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Author Topic: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build  (Read 11986 times)

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« on: February 21, 2018, 05:29:39 AM »
I bought an original Sneeker kit from Fred, many thanks Fred, and decided to use the parts as templets to build the plane. All parts have been cut out and the assembly begins today. TE ‘s completed from Fig 2 on the plans. Tim
« Last Edit: February 21, 2018, 06:06:38 AM by Tim Chenevert »
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2018, 07:38:20 AM »
I always thought the Sneeker was a cool combat plane and have seen a few fly although I never had one. Looking forward to following your build Tim.
Tempting fate and gravity one more time....

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2018, 09:44:26 AM »
Thanks, Jim!
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2018, 06:22:09 PM »
Motor mount glued together. Fig 3 on the plans.
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Offline Dane Martin

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2018, 07:03:50 PM »
Your rolling now! This should be really neat.

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2018, 07:08:23 PM »
Thanks Dane. I am having a lot of fun with this build. Tim
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Offline Paul Smith

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2018, 08:40:49 PM »
Motor mount glued together. Fig 3 on the plans.

On a build like that, I like to drill the holes first and use the engine as an alignment fixture.

I put quite a few Sneakers together after stepping up from a dozen each VooDoos and Combat Cats.
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2018, 09:08:46 PM »
You got 'er goin' your way now Tim! Keep the pics coming as you progress....
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2018, 03:38:41 AM »
On a build like that, I like to drill the holes first and use the engine as an alignment fixture.
I put quite a few Sneakers together after stepping up from a dozen each VooDoos and Combat Cats.
That is a great idea but how do you know exactly where the engine will go? Spacing from the wings LE and also balance? I plan to put the engine as close to th LE as I can.

Will do and Thanks Jim!

Tim
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Offline Dane Martin

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2018, 06:52:24 AM »
Riley is a fox man. He set these up around a fox. So anywhere from the leading edge forward is fine. Any heavier of an engine will just need a little tail weight, if that's your flying style, but would be fine.

Offline Paul Smith

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2018, 08:54:31 AM »
These kind of planes are ALWAYS nose heavy.  So always put the engine all the way back to minimize the tail weight.

Also, if you wait until last the drill the holes, you will have a hard (impossible?) time drilling straight.

I guess Riley Wooten may have also been a Fox man, but he was best known for winning with Johnson engines.
Paul Smith

Offline Paul Smith

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2018, 09:24:17 AM »
On the subject of engine mounts, I have never believed that I, or anybody else, could drill proper mounting holes after the plane is assembled.

My style is to drill the holes one at a time on a drill press, before assembly. Drill the first hole, bolt to the engine and then drill the second hole.

Then, with the engine bolted to the hardwoods, fit the hardwoods to the center block.  An accepted combat technique is to add a vertical 6/32 bolt through the hardwoods and the center block.  This will give you both correct holes and the ability to position the engine where you want it.
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2018, 11:39:44 AM »
Very good ideas on the engine mounts! At this point I will try to place the engine as far back as I can and drill the holes on my Father in laws drill press. Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2018, 07:23:40 PM »
So I have another question; with the bottom trailing edge glued down, how do you glue the top TE down? It is a very tight space. I have used CA up to this point. I thought about using the original Titebond and pinning it in place and let it set for a day. I have also heard about a small tip that you can use with CA glue to get glue into tight spaces. Any suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks, Tim
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Offline Dane Martin

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2018, 07:31:47 PM »
IF! the build is fixed to the table pretty good there (which it should be), you can take gel CA and apply it to the top of the ribs and GENTLY roll the sheeting into place.
You could also use wood glue and do a similar thing but you'll have to pin it or ace bandage it to hold it while it dries.

I do the gel CA thing pretty much every time.

Offline Dane Martin

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2018, 07:32:53 PM »
Just do it gently so you don't inadvertently install a warp. Lol.

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2018, 03:54:17 PM »
Thanks Dane for the help! Wing and wing tips starting to take shape!
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2018, 04:21:19 PM »
I have 12 cap ribs to install. The instructions do not give any indication of where they go. I have 2 of the ones on the bottom, 2 of the middle ones and 8 of the ones on the top. Any help would be appreciated. Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2018, 04:17:09 AM »
Anyone? Tim
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Offline George Truett

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2018, 07:15:26 AM »
Tim,  looking at the plans your cap ribs go between the outer 4 ribs on each side, 3 on the top and 3 on the bottom each side for a total of 12.  Never having built a Sneeker I would guess 4 of the cap ribs are different for clearance.  Since the only thing they might hit are the leadouts I would again guess the 2 and 2 cap ribs that are different are to go top and bottom closest to the inboard wing tip.  I would do a dry fit with them moving the leadouts through full travel to make sure they don't rub anywhere.

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2018, 08:59:02 AM »
Thanks George and I think that is a good explaination. I am waiting for a 3” Bellcrank to arrive in the mail and will install it and leadouts and check the cap ribs for fit. Tim
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2018, 01:23:07 PM »
Don't the plans show that?    I vaguely remember 1/2  ribs between the main ribs. D>K
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2018, 05:03:40 PM »
It shows them in place from only a top View. Does not say which ones go where. Tim
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #23 on: February 25, 2018, 06:30:44 PM »
The false ribs go top & bottom, and are all identical, or at least they should be identical. If you don't have enough, use one for a template to make a few out of some scrap.

It has been about 55 years since I built my one and only Sneaker. I liked it a lot, but more for fun flying than for actual combat matches. I used ST .35C's, and still have all both of them.  :o Steve 
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Offline Dane Martin

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #24 on: February 25, 2018, 06:46:48 PM »
I can't find my plans. Don't they get sandwiched as doublers? Like George said. On the plans, those ribs will just look fatter I believe.

Offline Fredvon4

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #25 on: February 26, 2018, 10:07:28 AM »
The Sneaker Kit I sent Tim has a typical instruction sheet and NO Full sized plan... not every thing is obvious the way they drew the plane in 1/4 size
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #26 on: February 26, 2018, 06:56:56 PM »
Engine mount was pre drilled, blind nuts installed and was just epoxied in place. Tight fit but used a small curved cath tip syringe to get the epoxy in place. Bellcrank arrived today, thanks to Dane! Engine was placed back as suggested with enough room to route the fuel line between the cylinder and wing. I will check balance prior to covering. Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #27 on: February 27, 2018, 06:08:10 PM »
I have two more questions about this build;
Instead of using 1/2” styrofoam wedges between the ribs on the TE, I am thing about cutting triangular wedges from 3/32” balsa and gluing them in place. Any thoughts on this?
Also, for the cloth tape to hold the 1/16” wire hinges down on the stabilator, would Original Titebond glue work? Thanks (again) Tim
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Offline Dane Martin

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #28 on: February 27, 2018, 06:12:57 PM »
Yes on the first.
Most likely fine on the second question. What do you plan on covering the tail with? If iron on, what I do is cut two strips that can go all the way around the tube and stab. Glue the tube on, then iron on the strips like tape all the way around. Then cover the whole stab.

Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #29 on: February 27, 2018, 06:48:45 PM »
Thanks Dane. I was going to use Rustolem on the stab, booms and the planking on the center section. Monokote on the wings from the planking to the wing tips. Purple on the center and yellow on the wings. LSU colors....sorry! Lol Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #30 on: February 27, 2018, 07:33:05 PM »
Great point Motorman! I like the idea on the control horn and the spar bracing! I did that on my Twister with great results. Just thinking out loud but what about replacing half ribs with whole ribs? Too much weight? Tim
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Offline James Holford

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #31 on: March 02, 2018, 07:52:45 AM »
Im jsut now seeing this. A Sneeker?!?!?! You da man Tim. 

 I have a Voodoo started but it is at a halt because I cannt figure out what tank to put in it. Im not going to try to combat it. I just wanna fly n have fun with it.

Also I know where you can get a Combat Cat lazer cut kit if you are wanting to do one of them :D
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #32 on: March 04, 2018, 08:07:04 AM »
Hi James, yep a Sneeker. Fast and fun to fly. I am hoping to get it finished soon. Tim
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #33 on: March 04, 2018, 05:14:35 PM »
Im jsut now seeing this. A Sneeker?!?!?! You da man Tim. 

 I have a Voodoo started but it is at a halt because I cannt figure out what tank to put in it. Im not going to try to combat it. I just wanna fly n have fun with it.

Also I know where you can get a Combat Cat lazer cut kit if you are wanting to do one of them :D

Put a tank in just as the plans show.  Needs crank case pressure for reliability. D>K
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #34 on: March 04, 2018, 07:30:11 PM »
Put a tank in just as the plans show.  Needs crank case pressure for reliability. D>K

James, Gil is looking to build a VooDoo powered by an OS 25 with a hard tank too. Tim
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #35 on: March 04, 2018, 08:00:24 PM »
Use same tank with uni-flo plumbing.    H^^
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #36 on: March 09, 2018, 09:08:11 AM »
Another question:
It is time to glue the L brackets to the stab. What glue works best to glue the L brackets in place and to glue the linen in place that hold the L brackets on?
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #37 on: March 09, 2018, 11:08:50 AM »
Ambroid always worked for me with the cloth material or even fibre-glas. H^^
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Offline Fredvon4

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #38 on: March 09, 2018, 11:37:02 AM »
Ambroid
SigMent
Full Strength Dope
Tester Wood glue
Super Phatic
Elmer's White
TiteBond II
E 6000
Z poxy
CA Medium

NOT trying to be smart.... I have done it too may ways with what ever I had on hand

Truth is these days I prefer to NOT use the cloth to hold the pins.... I use a short length of CF tubing glued to LE of the stabilator with CF veil covering the whole balsa piece

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Offline Larry Borden

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #39 on: March 09, 2018, 06:33:07 PM »
The old Flight Line kits had a set of trailing edge jigs. I built a building board set up for Sneekers using the jigs. I started modifying the Sneekers with 4" booms, engine shoved back half way through the LE. Pacifier tanks made out of the old aluminum pudding cans.
I could never fly a Nemesis and they were about 10 bucks a kit back then. I could build three Sneekers for a little more than one Nemesis. Used STG21 35.
Pretty good flying plane.

Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #40 on: March 10, 2018, 07:36:06 AM »

  Mr Borden, how did the 4" booms work out?  I am thinking about a Voo Doo with a 25 O S engine to try for stunt, and am thinking about extended booms for it also.  Thanks for help/advice... :!
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #41 on: March 12, 2018, 06:58:15 PM »
I actually had a little time this past weekend to sit at the table and continue the Sneeker build. I have to install the fuel pod, which I have the pieces cut and ready to install, install the stab and paint and cover it! Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #42 on: March 17, 2018, 12:06:18 PM »
Fuel pod installed. Need to finish sand. Install engine and check CG and see if she needs wingtip weights and then finish! Definitely a learning curve for my first scratch build. Many thanks to everyone who helped me along the way. Thanks, Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #43 on: March 19, 2018, 04:11:35 PM »
I had a chance to work on my Sneeker a little. I have the wings covered with Monokote. Where the wood is visible, I will use Brodak’s butyrate dope in Cub Yellow to finish! Starting to see the end. Tim
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #44 on: March 19, 2018, 07:23:03 PM »
Lookin' great Tim!
Tempting fate and gravity one more time....

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #45 on: March 19, 2018, 08:39:06 PM »
Thanks Jim. It has taken a lot longer than I thought to build. I tried to keep as close to the original but I did add spar bracing along the entire wing and I made balsa strips in place of the styrofoam fillers called for on the plans. It will be on pacifier so I built a balsa pod in place of the metal tank. It has been very fun to build build an old school plane and look forward to its first flight! This is also my very first scratch build ever. Tim
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #46 on: March 20, 2018, 02:44:30 PM »
 First coat of the dope in yellow on! Tim
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #47 on: March 20, 2018, 06:03:46 PM »
Interestingly, when Walter Umland was kitting the repro Sneaker kits, the question was asked if he was going with the 4" tailbooms or the early 2" tailbooms. He contacted Riley Wooten, who said that he'd never kitted the Sneaker with the 4" booms. Which lead me to run down in the shop and pull out the kit I'd bought at a swap meet. I took a picture of it and sent it to Walter. The box had a sticker on it that clearly said this was the improved Sneaker with the 4" tailbooms. I guess Walter got a good giggle out of that with Riley.  LL~ Steve
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #48 on: March 23, 2018, 07:31:56 PM »
Ok Tim, hows the Sneeker coming along? Last report....it looked like it was almost there....
Tempting fate and gravity one more time....

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #49 on: March 26, 2018, 03:32:34 AM »
 Well, I went to mount the engine Friday night and had a Blind but issue on the last bolt. Long story short, ready to install blind nut and repair/ finish engine nacelle. Probably start this evening. Check balance and will be ready for maiden flight after balancing. Will post some more picks. Tim
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #50 on: March 26, 2018, 10:52:22 AM »
So true having someone who knows how to launch a combat wing. Basically I tell who ever is launching, the main thing is not to throw the plane.   Hold by the out board wing slightly nose up and out.    Never stand behind the plane.  Seen a few close calls when pilot didn't hold neutral elevator.  Will try to get a picture of how I hold them. D>K
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #51 on: March 26, 2018, 09:09:58 PM »
The Sneeker is back together! Engine is mounted. I am applying the finish. Will post finished picks soon. Tim
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #52 on: March 26, 2018, 10:20:56 PM »
Looking forward to the pics Tim!
Tempting fate and gravity one more time....

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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #53 on: March 27, 2018, 08:04:22 PM »
Here she is! It took a lot longer than I thought to build but I did it! This is a scratch built Sneeker. This is the first time I ever attempted to build a plane this way and it was very educational and a lot of fun to do. A big thanks to everyone who offered their advice and support especially Bootlegger for his help and patience trying to get the old Fox running. Well here she is:
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #54 on: March 27, 2018, 08:35:06 PM »
Looks great Tim! Good luck with the first flight.
Tempting fate and gravity one more time....

Jim Ballard
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #55 on: March 27, 2018, 08:52:25 PM »
Thanks Jim! That is a big engine on that plane. I did beef the wing up some. I can’t wait for the first flight. I will let you know how it goes. Any luck with your Twister? Tim
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Offline jim ballard

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #56 on: March 28, 2018, 01:10:04 AM »
Tim, that thing is gonna go like stink and turn on a dime. The twister is still in several pieces. I'm going to go ahead finish the build that is on the bench and then look closer at repairing it. In the meantime I'm flying my 35 year old Buster.
Tempting fate and gravity one more time....

Jim Ballard
Blackwell, TX
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #57 on: March 28, 2018, 03:30:18 AM »
I am glad to hear that you are going to try to repair your Twister. The more we fly them, the better we get at repairing them! Lol Tim
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Offline Paul Smith

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #58 on: March 28, 2018, 07:01:37 AM »
Another question:
It is time to glue the L brackets to the stab. What glue works best to glue the L brackets in place and to glue the linen in place that hold the L brackets on?

Right from Year One on the Voodoo, the standard stabilator practice was one long rod across the stab in lieu of two short rods.  Then a thin plywood control horn mount was added.  In theory, the plane could sustain a bite to the tail and maybe still be flyable.

You needed tail weight anyway so the weight of the wire was no factor.

Paul Smith

Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #59 on: March 28, 2018, 07:03:08 AM »
   Tim, I have a couple of questions, first where are the landing gear, and where is the vertical stabilizer?  No take off and landing points??   LOL   LL~ LL~ LL~
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Offline James Holford

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #60 on: March 28, 2018, 07:47:24 AM »
Aww yea!!!!!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk

Jamie Holford
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #61 on: March 28, 2018, 08:30:47 AM »
   Tim, I have a couple of questions, first where are the landing gear, and where is the vertical stabilizer?  No take off and landing points??   LOL   LL~ LL~ LL~
Gil ole buddy I have been meaning to talk to you about that....Tim  Lol
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #62 on: March 28, 2018, 10:12:52 AM »
Right from Year One on the Voodoo, the standard stabilator practice was one long rod across the stab in lieu of two short rods.  Then a thin plywood control horn mount was added.  In theory, the plane could sustain a bite to the tail and maybe still be flyable.

You needed tail weight anyway so the weight of the wire was no factor.

Thanks, Paul! That is a very good idea. Tim
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Offline Mike Greb

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #63 on: July 02, 2018, 08:49:58 AM »
That looks like a Mk1 combat special on your airplane.     Take it easy on that motor, as it has a weak crankshaft, and when the crankshaft goes it takes out the front bearing pocket in the crankcase.   10% nitro with a lot of castor oil will help the longevity, also running a suction insert from a 36x will help at a small loss of speed. 

Offline Ken Culbertson

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #64 on: July 02, 2018, 11:02:16 AM »
Here she is! It took a lot longer than I thought to build but I did it! This is a scratch built Sneeker. This is the first time I ever attempted to build a plane this way and it was very educational and a lot of fun to do. A big thanks to everyone who offered their advice and support especially Bootlegger for his help and patience trying to get the old Fox running. Well here she is:
This whole thread brings back some fond memories.  I had the good/or bad fortune to attend Texas Tech in 1965 - 1966.  Our dorm rooms were too small to build Stunt ships so I did combat.  Planes were slower and stronger so they lasted a bit longer back then.  It was always a consolation to draw Riley in an early round because you were usually eliminated before you could damage your plane.  Some of the pilot instructors from the now closed Reese AFB used to fly with us.  I got stationed with one in Korea years later and we resumed our rivalry flying mostly Voodoo's and Sneaker's using McCoy's and Fox 35's.  Hard to get anything else at the BX.  It drew a crowd and we had a blast doing it.  Haven't flown Combat since and judging from what I see here on weekends (some of the world team practice at our field) I will be watching from here on!

Ken
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Offline Tim Chenevert

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Re: Riley Wooten’s Sneeker build
« Reply #65 on: July 12, 2018, 06:44:35 PM »
I am pleased that this build was a trip down memory lane for you! I enjoyed building it a lot. The engine is a mk3 if I remember right and it screams. Tim
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