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Speed,Combat,Scale,Racing => Combat => Topic started by: Steven Kientz on April 11, 2008, 01:55:16 PM
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This is a test. anyone know the year and contest?
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No, but that looks like a Super Swoop on a pacifier...G21 Supertiger maybe?
Not that you asked any of that.
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I know its the '69 NATS, I thought that might be a Winder. As far as the flyer...?
Steve
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I can't identify the flyer.
The plane looks like a cross between a Swoop and a Winder.
The Winder was high aspect, the Swoop was much lower aspect. The photo looks like, maybe, a homebuilt that was a compromise between the two.
I build a Sterling Swoop from a kit. Heaaaavvvy! Back to Combat Cats.
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Here's a pic from Baxter's of a Super Swoop...I dunno, looks pretty similar to me. With reversed wingtips, maybe.
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I think the Winder & Super Swoop are nearly identical, at least in the pictures that I've seen. I have some other pictures but the files are to large. Might try to crop and post them later.
Steve
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The Winder is actually quite small, with a very thin wing (that often folded in midair). Swoops and Super Swoops had a far more "normal" airfoil thickness and chord. You can see illustrations of both, I'm pretty sure, at Barry Baxter's CL Plans website. There was another relatively small, relatively narrow chord combat design, kitted by Midwest, called the Matador, that was far better than the Winder, IMO (the stabilator on the Matador might have looked a little like the one in the lead photo here, but that's the only piece that survived from one of those that I had back in the late 1960's to early 1970's). Look that one up at Baxter's site while you're there!
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The plane looks like a cross between a Swoop and a Winder.
The Winder was high aspect, the Swoop was much lower aspect. The photo looks like, maybe, a homebuilt that was a compromise between the two.
It looks like a Matador with the three-boom stabilator from a Super Swoop . .
http://www.controllineplans.com/frameset2.htm
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If you enlarge the picture you can see where something is written on the wing. I couldn't make it out,but maybe someone else can. AMA # is visible.
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Looks like a Tyrantula 2, but moded with three booms and a plastic pacifier pod like the Spectrum had. G-21 35. Short hair for '69....
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Looks like a Spectrum, with a modified stab. At the right tip you can just make out the wing sheeting/tip brace which puts the leading edge sheeting back behind the pacifier pod. Anybody know Randy Wilging, the designer. Might be him in the pic.
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This picture is the same NATS. This is Carl Schilling, flew with my father out of Indpls.
Steve
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Plane on (our) left appears to be a Demon, Riley Wooten's diamond airfoil design?
Yup, first pic does look like the Spectrum. Ad does the right ship above.
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Here is a real beauty, hopefully it survived this day. Second picture is some planes from Indy combat team
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Voodoo on top, looks like a Nemesis peeking out underneath.
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Did you notice the numbers on the stabilators- I assume 69 for the year and then plane number.
Steve
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The red beauty in the top pic looks like an Exterminator.
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With regards to the original bird that is the subject of this post: If you look at the shape of the tips and the stab, they look more like a Tyrantula 2 than a Spectrum. The motor mounts extend further aft on the Spectrum. A lot of guys copied the Spectrum plastic pacifier pod in those days, it was quicker and easier to make (but weaker). Three boom mods were all the rage, too, a-la Terry Prather's 1967 Winder. I suspect the bird is a Tyrantula 2 moded for a G21. The T2 was originally designed for the lighter Fox 36X. Adding a third boom would CG it better for a G21. The T2 was a great flyer, in the Nemesis class. Just my 2 cents....
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Maybe its a Winder with modified wing tips and Spectrum pacifier tank?
Here's pic from a old kit that was never built...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v612/JOE91SC/WinderFastCombat001.jpg)
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Unless someone knows the flier we'll never know.
Steve
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We were using the plastic balls for pacifier holders 'way back in the dark ages...
Yes, that's 18-yr.-old me! Musta been about 1962? or thereabouts.
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Hey Ray you kid, do you remember flying against the likes of the Meriwethers, Dunham and Houghts. I don't know if Randy Cuberly was there or not. I didn't get back to KC until the fall of 62. My first big contest was in Wichita(63), but, Berryman wasn't there. I turned 21 in Dec of 62 and was called the farm boy by members of the Flying Eagles MAC of Kansas City Kansas. Now to the young man in the lead photo of this thread, maybe that was his own design as most were tending to do in that period of time. Later, DOC Holliday
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Hey John,
Being from OK, I was more oriented toward the Okies and Texans--I flew against (note I didn't say "competed with," no competition to them) Carl Berryman, James Mears, Riley Wooten, Wayne Welch, Norman Barnes, Gerald Sanders, Marlin McGee, etc., etc.
Berryman and Wooten in particular, were a couple of the most gracious fliers I ever met...Carl was about a hundred feet tall, but would hold his hand down at shoulder level when at the top of the circle so as to give you a fighting chance at reaching him, not that he needed his height advantage anyhow. Riley would always say "Boy you young bucks are sure makin' it hard on me", as he shredded your streamer at will. They sure could give a guy a combat lesson!
Not to say the other guys mentioned weren't gentlemen in the circle as well. "Them wuz the days!"
Biggest thing I was ever involved in at KC was a 5000 lap (yes, 3 zeros) Rat Race. Talk about equipment attrition!
--Ray
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My father told me he flew against Wooten,Nats in Calif.? He even got a cut on him,Riley promptly stopped fooling around and got the kill.
Steve
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This is a test. anyone know the year and contest?
Just ran into this browsing some old topics ... The flyer is Jim Ehlen of Crystal, MN (a Minneapolis suburb) holding a Tyrantula at the '69 Nats, where he placed 2nd in Senior Combat.
Jim is still flying combat 47 years later!
Dennis
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Finally an answer, thanks, DOC Holliday.
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I do believe that is Larry Driskill in the background too.
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Just ran into this browsing some old topics ... The flyer is Jim Ehlen of Crystal, MN (a Minneapolis suburb) holding a Tyrantula at the '69 Nats, where he placed 2nd in Senior Combat.
Jim is still flying combat 47 years later!
Dennis
Just found this thread. I recognized the face and thought he might be the guy who I flew against in the Senior Combat final match at the 1969 NATS held at Willow Grove, Pa N.A.S.
I'm glad he's still flying and extend my kind regards to him.
I won that year , but it could have easily been him.
Frank