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Author Topic: Magnum .36: Fuel data  (Read 4624 times)

Offline Sean McEntee

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Magnum .36: Fuel data
« on: December 30, 2015, 07:13:47 PM »
Working on a new project (more on that later) that is getting powered by a Magnum .36. Nose space is a premium so I don't want to put a bigger tank in it than what I need. It's been many a year since I had this engine in my Vector, and I cannot recall the fuel load.

Could anyone running this engine (especially one reworked by the late, great Byron Barker as that is what I have) please share your data.  Nose real estate is at a premium on this thing. I had a GRW 4.5 oz tank in the vector but, again can't remember if I was filling or not.

Thanks a bunch and happy new year!
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Offline Jim Svitko

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2015, 07:53:36 PM »
Maybe this will help.  I have a Magnum 36XLS from Randy Smith.  It is in a 48 ounce Gieseke Nobler and it pulls that plane quite well.  It is not hurting for power.  In warm weather I need 3 ounces of 5/22 to do the pattern with no fears of running out of fuel.   In cooler weather I can cut that nitro in half.
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Offline Randy Cuberly

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2015, 08:07:49 PM »
I have a pretty much stock one that I've only run on the bench and it takes 4.5 oz of 15% nitro to run for approximately 6 min 30 seconds.
It has a .280 diameter venturi and a Aeroproducts needle valve.  It also has a shim in the head but I don't remember the thickness and like a dumo I didn't write that down.  My guess is that the extra shim is only about .005 inch maybe less.  I don't test with low nitro fuel because of the altitude and heat in Tucson.

Randy Cuberly
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Offline James Mills

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2015, 08:42:08 PM »
Hey Sean,
I had one of Byron's 36's in my Formula S that was around 52 or 53 ounces.  Pulled it very well with one of the larger venturies, I used between 4.5 (maybe a bit more when it got really hot) SIG 10%. 

James
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Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2015, 10:26:15 AM »
  Dude!
    Fit the 4.5 ounce tank  during the build, and make sure the engine is sitting on 1/8" aluminum pads, so you have to shim the tank down a bit for proper operation. If the capacity isn't enough when you test fly it, we can build a custom tank the same length but 1/4" thicker and should be closer to 5 ounces. Kind of like we did on the Frisky Pete. If you have to relieve the maple motor mounts by 1/8" or so at the tank compartment, do it before you build the engine crutch. There is no set rule that tanks can only be 1" deep. If you get board, do a search over on Stuka for posts by Al Rabe and see some of the tank shapes he custom built for his airplanes. They just need to be mounted in the proper position. I have his CD's of his articles and such and it has also been posted on the internet some where. Interesting stuff that is largely over my head but still tons of useful information.
  Type at you later and HAPPY NEW YEAR!
     Dad
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Offline Fredvon4

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2015, 12:47:49 PM »
Sean and Dan...thanks for doing this on the forum and not during the daily, weekly, monthly family chat on the phone

I learn a lot by many of these complex or simple inquiry and the various answers

Happy new Year
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Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #6 on: December 31, 2015, 12:59:19 PM »
  Hi Fred;
  He was just home for Christmas, but the question never came up. He picked up some plans I had of a long ago project of his, and i guess that fueled a fire! This is the sort of question where I like to tell him, "if you were paying attention fifteen years ago at the NATS you would have known this!" He gets the joke,we both have a chuckle and move on, but I am really glad he stuck with the hobby and the friends we have made through out the years have really been a benefit to him during his Army career, and he always seems to be near a flying buddy where ever he is posted, except for Iraq and Afghanistan! Then I have to try and keep him supplied with goodies!
    HAPPY NEW YEAR and back to my plumbing project,
   Dan McEntee
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Offline Sean McEntee

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2016, 01:48:56 AM »
Quote from: Dan McEntee on December 31, 2015, 12:59:19 PM
  Hi Fred;
  He was just home for Christmas, but the question never came up. He picked up some plans I had of a long ago project of his, and i guess that fueled a fire! This is the sort of question where I like to tell him, "if you were paying attention fifteen years ago at the NATS you would have known this!" He gets the joke,we both have a chuckle and move on, but I am really glad he stuck with the hobby and the friends we have made through out the years have really been a benefit to him during his Army career, and he always seems to be near a flying buddy where ever he is posted, except for Iraq and Afghanistan! Then I have to try and keep him supplied with goodies!
    HAPPY NEW YEAR and back to my plumbing project,
   Dan McEntee

       Haha I figured you would have realized that I was paying attention by now  :P

       The problem isn't thickness, but length.  A standard GRW 4.5 oz tank won't fit.  A 4 oz tank is almost impossible too.  The nose on this thing is quite small, so building a tank is a given.  I was simply collecting info on how thirsty this engine is.  Seems like 4.5 oz is optimal.

        Thanks everyone for your input!
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2016, 06:04:46 PM »
Which Magnum .36 are you using? The round head XL .36 or the (much lighter) "square" head XLS .36?

I ran the XLS .36 for some years on a 4 oz Hayes clunk tank, .272" venturi/.157" spraybar, OS .46 LA muffler (pressurized), PM 10-22 and the 11 x 4.5 TT Cyclone prop. As usual, the more prop load or low time, the more fuel it'll need. Around 9,700 r's launch worked for me. It probably had 20 gallons of fuel through it when I gave it to Tim with the F.Twister and would still run off long strings of 1-flip starts.   y1 Steve
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Offline WR Crane aka MrClean

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2016, 09:29:27 PM »
I was just talking to my old hobby shop boss about my Magnum 36.  Mine was old and suffered from a design flaw.  The crankshaft intake was a square cut.  It wasn't the first one we had that when you got it broken in and performing really well  the intake would fracture and the front half of you crankshaft and everything attached to it took off, as mine did last fall.  Engine stopped abruptly, I brought the plane around for a landing noticing that it was really pitch sensitive all of a sudden and because of that (it was on RC not CL so I didn't have a visual seperation) knew what the problem was.  
Now I need all new parts from crankshaft on.  He mentioned radius-ing the cuts which I told him I didn't think would help in my particular case (as it was already gone) and then that he had all the parts I need BUT to save you, make sure you don't have one of the old cranks.  The TT 36 crank is the same and is radius-ed so it doesn't fatigue like the Magnum did.

I knew this thing was coming but I flew it anyway thinking I'd run into him yesterday and get a new one then.  One too many flights.  Had it happen to a Fox 35 as well but that sucker wasn't doing 115 mph straight up when it happened.  My top doppler on this plane averaged out at 135.  It scoots I tell ya, fast for a sport plane, slow for anything else and about  6 bucks of plastic all together.

Fuel, I think I have a 4 ounce tank in there and I rarely run anything other then 10% fuel in anything other then half a.  Good for 5-6 minutes but I do have a throttle on that.
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2016, 05:23:12 PM »
True, the Magnum/ASP (etc.) engines (made in PRC) will toss the crankshaft if revved too high, but for sensible CL stunt use, they'll run fine for years or decades. Don't worry about it! I launched mine at 9,700 to 10,000 with my usual prop, but 10,400 with a few others. The XLS .36 is a dandy engine. Haven't run an XL .36, but a lot of the local combat guys used them in 80 MPH. No idea what rpm they ran at, or how often they barfed.  D>K Steve
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"The United States has become a place where professional athletes and entertainers are mistaken for people of importance." - Robert Heinlein

In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.  In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2016, 05:33:44 PM »
Quote from: Steve Helmick on January 01, 2016, 06:04:46 PM
Which Magnum .36 are you using? The round head XL .36 or the (much lighter) "square" head XLS .36?

I ran the XLS .36 for some years on a 4 oz Hayes clunk tank, .272" venturi/.157" spraybar, OS .46 LA muffler (pressurized), PM 10-22 and the 11 x 4.5 TT Cyclone prop. As usual, the more prop load or low time, the more fuel it'll need. Around 9,700 r's launch worked for me. It probably had 20 gallons of fuel through it when I gave it to Tim with the F.Twister and would still run off long strings of 1-flip starts.   y1 Steve

Zero-flip starts, even, if you count the thing bursting into life when you're priming it without a battery attached as "zero flips".

I don't know if you've looked at my "Cartoon Mooney" thread, but that engine's on the trainer I'm building for my wife.
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2016, 05:53:38 PM »
Quote from: Tim Wescott on January 06, 2016, 05:33:44 PM
Zero-flip starts, even, if you count the thing bursting into life when you're priming it without a battery attached as "zero flips".

I don't know if you've looked at my "Cartoon Mooney" thread, but that engine's on the trainer I'm building for my wife.

How did you prime it without pulling the prop through? I had it start once or twice while flipping the prop to distribute the fuel after choking it the magic number of times. At least once, it was on an official flight.

Did you ever check for an actual fuel load in cc's or ounces? I just kinda figured out where the air bubble should be in the top of the Hayes tank. Got fooled a few times, when the front wheels were in a hole, etc., but generally had no problems with run time. If I'd had to fly it at -1,200' density altitude, it probably would have been ok on a full tank, but happily, that never happened.  ;D Steve
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"The United States has become a place where professional athletes and entertainers are mistaken for people of importance." - Robert Heinlein

In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.  In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2016, 08:58:18 PM »
Quote from: Steve Helmick on January 06, 2016, 05:53:38 PM
How did you prime it without pulling the prop through?

I'm trying to claim that a flip without a battery isn't really a flip.  Clearly I'm not making much headway.
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Offline fred krueger

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2016, 06:35:25 AM »
Sean,

I have more time on a Magnum .36XLS than any other engine that I own.  I have powered 3 different airplanes with one and used one at the 2012 NATS.  Mine were modified by myself:  added head shims, blocked the boost bypass and installed a venturi.  Mined liked the APC 10.5x4.5 prop a lot.  I consistently used 3.25 oz of fuel for a pattern (6:30 run).  I think I was running SIG Champion 5% or equivalent.

Fred
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Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Magnum .36: Fuel data
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2016, 10:25:04 AM »

 Does anyone have a picture of the roundhead 36 as I would like to compare it to the one that I have..
  Thanks...
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