Author Topic: Finally!!! /Super Satan (Read 25223 times)

Tom Luciano · « **on:** March 28, 2010, 08:42:35 PM »

Gentlemen,

Since things are a little slow down here, I figured I would share a couple of pictures of my new build. I purchased a couple of short kits (Action Ed) of the Super Satan, this one being totally original the next one will have some updates such as a modern bladder compartment and a few other changes. The reason I titled this thread as 'finally" is, I have wanted to build this plane since I was probably 10 years old. I can remember my father, and Larry Scarinzi flying these in local contests in New Jersey when I was just a young boy. Also, first Silk job since I was about 15 years old. Thai silk 8mm, which is a little heavy but it will work. I did run into some Clear issues mostly due to blushing since its been raining here for jeesh, I don't know. Anyway here she is, tipping the scale at a little porky 18.5 ounces. Brand new Fox .36xBB eBay engine and a Gerber 76099 pacifier. Probably won't get flown till early summer as I need to get a little more handle time before flying.

Thomas Wilk · « **Reply #1 on:** March 29, 2010, 08:09:30 AM »

I like your Logo.

I still have my patch.

Tom

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #2 on:** March 29, 2010, 08:58:59 AM »

Hey Tom,

  Yeah, it was a cool logo. I'm sure my father still has a few patches laying around. I remember we had 2 sizes, the sleeve size, and the huge one that you could put on the back of your jacket. I remember having my little denim jacket with the big logo that took up my whole back. If you do a search on this site you will see a thread on the history of the logo. It was actually the logo for the squadron Roe was in, in Korea. Thanks to Clancy for that info. I think I'll throw a decal on the wing of the SS.
  I'm actually very excited about completing this plane. First control line plane completed by me in ( i never thought I say this) 30 years. Actually, only one a active UMAC'ER completed in that time.
  Well lets hope I start a trend. Dad said he is going to throw a Killer on the bench. Way too much history and pride in this club to forget about its roots.

  Its funny I said my father would have the patches laying around. I mentioned to him I needed Celastic to complete the Stabilator attachment, but it was no longer available. A week later he comes over with a 10x12 piece. He probably hasn't used that since 1968

Paul Smith · « **Reply #3 on:** March 29, 2010, 01:02:08 PM »

Celastic was quite the rage for beefing up planes in the 60's. I still have a 1968 Goodyear racer with that stuff on it.

But in retrospect, it was awful thick & heavy for the strength it added. But easy to install!. It looks like gray 1/8" cardboard when dry, but molds to a contour when wet. You just wet it with dope thinner and rubbed it on. I guess it would add authenticity to a nostalgia combat plane.

Fibreglass and epoxy replaced Celastic as a beefer upper.

Thomas Wilk · « **Reply #4 on:** March 29, 2010, 03:06:23 PM »

Tom;

What is your Dads name? I seem to recall that name when I lived in Reselle Park (1960s and early 70s). Ask him if the names Tom, Steve, Jeff or Chris mean anything to him?

We still see L Scaeinzzi at the Nats.
I also am in contact with Jack Sammarco.

Tom Wilk

Paul Smith · « **Reply #5 on:** March 29, 2010, 03:16:42 PM »

http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/glossary-e/15902-celastic.html

You got me curious about Celastic. The stuff is still readlily available. It's flannel impregnated with acetate. Still used for puppets and stage props. it's not noted for high strength, but that's what we used it for.

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #6 on:** March 29, 2010, 05:03:43 PM »

Tom,
My father is Mike. Member since 1962, he took 2 years off while he built his 46 Ford coupe from 73-75. Competed in Combat and Carrier in the sixties and early seventies. He got out of Combat a little earlier because he couldn't keep up with the building. He actually was one of the test pilots for the plane as Larry was developing it. I built this off a set of plans that was going to Carl Goldberg dated May of 1966. This was ultimately the final version being #12. I also have a earlier version #7 which has a different sheeting configuration on it.

Actually, Tom I remember you very well. As Adults we never know what we say or do to kids that leaves a lasting impression. Your's to me; I am a engineer/estimator in my own construction company. Everyday I look at and roll plans up and I always use a trick you showed me. Simply stick your finger inside the plans and spin it as tight as you want. Works like a Charm! thanks you saved me a lot of space over the years.

Hopefully that jars your memory
Tom
Also he was treasure for 25+ years. He is still building like mad, lot of Giant Scale these days

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #7 on:** March 29, 2010, 05:15:14 PM »

Paul,

I have done some searching on the web for Celastic. It was primarily used in the theatre industry for making props, masks etc. I have actually seen it advertised on some websites and when trying to order it it will come up as unavailable. There is a replacement out there that you heat rather then dip in thinner. I don't know how it would work in this application. I found it very pleasant to work with 2"x2.5" piece almost weightless. Simply dip in thinner for 30 seconds or so and wrap it around the stabilator to terminate it. Worked Great!

Tom

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #8 on:** March 29, 2010, 05:21:24 PM »

this shot shows where its used on the Super Satan.
Very neat and clean.
Tom

Lee Thiel · « **Reply #9 on:** March 29, 2010, 06:01:05 PM »

I just bought 2 yards of celastic about 3 months or so ago. I will see if I can find the web address and post it here.
Lee TGD
Ok, found it. This is where I got it.
http://www.atlasortho.com/sub%20Products/subcat_html/Celastic.html

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #10 on:** March 29, 2010, 06:15:43 PM »

Lee,
Thats awesome! Did you have to buy 20 sheets though?
Tom

Lee Thiel · « **Reply #11 on:** March 29, 2010, 06:48:49 PM »

I think that it is a 2 sheet minimum. I sold one to another clubmember, so my cost wasn't so bad, since we also split the shipping cost.
Lee TGD

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #12 on:** March 30, 2010, 06:35:18 AM »

Tom
I dug up a couple club of pictures. I love looking at the planes being held in each era. First one is from the June 63 article in Model Aviation. I think this article was re-released in control line world recently. Maybe one of those young guys in the front is World Champ Bob Hunt. Maybe Bob will jump in here and recognize some of these guys. Wardo may also know.
Thanks,
Tom

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #13 on:** March 30, 2010, 06:40:58 AM »

This one has your gang in it. I'm thinking somewhere around 71 or 72. Taken at the club picnic the day before the famed Memorial day meet.
Your clan is circled.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #14 on:** April 02, 2010, 10:25:51 AM »

Is that our own Bobby Hunt on the left in the back with a head of hair?

Thomas Wilk · « **Reply #15 on:** April 02, 2010, 11:45:49 AM »

by golly you might be right. I can only identify about 6 people. Th mind is going fast. I have to wear a name tag to remind me who I am!!! HEE HEE Hee

Tom

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #16 on:** April 02, 2010, 04:04:04 PM »

Doc,

I don't know, it could be. The guy holding the stunt ship in front of the mystery man is Frank Imbriaco. Frank popped up in a picture of Shultzie's. He was fueling his JD Falcon at the 69 nats. I sent it to Frank a little over a year ago and apparently its a JD Falcon II. Somebody mentioned that Bob H. wrote about it. Oh, I'm the kid kneeling behind the bipe. Boy, wasn't I handsome? What happened!

If I only had half that hair I would be happy!

Tom,
No worries.
If you do talk to Jack tell him I was asking about him.

Thanks,
Tom

Al Ferraro · « **Reply #17 on:** April 04, 2010, 07:09:36 AM »

Tom, I remember your Dad flying the Super Satan and carrier back then. I went to the Union field with my dad when I was 14. Larry and your dad had those Fox 36XBB screaming and flying at far greater speeds than anyone else. When I read this post I had to reply because I also just completed a Super Satan and will be flying it soon.

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #18 on:** April 04, 2010, 07:37:08 AM »

Al,

After some surfing on the web. I found the Middlesex modelers website. I'm assuming that's you I'm seeing in the pictures. Great to hear you remembered my father and have built a super Satan. I would love to be there when you fly it! I actually took my sons down to mountain view park yesterday but, no one was there. Two best contests I attended when I was little were of course Union, and Middlesex. Why,they had the best playgrounds

.

Tom

Al Ferraro · « **Reply #19 on:** April 04, 2010, 08:53:15 AM »

Yeah, that is me and my son Patrick. Attendance at the field right now is low, but should pick up. We have a combat contest coming up soon and the top east coast flyers usually attend. I attached a copy of our Club's Contest Schedule, so if you want to see some real action. The Union Memorial Day Meet was a great contest with all aspects of control line flying, to see an event like that again you have to go to Brodak. I remember your dad flying a lot of carrier and in our club we have some of the best carrier flyers in the country that still compete. I just saw Larry at our club lunch, and I talk to Frank Imbriaco from time to time and he says he has his Scrambler almost completed. He actually only lives 5 miles away from me. Your photos bring back a lot of memories.

Michael Boucher · « **Reply #20 on:** April 21, 2010, 10:42:47 PM »

How did the smiley fly? If you didn't know anything else about the time frame of that picture, the smiley gives it away.

Frank Imbriaco · « **Reply #21 on:** May 27, 2010, 07:02:38 PM »

-An amazin' reunion of the"F U" Mac'ers (of Union, NJ )as Scarinzi used to refer to us. Al, Tommy, Tom and the rest of the guys in the photo. An amazing club with a super level of participation.That stunter I'm holding belonged to Hunt- as you can see, I couldn't walk with it.

Remember Thursday nites at the field? Three or four circles going, then off to eat at either 5 Points, the Homestead, or Peter Pan Diner.

Make mine one complete, one frenchy and a Birch Beer.

Frank

Thomas Wilk · « **Reply #22 on:** May 28, 2010, 06:20:36 AM »

Frank;
We remember those good times. I still hear from Jack Sammarco.

I'm out of modeling now, but son Steve is very active. He will be competing in F2C at the worlds in Hungary in July.

Tom Wilk (Duluth, MN)

Frank Imbriaco · « **Reply #23 on:** May 28, 2010, 07:40:56 AM »

Tom,
Good to hear from you. You must be very proud of Steve's accomplishments. Another seed sowed in the fertile soil of the UMAC Club of Union, NJ.
As I think back about the group, I will always remember the amazing building and flying talents of the weekend modelers who chose not to compete and shunned the spotlight. I was a young teen in 1965 when I joined and was the recipient of great guidance.
What a group, huh ?
Frank

Michael Boucher · « **Reply #24 on:** May 28, 2010, 10:13:25 AM »

Hi, I'm interested as to where this club was in Union, NJ ? I had worked at Mack Boring during the early 90's on Rt 22 in Union. Sounds like a great group. Thanks

Thomas Wilk · « **Reply #25 on:** May 28, 2010, 11:43:24 AM »

the club field was behind the "Elastic Stop Nut" factory.

Tom Wilk

Michael Boucher · « **Reply #26 on:** May 28, 2010, 02:43:04 PM »

Thanks Tom, Mike

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #27 on:** May 28, 2010, 07:31:31 PM »

Yeah Mike, vauxhall road. Elastic stop nut long gone, that area is now condos. I believe red devil is there but the last time I drove by it wasn't looking to good. Stunt circle take off pad is about the only thing left

. Yes, it was a great group anyone in the northeast will tell you that. Just read some of Bob Hunt's posts and you can see the influence that club had on him. I'm sure Frank has some stories to tell also.

Tom

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #28 on:** October 05, 2010, 02:20:40 PM »

Okay,
Here's a picture I will cherish. 44+ years after they first flew this plane. Mike and Larry holding my Super Satan. It will be flown within the next month. I just need to get up the nerve!
Thanks,
Tom

Frank Imbriaco · « **Reply #29 on:** October 05, 2010, 08:08:29 PM »

Hi Tom,

Sorry that I missed the Circle Burners' event. Was planning to enter , but had some bad luck with my Nobler and I also had a family commitment on that day.

Well, I've asked you a bazillion times to meet me at Solberg... Ditto Scarinzi. I've given up on him( told me he'd come if I drew him a map- yeah, sure .

I'm planning to maiden my Scrambler within the next week or two. Are you game ?

The snow will be flyin soon if we don't .

Say hello to your father and brother.

Frank

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #30 on:** October 05, 2010, 10:50:46 PM »

Okay Frank,
I'm in!

Tom

Al Ferraro · « **Reply #31 on:** April 20, 2012, 09:00:49 PM »

My Super Satan is ready !!!!

Al

Bill Little · « **Reply #32 on:** April 20, 2012, 09:15:51 PM »

Hi Al,

That looks sharp, great build!

What is the finish you used?

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #33 on:** April 20, 2012, 09:26:32 PM »

Al,
That came out gorgeous! I cant wait to see it fly!

Good Luck with it!
Tom

ray copeland · « **Reply #34 on:** April 20, 2012, 09:29:39 PM »

Simply beautiful Al !!! Makes me feel young again just to look at the pic!

dankar · « **Reply #35 on:** April 24, 2012, 01:17:04 AM »

Excellent job on this.

Al Ferraro · « **Reply #36 on:** April 26, 2012, 07:42:47 AM »

Thanks Guys for all the great comments. The model was built from a Builtrightflyright kit and covered with 8mm habotai yellow silk from Thai silks. Its been finished with Brodak clear dope which was brushed and sprayed. I got Larry Scarinzi's seal of approval this past Sunday at the Union Model Airplane Club reunion. The Fox 36x BB is tuned and ready to run on Blast like fuel but the maiden flight was delayed because of the rainy weather. Hope to wind it out soon.
Al

RknRusty · « **Reply #37 on:** August 06, 2018, 12:15:07 PM »

Hey, guys, look what showed up at my house today! It lives to fly another day. It flew all the way down from New Jersey and landed on my front porch, compliments of Tom Luciano. Looks like big fun!
Thanks, Tom.
Rusty

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #38 on:** August 07, 2018, 05:49:43 AM »

Rusty,
So relieved it made it to you without damage. There are some great threads about this design scattered throughout the forum. I recall a story from Andre Ming's first experience with this design that had me in stitches. Look it up! This design was the first of the high aspect ratio designs ,that was all the craze in the late sixties , early seventies. I should post the magazine article on the forum.
At the time I built this, none of us knowing, Al was building one, Tom Schaefer was building a Combat Cat, Frank building his Scrambler. All of this sparked the Vintage Combat Festival. I try to come out with a new design every year. This year I have the replacement to this plus a 1960 design Hatchet.
I hope you get the opportunity to get it in the air this year! Mike Lonke would be a good choice for first flight. Shawn Cook would be another if he gets to Huntersville. You will have loads of fun with it!

Enjoy and thanks for doing the internet show and helping promote CL flying.

Have fun!
Tom

RknRusty · « **Reply #39 on:** August 07, 2018, 08:00:42 AM »

Hi, Tom,
Mike and I talked about it last night, and Al was on the show too. It made for a great show and tell. Looks like there'll be no shortage of .36X engines, these guys have lots of them. I'll be taking it to Huntersville in October, and we'll give it a rip then.

Chris Rudd joined in and entertained us talking about the WC in France too, so we had a pretty good hangout session. I'll start a thread whenever I get out to play with the Satan, I'm headed out to the shop with it now.
Later,
Rusty

Andre Ming · « **Reply #40 on:** August 07, 2018, 11:43:24 AM »

Congrats Rusty! Tom is a fantastic craftsman.

Put the strongest 36X on it you have access to and HANG ON!!.

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #41 on:** August 07, 2018, 11:55:06 AM »

Andre,
Thanks for the compliment! When I thought about sending this to Rusty I thought of your story. I reread it about a month ago and was laughing out loud about your experience. It is such a great story of what was going on in your head at the time. I really enjoyed it!

I'll try to find the link

All the best,
Tom

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #42 on:** August 08, 2018, 03:48:50 AM »

The following is the thread with Andre's story in it. The whole thread is pretty entertaining.

https://stunthanger.com/smf/combat/super-satan/

C.T. Schaefer · « **Reply #43 on:** August 08, 2018, 05:21:54 AM »

Ha! I just re read this thread. Yes, good read indeed. 72 was my first Nats. Myself and a senior named Bruce camped in a pup tent. Had a blast (pun?). Since Larry was flying out I got to bring a small collection of his SS planes. I think there were 5 of them. It was fun meeting Duke and watching LS blow the lid off the perceived notion of what a hot combat plane was! Andre's post really captured the moment! TS

Andre Ming · « **Reply #44 on:** August 08, 2018, 08:53:44 AM »

C.T.:

Did you or Bruce happen to wear black rimmed eyeglasses and had somewhat of a "Beatle" type hair style (very dark, black?)?

I pitted for such a senior flying a Fox 36X powered "Pegasus". (His own design. Looked like a mix of Nemesis II shape w/Satan type airfoil). I LONG ago forgot his name, and I've been wondering who that was ever since.

All fer now!

Andre

RknRusty · « **Reply #45 on:** August 08, 2018, 09:44:04 PM »

I promise I'll start my own thread about this plane, but figured I'd show this picture first... The Satan in its new home:

See its new Li'l Baby Brother behind it... that one has a bladder fed TD .049

There's the tough crate Tom built for it on the table.

I'll bolt a .36X on it and fly it at Huntersville in October. We'll get video of it and post the flight report.
Rusty

C.T. Schaefer · « **Reply #46 on:** August 09, 2018, 05:38:45 AM »

Andre, Yeah, that was him. I can almost remember his last name. Sharp and capable! Think he lives in Florida now. His pal Brooks has been in touch with me and is sticking his toe back into the C/L thing. Hope to see him before long! TS

Tom Luciano · « **Reply #47 on:** August 09, 2018, 10:47:26 AM »

Rusty,
Thanks for resurrecting this thread! It prompted me to go thru all the other related threads and Vintage Combat festival threads as well. I am very excited to get my new Super Satan in the air.

What da ya say Tom S. & Al. Lets wring'em out!

I did watch the show, thank you for the kind words! I hope you get as much enjoyment out of that plane as I did. If all goes well I'll join you on Friday nights show. I want to thank Al, Mike, Gerald, Charles, & Steve as well for jumping in.

The Super Satan has a special place in my heart. The performance, mystique, evolution, Larry, fathers involvement, and just the bad ass look of it, gets me pumped!

Tom

RknRusty · « **Reply #48 on:** August 09, 2018, 01:18:20 PM »

Tom, the SS fits right in amongst its new family... randomly hung from the ceiling, Lol.

Monday night, I asked Mike how it might compare, speed and reaction-wise, to my 1/2A Gladiator(AME .061, 4.25" x 3" prop, 35% nitro), which we've both flown. He said the Satan might be a little slower, so I'm not too worried about it. But then I read Andre's description, Lol. Don't get me wrong, if not for my current physical shape, I'd string the bitch up and murder it... show it who's the new boss.

But all things considered, I think I should prop it back to a 4" pitch and start with stunt fuel to tame it. I'll decide whether my hip is ready for that kind of action on game-day. I DO NOT want to smack it just 'cause I'm gimpy.

Haha, as I'm writing this Bob Zambelli called, trying to drum up some Saturday flying. When I told him about the Satan, he started coming up with all sorts of ideas how to make it faster

Crazy dude! He loves fast, even if it's a stunt pattern.

Btw, Tom and whomever else, there is no show this Friday night, as I'll be at the beach.
We'll be back Monday, same Bat Time, same Bat Channel.
Rusty

Andre Ming · « **Reply #49 on:** August 09, 2018, 06:34:24 PM »

CT:

Wow... what a small world. I probably saw you there too, over at that test fly or during the event... but wouldn't have any way of knowing. Do you remember how Bruce placed in Senior?

Rusty:

Bear in mind that we were flying highly modified Fox 36X engines that were genuinely doing well over 120 MPH. Also, I just got off the handle of a terribly nose-heavy Demon. Looking back, I'm sure I would have been alright if I would have taken a lap or two to gather myself, and then feel the plane out a bit better instead of trying to slam into "Show Boat/Full Tilt" mode immediately. Young and impetuous.

Even with a typical prop for the day, a box-stock 36X on 10% will likely only be in about the 110-115 MPH range. Plus, Tom's SS may not be trimmed the same way as Larry's was.

If you can fly a contemporary 1/2A foamie combat plane, you can definitely handle the SS.

Enjoy!

Andre