How many have been keeping up with the NATS?  I see David Smith and his brother have done great.   

Joe mentioned a couple of reasonable explanations for the reduced turnout at the Nats this year. But if I list reasons for people who were actually missing this year, I come up with some more reasons. Of course, usually it is more than one contributing factor for each decision, so general conclusions are often shaky. There were health concerns holding back two contestants. Two were held back by school activities that couldn't be avoided. One had been traveling a lot to regional contestants and just couldn't manage a trip this long. One or two just didn't have their stuff ready. And always in the background are economic concerns which contribute to everybody's decision. So maybe next year will be better if some of these reasons are taken care of. We are a small enough group that substantial statistical fluctuations from year to year are not unexpected, and we should not panic about the attendance on the basis of this year alone.
That being said, I was pleased to hear that Brodak had a great carrier turnout this year. This is a substantially different contest for the official events, focussing on the more casual flier who is out to have a good time rather than to win a championship. Maybe it is best called a fly-in rather than a contest. It was disappointing to see that these sport fliers did not come to the Nats to fly in Sportsman Profile Carrier or Sportsman Profile .15 Carrier, events they were nearly all able to compete in, or in any of the other unofficial events.

Pete

Hi Wayne,
Not at all. "Fly-in" and "contest" are not mutually exclusive. I think Brodak is a good thing, and people go to have fun and fly. For many, it is the highlight of their year, as indicated by comments in this Forum. They are happy to do well in the contest, but they are mostly happy to have a good time, fly, see friends, see new people and see and show off new airplanes, all the good reasons to come to a fly-in. Keeping score is part of it and provides the framework for the whole thing, while the individual attitude of the contestants provides the relaxed atmosphere. (The same is sometimes true of local and other some other contests, but rare in national contests. Brodak is unique in that, I suspect.)
Ot at least this is my impression from talking to folks who go to this. Have I misunderstood?
Pete

Joe mentioned a couple of reasonable explanations for the reduced turnout at the Nats this year. But if I list reasons for people who were actually missing this year, I come up with some more reasons. Of course, usually it is more than one contributing factor for each decision, so general conclusions are often shaky. There were health concerns holding back two contestants. Two were held back by school activities that couldn't be avoided. One had been traveling a lot to regional contestants and just couldn't manage a trip this long. One or two just didn't have their stuff ready. And always in the background are economic concerns which contribute to everybody's decision. So maybe next year will be better if some of these reasons are taken care of. We are a small enough group that substantial statistical fluctuations from year to year are not unexpected, and we should not panic about the attendance on the basis of this year alone.
That being said, I was pleased to hear that Brodak had a great carrier turnout this year. This is a substantially different contest for the official events, focussing on the more casual flier who is out to have a good time rather than to win a championship. Maybe it is best called a fly-in rather than a contest. It was disappointing to see that these sport fliers did not come to the Nats to fly in Sportsman Profile Carrier or Sportsman Profile .15 Carrier, events they were nearly all able to compete in, or in any of the other unofficial events.

Pete

Comparison of The Brodak and The Nats.

Brodak:  Wednesday & Thursday, 4 events including two AMA Rule Book events, a person could enter three.
AMA Nats:  Tues, Wed, & Thursday, 12 events, including all three AMA Rule Book events, a person could enter eleven.

For a person with a job, attending two midweek contests would be a lot to ask. 

In my opinion, running Classes I & II combined at The Brodak has been a losing deal for a long time.  Sometimnes they're hard-pressed to give away three awards.   I don't see many scale carrier guys making the trip for that deal.  For that set of trophies, something like "electric profile" or "Sig Skyray (with the option of using Brodak kits) would be a better bet.  Also, the "sportsman profile" event with essentially the same rules as AMA Profile is largely redundant.  That could better be replaced with "nostalgia profile".

So my thinking on an improved Brodak lineup would be;

AMA Profile
Nostalgia Profile
15 profile (piston only)
Either electric profile or Sig Skyray (piston & electric combined).

There seem to be a lot of Skyrays out there (both pistion & electric) so let 'em fly.  I guess an "electric profile" event would still be open to electric Skyrays. 

Carrier at Brodak’s has had slow but steady growth. In 2007 we had 14 total entries in the 4 events flown. In 2011 we had 34 entries. This year we had our largest number of scale class entries, 5 or 6 as I recall. Several of the scale class models were ‘Nostalgia type’ but we also had AMA type models.

I believe it important to offer as many events as are practical, but the current list is probably the limit. Electrics have been accommodated in 15 and Sportsman, which allows them to fly with glow models. If participation increases then I think electrics could be revisited as a separate event. Skyrays, can and are flown in the profile events. However Skyray rules allow .40’s while profile is limited to 6cc so the flyer must use a profile legal motor. Electric Skyrays can be flown in Sportsman.

John Vlna
Brodak carrier Event Director

John, I like the Brodak carrier format as is. Its growing at a steady pace and is the closest Carrier contest for the geographic area. In the day, Ohio, Pennsylvania and Michigan was a hotbed for carrier. It was huge in Detroit, Cleveland, Dayton, Cinncinati and Eastern Pa. I just got the feeling that Pete felt that because Brodak is so laid back that he felt it wasn't serious enough and therefore not important. John, you see the entries for carrier at Brodak, what is the geographical layout of the entries.
Thanks
Wayne

I am with you.
Thanks
Wayne

As far west as Tulsa OK to Washington DC, Florida to Maine. Just about the whole country except the SW and West Coast.

I also think the format is fine, I think Pete just was pointing out that the Fly-In is different than the NATS.

Paul would like to see the events changed. I think the carrier event lineup is OK for now.

I believe that Waitsburg,WA qualifies for being from the West Coast (even though i am about 300 miles from  actual salt water in the Seattle area.) I think the Brodak format is just fine as it is.
Joe