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  • December 17, 2017, 10:19:45 PM

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Author Topic: Twister kit question  (Read 3566 times)

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #50 on: November 23, 2017, 05:29:43 AM »
I ordered the adjustable lead outs and a weight box from Brodak’s yesterday. Thanks Jim for the heads up on the correct parts. The spar is down and all the ribs are glued in place except the two outside ribs. I tried to post a pic last night but was unable to.
Happy Thanksgiving to all, Tim
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #51 on: November 23, 2017, 03:52:10 PM »
Happy Thanksgiving to all the members of the forum! Tim, get those pics working man.....we gotta have pics!   #^
Tempting fate and gravity one more time....

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #52 on: November 23, 2017, 05:30:30 PM »
I need to make them smaller to post and trying to figure out how to. I forgot to ask my daughters when everyone was here today. Tim
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Offline Target

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #53 on: November 23, 2017, 05:41:47 PM »
Most computers have editing software for pictures. Try right clicking the picture on your computer. Then "resize" 
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #54 on: November 23, 2017, 07:59:15 PM »
I am on my iPhone. We do have a lap top but for whatever reason it does not recognize my log in here, so I just use my phone. Tim
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Offline Target

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #55 on: November 24, 2017, 12:51:57 AM »
On my Android, there is a setting in the camera app that allows you to take smaller picture files. Default is the largest files with the most details. On your IPhone, I will bet it is very similar, there is a setting that you could adjust.
Another way I can do it after the pic is taken, is by emailing the picture to myself.
When I attach the picture attachment to the email, it will ask me if I want it full sized, 70%, 30% or 10% size.
If the original file is large, like 4-5MB, I go with the 10%. If it's 2MB or less, the 30% usually makes it small enough to post here.

Another factor that many people don't realize is the background has a huge effect on the files size. If you are doing a build log, check out the difference between placing the subject of the photo on a piece of white poster board, vs. putting it on a textured background, such as a piece of fabric.... The difference in file size at the exact same range is very noticeable.
Don't even get me started on pics of planes on grass. That's the worst.

I also avoid quoting other people's posts and adding their pictures a second time. Uses up Sparky's bandwidth needlessly....

Hope this helps you post the pics, Tim. I love seeing pics and it can be very helpful for allowing others to chime in if they see something that could land you in trouble later, helping you out.
Looking forward to your Twister maiden flight!

R,
Target
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #56 on: November 24, 2017, 03:32:51 AM »
Thanks. Chris for the info and I will try to post some pics as I go along. I have viewed others posts on builds which have helped me greatly and hope I can do the same. Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #57 on: November 24, 2017, 04:45:26 AM »
Test
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Offline Target

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #58 on: November 24, 2017, 08:21:18 AM »
Bravo, Tim  !
Now we're talking.
Good luck with the rest of the build!
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Online James Holford

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #59 on: November 24, 2017, 03:57:33 PM »
Lookin good man.

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #60 on: November 24, 2017, 04:06:23 PM »
Thanks guys! I am glad I can now post pics. I am waiting for the weight box and adjustable lead guide to come in to continue the build. Tim
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #61 on: November 25, 2017, 10:33:08 PM »
Looking good Tim!
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #62 on: November 26, 2017, 05:27:30 AM »
Question
The instructions are vague about installation of the Bellcrank assembly. It looks like the bellcrank is bolted to a piece of balsa? And is glued to two strips of wood on each side of the ribs. Can anyone elaborate on this? Thanks, Tim
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Online James Holford

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #63 on: November 26, 2017, 05:31:00 AM »
Suspendin bellcrank is the way to go!

Mike griffin had a video on youtube that gives a rundown on how to make it

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #64 on: November 26, 2017, 06:19:02 AM »
Thanks, James, looking for the video now. Tim
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Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #65 on: November 26, 2017, 07:28:07 AM »
Question
The instructions are vague about installation of the Bellcrank assembly. It looks like the bellcrank is bolted to a piece of balsa? And is glued to two strips of wood on each side of the ribs. Can anyone elaborate on this? Thanks, Tim

      Study the plan closely again. The bell crank is bolted to a piece of plywood, and is then glued to two square strips of balsa that are glued to the two center ribs. It is quite strong enough if done correctly. The balsa strips run from front to back. I think there is a sketch of their position on each rib. With C/A glue you can just tack them in place, bolt the bell crank to the plywood base and test fit. Get lead outs made up and installed also.  Search on here on how to use the copper tube method of bushing the lead outs. And don't forget to do the flap push rod. That can all get installed right before the center section sheeting is put on.  Read the instruction through, and do the steps in your mind so it makes sense.
    Off to the flying field!
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #66 on: November 27, 2017, 08:51:22 PM »
Wing is starting to take shape! The plans call for a no 39 or 40 drill bit to enlarge some of the holes on the bellcrank, is there a standard size drill bit that will work or do I need to purchase a no 39? Thanks, Tim

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Offline bill bischoff

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #67 on: November 27, 2017, 09:55:32 PM »
A #39 drill is.0995". The closest common size is 3/32", which is a fuzz smaller at .0938". The difference is less than 6 thousandths of an inch. Try 3/32, and if the pushrod is not snug in the hole, you're OK. You DO NOT want any excess slop, however, so don't be tempted to go to 7/64, the next biggest common fractional size.

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #68 on: November 28, 2017, 06:24:36 AM »
Thanks. I may do a test drill in wood to check fit. If not, will check hobby store. I just don’t want to buy a set for one bit to drill one hole in the bellcrank if you know what I mean. Lol. Tim
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Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #69 on: November 28, 2017, 07:57:22 AM »

  Tim, I have  set of those drills, just come by when you are ready to use them..
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #70 on: November 28, 2017, 09:45:24 AM »
Awesome Gill! I was going to call you later to see if you had one. Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #71 on: November 28, 2017, 10:39:25 AM »
Gill, what was the measurement for the bellcrank? Tim
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Offline Fredvon4

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #72 on: November 28, 2017, 02:31:08 PM »
Tim.... no way do I recommend this for precision hole drilling ----but for most "wood" projects the $59 HF drill set is not too bad...It covers a full spectrum of alpha, numbered, and Inch drill sizes.....but they ARE low quality and IMO NOT for precision hole boring

I also highly recommend you study to normal drilling needs and find a ACE hardware that carries a LARGE variety...specifically the Brad Point drills and IF they have the 6" or 8" long ones even better... usually Irvin brand... usually pretty strait and not very expensive

Also just a a hint... taking the Bell Crank Pivot music wire... lets say 1/8h as an example... and chucking it up in the drill....will bore/burnish...the correct size hole

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #73 on: November 29, 2017, 02:45:25 AM »
Thanks Fredvon4 for the info. Tim
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Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #74 on: November 29, 2017, 09:44:23 AM »
 Tim, if you are referring  to the  flap push rod location, it is 7/16" out from the B/C post
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #75 on: December 03, 2017, 10:04:30 AM »
How do you install the flap push rod into the bellcrank? Does it push in from the top or from underneath the bellcrank? I have searched and can not find any pics and the plans do not say. Also one end of the flap push rod is slightly bent out. I want to make sure before I center sheet it. Thanks, Tim
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Offline Target

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #76 on: December 03, 2017, 12:28:04 PM »
Normal old school flap pushrods have a "Z bend" and yes it goes in from the top then.
If it has an "L bend" then it goes in from the bottom. and is trapped by the platform it is on.

New school is a ball link, with the ball bolted into the top of the bellcrank, and a washer above the yoke that rides the ball (so that there is now way it can come off ever.)

Make sure there is no binding, whatever you do, and account for the up angle to the flap horn.

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Offline Fredvon4

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #77 on: December 03, 2017, 01:42:37 PM »
Tim please re-look the twister plans...this is tough for a first time ever build but when looking at the assemblies and the plans some things just become obvious...in this case the lower side view has the wing, bell crank, flap horn (on top) and connections to the elevator

If using a Zee Bend...not easy for 3/23 push rod IMO....Going in on the BC from the top gives a better straight shot to the flap horn... installing from the bottom up will also work but needs a slightly different bend to the push rod and the need to put the rod on before bolting but the BC

Then there is the option of wheel collars or soldered washers...on only one 90 degree bend.....each with a plus or minus and new skill set

Nothing wrong with the stock controls ---and I recommend you do one or more by the PLAN method ---if for no other reason to understand the complexity of adjusting

That said a flapped plane needs some good method to adjustment for trimming reasons...  fixed 90 and Zee bend music wire is not too easy to adjust once set.... There are ways...all a royal PITA IMO....Please read a re-read about setting the controls and THEN final gluing the stab to determine the neutral of the Flaps and the elevator

SO I recommend AS you learn and build this one... search and read the hundreds of builds with all the various adjustable controls and ways to cobble your own preference or pay some one like Tom Morris a small amount to send you a custom system

This all was dumb to me when I did first twister from KIT...but I had done at least one ARF with flaps so had some small clue

I decided to do Bell crank, push wire to flaps, perfectly neutral..... 3/32 wire is hard for me to get perfectly made bends... fortunately I had NOT glued in the BC platform... too easy ....take any of my wire bend attempts... connect to flaps, lock them to neutral---- move BC ply fore or aft to center BC...mark, glue.....there is a hint here but I am old and forget what it is...


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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #78 on: December 03, 2017, 04:42:11 PM »
Thanks for the replies! BC platform was glued into place like the plans showed as I am trying to build pretty much a stock Twister for my first build. I am planning on using the stock pushrods also. Right now, Bootlegger and I have the flap push rod with the 90 degree bend on top of the BC secured with a collar underneath. The part that goes into the flap control horn looks like the bend is slightly less than 90 degrees. Does this sound about right? Thanks, Tim
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #79 on: December 04, 2017, 09:36:17 AM »
I too use the L bend for pushrods.  But I also put ply plates top and bottom so pushrod will not leave the bell crank.  I've lost one plane using the wheel collar method.  Even had a notch for the set screw.
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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #80 on: December 04, 2017, 08:48:57 PM »
That wheel collar will vibrate loose in a short time. You can put a Z bend in 3/32 wire. Bend the end first then use needle nose pliers with a death grip for the second bend. You can drill the bellcrank hole out a little if you need to. The push rod should come out the top and go up to the flap horn. Make sure with full deflection the pushrod doesn't hook on the bellcrank platform or hit the lead outs. The end of the push rod should be rounded so it doesn't dig the plywood.

Hope that helps,
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Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #81 on: December 04, 2017, 09:35:14 PM »
   I solder a washer on the push rod with a single L bend. When I am doing final set up on the controls, I use a set collar on the other side so I can get as real  condition as I can, but still be able to take it apart. When I am finally satisfied with the installation, I put the wheel collar back one for one final check out, then just solder the wheel color to the music wire. On some I have done, I didn't solder it but replaced the grub screw with a regular bolt for extra torque and used lock tight or super glue to secure the set screw. Never had a problem with either method and both allow you to get the best fit while installing and allow to dis-assemble if need be along the way,or even later on after a crash and repairs are needed.
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Offline Dave Moritz

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #82 on: December 05, 2017, 11:22:33 AM »
Tim (or any of the other brethren at hand):

I inherited a kit-built Twister, but it needs some work. Externally, the leadouts were finished via a questionable solder job. Not sure about their internal attachment to the bell crank, but likely soldered as well. When operated, the leadouts drag and bind up a bit. So, it looks like I'll have to tear into the plane and see what's going on. Not something to look forwards to.

My question: Can you tell me the location of the BC? Basically, I'd prefer to remove the sheeting on only one side of the wing, so the question is whether it'd the inboard or the outboard section.

Not related comment: Good discussion above on the adjustable leadouts. I'll likely modify this bird accordingly.

Thanks!

Dave Mo...

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #83 on: December 05, 2017, 05:56:32 PM »
Jim, how is your Twister coming along? Tim
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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #84 on: December 05, 2017, 06:22:33 PM »
Dave, make a small hole in the inboard top planking behind the spar and have a look inside.
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #85 on: December 05, 2017, 06:38:56 PM »
The BC is accessed from the top center panel portside. Tim
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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #86 on: December 05, 2017, 10:43:02 PM »
Dave-
If the back line pulls for up, the bellcrank is installed normally. If the front line pulls for up, the pushrod is inboard of the pivot.
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Offline Dave Moritz

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #87 on: December 06, 2017, 10:26:25 AM »
Three quick responses - Motorman, Tim and Chris - you're all the best!  I've got a normal installation, so will commence with the task at hand.

Thanks.

Dave...

Offline jim ballard

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #88 on: December 06, 2017, 08:02:17 PM »
Jim, how is your Twister coming along? Tim

Tim, I'm still about where I was on the build. Haven't had much time to work on it since before Thanksgiving. Hoping to get more done in the next week.
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #89 on: December 06, 2017, 09:08:00 PM »
Good to hear from you Jim. I am thinking about using Titebond, instead of epoxy, to glue the doublers and hardwood engine beams together. Also, anyone have any suggestions on how to drill the holes into the elevator and flaps for the wire spanner?  Tim
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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #90 on: December 06, 2017, 10:45:32 PM »
You can strap it to a squared up 2x4 and use a drill press....
It doesn't hurt to add a triangle of 1/64" ply over the balsa where the wire is under it also.
Putting some thin CA in the (loose) hole to make the balsa more solid and letting it cure before the wire goes in isn't a bad idea either.

Most of the above applies more to the flaps, because you may have to "tweak them" to adjust for the wings to be level upright and inverted....
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #91 on: December 07, 2017, 10:04:44 AM »
Take it from experience, don't use Tite Bond or white glue for motor mount beams or ply doublers. 
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Today I broke my personal record for most consecutive days lived.
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Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #92 on: December 07, 2017, 10:37:31 AM »

  Tim, I have to agree with Doc about using titebond on motor mounts and doublers, use 30 minuet or longer for these parts, it will be much better..
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #93 on: December 07, 2017, 06:48:47 PM »
Thanks Gil and Doc. Gil, How doni mount the alum engine mounts that you gave me? Do I recess them into the wooden beams or just bolt them on? I am on call all weekend but want to start on the fuselage. Thanks for your help last weekend. Tim
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #94 on: December 07, 2017, 09:41:04 PM »
Don't want to step on Gil's toes, but if you look close you will see how I use my metal plates.   

If you open the link below the picture you can enlarge it to see what I am talking about.   This also sets the engine out board a little more. D>K
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Offline Dave Moritz

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #95 on: December 08, 2017, 07:45:21 PM »
My rehab of the inherited Twister continues. I got the bell crank out after some major surgery (not pretty).  Question regarding the lead-out wires: the wire used is .054", and this seems like overkill.  What do the brethren here think? Am considering .027".

Tim: my apologies for hijacking your thread!

Dave Mo...

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #96 on: December 08, 2017, 09:17:50 PM »
Yes, way overkill. .027" is the correct stuff.
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #97 on: December 10, 2017, 02:42:54 AM »
No problem Dave. We are all trying to get our Twisters built or rebuilt so we can fly them. I am glad this thread is helping you. I should be able to start back on mine today after I finish with call. Tim
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Offline Motorman

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #98 on: December 10, 2017, 12:19:53 PM »
Thanks Gil and Doc. Gil, How doni mount the alum engine mounts that you gave me? Do I recess them into the wooden beams or just bolt them on?

Glue them to the bare wood with epoxy.
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Twister kit question
« Reply #99 on: December 10, 2017, 06:15:59 PM »
I worked on the bellcrank and flap push rod today. I think I had the bends reversed. One bend was not quite 90 degrees and I think that one went to the bellcrank and the 90 degree bend went to the control horn. I feel this is correct but if anyone knows for sure, I am all ears. The wing and flaps are slotted for the hinges and the control horn location verified. I am thinking about adding 1/32” plywood at the flap/ elevator control horn locations to beef it up. Opinions would be appreciated on that. Actually opinions and advice would be appreciated on any part of this build! Anyway, I have started the fuselage assembly. Tim
Baton Rouge Bi-Liners
AMA 179681


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