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Offline Motorman

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« on: July 04, 2013, 08:58:44 PM »
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« Last Edit: September 08, 2021, 10:15:36 PM by Motorman »

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2013, 09:07:54 PM »
I'm building my first full fuselage for electric from scratch and I realize I need a little help. It's just going to be a simple box with a bubble canopy for a 550 Sq. In. wing.

Sides 1/8" balsa - 6 Lb. or should they be harder?

1/64 ply inside the nose - what kind of glue is best for laminating?

Top and bottom - is 3/16" sheet too heavy? I wanted to round it off a little

How big should the hole be for the cooling air?

I know how the battery mounts but where does the esc & timer go?

       6 lb  1/8" is PLENTY for the fuse sides, you should able to sand some contour in it. My airplane (piped 61) has 3/32 4.5 lb wood spliced to 1/8 6 lb over the wing. I haven't thought through the issue with doublers, I would be tempted to use balsa on an electric.  Use either slow-setting epoxy applied VERY SPARINGLY, or medium CA using the line method making sure to get full coverage near where the formers are going to

    3/16 is not too heavy (presuming maybe 5 lb density) and should allow some minimal contouring. I would use something thicker, tack-glue it to shape it, then knock it off and hollow it to about 1/8-3/32 wall thickness. Depends on the desired finish. I would go thinner if I was going to use graphite mat, not so thin using silkspan.

   I can't answer any of the electric specific questions.

    Brett

Offline Curare

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #2 on: July 05, 2013, 12:39:12 AM »
On my last model, I had a bit of an issue with doublers, even though I'd used more epoxy than I'd like, it still delaminated. Upon closer inspection, the glue was bridging between the balsa and the ply, rather than creating a complete lamination. I had it clamped with everything I could find in the workshop!

Is there any prep work to be done prior to laminating? Should I pre-sand the sheets prior to application of the glue to ensure a better connection?

I'm tempted to vac bag my laminations next time.

Greg Kowalski
AUS 36694

Offline John Moody

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #3 on: July 05, 2013, 05:22:48 AM »
Greg,
Whenever I have to laminate a largish area, fuse doublers or foam wing sheeting  for example,  I always use epoxy resin -  not epoxy glue. It is much thinner than the glue and spreads easily with an old credit card.
Pour  the resin onto the doubler and spread it all over . Remove any excess resin, you only want to “dampen” the wood surface, not soak it. Any more than this just wastes resin and adds extra weight. Position the doublers on the fuselage and weigh down securely overnight rather than clamping.
If the doublers are not very big I just use TiteBond. I have never had any problems with either way.

Of course, with any laminating job always ensure the surfaces are sanded smooth and free from dust to ensure a strong bond.

John.

Offline John Cralley

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2013, 07:25:39 AM »
With electric models, where there is no need for fuel proofing, I have had good success with contact cement for laminating doublers. Bear in mind you only get one chance to get it correctly aligned!!  y1
John Cralley
Scratch Built - Often Re-kitted!!!
AMA 52183
Central Illinois

Offline Curare

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #5 on: July 17, 2013, 05:39:08 PM »
Can anyone give us the skinny on the CA method? Just curious is all.
Greg Kowalski
AUS 36694

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2013, 09:31:30 PM »
If you clamp it too hard it will squeeze the glue out and what little is left will be absorbed by the wood.


Brett, what is the line method with CA, how far apart are the lines?


  1/2" is what I used, it depends on the thickness of the beads you lay down. It's shown somewhere in here, I think:





    These are the original Bill and Bob Hunter Hot Stuff videos, it's two hours worth but you *will* learn something.

    Brett

Offline Derek Barry

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2013, 05:01:15 PM »
I use 4-5 lb balsa for my fuse sides and from the spinner to around the middle of the wing there is a 1/8 balsa doubler on the inside made out of the same 4-5 lb stock. I use slow cure epoxy put on with a brush. I lay it on a sheet of glass or granite with weights on top for at least 24 hours. Sometimes I put carbon veil between the two pieces of balsa. I run a PA 65 and have never had a failure. There are many ways to accomplish this and the two methods Brett mentioned will work just as good. Personally, I prefer epoxy over CA.

Derek

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2013, 06:29:53 PM »
I use 4-5 lb balsa for my fuse sides and from the spinner to around the middle of the wing there is a 1/8 balsa doubler on the inside made out of the same 4-5 lb stock. I use slow cure epoxy put on with a brush. I lay it on a sheet of glass or granite with weights on top for at least 24 hours. Sometimes I put carbon veil between the two pieces of balsa. I run a PA 65 and have never had a failure. There are many ways to accomplish this and the two methods Brett mentioned will work just as good. Personally, I prefer epoxy over CA.

    When you are gluing to 5-lb balsa almost anything is good enough! Just have to be careful to seal the engine compartment up, although in this case they are talking about an electric so probably not important here.

   I have taken to using variable-thickness fuse sides of late. You certainly don't need 1/8 for the rear end, but it's nice to have a bit more meat up front when contouring the nose. I make the splice at about the high point of the wing and then taper the 1/8 down to 3/32 pretty much from about F1 back.

     Right now I have so much 3.5-4.5 lb 1/8 (and everything other size for that matter) I am going back to that for the next few airplanes, you really lose nothing weight-wise and it's a little more forgiving.

   I scanned through the videos above for the first time since, er, Derek Barry was only hypothetical, and I am surprised how much of these techniques I apparently picked up from these videos and how much of it I still use. And make no mistake, those guys were consummate modelers.

    Brett

Offline Curare

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Re: Laminating Glue (Fuselage)
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2013, 07:48:13 PM »
Wow, thanks for the links, no doubt they'll be very educational!
Greg Kowalski
AUS 36694


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