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Author Topic: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In  (Read 1257 times)

Offline James Holford

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ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« on: August 10, 2019, 11:47:55 AM »
Whats the break in process for the ST.51 with Gardner P&L set ?

 The motor is brand spanking new. Never run. Im wanting to swap the P&L with the Gardner set I have for it.

 Ive heard you could drop the set in and just go fly but before I do such a thing. Id like verification as I dont want to ruin a perfectly fine great hard to get motor.


This motor is planned to go in a SV-11

Thanks

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Jamie Holford
Baton Rouge Bi-Liners
Lafayette, La
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Offline RandySmith

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2019, 02:52:31 PM »
Whats the break in process for the ST.51 with Gardner P&L set ?

 The motor is brand spanking new. Never run. Im wanting to swap the P&L with the Gardner set I have for it.

 Ive heard you could drop the set in and just go fly but before I do such a thing. Id like verification as I dont want to ruin a perfectly fine great hard to get motor.


This motor is planned to go in a SV-11

Thanks

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

NO  unless it is one of the ones that is  fitted  loose,  you will need  some breakin,  Run the engine on the bench in the fastes 4 stroke it will  run in, Then turn needle into a  rich 2 cycle,  cycle like this  for  30 sec at a time
I would run  5 or 6 tank fulls
Use at least 1/2 synthetic oil,  I would  use  20 % total 75 percent of that  synthetic.

Let us know how it goes

Randy

Offline Brian Gardner

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2019, 09:02:58 PM »
As per the instruction sheet supplied with it mate....and as per Randy's post.

Do not run it wet and cold, get it up on the 4/2 switch. Give it multiple short runs allowing to cool between runs to heat cycle it.

Offline James Holford

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2019, 09:10:10 PM »
As per the instruction sheet supplied with it mate....and as per Randy's post.

Do not run it wet and cold, get it up on the 4/2 switch. Give it multiple short runs allowing to cool between runs to heat cycle it.
I totally forgot about that sheet!!! Sure enough it is in the tube. Thanks yall

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Jamie Holford
Baton Rouge Bi-Liners
Lafayette, La
AMA #1126767

Offline RandySmith

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2019, 11:45:58 AM »
I totally forgot about that sheet!!! Sure enough it is in the tube. Thanks yall

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I have setup many of these now that Brian supplies, The  ABC setup of Brian's make the  ST 51  a wonderful engine, and one that will last for a long time, and will Guarantee  great compression and power. Treat them well  and you will have a really great stunt engine !

Randy

Offline Joe Hunt

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2019, 01:32:14 PM »
i have one of the china g 51 and have been told that the piston/ring can be problematic. is one of those gardner p&l a solution? where do you get one if it is the solution?   thanks

Offline James Holford

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2019, 01:56:39 PM »
i have one of the china g 51 and have been told that the piston/ring can be problematic. is one of those gardner p&l a solution? where do you get one if it is the solution?   thanks
Mine is the Chinese ST.51. I got my set from Brian Gardner himself when he was doing his run on them.

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Jamie Holford
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Lafayette, La
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Offline Jim Svitko

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2019, 03:11:14 PM »
i have one of the china g 51 and have been told that the piston/ring can be problematic. is one of those gardner p&l a solution? where do you get one if it is the solution?   thanks

I heard the same thing about the piston/ring being a problem.  Have you run that Chinese made ST 51 yet?  I have one, the CL version, and it runs very well.   I see no need to replace anything unless necessary.

If some have had problems with the ring, I wonder if it is because of improper break-in.  I followed Randy's break-in instructions and I have had no problems with the engine.  If a problem develops, I have an extra set of Brian's parts.

I have another ST 51, Chinese made, RC version.  I put Brian's parts in it.  I have not run this engine yet.  It is kept in reserve for a future plane.

Offline Joe Hunt

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2019, 04:50:15 PM »
have not run it yet, it's new and i'll do what you suggest.    thanks, joe hunt

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2019, 08:00:20 PM »
   I bought some rings from Joe Bowman for my St.51'a and when I did he asked if they were for a Chinese version, and I said no, what was the difference. He said that he set the gap a fuzz wider for the Chinese versions because, I think, the cylinders tended to be a few tenths smaller or something like that. Otherwise he could see NO difference between the Chinese and Italian versions. From what I understand, the Chinese versions were assembled from Italian made parts that were in stock. They never did actually produce anything over there, just assembled them from inventory. If you have a new engine, I would run it like it is as you might find it runs quite well stock, and if and when you wear it out, change it over to ABC. Or, if you must change it over, hand on to the old parts because you can install those into a clapped out R/C version and make it a true C/L model. There is a difference in the R/C and C/L cylinder timing, everything else except for the carb/venturi is the same.  I have been running St.51's since they came out, both stock as a rock and a few reworked and they are a great engine, but like Randy says, you got to treat them well and they will treat you well!!
  Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee
   
AMA 28784
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AMA 480405 (American Motorcyclist Association)

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2019, 09:35:17 PM »
G-51 !  :P

Seems that ALL the Chinese made / assembled Versions have a 4 didgit number stamped on the EXHAUST SIDE Lug .& like ' CHINA ' in the backplate cavity .





Theres That , no ' made in Italy ' under there version . And the one still , before they changed the die . ?
Some of the China ones , theyve deleted the protrusion on the bypass side that gets in way of the screwdriver / bolts , there .

So this here below is the LATER ( Last ? ) Chinese version .



============================================================================================

Brian Wynch said to me , personally , first person etc etc . Wether it was correct of course , I couldnt say ,
That the Chinese had asked him if there were any ' improvements ' that they should make to the engines .
He said He'd said ! , the Carb needed some modification to the track , or somesuch like .
AND " The Ring was to hard " , " and so theyve put a softer one in it , so it needs less bbreak in "

Wether this is a load of cobblers ive no idea. Brian Winch is the ' Airborne Enigineer ' and does a engine column in the englih Aeromodelor mag .
Mostly a rant & He was a cop ,
so bu##er me , likely .

===============================================================================================

As For BREAK IN , on the RINGED Version . Ive four , three italian . after twenty years the bearings got past it on one , from nitro NOT wear .
Ones a first China , " made in Italy on the casae , as per Italian case . Number on left lug. " CHINA " in Backplate .
So first place to LOOK is up the backplate .
Anyway , where were we ,  S?P

Pre Lube ! should at least throw some fuel in it , or ATF , or maybe Syn. Flip it through thoroughly to distribute .
Mount up Etc the throw a good dose of fuel in , remove glow plug & flip ovr untill cleared, or the plug will oil .

Give a prime ( no fuel line connected ) and get a ' burst ' on a prime or three . WINTER and a bit of nitro in the prime is likely necesary .
Tho they run real good on no nitro & I doubt if theres a output differance , and the needles reasonable .

Then I give em a few two - five second bursts .

Theorey was any hig spots dont heat & break through the oil film . But modern machineing , high spots are improbable .

------------------------

A few 10 to 15 second bursts . By now youll likely have caught the needle correct , at ' the break or out down in the fourstroke . Maybe 3 turns thereabouts.
If your a hill billy and driven all the neighbours out , No Muffler itll run cooler for break in .

The silent mufflers real good , and no power loss , theres a big flash ' Q 500 ' ST 40 Q500 muffler too , that breaths easy .

Being fussy you then give it a few one minute runs . Idea being to get  it still so you can about keep your hand on it . The FINS not the muffler !  ;D
Thats 90 degrees out there , if you dont Grip It & get burnt .
Let it cool as necesary between runs . A minute or two in winter , maybe 10 or even more in summer ! so we prefer winter for break in .

Now everyones happy and you put the rest of 2 litres / 2 quarts of juice through it , on the bench . and have it pretty much in a solid four
for the first flights , and try not to have it lean off during the first gallon .
One of my two original , of three & the China job , measured last week , still had 5 1/2 Thou.  measured ring gap .
Delacquerd it & replaced the bearings , on Mark Battys advice , as it'd started to stop early ,
as explained " the Nitro gets the bearings and you get bits of metal in the plug , shorting it out "
Which having replaced the bearings with used Jap / taiwanese Manum ones ( I know , skinflint ) it has recovered from .

So the two ive used most have both survived well . Usually use afterun oil or CRC at least . Likely now I will flush them , occasionally at least , beforehand .
Havnt run intake filters , most of the use was in NZ , a lot of fine dust here in Aus. Youd need to compare hardness ( a Brinall test ? ) to see if true on the ring. )


Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: ST.51 Gardner P&L set Break In
« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2019, 09:44:57 PM »
Heres how to get all artistic with a FILE : Tape it up first in case you slip . Left the ' 51 ' still perceptable . Generally curved across . To Get the Obstruction
to be less obstructive . Wet & Dry on a stick , to remove the file mark , and polish if your inclined to go real fine . This is the Italian Version , one of two from 2000 odd , so near two decades use . Havnt even run the Chinese Version Yet . All are stock internally . a 12 x 5 Top Flite Sq Tip trimmed to 11 5/8 inch seems pretty usefull .



We'd assume this is the explanation for the obstruction , Reworking the die , they didnt get to fussy , The 49 Sport was a predecessor .



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