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Author Topic: Orwicks again  (Read 2053 times)

Offline Jim Kraft

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Orwicks again
« on: August 30, 2008, 07:06:13 PM »
Received this Orwick 64 in the mail yesterday, and after checking it out I mounted it on my test stand for a run or two. This is my first Orwick and happens to be a very good one, well broken in but all the bearings are tight and it has great compression. It is missing a little paint around the engine bolts, but otherwise looks very good. I was surprised to see that the intake tube is only .270" as my Anderson Spitfires are much larger than that. I always have to block off part of the intake on the Spitfires to work well in C/L planes. I think the Orwick will be just fine as is. Somewhere I read that there were both 7&9 fin models. This one happens to be a 7 fin job. Does anybody know what the difference is? Was it a change in year models? Now I have to find something to put it in to fly.
Jim Kraft

Offline Don Hutchinson AMA5402

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2008, 09:33:37 PM »
There were several iterations of the Orwick engines including the number of fins. Some were built by Cunningham too. The Orwick built 64 I have is S/N 4158, came out of a fall, 1947 lot. I think the Cunningham engines had a five digit number. Dr. Spark can probably give you better info. In any case, they are sweet engines. What is the S/N on yours?
Don

Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2008, 07:49:29 AM »
Hi Don; This one is S/N 4483. On the test stand it starts and runs really well. But they always do on the test stand.  LL~ I ran it on both gasoline with castor, and 5% nitro fuel 28% castor, and it ran almost the same on both.  I don't think it has the original spraybar needle in it and it looks like it might be leaking a little at the holes where it goes through. What did they use to seal the spray bar going through a round ventura? The needle works just fine, but I haven't seen one like this on an Orwick before. I have used rubber gaskets made out of bicycle innertubes to seal them, and maybe I will try that on this one. I have had the same problem on Forsters and Ohlsson's with no flats on the intake tube.
Jim Kraft

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #3 on: September 04, 2008, 01:13:54 PM »
A long, long time ago, I owned an Orwick 64 which was stamped "Cunningham" on the exhaust stack.  Otherwise identical to the one stamped "Orwick". 

Were all the Cunningham-Orwick motors identified as Cunningham, or did Al steal the Orwick name also?

Floyd
90 years, but still going (mostly)
AMA #796  SAM #188  LSF #020

Offline James Lee

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #4 on: September 05, 2008, 10:45:38 AM »
Jim
The original Orwick spraybar was pressed in....   No leak....   y1
Jim

Offline Don Hutchinson AMA5402

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #5 on: September 05, 2008, 01:26:23 PM »
Jim-  From the S/N I would assume you have a Henry Orwick built engine. I don't know anything about the relationship between Cunningham  and Orwick so can't add anything there. Also, there were other runs of replica Orwicks made in the 80's or so. Joe Klauss had beautiful repros that came in a very nice wooden box and a bunch of Dunham Orwicks were made in England. I have no idea how or if these were serealized and if my memory is not totaly gone, the Dunham Orwicks were made a bit off dimensionally so parts would not interchange. There is a gent out in Midland Texas who can give you all there is to know about Orwicks but I can't reall the last name!! There was also a real history of Orwicks in MECA or some similar mag which I found on the internet but once again I don't remember how I found it! Google Orwick maybe??
Don

Offline Don Hutchinson AMA5402

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #6 on: September 05, 2008, 02:30:33 PM »
Jim-
I went digging into the net and found the issues of the MECA journal that has all the Orwick info in them. 9 articles in all. Have ordered these from MECA and will let you know when I get them. Should answer all the questions! Even the name of my contact in Midland.
Don

Offline James Lee

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #7 on: September 05, 2008, 03:02:36 PM »
Don
You are referring to Bill Tift, He does know just about all there is to know about the Orwick history!!! y1 y1  Used to see him at the Tulsa Collecto...
That series of articles is very interesting  H^^ H^^ H^^
Jim

Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #8 on: September 05, 2008, 04:33:23 PM »
Thanks for all the info and replys on the Orwicks. Jim; I was pretty sure the needle/spray bar were not original and have since replaced them with a Super Tigre that I did a little rework on. That is working great and the engine starts and needles really well. Every time I get a new sparker I am like a kid with a new toy. LL~ Just love to run and fly them in various planes. I have a couple in old ff planes with radios, and four in C/L planes. Just to much fun.
Jim Kraft

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2008, 11:19:16 AM »
I have a Joe Klaus (K&M) replica Orwick 64.  His serial numbers were stamped on the back plate and was "R64" and then serial number, beginning with 001.  Mine reads "R64091".  It is a really nice job and it runs great!  Most of the small parts are stamped "K&M", to avoid confusion with original Orwick parts, although every part of his engines will interchange with original Orwicks. This is the only repro Orwick that I know of which is EXACTLY interchangeable.

Floyd
90 years, but still going (mostly)
AMA #796  SAM #188  LSF #020

Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2008, 04:33:20 PM »
Floyd; I saw one of the K&M Orwicks go on E-Bay awhile back. I think it was new and still in the wooden box. Brought a really high price, and was a beautiful engine. Also some of the earlier "73"s sold, and one went for over $750.00. I just would not be able to fly an engine that I paid that much for. There were also some "23"s and "29"s that went for around $300.00.
Jim Kraft

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2008, 11:24:22 AM »
The Orwick "73" was an odd-ball.  Very few were made.  JC Yates owned one, and I know the location of a 73 once owned by John Pond.  From rumors, I understand the 73 wasn't any more powerful than the 64, but it should have been!.

Floyd in OR
90 years, but still going (mostly)
AMA #796  SAM #188  LSF #020

Offline raglafart

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2008, 07:05:42 PM »
Hi Jim
Your needle valve assembly looks like an Atwood Super Champ assembly it's definitely not a genuine Orwick unit. I have the copy of the article from the Model Engine encyclopedia, Henry sub contracted the manufacture to Cunningham, in a nutshell, Henry wasn't happy with the modifications Cunningham made and there was a bust up. Cunningham then set up and produced his own similar version that had the beam mounts, while Henry took back manufacture. This was when the fin count changed.
I've copied the table and hope you will be able to read the details of the production changes and relevant minor changes to the head, needle valve assemblies, fin count and piston design.
Cheers John
John Goodwin

AUS 21261

Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2008, 08:18:25 PM »
Hey John; Thank you for posting this as I was able to print it out just fine. I was told that this was a '48 Orwick 64, and from your chart that is exactly what it is. I have had the back plate and cyl. off and the piston is the "A" type with the wide pin bosses with oil holes. The rod is a piece of work and looks like it is polished with an oil slot in the top end, and oil holes in the bottom. The head is the "B" type and the cyl. counting the flanges has 9 fins. I have not quite figured out what needle and spray bar were in it, but I new they were not stock. I have removed them and made a couple of pieces of aluminum to fit the round ventura, and flat where the spray bar goes. I then installed a Super Tigre needle and spray bar which are working very well. I just checked the needle that was in the Owick, and it does fit right in my two Atwoods just fine, so you are probably right on that. Not sure about the spray bar as it looks to short. Maybe out of an Atwood Triumph 49. Thanks again for the info.
Jim Kraft

Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #14 on: September 17, 2008, 08:36:15 PM »
I flew the Orwick in my Taurus today and it flew it very well. I took Floyd Carters advice and drilled out the motor bolt holes to accept 6-32 bolts and used the optional motor mounts with aircraft lock nuts. For those that don't know, the Taurus is a Brit design with a 68" span, 850sq." wing, at about 65oz.. It does have a fairly beefy front end but I did not have any problem with the mounts coming loose. I put 7 or 8 flights on it in pretty heavy wind and was very happy with the way the motor runs. I was running and old Top Flight 12-6 paddle blade prop and 5% glow fuel. With the timer set at just a little before TDC, and it ran in a very fast 4 stroke just breaking into a 2 in places. All in all I am very happy with it and will probably build something for it now. The old Taurus is about 12 years old now but is still a good test bed for engines. I have the motor mounts set up to take steel pads which are mounted to the mounts and drilled and tapped for the engine that I am running. So far I have had a Fox 59, and Anderson Spitfire, an Atwood 63, a Super Cyclone, and now the Orwick. The Anderson and the Orwick are the best.
Jim Kraft

Offline Don Hutchinson AMA5402

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2008, 03:38:53 PM »
Just received volumes 24 and 25 of the Engine Collectors Journal. There are 54 total pages of text and photos about the Orwick engines between the two of them.  Each voume is 6 issues and cost is $15.00 per volume. Will tell you everything there is to know about Orwicks and those who built them.
Don

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2008, 10:42:45 AM »
Don.  I wonder if your documentation shows pictures of H. Orwick's  "shop" ?  I remember almost every detail of his garage-operation in L.A.  I only visited twice, around 1951 or so, but somehow remember it like yesterday.

Floyd in OR
90 years, but still going (mostly)
AMA #796  SAM #188  LSF #020

Offline Don Hutchinson AMA5402

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Re: Orwicks again
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2008, 12:18:07 PM »
Only the shop in Gardena, not the one on W.70th. If interested, I can send the books to you after Jim K finishes with them.
Don


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