News:



  • April 20, 2024, 12:12:26 AM

Login with username, password and session length

Author Topic: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area  (Read 1072 times)

Offline Keith Miller

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Commander
  • ****
  • Posts: 210
Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« on: October 12, 2022, 07:50:59 PM »
Hi all -
I have the older Fox 35 stunt and attached an Aero Products tongue muffler with a 10x6 prop. The engine quits early and I'm believing it's getting a bit too hot.
Yes, I have to use a muffler - field rules.
Yes, I'm running 5% nitro, 29% all castor fuel.
I saw posts recommending dropping to a prop  with lower lower loading like a 9x6, so I can try that.

Next I measured exhaust areas.
The stack on the Fox has 0.246 sq in of total open-face exhaust area. Granted, that's much larger than the actual exhaust area right where the piston actually opens up into the stack, but it's what I measured.

The Aero Products tongue muffler has 14 holes at 0.076" diameter (#48 drill just fits). That's only about 0.064 sq" of area, which is only 25% of the open face of the stack.

Whaddayallthink?
Drill out another 14 holes?
I suppose I could drill out enough holes to equal the area of the engines stack, but then it would just "look" like a muffler full of tons of holes.


Online Dan McEntee

  • 23 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 6856
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2022, 09:27:10 PM »
     Have you tried a few flights on the sly with no muffler to see how it runs that way? You can add another row of holes and see how it runs. Might even consider a few on the end pointing away from the stack. As far as prop goes, we don't know what size and weight the air plane is. I would try a 10-5 and spin the engine up a bit before dropping down to a 9-6. Did you buy it direct from Randy? Is it a strap on muffler?
   Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee
AMA 28784
EAA  1038824
AMA 480405 (American Motorcyclist Association)

Offline Keith Miller

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Commander
  • ****
  • Posts: 210
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2022, 01:40:09 PM »
Dan, no - I haven't run it without a muffler.
However...
I did run it with a lighter 9x6 wood prop and it ran well. I'll try a 10x5 as well.
Yes, this is a Randy Smith strap-on muffler (direct). "Strap-on" in that I wrapped a hose clamp around to the back of the ears. Works OK but a standard hose clamp is a bit clunky-looking.

Online Dan McEntee

  • 23 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 6856
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2022, 02:19:07 PM »
Dan, no - I haven't run it without a muffler.
However...
I did run it with a lighter 9x6 wood prop and it ran well. I'll try a 10x5 as well.
Yes, this is a Randy Smith strap-on muffler (direct). "Strap-on" in that I wrapped a hose clamp around to the back of the ears. Works OK but a standard hose clamp is a bit clunky-looking.

  With a worm style clamp, this is where you have to be careful. If you run the clamp down too tight you can distort the case and that will make the piston/liner fit tight in one spot and it will over heat. Look in the classifieds for some straps that John Paris is selling. Notice in his pictures how the strap lines up with a boss on the case, and when tightened down, this takes all the stress. . You might try your muffler help on with a small diameter tension spring to hold it just tight enough to hold it on. Will take some experimentation to find one but it has worked for people before.
   Type at you later,
    Dan McEntee
AMA 28784
EAA  1038824
AMA 480405 (American Motorcyclist Association)

Offline kenneth cook

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • ******
  • Posts: 1466
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2022, 05:31:02 PM »
           I use the same muffler and rather drill additional holes, Rather then drill more,  I open the stock holes up with the next size drill bit. I've gone up to 7/64" but it does start getting loud.

Offline Keith Miller

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Commander
  • ****
  • Posts: 210
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2022, 08:23:51 PM »
... Look in the classifieds for some straps that John Paris is selling. Notice in his pictures how the strap lines up with a boss on the case, and when tightened down, this takes all the stress. ...

Dan, such a strap would be great.... buttt - I see only 1 item advertised in the Classified section (see pic)..

Offline pmackenzie

  • Pat MacKenzie
  • 24 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 765
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2022, 10:42:42 PM »
Dan, such a strap would be great.... buttt - I see only 1 item advertised in the Classified section (see pic)..

https://stunthanger.com/smf/classifieds-92/fox-35-stunt-muffler-strap/msg571103/?topicseen#new
MAAC 8177

Offline Dave Hull

  • 24 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 1908
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2022, 01:49:46 AM »
Fox 35 Stunt muffler for an older engine with no mounting lugs. Made of folded sheet metal and uses a wire "bail" to hook a close-wound extension spring. With nothing much for it to ride on, it rubs and wears the case a bit. It has eleven .093" diameter holes for a total area of .075 square inches and makes plenty of power. I don't use the pressure fitting--it's mounted on a Bi-Slob. Running a 10x5 prop.

It has about 18% more area than your example.

Offline Dave Hull

  • 24 supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 1908
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2022, 02:07:10 AM »
Fox 35 Stunt muffler for an engine with mounting lugs. Made of DuBro muffler stock and uses 4-40 mounting bolts. It has nine .093" diameter holes for a total area of .061 square inches and makes sufficient power for a Nobler flown in light breezes. I use the pressure fitting on this setup. Running a 10x5 prop. I use this exact same setup on a Fancy Pants with no issues. Both with 4-2 runs.

These two mufflers have about 18% less area than your example.

Based on this, it wouldn't appear that your muffler restriction is the entire cause of perceived overheating and incomplete runs. Therefore, I would not start drilling more holes or modifying it in any way. Yet.

But we need more information to go on. How well broken in is your engine? How big/heavy is your plane? What kind of rpm/setting are you trying to run? Have you tried higher nitro? How tight is your cowling, if any? Is the piston or cylinder varnished up? Did this run fine before and this is an evolving problem, or is this a new installation?

Offline Keith Miller

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Commander
  • ****
  • Posts: 210
Re: Fox 35 Tongue Muffler total exhaust area
« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2022, 08:13:25 PM »
Thanks all for the great responses!!!
I'm feeling much more comfortable with what I have.
 #^ ~>


Advertise Here
Tags:
 


Advertise Here