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Engine basics => Engine set up tips => Topic started by: david beazley on July 26, 2008, 12:48:29 PM
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Let's say someone just got some brand new Sig 10/25 all caster fuel and he wanted to add some synthetic oil to the mix. Any recommendations as to what brand, amount, and where to acquire such oil? The fuel would be primarily for a Fox .35 that has had about 3/4 gallon of Fox 5% nitro run thru it and is still in the break-in mode.
Thanks,
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Sig sells Klotz synthetic oil; you "could" add about 5 oz. to get to approximately 29% total oil. The % nitro would be reduced slightly but not enough to matter, unless 10% is already marginal for your altitude/application.
There is probably nothing really wrong with just running the Sig 10/25 as it is unless you just want to add the synthetic to help keep the engine clean. If that is the case, the addition of 3% Klotz will get you there.
Cheers,
Jim
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Also, Henry Nelson sells UCON oils (not sure which ones). They'll do the same job. Remember to leave room for an ounce of Lubricin N-1 or Randy's Aero-1, too. Count those as part of the synthetics.
Ralph
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David,
Last time I checked - not recent - KLOTZ offered two synthetics: KL-100 and KL-200.
I forget which, but one of them has 25% castor, the remainder synthetic. The other is all-synthetic.
For a Fox 35, iron piston in steel sleeve, after a proper half-hour or so break-in, SIG 10/25(all castor) should be just fine. Much more time on all-castor fuels and you may start building some varnish on the piston. That's not necessarily a bad thing. What could be bad is having a synthetic part of the fuel dissolve and flush that varnish out. The gunk isn't pretty, but it helps the piston seal and last. "Deterge-ing" it out may return the engine condition to a much earlier stage in the break-in process.
Jim T or Doc H has mentioned running Fox 35s on synthetic including oils at around 22% total from first run on. That becomes the break-in condition, and they say they've had no problems doing that. Switching in midstream is also bad on horseback...
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David,
Last time I checked - not recent - KLOTZ offered two synthetics: KL-100 and KL-200.
I forget which, but one of them has 25% castor, the remainder synthetic. The other is all-synthetic.
For a Fox 35, iron piston in steel sleeve, after a proper half-hour or so break-in, SIG 10/25(all castor) should be just fine. Much more time on all-castor fuels and you may start building some varnish on the piston. That's not necessarily a bad thing. What could be bad is having a synthetic part of the fuel dissolve and flush that varnish out. The gunk isn't pretty, but it helps the piston seal and last. "Deterge-ing" it out may return the engine condition to a much earlier stage in the break-in process.
Jim T or Doc H has mentioned running Fox 35s on synthetic including oils at around 22% total from first run on. That becomes the break-in condition, and they say they've had no problems doing that. Switching in midstream is also bad on horseback...
I always ran my Fox 35 with either Fox or Dukes fuel. I stopped flying for about 15 years and when I returned I was running 10% nitro 25% 50/50 castor/syn. in the Fox. I found that the synthetic seems to have dissolved the castor build up and the engine now pushes fuel out the front of the crankshaft. It still runs great, makes tons of power and starts real easily. If I had it to do again I'd stick with the 100% castor oil though. I have since returned to using 5% nitro 26/2% castor/syn. fuel. This engine has a lot of time on it.
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One problem with all castor oil, is the varnish build-up. Of course, iron piston/steel sleeve motors need all the castor you can pour into them. I'm just now getting used to a mostly synthetic oil mix for my modern ABC motors. Old habits are hard to break!
Floyd
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One problem with all Castor oil, is the varnish build-up. Of course, iron piston/steel sleeve motors need all the Castor you can pour into them. I'm just now getting used to a mostly synthetic oil mix for my modern ABC motors. Old habits are hard to break!
Floyd
One thing I'll never get used to is cleaning up a plane that uses Castor oil. It sure is hard to get off the wings and fuselage. Windex just doesn't cut it like it cleans the synthetic oil. I'll have to find something else to use on the Castor oil planes.
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One thing I'll never get used to is cleaning up a plane that uses Castor oil. It sure is hard to get off the wings and fuselage. Windex just doesn't cut it like it cleans the synthetic oil. I'll have to find something else to use on the Castor oil planes.
Spray-way Glass cleaner!
http://the-auto-alley.amazonwebstore.com/GLASS-CLEANER-19-OZ.-AEROSOL/M/B000FMK1NY.htm
I get it at Safeway, almost everybody has either a Safeway or a Kroger nearby.
Brett
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One thing I'll never get used to is cleaning up a plane that uses Castor oil. It sure is hard to get off the wings and fuselage. Windex just doesn't cut it like it cleans the synthetic oil. I'll have to find something else to use on the Castor oil planes.
Jerry, for years I have always kept a spray bottle filled with regular old drug store alcohol on hand for cleaning up the castor after a flying session. It works great and is cheap as well and I have used it for about fifty years. Regards, Phil H^^
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Jerry, for years I have always kept a spray bottle filled with regular old drug store alcohol on hand for cleaning up the castor after a flying session. It works great and is cheap as well and I have used it for about fifty years. Regards, Phil H^^
Thanks Phil, I had thought about that but keep forgetting to do it. I always use alcohol to clean up a plane to make sure to get all the oil off before I'm going to do any work on it. Makes the glue stick and Monokote repairs stay put. Makes perfect sense to me to use it at the field for clean up.
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I never liked the idea of atomizing a flammable liquid.
Back a long time ago (early 70s??), one magazine had a formula for a plane cleaner. IIRC it was ammonia and baking soda in water. Worked GREAT, as long as you cleaned the plane right after flying, while the castor was warm.
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"One thing I'll never get used to is cleaning up a plane that uses Castor oil. It sure is hard to get off the wings and fuselage. Windex just doesn't cut it like it cleans the synthetic oil. I'll have to find something else to use on the Castor oil planes."
A tuned pipe, maybe. There are even less aesthetically pleasing solutions to the castor problem now.
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Always had good luck using windex for cleaning planes. In fact the cheap window cleaner that you get at the Dollar stores always seems to work the best.
Tom
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Spraying Simple Green full-strength cuts the grime off, then using Windex shines the bird nicely...Chad Hill
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Windex has a glass and surface cleaner with vinegar that seems to work very well. It cuts the castor and shines up the plane nicely. I've only used it on film covering, so I don't know how well it would work with dope, Rustoleum, etc.
Glen
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Jerry there should be no build up of castor on the crank shaft in my experience. Sounds like the case is worn out in the lower end. Some where I read where a case was slightly reversed honed that supposedly cured the fuel going out the front of the case. I think at one period of time that Fox did have a bad batch of cases in which the case wore out faster than the piston/cylinder. Might need to sendit back to Fox. DOC Holliday