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Author Topic: Saito 91 on CL  (Read 5988 times)

Offline Alex Rillos

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Saito 91 on CL
« on: January 08, 2017, 09:08:33 AM »
I am returning to CL after 40 years and wondering if I can use my R/C stuff on CL.
The Saito 91 R/C for exemple, what mods I have to do for CL? It's a powerhouse, I know, but I believe any 60 size airplane will fly great with it. Thanks. Alex

Offline Jim Carter

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2017, 11:57:26 AM »
Hi Alex!  I know there are some who will offer differing opinions but in my personal experience, I've not run into any significant problems using my r/c engines for stunt purposes.  The main thing is to lock the throttle open and set the needle such that the engine is not going to be able to run real lean.  I've even modified one of my planes to operate with a servo controlling the throttle.  I hang the transmitter on my side while I'm flying.  It's a hoot!  ;)

Offline Avaiojet

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2017, 12:38:58 PM »
Alex,

In one way or another with the type of model, you could use just about everything.

Don't make the mistake I did and be quick to unload what you might think you won't need.

I had plenty of NIB Enya engines I wish I still had.

Now, unless you have Rossi's like I did for my pattern ships.  LL~ LL~ LL~

But then again, I just reloaded a Rossi for a CL model, so one never knows.  ;D

Hard to replace good stuff for the old price you paid.

Charles
Trump Derangement Syndrome. TDS. 
Avaiojet Derangement Syndrome. ADS.
Amazing how ignorance can get in the way of the learning process.
If you're Trolled, you know you're doing something right.  Alpha Mike Foxtrot. "No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."  Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten. "No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot."- Mark Twain. I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.   Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."  "Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Offline Brett Buck

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2017, 12:56:25 PM »
I am returning to CL after 40 years and wondering if I can use my R/C stuff on CL.
The Saito 91 R/C for exemple, what mods I have to do for CL? It's a powerhouse, I know, but I believe any 60 size airplane will fly great with it. Thanks. Alex

  I think that Windy  used a Saito 91 (it's been a while). It worked OK, but he used the RC carb and an IR-controlled remote to deal with the power. I think his "full power" was something like 70% throttle opening, because there's no way conceivable to actually use the full capability of the engine.

     Brett

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2017, 02:46:39 PM »
   Hi Alex;
    I believe Brett is correct on the model Windy used in a semi scale Typhoon or Tempest, but I think it might have been a OS, but no matter. A local guy here in the St. Louis area, Walt Brownell, built the same model from Windy's drawings and used a OS.90, but with no working throttle. He used a lockable bell crank adjuster to be able to set a specific ground setting on the carb, and fine tuned with the needle valve. Like Brett said, there was no way he needed the full power, and this let him adjust for the prop he was using at the time. I think the .91 is the largest displacement you can legally use in a stunt model for competition now. I think also that it is common practice for those that do use 4-strokes with R/C carbs, to close down the throttle just a bit to help with full draw. Using a four stroke is all about full draw and making sure you have the best fuel flow you can get. I fly a Top Flite Score with a Saito .56 in it and it is an interesting power plant. Four strokes run completely different from anything else I've used, and I generally follow the Bob Reeves set up on my model. It was what got me the most consistent runs. Search here in the four stroke forum and you will find volumes on it and other people experiences, and I think he has some information posted on the Tulsa Gluedobber's web site. I first flew a four stroke model at the SIG contest years ago. Kieth Sandberg had a kit built Legacy with an R/C version of the Saito .56 in it and made me take a flight with it after the contest. He had his throttle locked down at about 3/4 open. I can't remember anything else about the set up but the model flew VERY nicely and it was what pushed me over the edge to try a four banger. I haven't sold all my other two stroke engines just yet but I do like flying my Score. The four stroke is just another viable power plant choice we have in this event for those that like that type of power plant.
    Are you still working in the St. Louis area? I haven't run into you at Buder Park since that day we met, but spring is coming! We have our winter contest, The Ice-O-Lated Stunt Contest on the last Sunday in February. If you are still in town, put it on your calendar and come out even just to watch.
   Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee
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Offline proparc

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2017, 04:16:27 PM »
I also believe Al Rabe used a Saito 91. I can only speak directly to the other Saito's which I own, and I can tell you first hand that, you CAN'T MISS with a Saito on a CL stunt ship.

Anything from FA40 to the FA91 is going to take care of business. Now, our Mr. Larry Renger would have something to say about the FA30 but, were not going to discuss that. LL~ LL~

The only reason I would discourage the 91 is that, they are going to force you use telephone pole wire if you go to a contest.
Milton "Proparc" Graham

Offline Brett Buck

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2017, 06:01:31 PM »
I also believe Al Rabe used a Saito 91. I can only speak directly to the other Saito's which I own, and I can tell you first hand that, you CAN'T MISS with a Saito on a CL stunt ship.

Anything from FA40 to the FA91 is going to take care of business. Now, our Mr. Larry Renger would have something to say about the FA30 but, were not going to discuss that. LL~ LL~

The only reason I would discourage the 91 is that, they are going to force you use telephone pole wire if you go to a contest.

       The pull test is not set by engine size any more, just weight. If you build a model that can use the full power of this engines, you hard darn well better run 0.021s or 0.024s.

      Brett

Offline Alex Rillos

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2017, 07:36:36 AM »
   Hi Alex;
    I believe Brett is correct on the model Windy used in a semi scale Typhoon or Tempest, but I think it might have been a OS, but no matter. A local guy here in the St. Louis area, Walt Brownell, built the same model from Windy's drawings and used a OS.90, but with no working throttle. He used a lockable bell crank adjuster to be able to set a specific ground setting on the carb, and fine tuned with the needle valve. Like Brett said, there was no way he needed the full power, and this let him adjust for the prop he was using at the time. I think the .91 is the largest displacement you can legally use in a stunt model for competition now. I think also that it is common practice for those that do use 4-strokes with R/C carbs, to close down the throttle just a bit to help with full draw. Using a four stroke is all about full draw and making sure you have the best fuel flow you can get. I fly a Top Flite Score with a Saito .56 in it and it is an interesting power plant. Four strokes run completely different from anything else I've used, and I generally follow the Bob Reeves set up on my model. It was what got me the most consistent runs. Search here in the four stroke forum and you will find volumes on it and other people experiences, and I think he has some information posted on the Tulsa Gluedobber's web site. I first flew a four stroke model at the SIG contest years ago. Kieth Sandberg had a kit built Legacy with an R/C version of the Saito .56 in it and made me take a flight with it after the contest. He had his throttle locked down at about 3/4 open. I can't remember anything else about the set up but the model flew VERY nicely and it was what pushed me over the edge to try a four banger. I haven't sold all my other two stroke engines just yet but I do like flying my Score. The four stroke is just another viable power plant choice we have in this event for those that like that type of power plant.
    Are you still working in the St. Louis area? I haven't run into you at Buder Park since that day we met, but spring is coming! We have our winter contest, The Ice-O-Lated Stunt Contest on the last Sunday in February. If you are still in town, put it on your calendar and come out even just to watch.
   Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee

Hi Dan, nice talk to you again.
I'm back in KC but will try to get there to watch the contest. Thanks.

If you remember, I was driven to use my electric R/C stuff on CL but after talking to you I was convinced that, for now, there's still room for glow engines on CL, and will spare the electric for later. I just bought 3 Enyas 35 and a Fox 35 on Ebay. LL~
And a PAW 40 diesel which I didn't decide yet on the plane for it.

Thanks for the info and it's clear for me that the .91 is a little too big for CL. :(

Later,
Alex Rillos

Offline Trostle

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2017, 06:40:19 PM »
I am returning to CL after 40 years and wondering if I can use my R/C stuff on CL.
The Saito 91 R/C for exemple, what mods I have to do for CL? It's a powerhouse, I know, but I believe any 60 size airplane will fly great with it. Thanks. Alex

Gordan Delaney flew his original super semi-scale Ki-61 Tony with a Saito 82.  64" span, 743 sq. in.  The fuselage is near scale outline.  Impressive flyer and very competitive.  Plans were published in Flying Models, Sep 2009.  Had a vibration problem with the Saito 82.  Also flew with the Saito 72.  With either engine, its performance and appearance are impressive.  Venturis to replace the carburetors for these engines have been available in the past.  Doug and Steve Moon might know of the availability of these.

Gordan has built another Tony and is flying it now.  I do not know what he has in it for power.

I should  also add that John Miller worked with Gordan to develop the plans for the Tony.  The plans published in FM should be used as the standard for what a set of plans should look like.

Keith
« Last Edit: January 11, 2017, 11:21:29 PM by Trostle »

Offline Martin Quartim

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2017, 08:08:34 PM »

Pat Johnston has a nice P-47 project,  that is big and it will balance perfectly with a Saito 91.

It has a very wide body that will enhance the sound of a 4 Stroke.

Martin
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Offline Alex Rillos

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Re: Saito 91 on CL
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2017, 04:05:42 PM »
Pat Johnston has a nice P-47 project,  that is big and it will balance perfectly with a Saito 91.

It has a very wide body that will enhance the sound of a 4 Stroke.

Martin

Martin, is that P-47 the same plan that Bene Rodrigues used some time ago?
Alex


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