you get the wing in the fuselage.
MM
-
You carry a large screw driver in your pocket and stake the safety thong before you go out.
Crist, can't wait to see how you get the wing in the fuselage.
MM
When I fly over grass that's what I do. I use a screwdriver to "stake" the handle till I can get to the center of the circle and get ready, then pull the stooge line. When the flight is over, I "stake" the handle and then walk to the plane, pull the safety plug, and walk the airplane back to the stooge keeping the lines tight. It helps keep the lines from twisting all up. Once the plane is hooked up to the stooge, I walk the lines out, untwist them, check the controls, and "stake" the handle for the next flight.
When I fly over a paved circle, I can't "stake" the handle. Of course I could make a fixture to hold the handle. But that would mean another piece of equipment to dray out to the circle. I'll just have to take my chances when flying alone to get to the plane to pull the safety plug after a flight. Still electric is a lot safer than an IC engine and getting your fingers caught in the prop starting it and adjusting the needle valve!
-
Today I detailed sanded all the built parts. Not the fuselage. It still has to be glued together after the wing is installed.
I also made up the landing gear spats. They are made from 1/32 plywood and 1/8 8# balsa which was glued together using medium CA. They were then sanded to a streamlined shape. Each spat weighs 4 grams. The LG wire will be epoxied to the spats and the gap will be filled with Aeropoxy Lite before covering with 2/10 CF.
-
As promised here are the weights of each piece. All are ready to cover except the fuselage parts.
Wing - 194 grams
Left Flap - 31 grams
Right Flap - 30 grams
Stabilizer - 37 grams
Left Elevator - 11 grams
Right Elevator - 11 grams
Fin - 13 grams
Rudder 4 grams
Left LG Spat - 4 grams
Right LG Spat - 4 grams
Both LG Covers - 3 grams
Weight Box Cover - 2 grams
Fuselage less Blocks - 106 grams
Fuselage Bottom Front - 5 grams
Fuselage Bottom Aft - 5 grams
Battery Hatch - 10 grams
Fuselage Top Middle - 3 grams
Fuselage Top Aft - 12 grams
Total for everything is - 485 grams or 17.1 ounces as weighed.
-
Looks much nicer than the Brodak ARC version. :##
-
Looks much nicer than the Brodak ARC version. :##
It must be really cold way up there. You definitely have a brain freeze! LL~
-
As promised here are the weights of each piece. All are ready to cover except the fuselage parts.
Wing - 194 grams
Left Flap - 31 grams
Right Flap - 30 grams
Stabilizer - 37 grams
Left Elevator - 11 grams
Right Elevator - 11 grams
Fin - 13 grams
Rudder 4 grams
Left LG Spat - 4 grams
Right LG Spat - 4 grams
Both LG Covers - 3 grams
Weight Box Cover - 2 grams
Fuselage less Blocks - 106 grams
Fuselage Bottom Front - 5 grams
Fuselage Bottom Aft - 5 grams
Battery Hatch - 10 grams
Fuselage Top Middle - 3 grams
Fuselage Top Aft - 12 grams
Total for everything is - 485 grams or 17.1 ounces as weighed.
I am impressed how light you have built this plane. My new one is a bit of a fatty in comparison.
The wings on mine unbolt off the fuselage and covered weigh 224 and 230g each.
I need to build the next one lighter that's for sure.
-
I am impressed how light you have built this plane. My new one is a bit of a fatty in comparison.
The wings on mine unbolt off the fuselage and covered weigh 224 and 230g each.
I need to build the next one lighter that's for sure.
Thank you Daniel. You'll notice that throughout the build, I used a lot heavier wood than the "standard" 5-6# wood.
-
I got the stabilizer, elevators, and flaps covered with white Monokote today.
The wing is next, then the color scheme trim.
-
OK guys, here's your chance on some feedback that I'm asking for. I'm trying to decide the color scheme for this airplane. It will be red, white, and blue.
I'll show 2 schemes I'm considering and let me know which one you like the best. If you don't want to post here, them PM me what you think.
The first picture is what I've used in the past and I call it my traditional scheme. Many of my airplanes had it and it was well received.
The second picture is of my Legacy 40 from this year in the Air Force Thunderbirds color scheme. I've used this scheme on my jet models and carried it over to the Legacy 40.
Let me know what you think.
Thanks.
-
As promised here are the weights of each piece. All are ready to cover except the fuselage parts.
Wing - 194 grams
Left Flap - 31 grams
Right Flap - 30 grams
Stabilizer - 37 grams
Left Elevator - 11 grams
Right Elevator - 11 grams
Fin - 13 grams
Rudder 4 grams
Left LG Spat - 4 grams
Right LG Spat - 4 grams
Both LG Covers - 3 grams
Weight Box Cover - 2 grams
Fuselage less Blocks - 106 grams
Fuselage Bottom Front - 5 grams
Fuselage Bottom Aft - 5 grams
Battery Hatch - 10 grams
Fuselage Top Middle - 3 grams
Fuselage Top Aft - 12 grams
Total for everything is - 485 grams or 17.1 ounces as weighed.
Crist, Wow....such a super job and what a neat workshop! Thanks for sharing this incredible build session! I would suggest that you simply stick all the parts down, put a frame around that board in the photo with some glass over it and hang it up on the wall! Build another rough one to fly! #^
Keith R
-
Thanks Keith!
-
I like the Thunderbirds color scheme except for that nose.
MM
-
Being a "Jet Guy" I vote for your first scheme. It screams C/L Stunt! The second not so much.....
Sorry ;)
Tim
-
C'mon Crist your in a rut !!! how about blue,white and red LL~ LL~ LL~
-
Ilnow some think it is dull;ooking, but haven't seen a Blue Angels scheme seen Larry Scarinzi's Blue Angel.
-
OK guys, here's your chance on some feedback that I'm asking for. I'm trying to decide the color scheme for this airplane. It will be red, white, and blue.
I'll show 2 schemes I'm considering and let me know which one you like the best. If you don't want to post here, them PM me what you think.
The first picture is what I've used in the past and I call it my traditional scheme. Many of my airplanes had it and it was well received.
The second picture is of my Legacy 40 from this year in the Air Force Thunderbirds color scheme. I've used this scheme on my jet models and carried it over to the Legacy 40.
Let me know what you think.
Thanks.
Of the two I like the scheme on the Agenda, fits the airplane design well. I'm also going to suggest not doing the chrome L/E thing. :)
-
OK guys. Thanks for your comments.
I'll go with the Agenda color scheme.
Stay tuned.
Thanks.
-
Just a quick update. Working on getting the parts covered with Monokote.
-
Whitie Tighties!
On to the trim, then hinging.
-
Now that looks great! This is coming along really quick for scratch building it. Thanks for keeping the pics coming.
-
The Monokote trim has been applied. I use the Windex method. I spray some Windex where the trim will be and on the trim piece too. Then the trim is positioned in place and I use a paper towel to smooth the trim piece out. I can make some minor placement adjustments using this method. I let it "dry" overnight and then seal each trim piece with my sealing iron set to "1.5". The LG covers and tip weight box are also done.
On to hinging and some pin striping.
-
Hinge time.
I use the discontinued Klett hinges. Yeah, I stocked up on plenty from hobby stores and eBay.
I use Pacer 560 glue to glue in the hinges. I use .032 wire threaded through the barrel on 1/2 of the hinge. For example, the stab uses 3 hinges on each elevator. I always hinge the movable part first (flaps or elevators). I put 3 hinges on the .032 music wire. BTW the music wire has a 90 degree bend on one end to help removed the wire once the hinge glue has set up. I always put the hinges so that the outer most "barrel" is toward the tip of the flap/elevator. This is to help when doing the final assembly, to align the .025 music wire hinge pin. You can move the flap/elevator up/down to help the wire find the barrel.
I use one of those "pulled" CA applicators to squirt the Pacer 560 glue into the hinge slot. A couple of good squirts usually does it. I don't fill the slot. The hinge takes up most of the slot and then you have a lot of ooze out and then you're cleaning up the extra glue. Gets to be a real pain. Once the glue is in the slots, I then insert the root hinge, then the rest out to the tip. I align the hinge in the slot and then make sure the .032 wire just barely touches the LE of the flap/elevator. Don't push too hard on the hinge or you'll deform the wire. You want to keep it straight along the LE. Set aside to dry.
When the flap/elevator side is hinged, I then "marry" them to the wing/stab TE. Another post regarding that.
-
I did the "inking" this evening. I use Black Super Monokote and slice out each line with my scalpel. Each line is about 1/32 thick. I found I could even do 1/64 thick line this way if I wanted to. I mark the flap/elevator where I want the lines to go and then tack it in place with my sealing iron set to about 2. Once in place, I then press the line firmly with my iron and the trim the line. Another firm press all over the line and we're done. A little wiping with alcohol to clean up the fine line Sharpie and now we're done.
I did the final hinging too. The steps I take are:
1) I trim the stab hinges to fit the 1/2 wide TE. The hinges are about 3/4 long so I trim off about 1/4 inch.
2) I then slip the .032 wire into the tip hinge on an elevator.
3) I then add the stab half and insert the wire through the hinge assembly.
4) Push the wire toward the root to the next hinge and repeat adding the stab half until all the hinges are added. 3 in my case.
5) I do the same for the other elevator.
6) I then dry fit the elevators to the stab with the horn.
7) When satisfied all is good, I then remove one elevator and squirt the Pacer 560 glue into the slot. Not too much here because the hinge slot is enclosed in the stab TE because of the CF.
8 ) I then install the elevator on the horn, then the root hinge through the tip. Wiping up all of the ooze out.
9) I then use thin strips of tape to ensure a tight hinge gap. I'll be adding some tape later on to seal the hinge gap at a later time.
10) Then the other elevator like wise.
Ditto for the flaps except the hinges didn't need trimming down. The excess length just went through the TE. If I remember the hinge slot on the wing TE was 1/2 long too.
On some of the pictures below, I just used some printed paper letters and numbers to see how it will look when done.
Tomorrow I'll add the correct hinge pins of .025 music wire and then on to installing the wing.
-
Crist,
So you when you assemble and fly the airplane the Klett hinges will have .025" wire in them and not the .032"? Just checking. Is there any kind of issue with slop in the controls? I can see where the hinges would be incredibly free with the .007" clearance between the hole diameter and the wire diameter. I wouldn't think of doing this on an R/C airplane but then again the controls are usually driven by a horn on the side or middle of the control surface and not from the end like on a stunter. I can see where the smaller wire diameter may not be an issue when the surface is driven from the end.
I just finished a Trophy Trainer last year and used the Kletts with a solid piece of wire running through the hinges. I used the .032" like the original pins, I did not think to use a smaller diameter. Let me know your thoughts.
Shawn
-
Crist,
So you when you assemble and fly the airplane the Klett hinges will have .025" wire in them and not the .032"? Just checking. Is there any kind of issue with slop in the controls? I can see where the hinges would be incredibly free with the .007" clearance between the hole diameter and the wire diameter. I wouldn't think of doing this on an R/C airplane but then again the controls are usually driven by a horn on the side or middle of the control surface and not from the end like on a stunter. I can see where the smaller wire diameter may not be an issue when the surface is driven from the end.
I just finished a Trophy Trainer last year and used the Kletts with a solid piece of wire running through the hinges. I used the .032" like the original pins, I did not think to use a smaller diameter. Let me know your thoughts.
Shawn
Shawn,
Yes, I use .025 wire as the hinge pin. I haven't noticed any slop. Remember that the flap is 26 inches long and there are 6 hinges. Really no slop at all. Also remember that I use tape to seal the hinge line on both flaps and elevators. I don't think most R/C ships have there hinge lines sealed with tape. Where the horn is has noting to do with using .025 wire.
-
When he gets it done as well as test flights, maybe put this all on a disc for us to add to our library. Learning some new stuff from this Crist. Texas must be good for you. H^^
-
When he gets it done as well as test flights, maybe put this all on a disc for us to add to our library. Learning some new stuff from this Crist. Texas must be good for you. H^^
Thank you Doc. It's here for all to see and learn. Once in awhile, I refer to a previous build log of mine to see how I did it!
Guled the wing in tonight. Tomorrow I'll add pictures.
-
Let's get the wing in this thing!
The first thing to do was to cut out the bulkheads for the wing. Once that was done, I enlarged the fuselage cut out on the outboard side near the LE. It really didn't take too much. Once I could get the wing in the fuselage I installed the flaps and "shimmed" them with 1/8 balsa on each side of the fuselage. This locates the TE tip to tip distance. You have to have the horn in place but not glued yet. I measured out from the center of the wing equal distance and made a mark with a fine line Sharpie. I then used a tape measure pinned to the tail post to get equal reading to the marks on the wing TE. I then marked the fuselage sides both top and bottom. I removed the wing and then cut "VEE" notches in the Monokote to give a good gluing surface. The point of each "VEE" is equal to the outside of the fuselage. The wing was inserted into the fuselage and the ailerons were once again attached and shimmed to locate the TE. I then used the tape measure to get the wing straight in the fuselage. I also used some 1/2 maple motor stock at the tips to ensure the wing was level with the top of the fuselage. BTW, all this is done with the top of the fuselage on the bench with the nose section overhanging the edge so it will lie flat on the bench. Once satisfied with the wing position, I use some thin CA to tack it into place. One final check and then I use medium CA along the inside of the fuselage to lock the wing in place. When cured, I flip the airplane over and CA the top of the wing. Another final check and all is well!
I then cut a "filler" for the LE from some 1/16 stock and glued it in with thin CA.
I used some CF tow to secure the flap horn bushing in place along with some thin CA. Once that is cured and the flap horn is secured, I removed the flaps.
I then fiber glassed the center section, top and bottom. I used 1 1/2 oz. FG and my MGS 285 epoxy. I cut each section of FG to 1/2 inch overlap up the fuselage side and each bulkhead. I then use 3M 77 to spray a very, very, very, light dusting on one side of the FG. This is done so aid in positioning the FG on the center section. Once positioned, I use a acid brush to apply the epoxy. I use a little excess and the brush to force the epoxy into the joint between the wing and the fuselage. Once the section is all epoxied up I then blot the excess epoxy with a small sheet of toilet paper folded over several times. I blot the epoxy up till there are no more "shiny" spots. Shiny spots are "pools" of epoxy and all they do is add weight. Once the top and bottom have cured, I trimmed the FG cloth and cut it away from the push rod opening in the top of the wing.
Up next, the controls.
-
For the controls, I install the flap push rod into the bell crank ball link. It's a bit tedious, but it can be done. I've done this on most of my full fuselage models and had to cut a hole in the sheeting only once. Once the push rod is installed the length is adjusted for neutral. When making up the fuselage sides I drill a 1/16 hole in the fuselage along the wing center line just aft of the flap horn. This is my neutral set point.
The elevator push rod is next. I get it close to the correct length and the ball links are inline with each other, I insert it through the bottom most aft of the fuselage. It is then bolted to the flap horn and the to the elevator horn. On the elevator horn I use a slider horn. You'll notice the placement of the washers. 1 under the head of the socket head screw to act as a "keeper" if the ball link comes apart and 1 on either side of the slider horn. Do not omit the washers on each side of the slide. Without them, the slider part will spread open due to the ball link and you'll have a control failure.
The stab is then inserted into the fuselage and the elevators are installed. They are shimmed with 1/8 balsa on each side of the fuselage to set the stab TE and then I measure from the flap hinge line to the stab hinge line at each stab tip and when they are the same, the stab is pinned in place. A quick check of the controls and then I mark the stab Monokote so I can trim it before the stab gets glued to the fuselage.
When all is well, I apply a small drop of J-B Weld epoxy to the flap horn side of the push rod hardware.
The stab is then removed and the Monokote is trimmed. The stab will be glued in at a later date when the fuselage is covered with 2/10 CF.
On to closing up the fuselage.
-
With the controls done, I closed up the fuselage.
I wet the edges of the fuselage and the "blocks" so that when they dry, it will result in a nice tight glue line. I used Pica Gluit to join the molded pieces to the fuselage because it sands well and won't leave a "bump". They are "clamped" to the fuselage using masking tape.
-
Thanks Crist, I put the wing into the B-25 and used the flaps to get the wing centered. Spot glued using CA. Once I seen all was straight I used more CA. Then I mixed up the poly-fil and filled the joint. Amazing how this stuff stays in place. Must have read this procedure on one of your other builds. Thanks. Didn't realize how big this thing is, thanks again. H^^
-
Doc,
It does make sense to use the flaps to center the TE of the wing doesn't it?
Today I cut out the tail wheel well.
I locate the center line and where I want it to be fore and aft. I measure the front and the back, in my case 1 3/4 inches.
I then used a 1/2 brass tubing sharpened to cut the holes at either end, centered on the center line. I then connect the holes using a ruler and scalpel. I then dry fit the 1/64 wall and mark the parting edge and the around the perimeter to get the right height. I then trim the ply wall and glue it in place using thin CA.
When dry, I'll sand the edges flush with the bottom sheeting.
-
I have been detail sanding the fuselage and pieces getting them to be ready to cover with the CF veil. I have been using some Aeropoxy Lite to do some of the filling so it takes a day between coats. In a few days it should be ready to start the finishing phase. Details, details......
-
This afternoon I started to do the finish. A quick summary of what it'll be. I use SIG dope and DuPont 3608S voc thinner. I'll use Nitrate for the base coats because it helps keep the CF "stuck" to the fuselage. I'll use Nitrate through the filler coats. Then I switch to Butyrate. For the clear I use SIG Lite-Coat.
I'm applying the first several coats of Nitrate clear thinned 2/1 dope/thinner to the bare balsa. I'll do at least 2 coats, but probably do 3 because I thinned it out. I'm really amazed how just a few coats of dope will start to change the "feel" or "texture" of the balsa wood! It starts to take on that "plastic" quality.
When done with these 2 or 3 coats I'll weigh and report of the weight gain. As a matter of fact, I'll report throughout the finishing process what the weights are. It's a good reference.
-
OK, the 3 coats of 2/1 Nitrate have dried and sanded lightly with dry 600 grit. Total weight gain was 4 grams. On to the CF veil.
-
The 2/10 CF veil is on! I used 3/1 thinner/nitrate dope to apply. Where I could I put some dope on the wood then put the CF on top of that. Then brushed it liberally. A quick trim with some 400 grit sandpaper. The CF feels like velvet! Weight added was 3 grams total. Total weight of finish - 7 grams.
Next up 2 coats of 2/1 dope/thinner.
-
Tonight I put on 2 coats of 50/50 Nitrate/thinner. After the first coat, I dry sanded it with 320 grit to help smooth the surface. Past experience taught me to sand it after 1 coat and not to wait till after the 2nd coat. If I wait till after the 2nd coat, the CF gets real hard and it is a lot harder to sand smooth. So I sand some now and then again when the 2nd dries. Maybe tomorrow because I have a contest in Dallas Saturday.
After sanding the 2nd coat, I'll install the stab, fin, and fit the canopy. After that the fillets.
Here are some pics after the 2nd coat has been applied but not sanded. Once sanded, I'll weigh the parts.
-
Today I got the stab, fin, and canopy glued in.
I aligned the stab TE using shims between the elevators and the fuselage. Then I measured from the wing TE to the stab aft most edge on the TE. When these were equal, I lined up the stab tips to the top of the wing to get the stab level. After triple checking, I used some thin CA to tack it into place. Once I was satisfied, more thin CA along with some medium CA. To aid in gluing the stab in, I cut the fin slot into the top aft portion of the fuselage. I could then get down on the inside of the fuselage where the stab goes through. I then epoxied in the elevator horn bushings. When everything was set up, I removed the elevators.
I then fit the fin to the fuselage. I notched the bottom of the fin to go "over" the bulkhead at the stab LE. I then notched the aft portion of the fin TE to fit the fuselage because of the taper of the fuselage. I then used my triangle to "square" up the fin and glued it to the top of the stab with Pica Gluit and then CA along the fuselage top.
I then trimmed the canopy to fit. I use a 1/4 thick bulkhead to act as a "shelf" for the aft portion of the canopy. I used some 1/2 brass tubing to cut a vent hole in the top skin. I roughed up the canopy with some 80 grit sandpaper and epoxied the canopy in place. I used some masking tape as clamps.
Tomorrow I blend in the canopy and start the fillets!
Oh, BTW, the 2 coats of 50/50 Nitrate dope and sanded added 6 grams to the model. Total weight added for the finish so far is 13 grams.
-
I still love your detail work. But, will it be too light for those Texas breezes? LL~ LL~
-
I still love your detail work. But, will it be too light for those Texas breezes? LL~ LL~
Doc,
Those Texas breezes can be a bit trying! Stay tuned for the "rest of the story...."
The detail work has been done and now onto the fillets.
-
The fillets are done. I did them the same way as I do all my fillets. I outlined the way in my Legacy 40 build log found here:
http://stunthanger.com/smf/gettin-all-amp'ed-up!/legacy-40-electric-a-build-log/msg398194/#msg398194 (http://stunthanger.com/smf/gettin-all-amp'ed-up!/legacy-40-electric-a-build-log/msg398194/#msg398194)
The fillets added a whopping 3 grams! Ya gotta love Aeropoxy Lite. Not only light, but strong too!
Tomorrow I'll sand the fillets then brush on some Nitrate on them directly. Then on to the filler coats.
-
I've never tried Aeropoxy Lite, does it sand as easily as the blue Aero Fil? Looking at the photos the Aeropoxy reminds me of the old Sig Epoxolite, that stuff was like trying to sand a piece of granite.
-
I've never tried Aeropoxy Lite, does it sand as easily as the blue Aero Fil? Looking at the photos the Aeropoxy reminds me of the old Sig Epoxolite, that stuff was like trying to sand a piece of granite.
Wayne,
I think the Aeropoxy Lite is harder to sand then Aero Fil. I've never used Aero Fil. I do think I remember reading that Aeropoxy Lite is much more structurally stronger than Aero Fil, so I would expect Aero Fil to sand easier. Yes, Aeropoxy Lite sure looks like SIG Epoxolite.
Because Aeropoxy is harder to sand, I try to get it as smooth as possible. Aeropoxy Lite does not sand like "a piece of granite." If you look carefully, you'll see where I used it on the turtle deck to help take care of some "waviness". It sanded quite well and didn't load up the sandpaper either.
-
The fillets are sanded. I use a radius tool that I made up from some 1/8 Lite-Ply and 3/16 dowel. I wrap some 320 grit sand paper around the dowel and up onto the Lite-Ply where I hold onto the tool and do my sanding. I also use some rolled up sandpaper where needed.
Once sanded I wipe them clean with acetone. Then using a touch up brush, I apply some Nitrate dope to the fillets. I do this to keep the finish from blistering. The Nitrate dope helps keep the dope stuck to the fillets.
Next up the filler coats.
-
I applied 2 filler coats and sanded them off today. The filler coats were 50/50 Nitrate dope/thinner with a Tablespoon of Zinc Sterate added. The first coat was brushed on, and when dry, sanded off. Then the 2nd coat was brushed on and again sanded off. The model was dusted off and weighed. The difference was 2 grams!
Tonight I'm doing the last of the Nitrate dope. I'm brushing on 2 coats of 40/60 dope/thinner to "seal" the model. These will be lightly sanded then at least 1 or 2 coats of SIG Lite-Coat clear will be brushed on, then sanded lightly. Hopefully from there I can spray the gray blocking coat.
Getting there. Weight added for the finish so far is 15 grams.
I know there will be a lot of glazing putty used on this model. Lots of dents and such will need to be filled.
-
The late Rusty Brown told me to never brush the carbon dust off after sanding. He stated it help fill the weave with another coat of dope.
-
The late Rusty Brown told me to never brush the carbon dust off after sanding. He stated it help fill the weave with another coat of dope.
Makes sense!
-
I sanded the last of the Nitrate coats off today with some 600 grit. Weight added by these 2 "sealer" coats of Nitrate was 2 grams. Total so far is 17 grams.
Onto brushing on 2 coats of butyrate SIG Lite-Coat clear to get the model ready for the grey blocking coat.
-
I brushed on 2 coats of SIG clear Lite-Coat dope thinned to about 40/60 dope/thinner. I then applied 3 more coats of about 25/75 dope thinner. The model now has a nice shine to it. The next thing to do is to wet sand the clear with 600 grit to prep it for the grey blocking coats. As a matter of fact all sanding from now on will be wet sanding. These clear coats added 4 grams. Total weight from bare balsa to now is 21 grams.
-
I shot 1 blocker coat tonight. I used SIG white and a little Jet Black dope and DuPont 3608Svoc thinner. I'm guessing that the ratio was 35/65 dope/thinner. Actually I ran out of dope before I could finish the right side of the fin. :) Tomorrow I'll start filling the dents and such with automotive glazing putty.
The weight gain on this coat was 7 grams. 28 grams so far.
-
OK, I started filling the dents tonight!
-
Crist
thank so much for sharing these info on line, I follow this with open eye and excitement. It's a great learning opportunity for me.
Could you advise about how to deal with the paint neighboring with film, or gluing the fuse to the wing while there is film around the area.
many thanx in advance,
sina
-
Crist
thank so much for sharing these info on line, I follow this with open eye and excitement. It's a great learning opportunity for me.
Could you advise about how to deal with the paint neighboring with film, or gluing the fuse to the wing while there is film around the area.
many thanx in advance,
sina
Sina,
Good to hear from you! I had the pleasure of judging your nephew last weekend. It was great!
First I'll deal with the film covering where the wing/stab meets the fuselage. I insert the wing and line it up. Then I use a fine line Sharpie to mark the top and bottom of the wing along the fuselage. Then I remove the wing and measure about every 3/8 or 1/2 inch along the line just made. I then use my scalpel and cut small triangles toward the center of the wing. Once the top and bottom are done, I go over the Monokote with the sealing iron to be sure it is stuck down real well. In the pictures you can see what the wing will look like with the triangles cut into the Monokote. BTW, the Monokote only goes into the fuselage about 3/8 inch. I then insert the wing, line it up and glue it in.
Concerning the paint line on the Monokote. I run some masking tape just to the outside of the fillet and do the filler and grey coats. Before the white goes on, I re-mask the line but just a little further out about 1/32 inch. This is because you want the white to cover the grey edge that was along the masking tape. Then when I do the clear coats, I re-mask the line again about 1/32 further out to be sure all the color is covered with clear. This has worked real well with the nitro engines and of course no problems at all with electric.
Hope this helps and take care.
-
It looks like you glued the fuselage to monokote and the only thing really holding it is the fiberglass? Why didn't you go for a wood to wood joint?
MM
I've done it this way for at least 10 years without any problems. So I stick with what I know works.
-
I like it Crist and why change some thing that works.
-
After a couple of days of glazing, sanding, glazing, sanding, etc I decided that I need to put on another coat of grey to really see how it looks. But instead I decided to spray on some of Sparky's DC 540 grey primer first. Here's the results. When dry I'll wet sand it with some 600 grit and see what it looks like.
More later today.
-
All sanded down and ready for the white. I left "a lot" of the primer on the model. I sanded it down till I could just see the grey dope that I sprayed on the other night. The glazing putty ( there was a lot of it!) and the DC540 primer added another 14 grams. So from when the fillets were done till now added 23 grams. More than I would like but the effort and weight gain was worth it. Total weight from bare balsa to now is 44 grams. My budget is 70 grams. 15 grams for the white, 5 grams for the red, 3 grams for the blue, 15 grams for the clear. That should put me over budget by 12 grams......we'll see how it turns out.
-
Christ, is that going to be a Rabe rudder, or just an adjustable one?
-
To increase the safety margin?
MM
Give me a break!
I've never had even a hint of structural failure of any of my stunters.
You build how you want and I''ll build my way.
Increase safety margin! Ha!
-
Christ, is that going to be a Rabe rudder, or just an adjustable one?
Both, maybe. At first adjustable, then I'll try a Rabe style, then decide which works best for me.
-
With the glass cloth bonding the center sheeting to the fuse sides internally, that airplane is not coming apart under "normal" pull test and flying conditions. Probably not even in a crash. Very nice work on the entire model. Crist, thanks for taking the time to photograph each step and sharing. Lots to learn here. :)
Shawn
-
With the glass cloth bonding the center sheeting to the fuse sides internally, that airplane is not coming apart under "normal" pull test and flying conditions. Probably not even in a crash. Very nice work on the entire model. Crist, thanks for taking the time to photograph each step and sharing. Lots to learn here. :)
Shawn
Thanks Shawn for the kind words.
P.S. Here's a picture of my Legacy 40 after going straight in. You're right on the part not even coming apart in a crash!
-
I finished shooting the white today. What I usually do is spray on at least 2 coats over the entire airframe. Then additional coats where only the white will show like on the fuselage sides.
I'll give it a thourough sanding with 600 grit wet and then shoot on a clear coat to seal the white. That should happen tomorrow.
19 grams were added for the white. 63 grams so far.
-
Was the plane too damage to graft a new nose on? I know when my P-47 went in on maiden flight, I too many pieces to pick up and internal pieces was unbelievable.
-
Was the plane too damage to graft a new nose on? I know when my P-47 went in on maiden flight, I too many pieces to pick up and internal pieces was unbelievable.
No Doc, it wasn't too damaged. Just the front end. It was heavy and I didn't have the heart to rebuild the front end. I ended up giving it away.
-
I sprayed a coat of clear to seal the white after I wet sanded the white using some worn 600 grit. For the clear I'm using SIG Lite-Coat clear. I used 2 oz of dope, 1 oz of retarder, and 6 oz of DuPont 3608S thinner. It went on real well and flowed out very nicely. I'll let this dry over night to be sure I have good adhesion, then a light wet sanding with 600 grit then I'll be ready for the red trim. I'll let you know what the weight of the clear coat was tomorrow after sanding.
I use the clear as a sealer coat for the white because when I spray on the red and blue trim colors, then when I wet sand the edges the slurry will "tint" the white.
Here's a "teaser" pic of the canopy!
-
Flawless work...
Marcus
-
(http://memecrunch.com/meme/3HBJX/iz-nice/image.png)
-
Thanks guys. Greg, I laughed out loud!
-
Give me a break!
Increase safety margin! Ha!
No kidding. Some people just don't get it Crist, or read first, or listen, or... D>K
-
Here's a "teaser" pic of the canopy!
Now that's why i asked you about that in the PM! That's so smooth, it looks like molded plastic. It's beautiful!
Thank you Christ
-
Wayne, Yeah I know........
Dane, Thanks. P.S. You know there's a plastic canopy under there! :)
-
I thought I'd share the equipment I use when spray painting my models.
I use a cheapie $20 HVLP Touch Up gun from Harbor Freight to spray the white and clear coats.
I use a Badger 250 "Spray Gun" for the red and blue trim colors. I also use this when inking to clear coat the ink lines as I go.
I use a Badger 350 single action airbrush to frost the canopy and apply the de-ice boot to the fin LE.
I also have a 2 HP 8 gallon Harbor Freight less than $100 air compressor that I use.
I use 3M fine line tape from the 471+ family. This stuff is great. Great adhesion and very flexable to make a tight radius like the aft portion of my windows. But pretty pricey like $11 a roll at Walmart.com. Good stuff and worth every penny. You spend months building and finishing a model and blow it on paint lines? No way with this stuff. 1/4 inch stuff shown in the picture. I mostly use 1/8.
-
I forgot to weigh the model after sanding the clear sealer coat before I sprayed on the red. I think it was only 2 or 3 grams.
I sprayed on the red trim today. I use SIG Fokker Red for that nice deep blood red color. I used my Badger 250 spray gun. I used 2 oz of Fokker Red, a little retarder, and about 6 oz of DuPont 3608S thinner. The dope has to be pretty thin to spray using this spray gun.
I'll weight it tomorrow after clearing off the "flash" and doing a light sanding. Tomorrow the blue!
-
Today I sprayed the blue on the bottom. I mix 3 parts SIG Dark Blue and 1 part Miami Blue to get a color that matches the Sapphire Blue Monokote trim. I added some retarder and thinner like I did with the red and used my Badger 250 spray gun. Tomorrow I'll do the stripes and weigh the model. My guess I added a few grams of blue.
-
This afternoon I sprayed on the side stripes. I used my blue paint. I used 1/4 inch tape and just followed along the bottom of the red and then I used small pieces of 1/4 tape to space the painted part of the stripe. Again I used my Badger 250 spray gun.
Tomorrow I'll clean off the flash and wet sand the red and blue color trim and feather the paint lines. After that I'll mask off and frost the canopy.
Then on to the clear coats.
So far from bare balsa through the stripes The finish weighs 69 grams.
-
Lookin' good! y1
-
Lookin' good! y1
Thanks Wayne.
I'll get to the canopy tomorrow.
-
The canopy is frosted!
I outline the canopy "framework" with 3M 471+ 1/8 fine line tape. On the "windshield" frame I like to put a taper as it goes to the bottom of the frame work. It seems to add some "beefiness" to the structure and looks authentic. Once taped and masked off I use my Badger 350 single action airbrush to very lightly go over the whole area to begin the frosting. I usually do this with the airbrush a little bit further a way from the canopy. I try to get individual dots of paint. I don't over do this. A little goes a long way. Otherwise you'll end up with a darker canopy. Once the whole area is "spotted" I readjust my airbrush to give me a nice small "foggy" type of pattern. I then go all around the outline and up the vertical frame work. I usually start off the canopy and move the airbrush onto the area I want sprayed. Again, I go with just a little at a time and go around several times till I get what I want. When that's done, I then go to the corners and spray a small radius of frosting onto each one. You can see what I mean in the pictures. Remember what Windy would say, "less is more". Don't over do it. Under do it is better.
After I unmask the canopy, I then spray on a coat of clear to protect the "fragile" frosting.
The frosting seems to darken after a coat or 2 of clear, that's why you don't want to over do it.
Then once that is dry, I'll spray the whole model with a coat of clear to seal all the colors and trim. Then it'll be on to the inking. Stay tuned!
-
You are an artist in disguise.
-
You are an artist in disguise.
Thanks Doc.
-
This morning I wet sanded the clear sealer coat using 1000 grit sandpaper. The seal coat of clear added 5 grams. Total weight so far is 74 grams.
The model is now ready for inking later today. Getting close.
-
I inked the model tonight. I use Staedtler pigment liner. These pens are acid free and archival quality ink. I've used these pens on models 10 years old and the ink lines have not faded. Good stuff.
After wet sanding the sealer coat I then ink the panel lines and rivets. When I make a mistake the ink can be "erased" with some Q-Tips and rubbing alcohol.
Next up the clear top coats. I'll spray on at least 2 and probably 4. We'll see what the weight increase goes with each coat.
-
Today I sprayed on 2 clear coats. I'm guessing that the SIG Clear Lite-Coat dope was thinned to about 1/3 dope 2/3 thinner. I added a little retarder and some Dave Brown Flex-All to the mixture. I use the Flex-All only on the top coats.
It's been several hours since I sprayed and I did a quick weight check. Looks like 8 grams were added and it's still gassing off. Total finish so far is 82 grams.
-
How "touchy" or prone to running is the Staedtler ink when you're spraying the clear over it?
-
How "touchy" or prone to running is the Staedtler ink when you're spraying the clear over it?
Not too bad. I let the line air dry for about 1 minute then spray on some clear with my Badger 250 spray gun. Then after that I can put on a fairly heavy medium coat of clear without any problems using my HF HVLP gun.
-
I wet sanded the first 2 coats with 1200 grit sandpaper. Then I shot the final 2 coats of clear today. Both went on very smooth and laid out very well. Very happy with the finish. I'll let it gas out for a few days then work on getting the motor and electrics mounted. Then in a few weeks, I'll wet sand and start the rubbing out process.
Total weight of the finish was 90 grams. 20 gram over budget which was 15 grams under estimated! Might make 49 ounces total ready to fly. Realistically more like 50 ounces. We'll see.
I started the finish on Feb.11th. 3 weeks ago today.
-
Can't say I see a need to rub it out. ;D
-
The length of this build is taking on Howard Rush proportions. One the other hand, making it right is just making it right.
-
I got another Spin 44 NIB today. Tomorrow I'll wire it up.
I also made up a new set of .015 x 63 feet eye to eye lines and spruced up one of my handles.
Maybe tomorrow I'll dry fit the airplane and get a decent weight for it. It'll be close to 49 oz!
-
I installed the electrics tonight. I removed the black battery wire from the ESC and added a longer wire and shortened the timer wires. There is no need for a pile of spaghetti in the area!
Igor would be pleased, I put the heat sink up into the "breeze" and the attaching Dual Lock on the component side. :)
Lots of room for cooling air. It does get hot here in the Dallas area!
Tomorrow I'll add the battery hold down and the hatch release.
-
Well today I decided to redo the my mods to the ESC. I took off the heat shrink and used a 7/8 x 1 piece of 1/16 ply on the component side so the Dual Lock would have a nice flat area to stick to. I also tied off the timer and switch wires to the capacitors. This will give a better strain relief. I then used some clear heat shrink over the whole ESC. I then added the Dual Lock to the "bottom" of the ESC for mounting.
I then made up my hatch release. It consists of some 5/32 and 1/8 O.D. aluminum tubing, some very short lengths of 3/32 music wire and 2 wheel collars. The 5/32 tubing was glued to a piece of 1/8 square balsa and glued to the aft bulkhead. I then made up the plunger using the 1/8 tubing and the small 3/32 music wire was used inside the 1/8 tubing where the wheel collar set screw goes. In use the hatch is held in place using 2 strong magnets and when ready to open the hatch, I just reach underneath and find the plunger and push up. This pops the hatch off.
I also cut off the excess axle length on the main lading gear and mounted the wheels. I estimated the MLG at 50 grams and it came in at 48 grams.
Tomorrow the battery hold down.
I included some side pictures of the ESC switch and the arming plug receptacle.
-
I had bad luck with the Pigment Liner pens. It reacted badly to House of Kolor catalyzed polyurethane topcoat. Such is life.
-
I had bad luck with the Pigment Liner pens. It reacted badly to House of Kolor catalyzed polyurethane topcoat. Such is life.
I've had zero problems with SIG dope for the 15 years I've been flying stunt. I tried another brand and had problems about 10 years ago. I went right back to SIG and never looked back.
-
Yea, I've used Certified and Randolphs for years. No issues. This was a catalyzed polyurethane that reacted to something in the ink. Rare occurrence. I never had problems with Rapidograph or Micron Pigma pens. So, I'll just go back to using those.
-
Yea, I've used Certified and Randolphs for years. No issues. This was a catalyzed polyurethane that reacted to something in the ink. Rare occurrence. I never had problems with Rapidograph or Micron Pigma pens. So, I'll just go back to using those.
That's what cool about our hobby, you use what works for you! Many different ways to get there.
-
On the arming plug, did you just glue a deans connector into a piece of plywood or can you get them with a flange?
Thanks,
MM
-
On the arming plug, did you just glue a deans connector into a piece of plywood or can you get them with a flange?
Thanks,
MM
I just epoxied it to the plywood.
-
I finished the battery hold down, sealed the hinge lines, and hinged the rudder. I still have to apply my AMA numbers, get a spinner, and hook up the adjustable rudder linkage. The spinner and linkage are on order so it'll be a week before that gets done.
I did install a beat up spinner and prop and weighed the model. It weighed 51.6 oz. My budget was for 50.3 oz. I checked the CG and it balanced out at 15% MAC. I'm considering getting a Cobra 3510.24 820Kv motor for the model. It weighs 1 1/4 oz less which will help move the CG back about 1/8 inch to about 17%. We'll see how it flies first.
Pictures to come when it is all done. It does look good though!
-
I really like your super clean electrical installation. I like how you shortened the wires and eliminated at least one set of connectors but you still have good access & serviceability.
Another wonderful project from the Rigotti Works. Thanks for bringing us along for the ride. CLP** BW@ 010!
-
Total finish so far is 82 grams.
82 grams, does this include the film on wings & tail, or just the dope on fuse & rudder ?
-
I really like your super clean electrical installation. I like how you shortened the wires and eliminated at least one set of connectors but you still have good access & serviceability.
Another wonderful project from the Rigotti Works. Thanks for bringing us along for the ride. CLP** BW@ 010!
Thanks Dennis. I hope you enjoyed the ride!
-
82 grams, does this include the film on wings & tail, or just the dope on fuse & rudder ?
Hi Allan,
The 82 grams is just for the doped areas. The fuselage, fin, and rudder. I'm sure the finish could have been made lighter, but with me coming in under budget on the construction phase I felt it wasn't all that critical. If you look at my weight and balance sheet the weights for the wing, stab, flaps, and elevators all include the Monokote, horns, hinges, and flap push rod. It's just the way I do it.
-
It is his way. You ought to see some of the stuff people do when building and finishing a plane. Plus I like it. VD~
-
Motor man,
You comments are way out of line.
Crist has been showing one of the best building sequences that I have seen. We all have different ways of doing things, and there is room for us all to learn how the other guy does it. No one is saying that their way is better or worse. If you think your method is better,do it your way.
-
Don't get what, that you like to bully people on the internet? He's gluing to monokote (why) then making up for it by using a big fillet of fiberglass and epoxy and half the glass is over monokote too. I guess it's strong enough but what's wrong with ending the covering at the outside of the fuselage then gluing wood to wood? Isn't that the way most people do it? Is there some compelling reason for this method?
MM
Never mind MM, you just go ahead and keep doing it your way and Crist will continue his way. I've seen many of his finished models, all are superbly finished and are way more than strong enough everywhere.
There is nothing wrong with wood-to-wood but it isn't absolutely necessary. There's no need to overthink it. Did I say there's no need to overthink it?
Myself, I cover and finish the wing with Polyspan and dope and then give that finished surface just a light scuff with 320 before epoxying it into the fuselage. After that it gets an Aero-Fil fillet all the way around. I'm 100% confident that you could drive over the finished model with a dump truck and the joint itself would still be intact.
-
Hi Allan,
The 82 grams is just for the doped areas. The fuselage, fin, and rudder. I'm sure the finish could have been made lighter, but with me coming in under budget on the construction phase I felt it wasn't all that critical. If you look at my weight and balance sheet the weights for the wing, stab, flaps, and elevators all include the Monokote, horns, hinges, and flap push rod. It's just the way I do it.
Will you be posting and update of your 2016 W&B file reflecting the finished model ?
-
Allan,
Yeah, I sure will. It's almost done.
-
Looks like the weather will be good enough for the first flights on Wednesday! A full report tomorrow. Batteries fully charged, spinner and rudder linkage done.
-
Looks like the weather will be good enough for the first flights on Wednesday! A full report tomorrow. Batteries fully charged, spinner and rudder linkage done.
Is the nut on the handle tight? ;D
-
I flew it this morning. Four 1 minute flight followed by a 2 1/2 minute flight. The first 2 1 minute flights got the handle neutral setting and the wins level, the second 2 1 minute flights got the turn rate equal on insides and outsides. The 2 1/2 minute flight was exploring inside/outside loops and H8's. The wind was coming up when I was at the circle and the last flight, the 2 1/2 minute flight, I got some nasty turbulence off the treeline so I decided to pack up and do more flying another day. All-in-all I'm happy with the airplane. It doesn't feel nose heavy but I really need to do more flying and more trimming for sure.
I forgot to show my battery hold down method. I notice that the nose section seem to "twist" a bit so I designed a battery hold and nose stiffener all in one. The main part is a piece of 1/16 Birch ply about 4 inches long and the inside width of the battery compartment. It is hold in place by 4 #2 Servo mounting screws. The aft screws only need to be loosened because I notch the hold down to slip under their heads. The pictures should make this easily understood. On the battery side of the plywood I have some thick foam tape to actually touch the top of the battery.
-
Keep trying, I may try electric one of these years. But, I short tank my new IC powered planes. Glad the plane is working for you.
-
Had the plane out today. Weather was very good indeed. Many thanks to the other DMAA members who were out flying for helping me get the wings level. I flew 2 complete patterns today. I'm going to really like this airplane and the way it flys! Still working on minor trim issues for the next several flying sessions.
-
Great to see that you got some flying time. Airplane looks good.
-
Thanks Fred.
-
Christ, I've only flown in Texas once so far. We have plenty of family and friends in Texas though. Got some trips planned to be out there this year. I hope to meet up with you and the DMAA guys!
-
Hopefully we can get together!
-
Crist, it's great to hear the plane is working. Of course you know you have some of the best to help you. H^^
-
Absolutely Doc!
-
The last few times out flying, I've been working on the trim for this plane. Last Thursday I was out and after several trim flights, I decided I didn't like the direction I was headed so I quit and went home. The plane was flying pronounced tail low, there was a fair amount of "up" elevator all to get that "equal turn on both insides and outsides. Also when the motor quit, the model had a tendency to float a bit. Not surprising with the up elevator. After thinking about the plane I decided to go back to point "zero" and start over. I centered the elevator to stab with the flaps at neutral and reset my handle back to equal amount for a truly neutral setting on the lines. And then I added some upthrust. I added 2 washers to the "top" mounting screw and 1 each washer to the right and left midway mounting screws.
I then went out this morning and did 5 test flights. The model was very close on the first flight. I adjusted the elevator push rod just a little and now I was getting a very near equal turn on both inside and outsides. The tail was flying very close to being straight both upright and inverted. A minor handle adjustment for neutral and it was flying very well. When the motor quits, the model settles into a nice decent and doesn't float like before.
A recap of the big problem I was having was that the model would turn a lot tighter on the outsides than the insides. When I adjusted the elevator push rod to get equal turns, the elevator was pointing up some and the model flew in a tail down attitude. Since I reset the controls and handle and added some upthrust, the model is flying very well and in the correct attitude.
I included a picture of the spinner to nose ring to show the amount of upthrust that 2 washers created. I could have used only 1 washer, but I wanted to be sure that the upthrust was plenty to really see what effect it had on the model. Here's the kicker - I used my CAD program to draw in what 2 washers do to the thrust line and it measured out to be........ 3 1/2 degrees of upthrust!
One thing I learned when flying RC helicopters, was give the helicopter what it needs, not what the "normal" is. In other words, if the normal high pitch would be 10 degrees to maintain RPM, and your helicopter still revs up, then give it 10 1/2 degrees to get the RPM to stay the same.
I'm leaving it like it is for the next several flying sessions and I'll work on getting into a finer trim now that the model is flying a lot "happier".
-
Thanks for the up date. I guess it is true, trimming is a never ending job. H^^
-
Another update. Finally got out to do some more flying. Put in 5 more flights. I did a minor adjustment to the elevator push rod length, adjusted the LO, and added back in about 1/10 ounce tip weight.
Starting to get comfortable with the plane. More flying today and Friday. Then our contest this weekend.
-
Six more flights today. No trim changes. Just trying to get some handle time. Starting to feel comfortable. Still more trimming to do but for right now, I need handle time.
-
This airplane garnered 17 points at the in both 2019 and 2020 NATS. I've received many compliments on how nice a model it was.
Today may it rest in peace.
The 2nd loop of the Clover in went in inverted. Pilot error all the way.
Time to start a new one.
-
OUCH! It's a sad day when any beautiful ship is lost. :( But I can't wait to see your next one. #^
Dennis
-
I know what the problem was. You went back to them 2- blade props!
-
I know what the problem was. You went back to them 2- blade props!
This was the first time I flew it since Cleveland. The 3 blade will have to wait till the PF is done in a couple of weeks.
-
That is sad and I never got to see it in person. D>K
-
This airplane garnered 17 points at the in both 2019 and 2020 NATS. I've received many compliments on how nice a model it was.
Today may it rest in peace.
The 2nd loop of the Clover in went in inverted. Pilot error all the way.
Time to start a new one.
Crist,
Sorry to see this, that was a nice plane.
James