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Author Topic: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log  (Read 15195 times)

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« on: January 18, 2013, 11:48:26 PM »
I thought that I would try some indoor electric C/L.  Igor's GeeBee caught my eye and after several emails and reviewing some threads on Stunt Hangar I decided to build one for myself.  This build log won't go into to much detail seeing Igor already has one here:
http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php?topic=19265.0

Here is Igor flying his.  Way cool!:


My GeeBee is built from the following:

I got the following from RCFoam:

3mm Depron foam.  Each sheet measures 13.8 x 39.4 inches.  I ordered 10 sheets which is enough to build 4 planes.
http://www.rcfoam.com/index.php?cPath=41&osCsid=a5cdf7e36ba1616d725c091ae3cceeb7

3mm x .5mm x 1000mm carbon fiber strip.  1 strip is all you need per plane.
http://www.rcfoam.com/product_info.php?cPath=96&products_id=699&osCsid=a5cdf7e36ba1616d725c091ae3cceeb7

2mm solid carbon fiber rod.  This is for the pushrod and landing gear struts.  
http://www.rcfoam.com/product_info.php?cPath=95&products_id=737&osCsid=a5cdf7e36ba1616d725c091ae3cceeb7

GWS 2" light weight wheels.
http://www.rcfoam.com/product_info.php?cPath=128&products_id=1196&osCsid=a5cdf7e36ba1616d725c091ae3cceeb7

Motor:
I got the motor from HeadsUpRC.  CF2822 1300Kv Looks like they are out of stock! 1/24/2013
http://www.headsuprc.com/servlet/the-1516/Emax-CF2822-1300kv-Outrunner/Detail

Another place to get the CF2822 motor: http://www.valuehobby.com/power-systems/brushless-motors/emax-cf2822-outrunner.html


Another motor that the Spainairds are using comes from Hobby King.  A 2205C-1400 You can get it stateside.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__26482__2205C_1400Kv_Brushless_motor_USA_Warehouse_.html


I got the batteries from Hobby King.  They are 2S 850mah 25C Zippy Compact.  Weight is 43g.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__25519__ZIPPY_Compact_850mAh_2S_25C_Lipo_Pack_USA_Warehouse_.html
I changed the 20awg wire and JST connectors to 16awg and EC2 connectors.  Much better. See post #29 1-25-2013

I'm going to use my Phoenix 25 ESC.  I really should be using a Phoenix 10 which weighs 10 grams less.  But I have the 25A ESC and would have to buy a Phoenix 10.  

Igor says the HiModel Cool 11A ESC works well but the brake must be off when in governor mode:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HiModel-COOL-Series-11A-Brushless-Speed-Controller-6A-LBEC-/130648047437?pt=US_Character_Radio_Control_Toys&hash=item1e6b3aff4d
or
http://www.himodel.com/electric/HiModel_COOL_Series_11A_Brushless_Speed_Controller_6A_LBEC.html

For a timer I'll either use a Hubin FM-9 or I have several JMP timers that I'm not using on any current planes.

GWS 10 x 4.7 Slo Fyler prop.  Lots of places have these.  I also have some APC 10 x 4.7 both tractor and pusher props to try.

The lines are 5 meters long and .014mm SpiderWire.  
Launch RPM will be about 4500rpm
Target weight will be about 215g
Lap times should be about 4.9 to 5 seconds.
Tip weight is 12g
Downthrust is 4 degrees.

Enough of the specs let's get to it.

The Spanish published a .pdf of the GeeBee which I then traced using my CAD program.  I then arranged the pieces to fit the 3mm foam.  I printed out my plans ( which I've included here in this post with Igor's permission) and then cut out an airplane in about 3 hours.  I cut up the plan of each piece a little larger and used an Elmer's glue stick to glue the plan to the foam.  I used the glue sparingly and only in a few places to tack glue it down.  Then I used my hobby knife with a #11 blade ( a new one please!  You'll need several) to carefully cut out the foam.  Let the blade do the cutting.  When the blade starts to get dull, it will "pull" and tear the foam.  After cutting out the foam, remove the plan and I used rubbing alcohol to clean off the glue.  Another benfit to this is that it also preps the foam for painting.

Tomorrow I'll cut out the bellcrank, motor mount, and crank mount from 1/16 ply.  Igor uses .6mm glass fiber board.  For the control horn, I'll use DuBro Razor horns.  I've use these on my RC planes and like them very much.

I did have to make a correction to the fuselage brace.  It was 1 7/8 wide and it went right up to the edge of the fuselage crutch between the wing TE and the stab.  So I made mine 1 1/2 wide.

I uploaded a set of the corrected drawings with a narrower fuselage brace, additional details, enlarged elevator cutout in the rudder, and relocated bell crank.  These are what I built 1/21/2013
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 09:10:07 AM by Crist Rigotti »
Crist
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Offline ron young

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2013, 04:45:21 AM »
  WOW very impressive i have never seen anything like that before.
   Thanks for sharing
   Ron

Offline MikeCoulombe

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2013, 09:10:32 AM »
This should be big fun.

Crist is there any way you can post a copy of the plans in "tiled" form so we can print straight on 8.5x11 paper?

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2013, 10:02:50 AM »
This should be big fun.

Crist is there any way you can post a copy of the plans in "tiled" form so we can print straight on 8.5x11 paper?


I'll see what I can do.
Crist
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Offline Robert-Jan

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2013, 10:38:01 AM »
I'll see what I can do.


Maybe you can save it as TIF format.
Then you import it in EXCEL.
What EXCEL yes.
Whit EXCEL you can scale and...... tile.

Greetings robert-Jan

Offline Stan Bidowski

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2013, 01:25:42 PM »
Thanks for this Crist! Will follow your posts with interest!
Igor's plane looks like a lot of fun. I like Mike's idea.
A post with a tiled plan would make printing it out
easy for anyone who wants to give it a try.
Stan  y1 
Stan Bidowski
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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2013, 03:25:36 PM »
Tiled versions of the drawings have been created and included in the opening post.  Everybody enjoy.
Crist
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Offline Stan Bidowski

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2013, 05:00:59 PM »
COOL! Thanks Crist!
 H^^

Stan
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Offline MikeCoulombe

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2013, 08:06:20 PM »
Thanks Crist
Okay Stan the race is on.

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2013, 10:44:20 PM »
Today's progress.

I made up the bell crank assembly and the motor mount out of 1/16 plywood.

Then I did my color scheme and used a fine line Sharpie for panel lines and trim tabs.

I got as far as the landing gear and their braces glued in.

I did have to make a correction to the fuselage brace.  It was 1 7/8 wide and it went right up to the edge of the fuselage crutch between the wing TE and the stab.  So I made mine 1 1/2 wide.  It fits very well now.  I'll correct the drawings on Sunday.

In the picture, the fuse top and rudder are taped in place.


« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 09:11:41 AM by Crist Rigotti »
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Offline paul winter

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2013, 11:43:11 AM »
hi all
Cant wait till march to go and fly these in Produbice
paul

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2013, 08:04:34 PM »
Well, it's done except for the electrics.  The motor should be here Monday.  Monday evening is for finishing it completely.  The airframe is all done.  It weighs 105 grams as it sits without tip weight.  I think I'm gonna hit 235 grams.  I don't know if that will be too heavy or not.  WE'll see.  Maybe Igor could add some comments.

I had to enlarge the elevator cut out in the rudder by about 1/8 inch.  Everything else fit very well.

Enjoy the pics.

Crist
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Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2013, 01:58:26 AM »
I see new toy is born :-)))

Yes the weigh coud be aproximately OK, we have it also somewhere over 200g

Regarding your elevator - we do rudder as separate part, so it comes AFTER elevator, and it does not need any cutting

BTW did you use those large drillers? because those parts keeping wing seem to be without tension .. but may be it is not well visible on the picture

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2013, 02:01:21 AM »
hi all
Cant wait till march to go and fly these in Produbice
paul

Do not worry paul, you model is ordered, simply come and fly, but it will be helpfull if you bring handle for your hand, because everyone needs something else. The best so far we found is simply cut from plywood 3mm. Anatomic handles for outside are not optimal.

Offline Tania Uzunova

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2013, 02:09:24 AM »
Well, it's done except for the electrics.  The motor should be here Monday.  Monday evening is for finishing it completely.  The airframe is all done.  It weighs 105 grams as it sits without tip weight.  I think I'm gonna hit 235 grams.  I don't know if that will be too heavy or not.  WE'll see.  Maybe Igor could add some comments.

I had to enlarge the elevator cut out in the rudder by about 1/8 inch.  Everything else fit very well.

Enjoy the pics.




I do : )))

Greetings Crist ; )) lovely work I like it : )
I also building my gee bee at home and preparing for the contest in Pardubice Czech republic : )) I hope that year many people to come : ) it's III international contest with date 09-10 March : )

Here anyone of you can find more information about it : )

http://pavel.macek.hk/CL_Calendar/2013/Bulletin/CZE-361.pdf

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #15 on: January 21, 2013, 06:38:00 AM »
I see new toy is born :-)))

Yes the weigh coud be aproximately OK, we have it also somewhere over 200g

Regarding your elevator - we do rudder as separate part, so it comes AFTER elevator, and it does not need any cutting

BTW did you use those large drillers? because those parts keeping wing seem to be without tension .. but may be it is not well visible on the picture

Thank you Igor.
I put the rudder on after the elevator was hinged. 
I don't understand what you mean by the "drillers".  I used 3mm x .5mm cf spar, and the 2mm solid cf rod for the pushrod and LG.  No other cf was used.  Everything else was either 3mm Depron or 1/16 plywood.

Yes, another baby to add to the family!
Crist
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Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2013, 06:54:06 AM »
If you look closer to my pictures from buildig (on that another thread) you will see that I have large metal drillers on fuselage. It is only weight which make tesion on langing gears parts which are already constructed under wing and only then I glue those tvo upper parts. If you then remove those drillers (or simply that weight) all componetes have internal tensio. It is helpfull, because it works better under tension than under pressure. It will tend to fold under pressure (when wing makes lift)

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2013, 06:58:27 AM »
hmm ... now I see it is not very well visible, probably I had to post better pictures, but you can see it in post #19 (3rd picture) in that old thread:

http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php?topic=19265.0

if it is not clear may be I can find better pictures somewhere in archive

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2013, 09:30:18 AM »
hmm ... now I see it is not very well visible, probably I had to post better pictures, but you can see it in post #19 (3rd picture) in that old thread:

http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php?topic=19265.0

if it is not clear may be I can find better pictures somewhere in archive

Igor,
OK, now I know what you mean.  No I didn't do any "preloading".  The pdf plans looked like it used a 1 piece cf spar.  Your pictures show a 2 piece spar.  I thought it was 2 piece because it would be easier to package the kit.  I should of known better that you do things for a reason.  :>). 

On my next one I'll have to "preload" it.  Anything else I need to be aware of?

I'll let you know what's available as far as Spiderwire goes.  Yeah, I figured tieing the knots would be a challenge.  BTW, did you use normal line eyelets?  It looks like you do with the size of the hole in the LO guide.
Crist
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Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2013, 09:47:55 AM »
:- )))

I think no other tricks, but I do not know ... may be something is "normal" what is strane for you and strange for what is normal for you :- )))

No I do not use any connectros, I connect it directly to those wires on bellcrank and to hooks on handle, nothing special.

I found that simplest and maybe the only working knot is, if you fold the end of the line so it makes begin of eye and then you do usual simple knot on that double line. It is the only knot which does not tend to disassemble which I found, but you can search knots for fishing lines, may be you can find something better :- )))

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2013, 10:15:09 AM »
OK, Igor.  I'll let you know how it all works out.  Thanks.
Crist
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Offline MikeCoulombe

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2013, 11:00:51 AM »
Just for fun here is a neat site, animated knots. http://www.animatedknots.com/

Igor I saw the drills in the other build post but it didn't dawn on me what it was.
Now it all makes sense.

Mike

Offline MikeCoulombe

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2013, 02:56:50 PM »
Couldn't remember the name of the one I use, it is the "Bow line"

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #23 on: January 21, 2013, 05:51:37 PM »
Updated the drawing to include all my build changes which include a narrower fuselage brace, enlarged elevator cut out in the rudder, additional details, and relocated bell crank.  These are now what appear in the OP.  Enjoy!  8am Jan 22.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2013, 06:53:44 AM by Crist Rigotti »
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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2013, 09:57:09 PM »
Update.
The CF2822 1300Kv motor arrived today.  With the mount and bullet connectors it weighs 49 grams!  Ouch!  I ordered the HK 2205C-1400Kv motor and I'll report on that.  It'll be interesting to compare the 2.

Also when bench testing I noticed that the battery wires and JST connector was getting warm.  I also ordered some EC2 connectors for the batteries.  I also might go from 20awg to at least 18 or 16awg when I install the EC2 connctors.  I don't want any connectors that are getting warm.

Need to get some Spiderwire tomorrow and then I'll be all set.  The plane is flyable with the CF2822 and the existing battery wires.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 09:17:10 AM by Crist Rigotti »
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Offline Keith Renecle

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #25 on: January 22, 2013, 10:46:57 PM »
Hi Crist, You do such nice build threads, so thanks for another fine job! I see that the indoor R/C pattern guys remove all connectors, even the servo connectors and wire everything together just to get rid of every last gram that they don't feel is vital to the system. Maybe this is an idea here as well?? Just a thought.

Keith R
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Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2013, 01:56:56 AM »
Also when bench testing I noticed that the battery wires and JST connector was getting warm.  I also ordered some EC2 connectors for the batteries.  I also might go from 20awg to at least 18 ot 16awg when I install the EC2 connctors.  I don't want any connectors that are getting warm.

only 2 notes:

1/ NEVER let it run on bench ... it will burn :-))) 10" prop is over possibilities of that power train, it will unload in air, but static draw it too large .. if you want, then use smaller prop

2/ NEVER use those toy connectros, they are rated max 5A and they will not only get hot, they also limit power, I saw in on my own eyes, friend of mine could not make it flying overhead, we did not know why, and then I found that the connector was hot after flight, we used 1.8 mm MPJ connectros and problem was solved :- )))

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #27 on: January 23, 2013, 02:03:03 AM »
The CF2822 1300Kv motor arrived today.  with the mount and bullet connectors it weighs 49 grams! 

I do not use connectros between motor and esc, just like Keith wrote. However sometimes is better if motor disconnects from esc after crash :- ))))

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #28 on: January 23, 2013, 06:01:23 AM »
only 2 notes:

1/ NEVER let it run on bench ... it will burn :-))) 10" prop is over possibilities of that power train, it will unload in air, but static draw it too large .. if you want, then use smaller prop

2/ NEVER use those toy connectros, they are rated max 5A and they will not only get hot, they also limit power, I saw in on my own eyes, friend of mine could not make it flying overhead, we did not know why, and then I found that the connector was hot after flight, we used 1.8 mm MPJ connectros and problem was solved :- )))

Igor, Very good points!  I had my Wattmeter connected to it and watched the amps and temperature, and ran it for only a a few seconds at at time to be sure I wasn't going to burn anything up.  The max amp draw on the bench with the CF2822-1300Kv and the APC 10 x4.7 Slo Flyer prop was very close to 6 amps at 4500 rpm.
Crist
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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #29 on: January 25, 2013, 09:34:54 PM »
I received my EC2 connectors form Hobby King today.  I spent some time changing the battery wires and connectors.  I removed the 20awg wires and used 16awg wires (the largest that the EC2 connectors will handle) and installed EC2 connectors.  I shortened the balance and the discharge wires to a more reasonable length.  When finished each battery still weighed 43 grams.  No weight gained what-so-ever.  #^

I also picked up some line material.  I got some Sufix 832 6lb .006 .14mm Neon Lime 150 yards braid fishing line.  It'll give me superior knot strength, abrasion resistance, and casting distance!  Oh yeah.   y1  Did I get the right stuff?
Tomorrow I'll make up a couple sets of line.  Then I'll be ready to go flying!

Crist
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Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #30 on: January 26, 2013, 01:14:25 AM »
we fly green spiderwire, I think the strength was 5 kilo or something like that, means much more then this, but try it,, the wire should have "steel strength" ... means it shouln not elongate under load so much like silon fishing wire

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #31 on: January 26, 2013, 10:36:49 PM »
This stuff isn't supposed to stretch.  I'll try it and let everyone know how well it works.  I was busy today and didn't get to making up the lines.  Tomorrow!
Crist
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Offline Alberto Solera

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #32 on: January 27, 2013, 05:25:15 AM »
Hello
I broke a line of the same material (sufix 6lb/2.7Kg), This is the last model where I expected a line failure but take care.
I suppose the line had a  defect but I went back to thicker lines.

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #33 on: January 27, 2013, 05:29:08 AM »
I have thinner, I think 0.14mm but rated to 9 kilo or something like that

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #34 on: January 27, 2013, 08:51:25 AM »
Guys,
I just logged on to post my findings on using this line and saw these last 2 posts. 

I rigged up a pull test on my bench this morning and did an actual pull test.  The system pulled to 19.2 pounds before breaking.  The AMA requires a 10X pull test.  For a 9 ounce airplane (250g) it comes to 90 ounces (256g) or 5.625 lbs.  I'm uploading the video now.  It'll take about 30 minutes till it is visible to everyone.  I used a surgeon's knot on each end.  The rig consisted of 2 bell cranks.  The first is tied to my bench and the other to my pull scale.  The video will show and explain all.

Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #35 on: January 27, 2013, 09:00:25 AM »
I have thinner, I think 0.14mm but rated to 9 kilo or something like that

Igor,
Can you post a picture of the box the lines came in?  The lines I'm using are .14mm but only 6lb 2.7kg.  I'd like to know what .14mm line is rated at 9kg.

Thanks.
Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #36 on: January 27, 2013, 09:02:50 AM »
Hello
I broke a line of the same material (sufix 6lb/2.7Kg), This is the last model where I expected a line failure but take care.
I suppose the line had a  defect but I went back to thicker lines.

Alberto,
Thanks for the heads up.  I did a pull test to failure and the lines held up way past 6lb 2.7kg.  See my video in the post above.

Also are you guys still using the HK 2205C-1400KV motor?

Thanks.
Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #37 on: January 27, 2013, 09:48:40 AM »
Igor,
Can you post a picture of the box the lines came in?  The lines I'm using are .14mm but only 6lb 2.7kg.  I'd like to know what .14mm line is rated at 9kg.

Thanks.

no, sorry, I got that mine 4 years ago :- )))))

I just know that the number was unbelievable and I did pull test and it was clear that the number was oveestimated :- ))) ... or simply rated without know, but it was far far over srength of depron construction

I see I will need to go to fishing shop where I got it :- )))

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #38 on: January 27, 2013, 10:56:31 AM »
I thought that I'd post pictures of where the line broke during the pull test.  It looks like it broke at the knots.  What I thought was along its length, those are the free ends.  I looked close under a magnifier and you can see where the line broke.
Crist
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Waxahachie, TX
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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #39 on: January 27, 2013, 11:02:38 AM »
no, sorry, I got that mine 4 years ago :- )))))

I just know that the number was unbelievable and I did pull test and it was clear that the number was oveestimated :- ))) ... or simply rated without know, but it was far far over srength of depron construction

I see I will need to go to fishing shop where I got it :- )))

Not to worry Igor.  I just thought that it would be good information the share with the group.
Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Alberto Solera

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #40 on: January 28, 2013, 03:21:28 AM »
Alberto,
Thanks for the heads up.  I did a pull test to failure and the lines held up way past 6lb 2.7kg.  See my video in the post above.

Also are you guys still using the HK 2205C-1400KV motor?

Thanks.

We use that motor but our models are about 50 grams lighter.

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #41 on: January 28, 2013, 03:27:30 AM »
Christ, that bellcrank does not look like our 4"

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #42 on: January 28, 2013, 05:52:48 AM »
We use that motor but our models are about 50 grams lighter.
OK.  Thanks.
I'm thinking of building another one, only lighter!
Crist
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Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #43 on: January 28, 2013, 05:54:32 AM »
Christ, that bellcrank does not look like our 4"

Igor,
My bell crank is made out of 1/16 .063 plywood.  I did make it so I can adjust the "throw" of the elevator pushrod, if need be.  The outer most hole matches your bell crank.
Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #44 on: January 28, 2013, 06:20:11 AM »
the size 4" is to limit the force necessary to deflect elevator, the line tension is VERY small and size of bellcrank can limit controlling overhead on when it fly vely slow

we do it from GF plates 0.6mm but I had it also from old CD ... it is very strong material :- )))

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #45 on: January 28, 2013, 06:48:54 AM »
the size 4" is to limit the force necessary to deflect elevator, the line tension is VERY small and size of bellcrank can limit controlling overhead on when it fly vely slow

we do it from GF plates 0.6mm but I had it also from old CD ... it is very strong material :- )))

The CD is a great idea!
Yes, my bellcrank is 4 inches.
Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #46 on: January 28, 2013, 09:05:06 PM »
I flew it tonight in a small hangar at the airport.  It needs a lot of trimming.  I had to add some tail weight.  I think 4 degrees of downthrust is too much.  It turns inside OK, but outsides it just whips around.  Maybe it needs a pushrod fairlead?  I think 4600 rpm is just about right.  I did a few wingovers.  Boy does it go over slowly!  The hangar wasn't that tall inside so I had to be careful.  I'll do more trimming and such in the bigger hangar another time.  The thing does glide like a brick!  I used both the GWS and the APC props.  On the APC props I also tried both tractor and pusher.  I think I like the tractor prop for now.  Again much trimming is needed.

Here's a video of the last flight this evening.  It should be ready at about 10:30pm. Monday.

Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #47 on: January 29, 2013, 12:36:58 AM »
So flying :- )))))))

But slow? I see it was QUICK :- ))))

The down thrust is for tractor, it must be reversed (up thrust) for tractor. I think you have too long upper line, it seemes like you have permanently up handle. That could be reason.

And I think it is tail heavy, at least it looks overcontrolled in corners.

And do you think it glides like a brick? I do not think. I think it does not glide at all  :- )))))))))))))))) ... it is airplane with vertical landing :- ))))))

Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #48 on: January 29, 2013, 06:40:08 AM »
So flying :- )))))))

But slow? I see it was QUICK :- ))))

The down thrust is for tractor, it must be reversed (up thrust) for tractor. I think you have too long upper line, it seemes like you have permanently up handle. That could be reason.

And I think it is tail heavy, at least it looks overcontrolled in corners.

And do you think it glides like a brick? I do not think. I think it does not glide at all  :- )))))))))))))))) ... it is airplane with vertical landing :- ))))))

Yeah, it was quick.  About 4 seconds lap.  The plane is on the heavy side and first time out I wanted to be sure it was going to go up and over.  Very different watching the plane go so slowly doing loops and wingovers.  :>)))

I looked at the video and you're right, the up line is too long.  That will be fixed next time out.

I'll recheck the balance point too.  It might have been tail heavy too.

Thanks.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 09:20:55 AM by Crist Rigotti »
Crist
AMA 482497
Waxahachie, TX
Electric - The Future of Old Time Stunt

Offline Igor Burger

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Re: Igor Burger's GeeBee R3 C/L - A build log
« Reply #49 on: January 29, 2013, 06:44:35 AM »
Do not affraid of slow lap times, if it is too slow, it will simply stop in middle of wingover, but it will not fall :- )))))


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