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Author Topic: little advice please! -Trimming  (Read 724 times)

Offline Tom Luciano

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little advice please! -Trimming
« on: May 02, 2010, 07:14:13 PM »
 Gents,
  Got out with my new Gotcha SX 460 today. This is the perfect plane for my boys to learn on. Within the second flight I was hands off (well kind of) with the 6 and 12 year old. Only one gentle pancake, no damage. I built this with full sized wing and a old Fox .29 for power. Great line tension, about 5 sec. laps. Okay here is my problem, level flight and insides it flies great! Outsides and inverted the outboard tip comes up quite a bit. I know I can heat the covering and twist the wing. For the life of me, I cant remember what way to twist it? Also, why does it not fly tip low when upright?

 No matter what, it was a great successfull day, and the boys can't wait to get out again. I already have to reel them in a bit because they got a taste of their first loops  #^ I really should have taken some pictures :(

Thanks,
Tom
« Last Edit: May 02, 2010, 07:45:49 PM by Tom Luciano »
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2010, 09:27:15 AM »
Great to here the lads are doing good.  Now take the plane and hold it so you can sight it from the rear.  Does it look straight across the trailing edge and the whole wing.  Sounds like you may have a little twist in the wing.  If it does you need to get the twist out of if it is not that bad put a trim tab on the outboard tip.  It is amazing that it does not fly outboard wing low upright.  Anyway keep the boys going and don't push when they say they don't want to fly.  Don't ask me how I know. H^^
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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Offline Paul Smith

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2010, 12:30:50 PM »
You just have to imagine that you're flying a real plane and need to use the ailerons of level the wing.

So if it's trying to turn right, you need some left aileron to correct.  On the foamie, it may be assembled a little out of whack, so steaming and heating will only be a temporary fix.  I would suggest making a balsa trim tab and adding it to the outside wing tip.  Without seeing the plane in flight, I'd guess 1/2" x 3" would be a good size for a start.  

Yeah, right, inch, not foot, unless you have a 120" wing.

The advantage of a trim tab is you can tweak it without a heat gun.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2010, 11:10:43 AM by Paul Smith »
Paul Smith

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2010, 08:58:34 AM »
1/2" X 3',  but I think he will figure out you mean  1/2 inch by 3 inch.  Just razzin ya to get the old blood stirred up so it doesn't start clotting. S?P S?P H^^
John E. "DOC" Holliday
10421 West 56th Terrace
Shawnee, KANSAS  66203
AMA 23530  Have fun as I have and I am still breaking a record.

Offline Tom Luciano

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2010, 02:50:09 PM »
Thanks Guys. Yeah LOL!!  I knew what you meant Paul. I'll twist the outboard Wing down a bit and see what happens. I found it to be a little wierd that it flew so well upright but as soon as you start outside manevuers she wants to roll right in.

Thanks,
Tom
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Offline Paul Smith

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2010, 11:27:57 AM »
If the plane is warped enough to really hurt, you should be able to see the top or bottom of the wing level flight.  If all you can see is the wing tip, you're probably as flat as you need to be.

Torque roll or gyroscopic precession is another issue.  All planes with regular engine rotation tend to get a little loose on DOWN turns.  So, if anything, a bit of intentional warp to counteract that might be in order (or else a Rabe rudder). Back in the days of traditional Slow Combat, I build a series of planes with Rabe rudders, and it helped a lot, but not enough to keep me putting so much effort into a short-lived airframe.

One parting shot, a little bit of extra outboard tip weight will go a long way toward making warps a smaller
issue.
Paul Smith

Offline Clancy Arnold

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2010, 07:11:45 PM »
Paul hinted at the rest of the problem.

You have two problems to fix.

Warped wing and tip weight.

Your description says that you have insufficient tip weight besides the warp.  Upright the warp is holding the tip down but inverted it is lifting the wing up.  When you get the warp under control either by twisting the wing to remove it or a trim tab to cancel it out then you will be  flying with the wing tip high upright and inverted so before going much farther add some tip weight now.  when the wing is flying the same upright and inverted then adjust the tip weight to level the wings.  I always try to have excess tip weight until I know that the wing flies the same upright and inverted.
Clancy
Clancy Arnold
Indianapolis, IN   AMA 12560 LM-S
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Offline Tom Luciano

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2010, 08:09:11 PM »
Sounds like a plan y1
thanks Clancy


Tom
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Offline John_Craig

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #8 on: May 11, 2010, 02:12:02 PM »
I have extra tip weight on my 460.  It cured a lot of strange behavior.  Perhaps an ounce & a half.

Offline Lionel Smith

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Re: little advice please! -Trimming
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2010, 11:00:03 PM »
Sounds like the inside wing is warped down a little, why I say that is when upright it flies level because the weight of the lines keep it from flying wing down, but inverted you have the weight of the lines aswell as the warp pushing the inside wing down so it shows up more.

Forever learning to keep the pointy end away from the ground!


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