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Author Topic: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?  (Read 3705 times)

Offline Robin_Holden

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AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« on: May 29, 2009, 05:36:30 AM »
Greetings fellas from a very sunny Charente.

I've noticed the new Brodak inspired Aviastar C/L engines are turning up on the infamous E-Bay for 'interesting' money.

Anyone out there tried one yet please ?
Anyone with any experience of this engine ?

My first thoughts were it seemed a touch heavy ! Especially when you compare the 46 to say an OS 46 LA.

Would appreciate your comments ,

Thanks ,

Robin [ ex-pat Brit in the Charente full of ex-pat Brits ! ]
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Offline Ralph Wenzel (d)

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2009, 06:03:35 AM »
Just a short comment regarding the weight: Aviastar .46 vs OS .46LA - -  An engine with balls will always weigh more than one without; i.e., plain bearing. This is certainly true within a given manufacturer's lineup; generally so for all.

As an example, the old ST C.35 weighs about 6.5 oz.; it's G21 (ball-bearing) sibling is a touch over 8 oz.

You might also have observed the very slightly lower weight of the .53 compared to the .46 - - The .53 has a thinner brass liner; so, less total weight.

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Offline George Albo

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2015, 07:32:18 PM »
Quote from: Robin_Holden on May 29, 2009, 05:36:30 AM
Greetings fellas from a very sunny Charente.

I've noticed the new Brodak inspired Aviastar C/L engines are turning up on the infamous E-Bay for 'interesting' money.

Anyone out there tried one yet please ?
Anyone with any experience of this engine ?

My first thoughts were it seemed a touch heavy ! Especially when you compare the 46 to say an OS 46 LA.

Would appreciate your comments ,

Thanks ,

Robin [ ex-pat Brit in the Charente full of ex-pat Brits ! ]

Robin I'm considering getting an Aviastar .46. I just saw/read your question. I'm a little late to the party but would like to know if you got it and if you did, what are your thoughts on it's performance. Don't care about the weight issue.
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Offline Robin_Holden

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2015, 02:17:24 AM »
Quote from: George Albo on May 04, 2015, 07:32:18 PM
Robin I'm considering getting an Aviastar .46. I just saw/read your question. I'm a little late to the party but would like to know if you got it and if you did, what are your thoughts on it's performance. Don't care about the weight issue.


George hello.

Didn't go for one. Stuck to my favourite , the OS 46 LA  .

Just so easy to set up , reliable and  great value.

I did buy an Evo 60 CL from Randy a few years ago. Another great sport engine. I believe they've stopped making them .

Regards from S.W. France ,

Robin.
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Offline George Albo

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2015, 03:11:44 PM »
Quote from: Robin_Holden on May 05, 2015, 02:17:24 AM
George hello.

Didn't go for one. Stuck to my favourite , the OS 46 LA  .

Just so easy to set up , reliable and  great value.

I did buy an Evo 60 CL from Randy a few years ago. Another great sport engine. I believe they've stopped making them .

Regards from S.W. France ,

Robin.

OK Thanks. I heard complaints about the OS 46 la being nickle plated rather than chrome. and I've heard people extol them. What is your take on this? If nickle plated is it such a big deal if you lubricate it with castor?
 
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2015, 12:06:57 AM »
Chrome is better, but ABN isn't horrible, if you're careful, use good fuel, a little extra oil, and a little lucky.

Have you looked at the Magnum or ASP equivalent?  They're real chrome. Quality is better than Fox, but not as good as OS. I like engines that have setscrews holding the throttle into the crankcase, like the LA's...easier to convert to front NV. I'm kinda partial to them, as are a fair number of guys in our area.

I ran an XLS .36 for some years on a Twister...as many as 13 one-flip starts, and a couple of no-battery starts. That engine came to me from Mike Haverly, and I gave it to Tim Wescott after something around 20 gallons of fuel through it. Still would start with one flip (or no battery if conditions were just right).  The XLS .36 is nice for a Classic that originally used a Fox.  D>K Steve
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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2015, 06:04:36 AM »
I did the testing and evaluation on the first prototype Aviastar 53.

John and I flew it on a large test plane designed around a Super Tiger 60.

Weighing around 78 ounces, it flew as well as with the ST.
The 53 was very powerful.

I made a few very small mods to the 53, mainly reducing the squish band to .070 width and tapering it 5 degrees.
I had no complaints about the engine and, providing that the factory followed my instructions for the mods, I would not hesitate to put it on a large stunt ship.

I wrote an article - if anyone is interested, I will post it.

  Bob Z.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2015, 07:25:38 AM by Robert Zambelli »
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Offline Bill Calandrella

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2015, 06:38:15 AM »
Bob Z.

Please post the article you wrote.  I am interested in reading it.

Thanks,

Bill
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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2015, 07:35:20 AM »
Here is the article - Control Line World, Volume 3, Number 2, April 2009.

  Bob Z.
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Offline George Albo

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2015, 02:21:01 PM »
Quote from: Robert Zambelli on May 06, 2015, 07:35:20 AM
Here is the article - Control Line World, Volume 3, Number 2, April 2009.

  Bob Z.

Robert thanks for posting the article on the Aviastar. The article plus the fact that I haven't gotten any feedback on the question I posted on the Evolution 46NX to C/L conversion, or not being able to find a new OS 46LA,. I decided to pull the trigger and purchase two new in the box. I went to Brodak and got the 6mm venturi plus head gaskets for spacing etc.

 For $100 for two engines couldn't beat the price. So I'll be dickering with these for awhile. I have two new in the box ST 46 that have never been run. Saving those for contest aircraft once my skill levels are up to speed. No more ST 46 to be found either, bummer. I feel like Rip Van Winkle coming back into the hobby and finding so much missing. New stuff is good but I miss the old. I'm 56, started C/L at 8 yrs of age. Dope tissue cutting your own stuff from printed balsa with exacto knife, etc.

Yup, I hope I don't get frustrated or let the excitement wear off on account of frustration. Could happen, hope not. Thanks for your article it was the deciding factor.

George Albo
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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2015, 06:36:47 PM »
George - thanks for the kind words.
When you get the Aviastars, test run/fly them. If you're not pleased with the running characteristics, remove the heads.
The combustion chamber should appear as in the photo, the left hand exhibit.

If it is not as shown in the picture and does not run as you need, send me the heads and I will modify them.

  Bob Z.
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Offline George Albo

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2015, 08:08:21 PM »
Quote from: Robert Zambelli on May 06, 2015, 06:36:47 PM
George - thanks for the kind words.
When you get the Aviastars, test run/fly them. If you're not pleased with the running characteristics, remove the heads.
The combustion chamber should appear as in the photo, the left hand exhibit.

If it is not as shown in the picture and does not run as you need, send me the heads and I will modify them.

  Bob Z.

Cool Robert and thanks for the offer! 

Just as an aside, I have been rummaging through boxes that have been sealed since a little after Hurricane Andrew. I have been thrust back at warp speed into my past and just had a head on collision! WOW!  I found 3 kits in various stages of deterioration. Parts missing, Termite consumed (ouch), and plans damaged by water and mold. AYE AYE AYE AYE! I also found a pint can of cox fuel. Unopened, and get this, two cans of K&B fuel in Gallon cans! The price sticker is for $4.00!! When I likened myself to Rip Van Winkle I was not kidding!!!!!

By the way, any suggestions as to what needle valve assemblies will work with the Aviastar? Also where might I get them? I checked with Brodak and they don't have, sent them an email and am waiting for their answer. Sig, can't find a thing through the website. I entered the engines section on their marquee and nothing. Any suggestions would be welcomed.

Thanks again for your kind offer.

George Albo
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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2015, 12:19:51 AM »
I'm pretty sure the NVA for the ST 60 will work.

Bob Z.
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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2015, 12:47:07 AM »
Something I forgot to mention.
All the testing I did was with a pre-production prototype 53, as stated in the third sentence of my article.

I also stated that the only mod I did to the engine was to change the combustion chamber shape. I should have typed INTERNAL mod.

The venturi modification was what I call an external mod.

For the engine to perform as a true stunt powerplant, I recommend both these mods. Hopefully, they are applied to the production engines.

   Bob Z.
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Offline George Albo

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2015, 10:52:23 AM »
Quote from: Robert Zambelli on May 07, 2015, 12:47:07 AM
Something I forgot to mention.
All the testing I did was with a pre-production prototype 53, as stated in the third sentence of my article.

I also stated that the only mod I did to the engine was to change the combustion chamber shape. I should have typed INTERNAL mod.

The venturi modification was what I call an external mod.

For the engine to perform as a true stunt powerplant, I recommend both these mods. Hopefully, they are applied to the production engines.

   Bob Z.

Yes I saw that you had internally "DOMED" the head. If I keep looking for stuff and not find it, I'm going to have to enroll at the local college and learn machining/milling/sand casting and start building my own!  Thinking of using Duke Fox's approach for simplicity and cost effectiveness. Steel piston over steel liner.  I can dream and ponder right?.....

Thanks for the suggestions

George Albo
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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2015, 11:06:56 AM »
  Thinking of using Duke Fox's approach for simplicity and cost effectiveness. Steel piston over steel liner. 



Steel liner, Meehanite piston.

   Bob Z.
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Offline George Albo

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Re: AVIASTAR 46/53 ? Anyone tried one yet ?
« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2015, 01:46:27 PM »
Quote from: Robert Zambelli on May 07, 2015, 11:06:56 AM
  Thinking of using Duke Fox's approach for simplicity and cost effectiveness. Steel piston over steel liner. 



Steel liner, Meehanite piston.

   Bob Z.

lol...you answered my question without it being asked. Was wondering what the mix was as I heard that Duke used a steel/lead type liner.

Really, I am seriously thinking of learning basic machining/milling etc. Never too late to learn.   

Back on the topic of the Aviastar. I was online looking for the NVA you suggested, and google being what it is, sent me to ebay where someone had already sold 3 .46 engines. Out of curiosity I kept reading the details of the engines he was selling, turns out he had acquired the engines new and unused at the 2009 NATS. He wrote that they had been customized for U/C stunt. Said that the builder had removed .008 from the squish band and had installed an ST 60 NVA. Claimed it went into 4-2-4 mode and were very strong and good engines. that being so, WHY on Earth have they faded from the market?

George Albo
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