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Author Topic: Propylene oxide What to do with it?  (Read 1463 times)

Offline frank mccune

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Propylene oxide What to do with it?
« on: April 10, 2016, 03:37:46 PM »
    Hi All:

    I was given a bit of this stuff today and I was wondering how I can use it in my engines for Sport and/or Stunt flying. 

    Any suggestions about its use and how to safely use it?

                                                                                                                                    Tia,

                                                                                                                                    Frank McCune

Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Propylene oxide What to do with it?
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2016, 11:43:23 PM »
It's an ignitor, so if your fuel has a respectable amount of alcohol in it, the P.O. will only cause pre-ignition.

If you want to see what this stuff does, pour a teaspoon full on a concrete patio, stand back, and throw a lit match on it. DO NOT bend over this small wet spot while applying the match. The flame will be roughly 3'-4' high, if memory serves (and in this case, it might!). You'll probably want to dispose of it in a safe manner.  y1 Steve
"The United States has become a place where professional athletes and entertainers are mistaken for people of importance." - Robert Heinlein

In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.  In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.

Offline Rich Perry

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Re: Propylene oxide What to do with it?
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2016, 05:30:00 AM »
Brodak sells the stuff.

Offline MikeyPratt

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Re: Propylene oxide What to do with it?
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2016, 08:02:04 PM »
If I recall correctly, didn't one of the Fox fuels have 1% PO in it? D>K

Hi Ty,
Years ago all fuels had 1 to 2% PO to make it easier to start the model engines.  That practice has gone away because if were you were at the flying field and didn't tighten the fuel can securely, the PO would evaporate very quickly.  The people that fly carrier still use the PO to keep the engine running during low speed flight with high nitro fuel.  One of the most popular fuel mixes for carrier was 70% nitro, 20% Klotz, 10% propylene oxide.  The transition from idle to full power was almost instant, and did they ever scream.

Later,
Mikey

Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Propylene oxide What to do with it?
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2016, 03:06:29 PM »
George Aldrich's excellent article on performance engine rework (Aero Modeler Annual, sometime in the '60's) said NEVER put PO in a fuel with alcohol, or it would cause pre-ignition. Not knowing any better (not having a copy of said Annual), I did it the "cowboy way" and experimented, using my basic 65% nitro homebrew. With 5% PO and 4% Nitro Benzene, got a nice gain (don't recall rpm gain), and with 8% Nitro Benzene, got +800 rpm. There were some problems with this, because the engine didn't "clear out" as quickly and really didn't like running rich all that well (rich for launch, WFO afterwards). And of course, Nitro Benzene was soon to (justifiably) become a banned substance, along with Benzene. Nitro Benzene is what us old timers remember as "that shoe polish aroma", because Kiwi shoe polish contained a little bit of Nitro Benzene.

In speed/racing engines, Amyl Acetate does the same thing as NB, in a much smaller percentage, without the bad traits and the carcinogenic issue. AA smells a lot like bananas. FWIW, Amway used to sell an "octane booster" for automotive uses that smelled "a lot like bananas"! If anybody has any experience with the Amway product, I'd like to hear about it. "Octane Boosters" usually sell for $8 or more for 8 oz bottle, while AA is cheap by the gallon.

Mike is correct about PO being uber volatile, and difficult to store without considerable loss to evaporation. I used a quality plastic quart bottle, wrapped the joint between the lid and bottle with layers of vinyl electrical tape, and put it in the freezer. I wouldn't store it in the freezer with food. If I had some I wanted to dispose of, I would let it evaporate on a hot sunny day with a nice breeze.  H^^ Steve
"The United States has become a place where professional athletes and entertainers are mistaken for people of importance." - Robert Heinlein

In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.  In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.


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