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  • November 17, 2017, 05:49:50 PM

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Author Topic: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.  (Read 563 times)

Online Avaiojet

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Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« on: August 22, 2017, 02:24:10 PM »
I designed a biplane stunter with the engine in the rear.

I'm thinking with the engine running the spent fuel will be "all over the place" because it will be pushed through the running prop?

So, I'm thinking of going electric with the design while I still can. The model is only part built so changes can take place easily that have to do with the IC or E. If I elect to go with either one.

Has anyone built a model with the IC engine in the rear as a pusher?

Was there an issue with spent fuel being sucked through the prop?

I just feel it will be really messy.

This model is set up for a .46 pusher.

Thanks in advance.

Charles
« Last Edit: August 23, 2017, 06:17:53 PM by Avaiojet »
Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.


Offline Traian Dorin Morosanu

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stund Design Issues.
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2017, 06:06:06 AM »
I just realized something. That something is I have not asked the most important question. Any design must have a purpose so he it comes: what do you want the model to do in the first place? Stunt? Sport flying? just fool around? Experimental platform? What is your goal?

ENGINE TANK FOR STUNT
Engine on back and tank in front of it is counter productive setup in Stunt. The motor will surge when the model dives and will slow down during climb. You can get away a little with a RC type carburetor with motor setup like a RC and use throttle servo that gets impute from a Active CL timer.  But if you do this you might as well go electric at this point and call it a day.

About electric
There is a small learning curve but if you can add and multiply you can do it. Battery technology is going in one direction now and the power density s getting better all the time and soon they will surpass the IC very soon. Soon I believe all the RC flight will be electric in the near future. You might as well bite the bullet and learn about it if you are not familiar with it. Most questions are at your finger tips (use the search button) seek and you shall find ask and you shall receive someone wise said a long time ago.
Each goal you meet is a moment of happiness
Happiness is the harmony between what you think and what you do. Mahatma Gandhi

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stund Design Issues.
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2017, 06:08:17 PM »
Traian,

The model is EAA EXPERIMENTAL stunt.  LL~

I have the fuselage designed around an Irving 46, 1.2 HP. However, there's plenty of room for an "E" motor. I had, for a short time an "E" design that I converted to IC. It's called the ARGO.

I also wanted the model to do touch n goes, so the Irvine 46 has an R/C carb.

The tank issue is solved. Advice from a fellow modeler.

I just feel the spent fuel will be an issue being drawn into the prop, so, that's the reason I'm thinking "E".

Charles
Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2017, 05:08:55 AM »
I'm spending a bit of time considering going "E" with Pushy Galore.

So, I'm finishing the ARGO 2.

Pushy Galore has an R/C type engine mount so converting to an electric motor shouldn't be an issue. Battery room or placement could be?

What I'll do is continue with the wings a bit so I can get a better idea as to the overall weight. They are foam and require sheeting and landing gear.

Getting these tasks done will help in deciding which motor would be suitable and having the weight will be more accurate.

I would like the model to be a bit overpowered.

CB
Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Offline Ty Marcucci

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2017, 06:14:57 PM »
Why not use a muffler with a rubber tube to allow the exhaust to be dumped out of the props span? D>K
Ty Marcucci

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2017, 06:39:16 PM »
TY,

I actually gave that a bit of thought and haven't yet ruled it out.

It would just take away from the looks of the model.

Electric is becoming much more popular. I did get a small taste of the construction of installing the motor, so I'm considering "E" as I said.

Confidence level is still low with electrics, but I do have the Forum for advice and help.

It's a money thing also. I'll have to sell some stuff.

Thanks for the reply.

Charles
Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Offline Traian Dorin Morosanu

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2017, 10:13:03 AM »
Here is an idea. You could use a servo and a CL active timer to achieve the 4-2-4 with rear motor. You might even have a wider motor envelope than the normal non throttle carburetor CL is using.
Each goal you meet is a moment of happiness
Happiness is the harmony between what you think and what you do. Mahatma Gandhi

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2017, 10:43:50 AM »
Here is an idea. You could use a servo and a CL active timer to achieve the 4-2-4 with rear motor. You might even have a wider motor envelope than the normal non throttle carburetor CL is using.

Traian,

Yes, "E" would offer many benefits.

You and I can talk about options as I continue with the framing to determine overall weight.

I'll be getting more work completed with the foam wings shortly.

Then, I can weigh the unassembled parts to get an idea of what the overall weight will be.

Thanks for the reply.

Charles
Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Online peabody

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2017, 05:55:23 AM »
Young Daniel built a bipe with a pusher...cleaning the prop will be the LEAST of your issues!
Have fun!
Get to work!
Come to the MCRC contest

Offline Skip Chernoff

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2017, 03:42:58 AM »
Charles for this set up electric is really the way to go....IMHO. Also if you used an R/C car or boat 2.4 transmitter with  receiver and ESC you could control the throttle and do touch n goes or slow flight.

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2017, 05:37:52 AM »
Charles for this set up electric is really the way to go....IMHO. Also if you used an R/C car or boat 2.4 transmitter with  receiver and ESC you could control the throttle and do touch n goes or slow flight.

Skip,

I'm considering Electric. Thing is, Electric is heavier than IC and the power plant is in the rear.

There's more to know with Electric and I don't know it. Yet.  ;D

Hey Skip! You been off planet?

Charles
Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Offline Traian Dorin Morosanu

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2017, 01:45:31 PM »
If you build electric the opposite is the truth.
Once you decide to build electric you have to think electric. You don't need 1/16 doubles in the fuselage. 1/64 ply here and there will be enough. The motor is smoother and you get almost no vibration. Motors weigh in the 140-175g while batteries are heavier so electric with rear motor has better weight distribution than the IC.
Each goal you meet is a moment of happiness
Happiness is the harmony between what you think and what you do. Mahatma Gandhi

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Pushy Galore, Biplane Stunt Design Issues.
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2017, 06:55:17 PM »
If you build electric the opposite is the truth.
Once you decide to build electric you have to think electric. You don't need 1/16 doubles in the fuselage. 1/64 ply here and there will be enough. The motor is smoother and you get almost no vibration. Motors weigh in the 140-175g while batteries are heavier so electric with rear motor has better weight distribution than the IC.

Traian,

OK, duly noted. 

I can change this to Electric with little difficulty.

Let me weigh these unassembled parts. See what you think.

Thanks for the reply.

Charles
Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.


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