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Author Topic: Keeping a McCoy 35 running  (Read 2557 times)

Offline Ronald Eshleman

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Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« on: July 06, 2010, 08:37:48 PM »
I recently acquired a red head McCoy 35 from a gentleman's collection.  It is on a Ringmaster probably from the late 5o's or 60's.  I cleaned up the spray bar and it runs well on the engine stand.  However back on the plane it runs 30-45 sec. with bubbles in the fuel line before shutting down.  I've not gotten in the air because of the stopping.  I cleaned the spray bar.  Reinstalled with the hole pointing down at the angle of the venturi.  Is that right?  I'm using 29% powermaster fuel and as stated it runs fine sitting vertical on the enging stand.  On the plane it sits outboard with exhast port aimed down.  I have the spray bar installed with the needle valve exiting up.  The fuel line comes out of the wedge tank at near entrance angle with port.  It goes down around the back of the motor and enters at the bottom on the venturi.  Compression seems good.  all screws are tight.  I've changed the glow plug several times...It sometimes stops after removing the battery.  The glow plug is a Fox plug. Hoping to get this ship in the air real soon!!

Offline RandySmith

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2010, 09:28:13 PM »
I recently acquired a red head McCoy 35 from a gentleman's collection.  It is on a Ringmaster probably from the late 5o's or 60's.  I cleaned up the spray bar and it runs well on the engine stand.  However back on the plane it runs 30-45 sec. with bubbles in the fuel line before shutting down.  I've not gotten in the air because of the stopping.  I cleaned the spray bar.  Reinstalled with the hole pointing down at the angle of the venturi.  Is that right?  I'm using 29% powermaster fuel and as stated it runs fine sitting vertical on the enging stand.  On the plane it sits outboard with exhast port aimed down.  I have the spray bar installed with the needle valve exiting up.  The fuel line comes out of the wedge tank at near entrance angle with port.  It goes down around the back of the motor and enters at the bottom on the venturi.  Compression seems good.  all screws are tight.  I've changed the glow plug several times...It sometimes stops after removing the battery.  The glow plug is a Fox plug. Hoping to get this ship in the air real soon!!

Ron

Leaning and bubbles at the very end of the tank is normal,( You also may could possibly have a crack in the rear of the fuel tube, or a feed tube that does not go all the way to the rear of the tank) cutting out when the battery is pulled is a sign of a bad or weak or wrong glo plug. Try a FOX RC long, T Bolt RC LOng, Glo Devil #300, or Sig RC long

Randy

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2010, 09:32:20 PM »
Randy posted while I was typing. ;D  I see your problem a bit differently than he does.  While bubbles in the line is almost always the case at the END of th erun when the tank is about empty, your problem is when the tank is full!

Mind you, I will never purport to know half of what Randy does about engines.

QUOTE:
However back on the plane it runs 30-45 sec. with bubbles in the fuel line before shutting down.

It is because the engine is quitting right after you start it, with bubbles in the fuel line, that I wrote this:

The fuel is foaming due to vibration is the first obvious problem.  That has to be cured or it will never run right.  Make sure the prop is balanced first.   Could well be the nose is just weak from the years.  If it (the plane) is as old as you think, I am positive no epoxy was used in the nose construction.  Couple that with very short maple motor mounts, and that can easily cause vibration.

Possibly a small air leak in the tank, also.  Take th etank off, empty it and submerge it in water.  Block off the vents tight, and blow through fuel line connected to the feed line.  Air bubbles naturally mean a leak.

What *brand/heat range* glow plug?  A hot plug is probably necessary.  How are you setting the engine to run?  Are you running it n a 4-2 style? (that's how the old McCoys are meant to run).

Lots of reasons for it not running on the plane, but if it runs on the stand all right , then 99,999 times out of 100,000  it is a problem in the airframe.

Big Bear
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Offline RandySmith

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2010, 10:42:56 PM »
Hi Ron

I read the post as foaming at the last 30 to 45 sec of the tank. If it is as Bill says  foaming badly at the start and will not run but a few seconds then shuts off, he is correct that you most likley have a vibration problem.  Does the tank have a very secure mount? It may help to put a thin sheet of foam behind the tank, or I use silicone to glue the back on when the tank height is set.
Also make sure you use good engine bolts and have a secure engine mount, another thing maybe that the wing/fuse joint is old/bad...check that too

Randy

Online Paul Smith

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2010, 07:26:06 AM »
1.  Check the venturi opening.  Maybe one of the past owners removed the insert or drilled it out.  A temporary fix, you can partially block half the opening with a wood plug.

2. Back in 1959, my father attempted to buy me a McCoy 35 for my birthday.  Mr. John Kilsdonk, the control line expert at the Royal Craft Bike & Hobby Shop advised my father that the McCoy would only lead to frustration followed by abandonment of modeling.  He was able to persuade my father into spending an additional $1.50 to upgrade to a Fox Rocket 35, which served me well.  I've always wondered if John tried to hit up my dad for $7.00 to step up to an OS Max III 35.

3.  There are a few satisfied McCoy 35 owners.  But there are many times more guys who quit because of them.  They are sort of the next step in running the gauntlet, for those who survive the Cox PT-19.
Paul Smith

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2010, 09:23:09 AM »
One thing that has always helped and I do not see it mentioned here.   Put a fuel filter in the line between the tank and engine.  It will break up any air bubbles.  Most of all make sure you have a solid mount.   Also do you feel a lot of vibration?   A fellow held one of my planes years ago.  He had me shut it down and rotate the propellor 180 degrees.  As he stated that sometimes it works, sometimes it don't.  It worked that day and several times since on different planes.  Sometimes even tho the prop may be balance it may be the blade area is different.  Let us know results. H^^
John E. "DOC" Holliday
10421 West 56th Terrace
Shawnee, KANSAS  66203
AMA 23530  Have fun as I have and I am still breaking a record.

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2010, 10:36:27 AM »
(ship)3.  There are a few satisfied McCoy 35 owners.  But there are many times more guys who quit because of them.  They are sort of the next step in running the gauntlet, for those who survive the Cox PT-19.

Hi Paul,

While there is a lot of truth in what you are saying, there are also a whole lot of people who stuck with it and had a McCoy .35 to start out with. ;D

McCoys were often mistreated by unknowing individuals who used the wrong fuel and ran them too hard.  I've been lucky.  I've had the same McCoy Red Head since 1963 and it still runs great with MANY hours on it.  And who's to argue with George Aldrich?  He said the McCoys were the best times Stunt Engines that were mass produced.  No they are not the best engines ever produced when it comes to materials used by Testors.  The Lighting Bolt cases actually did do something to help the issues, but the pistons were still too soft for lasting a life time.

Yes there were, unfortunately, LOTS of QC issues with them as time went by, especially.  But, that has also happened to a lesser degree with about EVERY mass produced model engine. ;D

Big Bear
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James Hylton Motorsports/NASCAR/ARCA

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Online Brett Buck

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2010, 11:00:51 AM »
McCoys were often mistreated by unknowing individuals who used the wrong fuel and ran them too hard. 

   And because they were only $4!  The old "run it till it blows, then buy another one" effect.

     Brett

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2010, 11:02:16 AM »
   And because they were only $4!  The old "run it till it blows, then buy another one" effect.

     Brett

LOL!!!!!!!! so true! LOL!!!!!!

Bill
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Offline Phil Bare

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2010, 11:02:32 AM »
Another thing that I havn't seen mentioned is a possible split in the fuel pick up tube in the tank. McCoy .35 Red Heads were among the best 4-2-4 engines of the day and when ran on 29% castor fuel in the 4-2-4 mode, they gave very good service.
Low oil and a screaming lean run would kill the piston though.
Jim Kraft runs them and maybe could give some suggestions. H^^

Offline Balsa Butcher

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #10 on: July 07, 2010, 09:45:14 PM »
I'd also replace that 50 year old wedge tank with something a bit newer. Available and not too expensive from both Brodak and RSM.  8)
Pete Cunha
Sacramento CA.
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Offline Ronald Eshleman

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2010, 07:56:48 PM »
   Well I've really appreciated the suggestions.  I've been working with Fox .35's the last 2 days, with various spray bars, 1 or 2 holes.  Tank # 1, an older wedge was not working properly...acted full with very little fuel in it?  Running out the bottom as if full! The next tank worked well with Brodak fuel instead of the powermaster. With little control of needle I readjusted the spray bar, marking it first as to where I began...rotating it until the center hole was out of sight gave me needle control to the point of 4-2 ing well.  Still kind of out of control I investigated tubing again...a HOLE right near the exit of the tank!?  Now I want to simulate raising the nose, inverted etc.  Then I'm ready again to try flying and go back to those McCoys with the same process.  I'll report after some testing.

Rn Eshleman

Offline Ronald Eshleman

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2010, 08:22:37 PM »
Just an update.  Today I ran a 3rd Fox .35 with Brodak 29% fuel.  It ran quite well.  Then to those 3 McCoy .35's.  The first engine was not tight on the fuse!  It looked like it was but....opps...about 4 turns to every bolt.  Then a restart...this time I could set the 4-2 and it ran the entire tank.  I then ran 2 other McCoy .35's setting each needle for 4-2. 

RIGHT TANK, RIGHT FUEL, SPRAY BAR CLEAN and POSITIONED correctly, MINIMAL VIBRATION, BALANCED PROP, STRONG BATTERY and NEW FOX GLOW PLUG.  Now I'm ready to FLY!!  That should be in the next day or 2 if the weather co-operates.  THANK YOU for all ADVICE.  GENTLEMEN, you make me smile!!!

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #13 on: July 12, 2010, 09:54:38 AM »
Great to hear they are all working. H^^
John E. "DOC" Holliday
10421 West 56th Terrace
Shawnee, KANSAS  66203
AMA 23530  Have fun as I have and I am still breaking a record.

Offline Ronald Eshleman

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Re: Keeping a McCoy 35 running
« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2010, 08:13:38 PM »
Another great night running one of those McCoy 35's I've been working with.  Did a maiden voyage on a bi-plane I inherited from the 60's.  My friend Bob was there to see it fly.  He started the construction 50 years ago!  I covered it with tower coat in red black and white.  It is very sharp. He must have a 6 oz. tank in it?  It ran for 6 plus minutes.  Very nice run with 29% Caster/ 10% Nitro Brodak fuel and a Fox RC Long glow plug on 52' lines.  It was a memory making moment.  I've taken the many posts here to heart and success is becoming a reality.  Once again, thanks for the suggestions.  The Ringmaster is now flying well too.  Just need to tweek the needle valve a bit.  Right fuel, right spray bar setting, right glow plug and joy is at hand!


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